Comment / Why Netanyahu really does want to advance peace

Every politician wants to be "the peace pol" same as they want to the "the education pol" It's become a safe category: no displaced people left behind, children included. Peace and a Palestinian nation are still, alas, a house of cards waiting for that next puff of recidivist air. It takes roots for grass to grow; nations, and peace, are nurtured from the source. The Palestinian and Israeli communities are saddled with demagogic parties and figureheads which mirror the other side. A plague on all the false houses; after all, their presence has only been a plague on all of Israel and the Palestinians as well. Begin with jobs and education (how about a rebuilding program for the Palestinians in the mode of the CCC and NRA of 1930s America--or of pioneering Israel, does anyone remember?), and bring forth peoples and communities with the will and equipment to move on. Or is this too frightening a prospect for the respective establishements to bear???

which I for one hope they do. Then they must realize that the time for peace is almost past. If they wish to deny the Palestinians a soverign state then the consequence of that is assimilating the West Bankers into Israel. These are simply the two choices. Since there are a half a million settlers who I am sure won't go quietly so it will probably mean civil war. All the West Bankers will want to know once the become Israeli citizens is "Where do we vote" End of Israels ethnic character! so make peace now or direct them to the voting stations later.

But I hope I am wrong

Michael, just exactly what is the color of the sky in your world? Peace is the last thing Abbas and company desires, and Bibi knows that. Those clowns would only find "peace" in the destruction of Israel, and Bibi must do anything to prevent that.

because is how the strong feels. So secure of it's own strenght that they forget the opportunity to have a good agreement with the enemy. Then, the cycle of life let's the enemy to get stronger and to destroy you. Just peace could save israel from the catastrophe. But Israelis are so self-confident......

This is precisely one of the most important reasons why Netanyahu appointed Michael Oren ambassador to the United States. Erev Tov Moishe (Thomas) Goldstein

Remember the idiotic Rhodesia Army. They would never allow the blacks to take over their country but in the end, poor leadership of its Political and Military spheres guaranteed a loss. The same thing happened in South Africa and a Truth and Reconciliation Commission and the same thing will happen in Israel for we naively believe our politicans and army can hold back the inevitable. We could share with the Palestinians now, but we're too dumb for that like the Rhodesians and South AFricans were so our fate will be the same as theirs.

I don't know when the last time you were to San Francisco or LA or Seattle. But urban sprawl is not unknown. And all three have huge vertical challenges though not of this magnitude. After the conquest of 67, Bethlehem was not cut off and surrounded from the rest of the West Bank nearly to the extent it is today cut off and surrounded by the ever-expanding "city" of Jerusalem. I have no doubt that Netanyahu will call anything Jerusalem to deny the coming into existence of a sovereign and independent Palestine. I put nothing beyond him and his Likud cronies to dispossess Palestinians and call 'disputed' whatever is needed to destroy hope for a Palestine that is viable.

You spout complete nonsense over and over. "the 1922 mandate terms based on san remo 1920 and the balfour declaration 1917" None said a Jewish 'state'. None! nil! nought ! nada! nothing!

There is no hope for the Jewish state surviving in the nastiest neighborhood in the world if it presents itself as inwardly irresolute and unwilling to engage in war. The Arab adversary should always be fully aware that Israel is resolute, steadfast and more ready to wage war than agree to a fraudulent peace. If the Arab and Muslim world rejects Israel, it must live with the consequences of its enmity and become the ultimate loser. A Jewish state, which no longer seeks to make peace at any price will prosper and grow. It will also engender respect from both its friends and its enemies. As to the Palestinians peoplehood: http://xrl.us/berwte

a diplomatic struggle versus iran? defense backing against iran? are you kidding me? how stupid can you possibly be? containment with iran will never work. Appeasement doesn't work..and your notion that to let iran build nukes because you have a promised defense umbrella is ludicrous...but then you're a leftist and defacto, you dont really have a clue about anything real...all you offer are hollow ideas and words..the ONLY answer is to totally destroy irans facilities and hope that over the next few years barackio can somehow bring real regime change with and to the people of iran.

the envy arises from the fact that my country is,more or less,pursuing your policies and strategy. the first question is,since you have repeatedly called for transfer of non-jews from palestine,where in those "treaties" do you find such an article? the second,crucial question is,since israel has always aspired to the same,namely israel in all palestine,all jewish,why do you think it as not annexed and incorporated all of west-bank and golan?then transfered?could it be a matter of reality,of feasability?what is stopping israel from adopting your measures,so dear and near to its heart?

