Only gall and nothing more

Every new Jewish home in the West Bank makes the Two State solution less and less practicable - which is, after all, the settlers' declared goal - and brings us closer to the day Israel cannot separate anymore from the Palestinians. When that day comes, a Jewish minority will then faces an impossible choice: Either to forcibly impose its rule over an Arab majority, OR, to accept resignedly to live in a "one-man-one-vote" state extending on all Eretz-Israel. On that day, there will still be some Jews to whine: "The palestinians have decided their own fate."

I am not sure the quote is accurate. Too bad you didn't indicate the source. Even if the quote is accurate, it doesn't mean much. Were I a rightist I could have reminded you of Yasser Arafat in Johannesburg, May 10, 1994, where he uttered almost exactly the same words. Leaders' declarations do not necessarily always reflect their real thoughts, and sometimes aim rather at softening opposition.

However, I imagine in the Israeli case it stems from a culture of greed and lawlessness with no personal accountability. Note Ben Gurion's announcement in 1947 upon receiving Israel's UN share of Palestine, "We take now what the UN gives us, later we take the rest." Such ungratefulness and tribal self promtion. No one is going to accept that kind of aggression today and the violations in sovereign and human rights it entails. Thus Israeli arrogance and gall is about to take a nose dive and I most certainly agree it's beyond time as you points out. Dutch

I have no idea where you got that completely wrong information about German refugees after the world war II from. My parents were both dispossessed and expelled just like 12 Million Germans were after WW II. They were expelled from Czechoslovakia and what is today Poland (former eastern German Parts) and other counties. And there were many other conflicts in the world since the end of WW II were people were forced to flee losing their property on ethnical or nationalistic grounds. Though this is depict able it's a historical fact -the Palestinian refugees are not unique in this world! Yet for the sake of peace I don't carry a key to my old house with me!

That's it really....

Gideon, as usual, speaks for the Jewish conscience and soul. I, for one, find it comforting to know that not every Israeli thinks it is okay to murder Palestinians.

and advertised their war of annihilation to start this mess what would you suggest? who would you call the Nazi? Hamas TV show teaches kids to kill Jews - Jihad Watch26 Sep 2009 ... The bear puppet host, Nassur, of a Hamas children's TV program ..... This program says to kill all Jews, not just those living in Israel. ... www.jihadwatch.org/.../hamas-tv-show-teaches-kids-to-kill-jews.html - Cached - Similar

All those slavering quasi-fascists have a point -- although they don't quite put it like that. And so do you. Indeed, what Israel is doing now is morally inadmissible. But if that is granted, then how does one justify the process by which Israel was created in the first place? What is going on now always has gone on. To condemn Israel's behavior is to condemn the very creation of Israel. So the logic of your critics is entirely consistent; they support Israel's existence, and they support the behavior that made that existence possible. It is absurd to drive a people out of their house and then object to driving them out of the garage as well. Either both actions are just, or neither one is.

You serve Israel Gideon by remaining compassionate to the bone, but if Israel indulged in the luxury to live in your Ghandi-like fantasy, we would be muscled out of Israel only to float around the planet once again at the mercy of host countries. Is the what you would have of us? Is that the future I want for my child? No! Compassion has its place - right after the enemy surrenders.

a former Nazi who was my boss 40 years ago. He would muse about his days as an officer in Hitler's panzer division. He would tell me: "I was only trying to protect my family". I liked him. He wasn't a bad man. But he was terribly wrong.

It's good that Haaretz and Israel can host profound self criticism freely as exemplified by Gideon Levy's latest diatribe. It might be more credible and valuable if the Palestinians and Arabs as a whole had the same talent for self criticism and tolerance. Anyone comparable to Gideon on the other side who leveled criticism against the hateful, violent, anti semitic campaign the Arabs have been waging for 6 decades would be silenced or killed. That is the irony of Jewish self criticism, it inadvertently supports the enemy, whose hate and intransigence from the beginning is the cause of the mid east conflict. Gideon, shame on you. When will you start to criticism Palestinian's murderous intolerance within their own camp?

Extreme ideal criticism is always appropriate.. However it is one sided. Where is the interior criticism from within the Palestinian camp that points out their denial, hatred, annhilation? There is none, and that points out the profound disparity between the cultures. Israel and Judaism is democratic and pluralistic. The Arab culture is repressive, misogyonist,and devoted to the destruction of Israel. When they allow self criticism, yours too will be more welcome. In the meantime you are only encouraging anti Zionist parties.

