Educating toward indoctrination

It seems to me you really should start cutting the b.s. what do you think did happen and would happen to Jews and Jewish kids in Arab countries.

OH GIVE ME A BREAK. As oppossed to what, the surrounding nations that are raised on "the truth" and taught to "think independantly". The writer needs to review a 11th Grade US History book, then go talk to the Russians about how WW II was won. History is written by victor. - Winston Churchill

Greg, Israel should be supremely thankful for a million highly educated ashkenasis from the FSU. Israel wouldn't be a high-tech, academic, and cultural world power without them. Come to think of it, Israel simply wouldn't be without them. Only stupid, narrow-minded people can't appreciate these facts . Do I detect "a bisel kayn"?

In the same issue, Haaretz has a headline " Arabic studies to become compulsory in Israeli schools". At a first glance a reasonable person would think "Are these people schizos, or just incompetent?"

Is this what we send our children into every day?!

One who does not teach the truth is not a teacher but an indictrinator. If, in fact, Israel's school texts do not tell the truth about its far and recent history, I am put in mind of America's texts which glossed over slavery, labor abuses, and the ultimate rejection of society by the adults when they discover they have been systematically lied to. A very dangerous future awaits the text authors and their children. This issue needs to be rethought.

Let's say a thief steals a laptop from me. I denounce him to the cops, but those corrupt cops do nothing. Then I get my laptop back -by force. Then I am being called a thief, for merely retrieving something that was mine in the first place. Is it humanistic to teach that we must forgive the first aggressor, and that a first aggressor can get away with it, and that defense and retaliation -and therefore EQUALITY are not values at all? So an attacker has all rights and a defender has none?

Because mine learn exactly as they should in a free and liberal country and are quite well informed. Arab is 2 of my kids second foreign language and they are fascinated by culture and history of the Arab world (taught at school). My guess is this editorial's writer has no kids in school and longs for indoctrination - but from the radical left...

In contrast with the "Palestinian perspective of the Nakba". How dishonest can your editorial be? Why wasn't it Israeli perspective of the Nakba? Or would prefer unsterile Palestinian narrative?

Armenian Genocide needs to be recognized or this will be a weapon in the hands of the anti-Semites around the world.

Political Correctness has poisoned Israel just like every other modern state. Every child is raised to hate themselves, love the hordes and long for their complete extermination at the hands of the oh so noble savages. To find Peace, in the Grave. The sheep finds the safety with shepherd, until he chops them up to make stew.

It is quite telling what is not written in Haaretz. For real news we need to follow the blogs were information is leaked. Haaretz can still have an opinion but has to be silent about many obvious facts.

Well, be thankful, Haaretz, they haven't shut you down like they would have in Iran. An excellent, excellent editorial.

Gideon Sa'ar was at the recent Holocaust conference for educators around the world and he knows the issues discussed: "During the course of the conference, numerous questions were addressed, including: How should international organizations grapple with Holocaust denial? How should they respond to those who wish to diminish the Holocaust? Should visiting Holocaust-related sites be compulsory for high school students? Should educational authorities co-fund these trips? How do we teach about different historical contexts without a competition between the suffering of victims of different totalitarian regimes? How do we avoid falling into the pattern of always referring to the Jewish people as victims? By marking a few Holocaust memorial days over the course of the year, are we highlighting or diminishing its meaning?" Armenian Weekly Yossi Sarid was a better Minister of Education; at least he acknowledged the Armenian genocide. Turkey, btw, did not attend the conference because it was after the flotilla incident; Turkey, which still cannot reconcile with the Armenians. When you cannot feel the pain and suffering of each other, peace and reconciliation will never happen. Einstein warned about the dangers of nationalism when Israel was founded. Nationalism can only be replaced with international cooperation. I wonder how long that will take to happen.

Communism does not disappear in 1 day. Russian Jews will say they are not, but they are as "Soviet" as Putin.

Armenians were hurt the recent Holocaust conference in Israel did not have any Armenians on the panel to discuss the Armenian genocide. Armenians have hosted genocide discussions in the USA that included Holocaust survivors, survivors from Rwanda, etc. and Armenian survivors. They are very interesting and educational because people hear all their stories. It's true that being the eternal victim is fascist and nationalistic and does not allow compassion for others who have suffered. Palestinians know the story of the Armenians and have helped save some; it would be easy for them to understand the story of the Armenians and Jews both in the context of history if it were presented to them. Also, Israel has to understand the pain and suffering of Palestinians; it is each understanding the pain and suffering of the other that brings about peace.

