The patriot

Gideon really lost it.

Levy's voice is not one of reasoned crfiticism - his viewpoint is hate speech, plain and simple. Haaretz can bring worthy voices of dissent while maintaining higher standards of journalism.

Is it really what happens? Tibi, Zuabi, Goldstone and Chomsky are not all the world yet. Even if you add a couple of presidents and PMs to them. Take a look of world independent press for last 2-3 weeks (not Haaretz and AlJazeera though). The most strong therm that was used in serious analytic articles , was "stupidity" (witch it was). So let's stay more rational. It is right that this "Israeli patriot", the article speaking about, is not particularly bright and clever. He is hysterical also. But his opponent resembles him as 2 drops of water. That is a real problem that we should deal with.

Levy portrays himself.

What is an arab patriot Gideon? One who teaches his children from kindergarten that Jews are roaches to be eradicated. fills them with lies like the Jews poisoned arab water with radioactive waste to give them cancer. denies any responsibility for his own state of affairs. lives only from foreign handouts with no sense of shame or pride. cannot figure out how a few million Jews who come from 75 countries with different languages and cultures and no natural resources turned a small sliver of land into a European level economy and culture with a disproportionate % of nobel laureates in science and literature. and this while its neighboring 350,000,000 arab muslim neighbors (plus a few hundred million more non-arabs, like iran and Pakistan) did everything in their power to eradicate them from the map. why it is the only country in the ME where women and gays are equal under the law and where all religions are free to practice and thrive (except ironically non-orthodox Jewish ones). yes levy I am a Jewish patriot and proud of it. Jews like you, who so despise their own people and country that they demonize them obsessively with no balance or rationality makes me sad and sick. The arabs (and muslims generally) have a long way to go to catch up and they are more likely to take Europe back with them to the middle ages than take their own societies to the 21st century.

gideon is one of the only sane israelis. too many seem to be increasingly racist and fascist.

"NEVER AGAIN" does not mean trying to change the habits of the jew killers, or convincing them that they should allow jews to exist. It means Jews should acquire the resources to liquidate would be jew killers, and their supporters, before they have a chance to even speak their evil. Defending the attack on the flotilla is a futile exercise to convince jew killers. Those who seek to send the Jews "back" to the ovens of Europe should be immediately liquidated without apology. Each budding hitler killed is a jewish life saved. "The world" repeatedly seeks jew killing, perhaps the world does not deserve to live.

Gideon, I am coming soon to be your neighbour,just before you leave Israel for greener pastures. My dinner invitation still stands.I hope we shall converse in a civilised manner.That your hate and worse CONTEMPT for the GREAT UNWASHED,amongst which I proudly include myself,will not choke you during the tasty(kosher,I am the host) victuals we partake of.During the next week or two afterwards,you will leave for London,New-York or maybe Harare(also an English speaking capital) from whence you will be able to comfortably vent your vitriolic spleen. The reason:I shall be as persuasive as you and make you as sick of my opinions as you make me of yours,but I shall be the Oleh Chadash,whilst you,my friend, are just the old hack.

You got it right! Americans will only watch this fiasco for so long! Not all of us are fundamental idiots who believe in fairytales. We love Israel but will not let it become the monster we most despise.

Seeing into the future is what the Israelis need. Present Isreali strength is not 100% guarantour of the future of Israel. An amicable relation with neighbours is far better guarantee. Peace settlement at less than the aspirations of Israelis is better than provisional supremacy over double the land Israel controls now. A country cannot live wary all the time. Antagonism is building up against Israel, thanks to the present government..

Seeing into the future is what the Israelis need. Present Isreali strength is not 100% guarantour of the future of Israel. An amicable relation with neighbours is far better guarantee. Peace settlement at less than the aspirations of Israelis is better than provisional supremacy over double the land Israel controls now. A country cannot live wary all the time. Antagonism is building up against Israel, thanks to the present government..

Israel's society is structured in such a way that any criticism of the military is seen as a betrayal by the parents of those serving. As a conscripted army the citizenry rightly will do everything they can to protect their children essentially, and the actions of their children. This in turn leads to the 'Patriotic Israeli' as you describe who wants all the good things in life usually a western orientated one, not a middle eastern one, who shouts the loudest when the actions of the IDF are questioned, moans that his children are having to police the territories, and gets frustrated that little Isaac or Rachel again miss their birthday due to service, and the refusal of the Palestinians to just disappear. But I do not think the 'patriotic Israeli' is the greatest threat to Israel. The greatest threat to Israel are those right wing nutjobs living anywhere but Israel who cheer from the sidelines at everything Israel does regardless of it's impact on how Israel is percieved within the International Community. Politicians like cheering crowds particularly when abroad so they play to the gallery. Which in turn leads them to make evermore calamitous decisions such as raiding aid flotillas the day before meeting the President of the country that pays the bills. So he can be feted by the American Jewish community, which looks good at home, and makes himself feel special. When these disastrous decisions come home to roost the deft Israeli Politician hides behind the IDF or our boys and girls as one particular politician refers to them as, thus reinforcing the feelings of the parents, which in turn guarantees the support of the 'Israeli Patriot' as he supports our boys. Non so blind who cannot see, I'm afraid. Gideon I wish you luck your going to need it.