While I am full of admiration for Gideon Levy who constututes out "national concious," and had he not existed, he should have been invented -- I still have to draw his attention to the fact that the Palestinians (especially Hamas who Mr. levy claims to be the true representative of the Palestinians)do not declare that they will leave us alone, if we leave them alone. Let Mr. levy be a second Avi Nathan -- an embassador of peace --- and bring from the Palestinians, including Hamas, a peace proposal that will be acceptable even by people like me, yosi sarid or Yosi beilin. And as long as this does not happen, Israel must continue the occupation with all its terrible side effects

Jews, during their 3000 years of history, conducted many different discussions, and proud of it. You, Mr. Levy, throw at the Jewish state of Israel false accusations and, after that, bravely look around in the search of approving crowd, which is always there on the smell of Jewish blood. This is your moral nadir to which you are declined.

..adherents committed outrageous violence against Jews. You are, Mr. Levy, asking false questions and providing false answers. Government of Israel has all rights, as any democratic government, to suspend any rights that used to violate rights of other people, especially Jewish people on their most sacred religious and historical place. It is even imaginable the government would prevent young Jews from going to the Western Wall, if it knows that these "young Jews" are going to pelt other people with stones. "Can Palestinians, too, dream of holding a "Jerusalem March" of their own?" you asking (as if you were born yesterday). Answer: yes, after Jews assured that they are not going to become corpses on the sidewalks of such "march". You are, Mr. Levy, want to teach Jewish people what kind of discussions they have moral rights to conduct, and what kind they have not. Indeed, you do not have any moral right to do that because it is blatantly immoral.

But he does not qualify: little lies do not amount for the big truth. "Where did we get the gall to decide the fate of another people?", asks Mr. Levy. False, Mr. Levy... The question that the prophet should ask: "Who dare to have the gall to decide the fate of Jewish People?" And the fate of Jewish people tied to the Land of Israel like the fate of a fetus via umbilical cord to the mother. No "another people" except of Jewish has the right to that Land, which you Mr. Levy call "territories", like it is some kind of "terra incognita". Jewish towns and villages you call "settlements", like inhabitants of them arrived to this "terra incognita" on some kind of "Mayflower". You scorn the police chief Aharon Franco, but he is ten-fold more intellectual person than you are, Haaretz icon, because Aharon Franco correctly implies that it is only the great Jewish magnanimity and humanity that allow foreign religion adherents to pray on the most sacred place of Judaism, even after those...

Now's the time for Westerners who claim to be antiracist and committed to human rights to stand w/ the witnesses to Islam's darker side. To do so requires a universal standard of human rights and abandon our loyalty to multicultural relativism, which justifies, even romanticizes, indigenous Islamist barbarism, totalitarian terrorism and the persecution of women, religious minorities, homosexuals and intellectuals. Our refusal to judge between civilization and barbarism, and between enlightened rationalism and theocratic fundamentalism, endangers and condemns the victims of Islamic tyranny.

Amen to that, and hopefully there will be a day when both of our people can live in freedom, and free of violence. Co-existence is possible and one day, it will come true.

"It starts at school. We are reaping the pollution we have sown..." Peace, sh, peace! shalom.

Does nobody feel how bad the word "pals" is? You are talking about persons that simply want to live their life. Persons with children and names. On average they do you no greater harm than living on the land you envy and having the wrong faith. The gotspe is that many of the "pals" are the decendants of the people from biblical Israel. Even your language is similar.

Israel got the gall from their existence constantly being threatened by these extremist Muslims. The Ottoman Empire lost WW I and lost control of the Holy Land. The Brits than took control and the UN finally helped recreate the Jewish state. Since when are losers of a war entitled to govern what they think should be theirs? Especially when history does not back up their claims? Sixty years of welfare and for what? Who's the stupid ones here?

Gideon, I fear in the years to come I have to read many more articles like this from you. The Haaretz website is great for getting information but even in Haaretz your ideas seem to be a minority. The editors even do not notice that even their view is influenced by years of war propaganda. Would you have written this as "talk back" nobody would ever seen this. I respect your views a lot, and admire your honesty and tenacity (and I bookmark this page), Still fighting from within one day will become ineffective.