I remeber a scene in Fellini's film, "Amacord" of his youth growing up in fascist Italy, a society so much admired by jabotinsky, netanyahu's mentor. It shows the facsist youth group in a hugh open area, in their blue and whites, holding hoops as they do caleisthenics to improve the health and vigour of the communal state. La Giovenezza is playing in the background. Of course as part of their souped up zionist curriculum, the reishon l'tzion, would probably have some input on what zionist mixed groups can modestly wear in public. That's a factor Mussolini didnt have to contend with, but damn, all Italian youth knew the story of Mussolinis heroic campaign to restore the national honour and distiny in their takeover and colonisation of Albania and Ethiopia.

Is it the secular Jewish Israel who care less for anything but kochav nolad (Israeli version of Idol) or hisardut (survivor)? Is it the secular Russian Israel who have their own agenda. Or is it the conservative Zionist Israel, who care about the future of the Jewish state and are pro-active? Which Israel are you talking about Haaretz? Because if you are referring to the third group who are less than 20 percent of kids, then your reporting leaves a lot to be desired and is also an indictment on the lack of ideology of the left.

Thou shalt not steal, from your neighbor nor anyone else... Though shalt not disinherit thy neighbor, nor anyone else... Thou shalt let the goi and the ger live among you, without inspecting tsitsiot daily... It's called civilization...

The Shoah taught us not to trust any body and not to rely on anybody, but sporadic goodness and bravery did exist. This Haaretz is what you forget while ignoring the fact that Arab kids do not know anything about the Shoah nor do they ever visit Yad Vasheem. Tolerance is indeed important to be taught but so is zionism and nationalism which means to be proud of your country. The Nakba was the sole fault of the Arabs and when this is taught we should remember who choose war and who wanted peace!!

This is the real issue of educational indoctrination. Im Tirtzu make a huge stink about a few university professors and the material that they place before a small number of adult students. Meanwhile, all of our children are being systematically indoctrinated into a narrow, tribalist, uncritical worldview in which anything that is 'good for the Jews' is automatically morally good. Those who criticize university professors for not presenting a balanced view or for discouraging alternative perspectives, have no problem whatsoever with the enforced conformity of our school system and the ongoing efforts of Education Minister Sa'ar to militarise the classroom to an ever greater extent. This is not education in the proper sense but manipulation of young minds.

TEACH ME TOO THAT HOW CAN I FORGIVE THOSE STUPID SELFISH PEOPLE. TEACH ME TOO ! what is your name brother ?

.. to learn to love itself EVERYTIME WITHOUT ARRONGANCE.

Sure! Of course! Its too bad though that the Education Ministry cant rewrite the history books in the US and European countries. Good luck with the rewrite of the israeli history books. If it helps.

Well of course. Truth wouldn't be a very good idea, would it?