But Michael, even if Israel left the West Bank that wouldn't bring peace. For one thing Abbas has made it very clear that the "right of return" for some 5,000,000 Palestinians to Israel proper is non negotiable. So if Israel left the West Bank, Abbas would break off negotiations until Israel agreed to that as well. And that wouldn't bring peace. Hamas (supported by so many Palestinians and so much of the world) wants Israel out of the middle east.

VH: Explains how land became palestinian when they didnt exist in 1967 or 1948? They existed from the day the Palestine Mandate came into being. People who lived in Palestine were called Palestinians, strangely enough. VH: then he explains why the un charter of 1945 ratified the 1922 mandate terms based on san remo 1920 and the balfour declaration 1917? I didn't actually explain that at all. Didn't need to, the facts are well known. The Balfour declaration signalled an intention, it has no legal status. It is otiose. San Remo has no relevance at all, it didn't decide anything relevant and anyway was not binding on any parties. It too is otiose. The only binding thing of relevance is the UN resolutions. No doubt this is why V Hardman tries so hard to promote daily these spurious red herrings.

living in Gilo in their 1948 war It is NOT a new Jewish area. Arabs from Beit Jala have used it for target practice at Israeli civillians needless to say.

in fact from the strategical high ground concerning Gilo you are absolutely right. Thats what I stated several times about the Golan Heights. As an Israeli I would never give up because I do not trust the Syrians. B U T and here is Fortuna probaly right - is this the best timing to bring an extension of Gilo on the table. Is this a part of a poker game as Fortuna mentioned ? The furniture salesman has to rethink his tactics for the good of Israel.

explains how land became palestinian when they didnt exist in 1967 or 1948? then he explains why the un charter of 1945 ratified the 1922 mandate terms based on san remo 1920 and the balfour declaration 1917?

first there's the palestinians.they categorically refuse a state,in the west-bank and gaza strip,linked,and a jerusalem arrangement.second the dreaded syrians-they refuse golan heights,some monitoring on or about mt.hermon(in case they attack israel all alone)and a water-sharing scheme(they want israel to have it all).finally the lebanese want israel to keep its little bits(simple neighbourly generosity)and to generally lord it over them. not all is lost however-one out of four peace advancers is a fair start.

Hamas TV show teaches kids to kill Jews - Jihad Watch26 Sep 2009 ... The bear puppet host, Nassur, of a Hamas children's TV program ..... This program says to kill all Jews, not just those living in Israel. ... www.jihadwatch.org/.../hamas-tv-show-teaches-kids-to-kill-jews.html - Cached - PMW Bulletins23 Sep 2009 ... Hamas teaches kids to kill Jews ... The bear puppet host, Nassur, of a Hamas children's TV program used different words for ?slaughter? to describe ... First the bear explains that all Jews must be ?erased from our land. ... www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=157&doc_id=1339 - Cached - Hamas TV show teaches kids to kill Jews. // Current22 Sep 2009 ... "Hamas teaches kids to kill Jews," by Itamar Marcus and Nan Jacques ... First the bear explains that all Jews must be "erased from our land. ... current.com/.../91032140_hamas-tv-show-teaches-kids-to-kill-jews.htm - Cached - Video results for Hamas TV on kill all Jews

Yes, yes, we know Gilo is 'strategically important' to Israel, but there again, which of the 160 settlements isn't, according to the Israelis? The harsh fact remains. Gilo is on Palestinian land. Israel redrew the city boundary in 1967 to try to get its hands on areas like this. But an occupying army cannot annex land, it is expressly forbidden in international law, so Gilo remains an illegal settlement built on someone else's territory. It does show starkly how little Israel cares about the law, peace or its reputation for integrity. The Somali pirates are more honourable characters to deal with.