"where did we get the gall to decide the fate of another people?" Caesar had a lot of gaul; but Gideon Levi's people invented chutzpah! Seriously, I hope his article reflects a new awareness in Israel today of the depths to which Israel's power-mongerong has dragged her people. Else I fear for Israel. When a nation collapses from within, the first thing to go is her morality. It is replaced by cold political expediency.

the truth is in the middle. don't you all see that both of you are right. GL IS CORRECT despite his extreme slant, and so is the outraged readership by his one sidedness and lack of balance. both sides have a lot to be ashamed of, and a lot to be proud of as well. the future needs this truth to be the hub of a new reality. no more finger pointing and debating the history... for the childrens sake we must accept one anothers presence, and build (from admission of all of our past errors) a fair future for both nations learning from our past ill advised decisions and faults. we are two great nations with beautiful people and glorious histories... we can overcome. salaam-shalom-love-ahava-peace

Nothing can be added to this amazing article and it does pierce through with it's moral clarity but again, the Israel of today is not only hardened by militarism, chauvinsm, and unbridled aggression, but also by a cold dose of denial. The voice of Levy in my view echos louder in moral certitude than ANY Jewish prophet in all the Torah because this is not a ancient theoritical exercise but he is expressing views that effect the lives of millions. The provocative questions Levy posses - " who gives Isreael the right", is one that will live in infamy once the final chapter of this conflict is written.

so many I read and talk to tell me how backward, how belligerent, how much better it is to be under Israeli rule.. Gideon is right to ask as he does. The very notion that they have to earn their European Brownie points is such a warped perspective. When will we realize that we need peace deals for ourselves. Not to drag the enemy into being one of us.

As long as people keep saying the problem is settlements and occupation there will never be a solution! The problem is not settlements and occupation. The problem is that the Arabs are not committed to peace - plain and simple the Arabs are not committed to peace. If the Arabs were committed to peace they would be willing to compromise for peace!! The Arabs were never required to make concrete concessions!! The fact is that if the Arabs saw peace as a value they would be preaching love, tolerance and respect in mosques and schools. They wouldn't be calling streets after suicide bombers!! Israel is always required to make concrete concessions: In 1956 we gave bk the Sinai. In 1982 we gave bk the sinai again. In Oslo we gave land to the PA. In 2005 we gave up Gush Katif. By Israel making these unbelievable gestures we showed how valuable peace is to Israel. The Arabs keep claiming that they are the victims, so they don't have to make concessions!! The road to peace is to require that the Arabs accept that they are at fault in this conflict and that they must make concessions!! The Arabs are 100% at fault for the Palestinian -Israeli conflict. The Arabs said no to peace in 1947 with the partition plan. The Arabs said NO NO NO in 1967 at Khartom! The Arabs said no in 2000 in Camp David! The solution will come when we stop feeling that Israel has to give up everything. Israel must demand that the PA makes serious concessions 1) Accepting that Israel is not going bk to 67 borders 2) Israel will keep the IDF on the Jordan border 3) Jews can establish a house of worship on the Temple mount and share rights just like in Maarat Hamachpelah

Israel, bad, Palestinians good. GL forgets the wars against Israel, the Palestinians unwilling to have their state since 1948. The intransigeance of Arafat & successors to make peace among their factions & want peace for their people. The Arab world using the Palestinians to further their claim that Israel should not exist. All the manipulations of human rights at the UN, only Israel cited when moslem countries are the worst offenders.The arming by Iran of Hezbollah & Hamas. Sderot. The shaheed brain washing & mentality that put palestinians & extreme arabs at odds with living at peace in a democracy that is not governed by Sharia laws. In this snake pit, it's a miracle Israel is still standing. As all the extreme lefties, GL is judging out of context, treating the pals like innocent children who have not the same standards of democracy than the rest of us, so cannot be judged by the same criteria.

Mr. Levy, Why is it that you refuse to acknowledge what the world does to a Jew who will not stand up for himself? Maybe you should re-read Netanyahu's UN speech one more time.