And while Mr Gideon is a poetic writer, the other side wants to include West Bank as a launching pad for their rockets. Unfortunately, Mr Gideon, reality in the ME is not poetic and sooner you discover that, better for you.

You hit it on the nail, again, Gideon. and this is the way the students learn about democracy in this land. and they really believe it. They have created a mental wall that keeps out criticism from anyone and everyone

There is no doubt that certain aspects of Mr. Levy's epistle have merit. There is only one point he does not make acknowledging the mistakes Israel makes. Having heard Ms. Helen Thomas say "jews should go back to Germany, Poland etc. but not that peace with the Arabs is important but back to the greatest annihilators of Jews in history. She did not say Americans should go back to Africa, England or etc. Was the goal of most Arab countries to "drive the Jews back into the sea?" Id the majority of 1 billion muslims anti-semitic because of their Koran or Israeli politics? Those are existential questions Mr. Levy does not bring up in addition to his points. Israel has contributed to more health by companies such as Teva in addition to it's militrary business. The UN voted Israel was 100% compliant in returning GAZA and Lebanese land. Did that help??? It cannot when the Islamaztion is spreading even to Turkey. Regardless of who is to blame in the "flotilla affair" did Turkey s motivation to become a NEW defender of the Palestinian cause it to provoke the affair. Mr. Levy's simplistic approach bears more scrutiny as to the other factors. Does our religion provide for 30 or 70 virgins to die in martydom.

But to warm a snake on your own chest is too much to ask for . Those are open bitter , mortal enemies of Israel regardless what Israel does or does not . Their core problem is the mere existence of the Jewish state . And as such the Israelis do have a very legitimate claim against those enemies . For Mr Levy it does not matter , Israel to him is of little value . But we tend to disagree .

gedeon levy do you really know why the "world" hate us. You said the Israeli patriot doesn't want to know. Matbe they do know and arent interested in their (read the "world's") EXCUSES. Granted our country has not been 100% pure in their actions againts not helpless but weaker minorities. Machsomim arrests innocent death collateral damage may or may not be excused. BUT that is not THE reason that THEY hate US, just excuses. As you well know

The article he wrote does not make any sense in the real world that Israelies are living in. The external dangers to Israel are so dramatic that focusing the discussion to left-right is a waste of energy. The problem is, as in the flotilla , there are "usefull idiots" (phrase from Peron, Argentinian dictator) helping the enemy to divert the world criticism from the real dangers. If you don't believe this, take a look at the media and count how many minutes they are dedicated to Israel and to Kyrgistan (2000 deaths and 400.000 displaced). With people like Gideon and some other "usefull idiots" the world attention is directed only against Israel.

This is the kind of attitude needed to nurture peace. Extremists on both sides have to be cornered and neutralized.

Levy is just upset that Israelis haven't rolled over and let the Palestinians and other Arabs kill us. Oh, woe be to Levy that Israelis - patriots or not - do indeed have the right to a nation and to protect themselves. And oh, woe be to Ha'aretz readers to think that Levy cares about human lives. He doesn't. He cares about Palestinians and regrets that the Palestinians haven't killed enough Israelis yet to make Levy and the rest of us "go back to Poland and Germany". (yea, that would include several million Jews from Arab countries, Africa and India who have nothing to do with Poland, other than Hitler didn't manage to kill them all off before he lost the war and killed himself).

Just a technical point: your Share (Addthis) facility does not work, at least in the UK.

from Mark Twain: “In the beginning of a change, the Patriot is a scarce man, Brave, Hated, and Scorned. When his cause succeeds however,the timid join him, For then it costs nothing to be a Patriot.”.....For me, Mr G.Levy is this "scarce man, Brave, Hated, and Scorned". Hopefuly Levy's cause WILL succeed!

What would it take for the Isralis 'patriots' to shake up and realise the current state of the World?