It seems that nothing changed since Haj Al-Ameen Al-Husseni's Nazi propaganda, Ikrima Sabri is another carbon copy of the original Muftis: "Oh, Allah, destroy America for it is controlled by Zionist Jews...Allah will avenge, in the name of his Prophet, the colonialist settlers who are the descendants of monkeys and pigs...forgive us, oh Muhammad, for the acts of these monkeys and pigs who wished to profane your holiness". (from the weekly Friday prayer sermon by PA Mufti Ikrima Sabri broadcast on the official PA radio station the Voice of Palestine, July 11, 1997. When comparing Sabri with his predecessors before him, it is understood that much in common they have since Islamic fundamentals are what fuels their speeches and rhetoric. One could fairly say in Palestine "once a Mufti always a Mufti". "Israeli authorities... infected by injection 300 Palestinian children with the HIV virus during the years of the Intifada." (Friday prayer sermon by PA Mufti Ikrima Sabri from the Temple Mount(Al-Aqsa Mosque) broadcasted on the official PA radio station the Voice of Palestine, July 11, 1997.). "Jerusalem is a symbol for every Muslim in the world. The claim of the Jews to the right over it is false, and we recognize nothing but an entirely Islamic Jerusalem under Islamic supervision..." (PA Mufti Ikrama Sabri, Al-Bilad, July 31, 1997) "The Zionist entity exists on seized land. The Jews remain enemies because they expropriate lands, build settlements and pay high sums to buy properties. They are the greatest enemies of us Muslims." (PA Mufti Ikrama Sabri in a newspaper interview (The New York Times, May 18, 1997) "The existing State of Israel is not worthy of ruling since they know no religion and no God." (Sheikh Hamid Al-Bitawi, chairman of the Palestine Religious Scholars Association and head of the PA's Sharia Court of Appeals in Nablus, in an interview with the official PA newspaper Al-Hayat Al-Jadeeda, July 27, 1997.) "...The Jews always set a trap for the community of Muslims... The Koran repeatedly warns against the traps and plots of the "people of the book". They relentlessly scheme in all times and places and this is what they do today and tomorrow against the Muslim camp..." (An excerpt from the weekly Friday prayer sermon at Al-Aqsa mosque broadcast on the official PA radio station the Voice of Palestine, October 24, 1997).

It's little wonder Israel has dug itself into a very, very, very deep hole, blindly aided and abetted by the US veto vote in the UNSC .... If Israel's next generation of leaders are fed the same fallacious twaddle spouted by the people in power now, heaven help our Jewish homeland state and kiss the basic tenets of Judaism in Israel goodbye ... Almost everything for the last 62 years, has been a LIE .... http://talknic.wordpress.com/ ... the only way Israel can become a shining light, is to clear away the BS

Exclusively. This is called "education", and it's the same proper education that all Jews everywhere have had for thousands of years. Pity that your children don't get that. Pity for them. Your ancestors knew better.

During the past few years of armed conflict the Palestinian Authority [PA] has been making a paramount effort to convince their own children that there is no greater achievement than to die for Allah in battle, known as Shahada. "Ask for death" has been the PA's message to its children via all the media at its disposal, including children's TV broadcasting, the educational system, cultural programmes, directives from political and religious leaders and even from within the family. Polls show 72- 80% of Palestinian children would sacrifice their lives for Allah. The PA has done everything in its power to teach hatred to adult and young minds; a monstrosity of historical proportions, planting the seeds of the next war. And all youre worried about is Nakba is not taught? are you really losing it?

Stop saying what you think is wrong. Start saying why, in your left opinion, Jews have any right to live here. UN 47 resolution maybe? Well, the UN can simply revoke it, or can add that also Armenians, North Koreans or Curds should be accepted here "en masse". Besides, the UN doesn't have any right to take land from Palestinians. A hypothetical peace treaty maybe? Any such would be coerced, and obtained under duress. Its like bursting into one's home, and saying "I agree to split it with you". The Holocaust maybe? Sounds like "someone killed my grandparents, so I have the rights to half of yours home". The truth is that without invoking history, the left cannot justify its own mere existence in Israel. So stop patronizing us, and clean up your own backyard.

these unthinking imbeciles are dooming our children to be like them - uncritical, unthinking, and essential doomed to die out. Unfortunately, they'll be taking our children with them.

However, kids grow physically and mentally and they hone their own opinions. Also, even as kids, the school room is not the only input of information. The truth will out.

"Holocaust studies have been expanded to "strengthen Jewish identity," while any reference to the wider context of the rise of European fascism has been omitted" - Now consider that it's not JUST the Jewish identity, it's purpose is also to reinforce the sense of Jewish victimhood and a concept of perpetual suffering at the hands of the world..."us against them". And the wider view of fascism and its dangers, especially the details of its many individual elements - indoctrination in schools/the media/the arts, nationalism, silencing of opposition movements, laws aimed at excluding minorities, etc... - might very well hit a bit too close to home...and be a bit too familiar. If you really think about the things you've pointed out, together with everything else that's been going on in Israel over the last 18 months or so, it takes no stretch of the imagination to envision where it's all leading. And as long as Israelis keep falling into line like they have been, whether by complacency or misdirected patriotism, it's going to get there - to know the despise of the world.

... oh wait, we've already established that academics are left-wing traitors. Therefore, there should be no history books at all!