Thank you for your article Mr Levy, thank you for your clarity on the 'situation'. You helped a Jerusalem resident feel less alone in her thoughts during this time of pride in the Jewish heart in Jerusalem, and the trashing of the lives of those who do not aggree. We will pay dearly for our actions, and we will hurl accusations of anti-semitism to those who dare question our divine right. We will pay dearly. At some stage, the bar and the gym will have to be housed together, it will be unsafe to move between them..

Would rather have my actions driven by gall than the hatred, violence, ignorance of the past, awful decision making and complete lack of responsibility for ones actions which have characterized your people/ancestors from a time long before israel was even a state let alone "occupied" anything....that is to say, if it were only gall, that is a pathetical dismissal and nothing mor

people who fire rockets at it? Israel hasn't ceded ANY territory in its history Petra. It vacated Sinai, which was legally Egyptian territory. Ditto south Lebanon, which was legally Lebanese territory. Ditto Gaza, which is legally Palestinian territory. It couldn't legally keep them. You seem to have a little difficulty with understanding international law (John from Kansas too). You can neither cede/annex a territory you conquer nor settle it without the consent of the territory's rightful government. (In the case of Palestine, the PA is the recognised de facto government). Belligerent occupation is only a temporary measure, so Israel cannot hang on to Palestine or the Golan indefinitely either. Talk of Israel annexing this and ceding that is just wishful thinking, it has no legality whatsoever and never will have in international law. Simples, eh?

Once again Gideon Levy found the real culprit in the Middle East. And the usual suspect is, of course Israel. Has it ever occurred to Mr. Levy that the Palestinians share the blame for their own misery in Gaza? As I recall, Mr. Levy was one of the strongest proponents of the withdrawal from Gaza. Has it considered the fact that after that unilateral withdrawal the Palestinians had the choice to use it as a lever to accelerate the Peace process? That they could have used that opportunity to engage in a dialogue and a commercial cooperation rather than launching Qassams and mortar attacks? How convenient to always blame Israel!

Gideon must be running out of anti Israel material so now he is scraping the bottom of the barrel...to heck with facts...to heck with the truth...somewhere somehow he has completely forgotten the history of why Israel is in the position that they find themselves in. Gideon cannot seem to put down the words that reflect the truth...it has nothing to do with gall but has everything to do with survival. When someone comes at you with the intent to kill and destroy most sane minded people react and want to preserve their status. To berate the idea of self preservation and to raise the flag for hatred and bigotry and destruction of a people as their goal is really sick. The word gall applies to the palestinians and their islamic/jihadist handlers not to Israel. Gideon if you feel so uncomfortable in the lap of luxury and a good life leave Israel and live with the people who wish you a very short and uncomfortable future.

The response to the question Raised by Gideon by some strikes me as very strange. It seems that, in their minds, it is legitimate for the victor in battle to dictate to the defeated how they should live and what rights thry have. Doesn't this mean that the palestinians have a vested interest in defeating and occupying the state of Israel so they can dictate to the Jewish people whther or not Israel should exist? A double edged sword cuts both ways.

Gideon, without you many of us in the Diaspora would feel that Israelis had lost all sense of ethical awareness. What Israel is doing is a chillul haShem, a true desecration of God's name, of the ethical and spiritual heritage of the Jewish people, and of the martyrs of our people throughout the ages who kept to Judaism precisely because it had not succumbed to the logic of power and cruelty that ruled the world. It is a tragedy today to hear so many Jews defending policies of oppression that are cruel and heartless and compassionless by saying "yes, but look at how terrible our enemies are--one must be realistic." The whole point of being Jewish is to proclaim to the world that the ways of the world can and should be changed, that justice, peace and love should rule the world, not power and domination. If we can't stay true to that, then there is no right to call Israel a "Jewish" state, but only a state with a lot of psychologically wounded Jews who are wounding others.

Gideon are you the ONLY moral compass left in Isreal? Bless your tongue for always speaking the truth.

The only solution most of these posts will recognize is one state, from the Mediterranean to the Jordan. Democracy for all therein. And no, the Palestinians aren't going to move to the moon. If that's what you want, your going to have to live with being a minority in your own country.