Ref Israel extending to Jericho, Mark L is not so far-fetched really. The Alon Plan, which Israel still looks to be following behind the scenes, has a wide corridor through Jerusalem and the E1 to the 'annexed' Jordan Valley and Jericho. With the proposed route of the security barrier several miles to the east of Ma'ale Adumim, that has in fact been near-enough achieved already. The Alon plan has the WB divided into two parts, north and south of Jerusalem, with a road or tunnel between them. Of course the settlement enterprise has now divided the 2 into 210 isolated bits, but the underlying landgrab plan does not look to have changed.

people flood the white house with email and call keep show to the Obama administration that american want 2 state not what Natanyahu want http://www.whitehouse.gov/CONTACT/ Comments: 202-456-6213 You can also call or write to the President: The White House 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW Washington, DC 20500 this may do more good than anything else! keep writing and call!! I DID!

The trouble is Pete that the Pals have nothing to bargain with. They have recognised Israel. They have given up terrorism. Israel has basically all it wants. It has the land. It has a crushed and quiet Pal population. It has the water resources. It has the security of controlling the Jordan valley and the Pals' external borders. It has the military might. It has it all. There CAN'T be fair negotiations between Israel and the Pals. The most Israel will offer is a Bantustan which is basically the current PA, with a possible slightly bigger state, maybe, perhaps in 15-20 years: 15-20 years in which the settlements will expand and Israel can change its mind. You think the Pals should leap at that? Or do you think they should wait for world opinion to turn against Israel as it is doing and for the world to force Israel out of the whole WB?

Netanyahu and his agenda have not changed one bit. Now and again, he might feed the world media with what they want to hear, just to stop the criticism. But then it's back to business as usual - with more colonialism and oppression for the good of a Greater Israel - the man is completely transparent!

at the presend time muckle there is de facto peace ! what there isnt are concessions to arabs who have no rights to demand them but insist they have ! try thinking its very refreshing even for you !

500,000 Israelis illegally residing in the WB. Bibi does not have even a small fraction of the political power and military might he would need to clear the WB so the Palestinians could have enough contiguous, fertile land to build their nation on. The game is over and done. The Palestinians have finally figured out that they are destined to be Israeli slaves forever. Those that think somehow the settlers can be removed are completely delusional.

Negotiations.Not by upfront demands to get what the Pals want as a condition for talk.Where does that stop and so called negotiations start if the Pals get they want before they start! What are they going to negotiate?what is their incentive? PS the usual slogans are just that.if you people were serious about apartheid, then you would have something to say about the entrenched apartheid in the Moslem world. PPS assymetric warfare bypasses the value of a large army.It does however give rise to lots of opportunity for propoganda for the terrorists hiding and firing amongst civillians. A miltary force to seperate the sides only works when people do not send their chidren to do the dirty work,the usual humanitarians are always availble the minute an "innocent" child gets hurt,never mind what they were doing at the time

Have you seen the "Merchant of Venice"?

A Jew growing up in a religious or nationalist home will want both Israel and the West Bank. They are one and the same. Some Jews will never see the reality of many Arabs on the territory and still want it all. Most others, like Netanyahu see reality and want a compromise. However, what Palestinians see as just and fair bears no relation to what Israeli Jews are prepared to offer and unless and until Palestinians come down from their demands neither Netanyahu nor any other Israeli leader will have an offer acceptable to Palestinians. Israel will not make a deal at any cost.

If he freezes settlements totally, what is he goint to talk with Abbas. About the right of return? In exchange to what? About palestinian recognition of the jewish state? In exchange to what? Nataniahu and the whole of Israel will not debate with the palestinians about 1948 refugees. The debate is about territories in exchage for peace. The borders will be moved in both directions. It makes sense then, to have settlements as an asset for negotiation.

900 new homes in Gilo is not Peace. It's provocation

gilo will never be given up. as akiva eldar reports, gilo and other jewish neighbourhoods have been at the heat of the israeli consensus for many years." these neighbourhoods prevent the near complete encirclement of jerusalem by hostile forces. gilo is a strategic high ground protecting the rest of jerusalem in case of war. during war of independence gilo was used by an arab army to bomb low lying jewish jerusalem.

It's time for the US to reopen the door to Palestinians. It was opened for Irish and Italians and Germans and Poles and Asians and Jews fleeing despots. Now it's time to open it for Palestinian moderates. There aren't more than 5-6 million. "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!" We can leave the radicals behind.

If Livni would just join Netanyahu instead of playing stupid games ("No. Really. I won the election! Not him!") like a petulant school-child, great things could happen. Nu! Kadima!

I was just thinkig physically of your non-sense - Jerusalem at elevation 2500 feet extended into Jericho at minus 1000; altogether 3500 feet difference within the same city, proposed by Mark of Lewiston!