Mr. Levy should know (and he probably does) that the Israeli patriot lives in an absurd reality. In a country where so many songs were written about peace and that meanwhile is plagued with so much hatred only because of its existence, even the greatest patriot understands that Israel is not Western Europe. Thus, Mr. Levy, although some of the soldiers may have made mistakes, the cause of Operation Cast Lead was without any doubt clear (>3000 rockets), as well as was its outstanding performances. I am not aware of many situations in the history of the world where a so called "humanitarian peace mission" like that of the Marmera, in which soldiers entered the ship with paintball-guns (!), were welcomed by a mob that had the simple intention to murder. However, Mr. Levy, there's one point that I tend to agree with you. We, as a country, realy should strive to behave like the U.S. They always act, whereever in the world, that the U.S. should protect whatever they deem to be vital for the country. That are real patriots.

Yes, these people exist, but far less in Israel than in most other countries. Even US patriots are more despicable than Israel's ones. Not to mention Syrian, Iranian or Turkish patriots who are openly advocating genocide.

Yes, these people exist, but far less in Israel than in most other countries. Even US patriots are more despicable than Israel's ones. Not to mention Syrian, Iranian or Turkish patriots who are openly advocating genocide.

change this mindset.? All I get in response to my measured logic from people who have been here many years is'I used to think like you..they dont want us here...they only understand strength.Any concession is regarded as sign of weakness'

...but most of this stuff rings chillingly true.

you are really wise and brave Gideon

Gideon Levy continues his on going, and unreasoned diatribes implying that the whole problem in this country is the problem of 'the patriots' (I'm surprised he didn't bring in the orthodox as well), and that all problem in the world are caused by Israel. He lists all those 'righteous' countries such as Turkey, and those individuals who have been vociferous in their criticisms, acts of delegitimisation, and more (Kamm, Fahima etc), and suggests that ctiticism of them is slander and hypocrisy. He joins those who consider that the critics of Israel are all justified, and that their voices are expressions of healthy democracy, whereas any disagreement with them is hypocrisy and undemocratic. By climbing into bed with the Fahima's of this world, or with people who behave treasonably by selling sensitive information to the press, Levy undermines, even further, any claim he may have had to journalistic objectivity and reinforces those of us who claim that the greatest dangers to Israel come from within, but not from those whom Levy demonises..

critisizing israel doesn't make you a patriot either and this seems to be your entire jewish contribution

critisizing israel doesn't make you a patriot either and this seems to be your entire jewish contribution

Israeli patriots want the end of occupation, colonization and apartheid in the West Bank. Israeli patriots understand, that it will not bring peace overnight, on the contrary, it may lead at the irst stage to intensification of violence and terror: this is what Israeli patriots learnt from experience. Every spot of territory, vacated by Israel, was immediately turned into base of terror and war against Israel. The international standing of Israel as the result of these withdrawals is at any time low. Israeli patriots want from the international community endorcement of Israel's right to defend itself and at the same time pressure on the government of Israel to end the occupation and colonization. The failure of the international community to endorce the right of Israel to defend itself severely undermines the prospects of peace.

And psychologists know that the reptilian brain is fond of rituals. Of course, Judaism sure is the most ritualized religion in the world. The ritual bath is the symbol of those who are bathing in the rituals. But didn't Israelis make of war a new ritual. And maybe, if the international communauty wasn't watching at them, they would live in a perpetual war? The reptilian brain hates to be criticized. It hates to be ashamed because it is the "head office" of pride and arrogance. God's Kingdom is the reign of the conscience and It is the contrary to the reign of the reptilian brain. The reptilian brain makes a man/woman read the Bible and see only what suites him/her, covering many omissions by some kind of mending which turn God's instructions into a fictive story. The conscience makes a human being work the Bible (in Hebrew), faithful to the roots, searching all the interesting answers to understand what are the rules of God's Reign, also called Kingdom of Heaven, and the reasons why we, on Earth, can't reach It...

this was way too left wing. A patriot wants us to be a good light onto the nations! However, when we are threatened, like any other state, we have a right to defend ourselves!

The term "patriotism" has become loaded when connected to current events. Everyone knows Samuel Johnson's phrase, ""Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel.". Fewer know that Johnson viewed English supporters of the American Revolution as "Traitors to this country", meaning of course, The British Isles. The apparent inconsistency between the two positions is explained by his distinction between "false patriotism" and "true patriotism". Israeli "patriots" of the right wing are like Johnson in that they reserve for themselves the right to choose who is a "true Patriot", and who is not. With the use of hindsight, it seems that English pro-Americans were gifted with a better sense of realpolitik and a truer view of ethical basis of the American demand, "No taxation without representation". At the simplest level, without referring to matters of ethical and moral importance, Israel's collection of taxes belonging to Palestinians on both the West Bank and Gaza, and its subsequent refusal to quickly turn over those taxes to whom they belong is one reason for the inability of the Palestinian authorities to adequately provide vital services for their populations. The resulting poverty of means is surely a major cause for the increasing enmity of normal Palestinian citizens to Israeli and Israelis, and is of advantage only to Palestinian extremists. Closer tot home,It does not seem to me that it is stretching the point to note that Israel's Bedouin, Druze, and Palestinians are well taxed but do not have fair representation in the local and governmental bodies which determine their slice of tax monies. What percentage of taxes spent on education, roads and other municipal services are devoted to Israel's minorities? What percentage in fairness should be devoted to those minorities?