You say the Palestinians decided their own fate, implying they should simply give up on their rights and property, yielding to the Zionist machine. Instead, they have refused to act like puppets, demanding justicec.Bravo! As to 1948, unlike other wars in the 20th century, Israel did not let refugees return; instead it misappropriated their property and gave it to its own citizens. Political control is one thing, but private property ownership is another. German refugees did not lose their property after WWII. This justified the 1967 war on the Pal side. In 1994, Israel expected the Palestinians to gratefully accept that portion of what has been stolen from them that it was willing to cede as though it was being generous. Thieves offering to return part of what they stole is not generous. Many issues would have been unresolved. Israel expected Gazans to be grateful in 2005 while their brothers on the WB remained occupied. Instead, they retained solidarity.

Yup, go to Gaza, and try to do your free speech act there. Try and meet and talk freely with anyone and everyone, then try and get it published in a paper. Hah. That's the difference. You are exploiting freedom of Speech and taking a one sided jaundiced view of a complex multifacted issue against your own people. You might be embraced by Hamas, but I dare you to find people brave enough to talk freely with you for publication. For a good reason. They value their lives.

Gideon Levy's voice of truth and courage should be the true voice of Israel - the Israel of humanity and compassion of Hebrew tradition. Thank you.

... Sitting down and talking rationally about carving out a realistic chunk of what remains of the WB, or drawing a line around what they demand and all-out fighting for it. Pride prevents the first way, power prevents the second way. The concept of waiting to be "given" a state is not surprising. The UNRWA has accustomed generations to thinking this is normal behavior.

Mr. Levy - as always - frames the question in a skewed and cynical way. The so-called 'gall' has been thrust upon Israel by the rest of the world demanding that Israel make peace without an actual partner. I suppose it was real chutzpa for Israel to disengage from Gaza, according mr. Levy's logic.

....for reminding me, and no doubt a few others who look on from outside, and care, that there are still some people in Israel who retain a human identity aside from their narrow blinkered view of what constitutes their interests.

Gideon...when you, and I'm paraphrasing here, ask when does one "free" being have the right to decide the doing or life of another "free" being. Well, when I live in a country a little over 8,500 sq miles and I'm surrounded by four other heavly populated same race nations that identify with my enemies that have tried to eliminate my people for more than just the past 60 years. It breaks beyond the question you ask and realms into the evolutionary or God given right/instinct to do what it takes or whatever it takes to ensure the safety and more so the survival of my family. Now I now you can argue and debate to the same outcome that they have a right to be here just as much or more so than us. So the truth of the matter, after putting aside all the politness and political correctness, is that really...really when the smoke clears all that will matter is who and whos family will remain. And I can pretty f***ing well garantee we will do our best that it will be our children to see peace.

what happens if an intruder builds on the roof of my house while i am away if a moske was built by the turcks on top of the acropolis , i am sure that it would be demolished when greeks got back their country.

Most of the Israelis are not right wing. But most of them don't identify with Gideon Levi either. He is not a regular left wing. He is an extreme leftist, who can be compared to the radical left in Europe. He identifies completely with the Palestinian side in this conflict, he shows no interest in the Israeli suffering and as such is not taken seriously here.He belongs to a tiny minority of Israelis who undermine Israel's existence.

Everyone sees and the international community knows the hypocracy of these actions. This is why American Jewish community is moving away from decades of "blind support." This behavior of treating Palestinians could be seen as a short term possible "win" but it's a long term "definite lost." Dear Petra: You posted & I'm paraphrasing "no country would cede land to another people who shoot rockets into their nation." Petra this doesn't happen any other place on the globe. Secondly, throughout history that provocation would result in war and there's an outcome. Israel and Gaza is like a bad movie that repeats itself..again again

Gideon, you are asking how Israel has the gall to dictate on how to treat the Pals. Well, they lost the many wars with Israel and because of which they are or should be annexed to Israel as their new borders. I say, those who do not like being told what to do by their new government, move out and join their brothers where they can do what they want.

I agree with what you say. Could you elaborate a little on what you mean by this interesting thought: '...the left has been unsuccessful in bringing the Palestinians aboard and they pay the consequences.'

Left wing Jews are effectively an isolated group in the Mideast. Neither the Palestinians nor right-wing Jews are interested in their solutions. They both want all the territory.The winner wins. The loser who has not changed intentions regarding having all the territory is oppressed. The Israeli left can only find consolation in like-minded Western countries which is why they look to them for imposed solutions. The left directs its anger against the Israeli right but in fact the left has been unsuccessful in bringing the Palestinians aboard and they pay the consequences.