The P.A. does not want peace. They want land without having to make peace with the Jews on land that they claim is solely Arab. Those that are not blind realize that their leaders do everything to achieve this.

Well good for you, 99,99% of the world would disagree though. How many Jews in Israel would agree to "an end to the occupation that started in 1967"? This isn't the scenario that Binyamin is envisioning. An Independent Palestine is a threat to him and he has his followers, I believe.

Benn is suggesting that secretly Netanyahu's really keen on peace. So? So freeze the settlements and talk to Abbas. Nothing easier, if he was really serious about peace. He's not. Or at least he's not serious about a just and fair peace. I'm sure he'd be happy with a peaceful little Bantustan surrounded by settlers and the IDF. So question to Aluf: if Bibi's serious about peace, what's stopping him? He's the one commanding a regional military superpower that surrounds and occupies Palestinians, not the other way round.

This is an intersting article, and hints to the real point. HOwever, Druid" #2 assumptions should be considered as well. These are realistic considerations. In any case Natnayahu move seems to be going towards a partial freezment and make a great noise of it. Probably removal os some illegal outposts and make a great noise of it, and stick to the policy of allowing economic growth in the West Bank When all those things come together, an attack on Iran could be likely.

By this time next year Jericho will be an incorporated suburb of Jerusalem and part of the annexed land.

When Hezballah and Iran say what they want they may just get that as well. Caught up on any choice Ahmadinejad "stinking corpse" or Hezballah comments lately? Like Sheba farms etc will not end their war. Very peace loving. Ever wondered why Syrian brothers have not transfered the title to their beloved Lebanese brothers.Ever wondered how many Lebanese Syria killed? How many Syrians they killed?How much they stole from Lebanon?Ever cried war crime over any of that Mr Peace lover?

Clearly this is a case of give and take - houses for land to facilitate land for peace.

Do you stand by your report in early October that Bibi agrees with the Jerusalem Center's Dore Gold that Israel must keep Area "C" (60% of the West Bank exclusive of Jerusalem) or do you stand by this report that he is ready to make a serious peace proposal? Wanting to hold on to a large part of Area "C" is not a serious proposal. Which is it? I would bet that he is up to some trick. See Akiva Eldar's article and the article about 900 new houses in Gilo. Neither of them is consistent with a serious offer.

I realize Netanyahu may offer but the people of Israel have the power public opinion controls the government in Israel no not visa versa alas Israeli leaders are powerless if the people want land are willing to pay the price if the Arabs expect Netanyahu to enforce American policy of total settlement freeze then they are biger fools than they were in 1973 to expect Israel not to re act fight because it was Yom Kippur Israel is Israel the general population rules and so no not a few people like in England and or Holland with a Queen RIGHT ??? Thank You... M. S.

Even if he were serious the best deal will still be a series of bantustans surrounded by Israel...with roads and settlements Ask him waht Palestine will look like to really see how serious he is

I Netanyahu sought to convince Obama about his sincere desire to resume negotioations for "an end to the problem" then these houses, even when in an integrated, Jewish neighborhood of (East) Jerusalem -not in a settlement inside the West Bank- are hard to fathom. What clumsy poker is this?

Which means, say one thing for international consumption ("let's talk peace"), while doing another thing entirely (building more and more settlements so as to destroy any chance of a real Palestinian state emerging). Benn is right about one thing though, Bibi wants war with Iran and Hezbollah.

I don't think any attack on Iran is likely, and a war with Hizbullah is unlikely to end differently than the last time and there will be less patience for it if Israel is the one that strikes first without pretext. However, assuming such attacks are planned, Netanyahoo's thinking will be that FIRST "defeating" Iran and Hizb would enhance Israel's position and THEN enable it to impose a settlement on the Palestinians. Not the other way around. That's assuming the attack goes as planned. Otherwise, Israel's negotiating position will be much worse.

but not too sure about the Iranian scenario as a diplomatic resolution is preferable. I think that President Abbas must meet with PM Netanyahu despite the outstanding problems with regards to what's happening with settlements. If the Palestinians are determined to establish a Palestinian state in the near future, the settlements will be addressed anyways along with borders. There's no purpose to further delay dialogue with the Israeli Government because this government is not going anywhere in the near future so it's better to be open minded for a possible breakthrough.