for the very few in the world like you my love and respect. a tear came down when i read your article it gave me hope that justice will prevail all over the world some day thank you all i can offer

i would like to see israel take responsibility for itself and its proplems for the next 30 years. stop blaming everybody else and act the way a sovereign democracy of 60 years should. mazel tov !

as usual, Levy raises legitimate points that "the patriot" has to confront and address. Also as usual, he does not raise the issue of how the "the left winger thinks." You know, the thoughtless type, who cannot conceive of any possible even theoretical situation where Israel just MIGHT have a point, whose world view begins and ends with Israel as the eternal evil doer, and where... well... just about anyone else, is blameless (except for the US who is also an evil doer). What we need today are people of nuance and responsibility, who can appreciate complexities of the ME. Not the "good guys vs bad guys" narrative. Ironically, this Bush-esque position has been adopted wholesale by the Left, including by Levy.

The abovementioned all seem to enjoy a right, which the patriot is not entitled to have. They have the right to be full of hatred of the purest kind. They may be angry and call names, but not the patriot, ever. He has the right to remain silent when threatened with annihilation. And that's close to remain calm when being actually killed, as we could all see, the world is seriously doubting, that the Marmara raiders were entitled to protect themselves against attempted murder.

This article does a great job of highlighting many of the hypocrisies of the Israeli right. In fact, it could be generalized a little bit and it would apply very well to the American right too. Ultimately, peace will fix these hypocrisies though, or many of them anyway. Here's hoping it happens some day ....

sad to say but he's entirely correct. a brilliant, albeit sobering column. sigh

Brainwashed and blind ' this s exactly the right diagnosis ( in arabic we say أعمى البصر والبصيره) . We ,as Palestinian ,would really like to see the israelis ( and the arabs!!) in the opposite of what Mr.Levi mentioned. Thank you Mr.Levi . The world must grant you the Nobel-Price for Peace.

"Our" as in the USA, I mean. Israel is obviously modelled hugely off of the country and that has brought it much prosperity. But on the other end is the frontier mentality, the genuine belief that behind every corner lurks a threat, the need to keep killing and destroying until everything strange and foreign is gone. Israel, with its enormously strong economy, nuclear weapons, and US-backed army, has convinced itself that teenagers throwing rocks, "missiles" from Hamas with an accuracy rate below 0.005%, and the very presence of Palestinians themselves somehow poses a dire threat to the existence of the country. It's very similar to the "Old West" mentality, where Americans cheered on as cowboys--with their guns and gold--slaughtered every Native American carrying a bow and arrow they could find. So that they could make the country safer for Good White Folk, of course. When you look at it from that perspective, and realize how Americanized Israel has become, it's pretty obvious how so many Israelis can convince themselves that nothing but as much blood as possible will lead to salvation. Like the American who is positive that the deaths of a million Iraqis has somehow avenged the deaths on 9/11, the Israeli who applauds the deaths of thousands of Palestinians is suffering from severe delusions.

It is an exaggerated note however, in the right direction. The Israel patriot is very critical of his country but at the same time is nationalist. A liberal who is also a nationalist thinks in his country first. As a liberal he should grant civic and liberal rights to all citizens including citizens that reject the national character of the state. At the same time having heard the minority a liberal patriot can also deny the minority demands, for the simple reason that the majority wants something else. If the minorty betrays the country as the aristochracy did after the French revolution they can be label traitors as well. Even liberals can do that.

amongst the Jewish community, whether in Israel or Diaspora, are really attributing their accusation as a result of their genuine fear for Israel and World Jewry. We have to be cognizant of the experiences we've had in the past and determination that nothing of it is repeated. I also understand where they are coming from, but I also know that it's imperative for Israel to remain a democratic, strong, pluralistic society which is inclusive and conducts itself as a light unto other nations. In one family there are no two people alike, as within our Jewish family.

I love your honesty Mr Levy you are truly pro Israel but the brainwashed that think they are pro Israel are destroying the state.You will get loads of digusting comments for telling the truth.Thank you Sir!