This briljant essay is probably to difficult for the majority of hatefilled responders here. But it contains an indisputable truth in every word and sentence. Gideon Levy is the moral guide for the peace loving minority in Israel, like Havel was for Tjecho-Slowakia, before the iron curtain came down. Maybe -oneday - he can lift the veil from the face of everybody who is looking away from the daily tragedy in Gaza. He who doesn't want to see, what's there for his own eyes, has no right to dispute the words of this brave man.

I don't think it is chutzpa. It is indifference. (Maybe indifference as a way of survival). People with some decision power in Israel, are either disconnected from the reality that happens 20 km eastwards, not wanting to compromise on their relative calm between some their latte and their next weekend in a Spa in the north of Israel, or either some messianic fanatics.

Gideon, although you live in a house built on stolen Arab land, which I feel smacks of hypocrisy, thank you for this piece of openness and honesty -- having done work in the WB and Gaza, I am always astounded and outraged when I return each night to Jerusalem, having witnessed house demolitions, land confiscations, or the brutality and arrogance dished out at checkpoints, to see Israeli Jews carrying on their lives with complete disregard for what's happening just a 20 minute drive away and beyond. When the rest of the world sees this and challenges Israel -- and that day is on its way -- I can imagine how quickly the Israel's arrogance will become shame. Your recent pieces will become prophetic.

It isn't Israel that has decided the palestinian's fate, although the palestinians have tried to decide Israel's. They have doomed themselves by an agenda that is more important than the welfare and stability of their own people. If future events were to cause Israel to cease as a nation, the state of the palestinians would be to bare to rise in its place.

They could have had their own country in 1948, but they didn't want it. Instead, they fought against Israel's existence resulting in thousands of their own people becoming refugees. They could have had their own country in 1994, but they didn't. Instead, they chose to engage in yet another intafada resulting in the peace process being closed for yet another decade. They had a chance at peace in 2005, when Israelis were forcibly removed from the Gaza Strip in 2005. Instead, they elected the terror group Hamas resulting in more degradation and suffering of their own people.

We take our right to play with the lives of others completely for granted because the people we model ourselves upon constantly convey to us the idea that this is normal. Teachers teach it in the schools, media analysts and pundits have never even questioned that such a stance is problematic and the problems we do face are ones that show us to ourselves as we wish to be seen: compassionate to our (Jewish) poor and our sick, outraged by mistreatment of Ethiopian immigrants in Petah Tikva schools, saddened and galvanised by the misfortunes of the earthquaked and tsunamied far, far away, compassionate with the occasional terminally sick cancer patient who, even when Gazan or Iranian, can no longer hurt us. It starts at school. We are reaping the pollution we have sown; the season of Nobel laureates will be over in a year or two.

The Muslims have more liberties in Israel than many of their own nations. If they don't like it, they can move. NO ARAB DICTATES TO ISRAEL, EVER!!! They can howl,cry, stomp their feet and hold their breath until they're blue in the face. ISRAEL WILL NOT CEDE ANY MORE LAND TO THE PEOPLE WHO FIRE ROCKETS INTO ISRAEL. NO NATION WOULD.

if one was equivocating about who's right and who's wrong, your article makes it easy to decide. you're protraying us falsely.if one owns a slave and he only has one pillow,judaism directs one to give it to the slave. that's who we are. the slave institution was undesirable but an unfortunate universal reality. judaism tries to mollify it with the rights of the slave in sight. the palenstinians aren't slaves but we try to mollify their foreign presence in our land. to protray any other way is incorrect and malicious.

firstly, after defeating them in their attempts to destroy Israel; and secondly, after their refusal to do anything to achieve anything resembling a constructive, productive autonomy.

Gideon Levy's article should shame Israel, yet I fear Israel has no shame. That it can conduct this horror and perpetuate it all these months and years can only be a lasting stain on a once proud nation. End the occupation; recognize East Jerusalem as the capital of a new state of Palestine and stand tall once again.

This op-ed of Gideon's this time really reaches a new low. Israel acts and always acted in pure self defense while dealing with Arab aggression that kills innocent Israelis for a very long time now.

....it's called "chutzpah". A certain amount of it is definitely tolerable, but if you cross the line once in a while (as the state of Israel surely has done over the past years), the International community will have no other choice but to step in.....