Rabbi calls Israel's treatment of Vatican 'outrageous'

I believe that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. And that's why I firmly believe Israel must recognize the legal status of Catholic institutions in Israel and exempt Vatican property in Israel from taxes as soon as the Vatican recognizes the legal status of Israeli and/or Jewish institutions in Vatican City and exempts Israeli/Jewish property in Vatican City from taxes. Waddaya mean there are NO JEWISH INSTITUTIONS in Vatican City? Call Chabad! Appoint a shaliach (emissary) to the Holy See! Beat the bushes, move that Mitzvah mobile into St. Peter's Square and urge the Men in Black to put on the straps! Then demand reciprocity from the Vatican. Ya think ????

Jews for centuries lent money with interest in Catholic countries because it was forbidden for Christians to charge interest to other Christians. The other side of this story however, was that the pope owned the Jewish communities and levied all sorts of taxes on them so he collected all that money back...a sort of ecclesiastical money laundering. In Italy, for example: Jews had to pay taxes to get married, to use salted meat...1/4 of all Jewish inheritance went automatically to the church. Now the church wants tax exemptions! Let the church give back to the Jewish community all the synagogues in Europe that were turned into churches during the middle ages..they are tax exempt.

Whatever wrong Pius did (and the case is still out until we see those documents), there is no conceivable way his actions could have been covered under Geneva Conventions. Perhaps you should go back on your medications.

I have no idea what you are talking about. In response to a statement that a saint is someone who has done nothing wrong, I said that this is not the definition of being a saint as I understood Catholic theology. What my statement has to do with your screed is not apparent to me, but I hope it made you feel better by letting you vent your emotions. From the tenor of your post, I question your ability to judge another's sanity.

Sure is a lot of "pressure" for opening the Vatican's archives . . . wonder if just anybody should gain access as well? Wonder what would be reaction if Christians demanded opening other folks' archives, and ran hot campaigns to force the issue? What would be the reaction if Christians involved themselves in the selection and honoring of high Jewish religious leaders? As a Protestant Christian, I'm a bit shocked by the suggestion that Christian property in Israel be frozen. Sounds to me a lot like the way some of Israel's harshest enemies yell. Maybe Christian property sent to Israel as aid should be returned also? What I'm suggesting is that one-way streets aren't that conducive to reasonable discussions. But: that's just my opinion, from Hawaii. Finally, I've read on Israel WebSites that after WWII the Chief Rabbi of Rome converted to Catholicism. Wonder why? With best wishes to people of good will everywhere, and to mix our warm ethnic greetings, Shaloha!

Now Vatican, prior to that the Turkish Ambassador, before that Britain, Sweden, Spain, Palestinians and the list goes on...Are Israelis that unhappy that they choose leaders who under legal investigations themselves to lead them? I thought they were supposed to be smart people? What does Israel want?...to fight with the entire world? Then get ready, because soon or later the world's patience will run out and what will you do then?

Israel signed a diplomatic agreement with the Vatican in which each agreed to do certain thing. The Vatican has delivered on its side and Israel hasn't--so the case is simple. Some of the correspondents here want to add additional conditions -- like return of the Temple's treasures (come off it!!). Well that's not how diplomatic agreements work. Need it be pointed out that Jewish institutions enjoy tax exemptions in predominantly Christian countries? Or that the rights of Jewish communities in these countries to their property is recognized in law?

really? I think the only way to see what he violated or not violated is to open up archives. And we are not talking about policing a few rocket throwers here. We are talking about wholesale genocide of nation. How to you live in peace with these people? And they dare to open mouth and teach morals. I guess the example of certain Nobel laureates can be very inspiring... Clearly for our not so Arab friends norms and ethics is a matter of popularity contest. Let's have at least some fashion going on. For example, today measure of ethics is Nobel prize! Tomorrow is Oswentsim. That way we know when we are up for Night Porter re - enactment, and not to let our kids out of home...

I wonder which one out of three is more important a. did b. nothing c. wrong I mean of you combine 6 million dead, murdered for their ethnic origin on one hand, and "saint" who did nothing wrong when he watched this murder in silence, while his parish actively took part in the events... and certain priests actively advocated "final solution". If these people are saints, one has to surmise whoever they are "saits" for are at war with Jewish nation to the last man. I question the sanity of your judgment even before we enter any discussion with regards to particulars. On the other hand, I have lived long enough to know that some families did worse things when they wanted to cause a spat between offspring joined in an marriage. Still, the sanity of such actions is only apparent if the war is planned...

In no way does the naming of a person a saint mean the person did nothing wrong. As I understand Catholic theology, only Jesus and his mother could claim that distinction.

allowing an independent investigation into Cast Lead---then why the refusal to defend in court. "If the Vatican has nothing to hide about the actions of Pope Pius XII then why have they consistently refused to open their archives that deal with his actions (or inactions) during the War?" david Be careful what you ask for. In any case the pope violated no Geneva conventions so what is in their archives is none of your business. When Israel and it,s leaders murder and steal and oppress then it is of our business. Got it David.

If the Vatican has nothing to hide about the actions of Pope Pius XII then why have they consistently refused to open their archives that deal with his actions (or inactions) during the War? If he is a saint, then he would have done nothing wrong. Celebrate it and show the world what a "great" man he was!

Typical reaction on this board. Instead of looking at today and the world we live in, fixate on something that ended 140 years ago.

I do not see any justification for exempting the Catholic Church from paying taxes in Israel. Tax evasion is a crime. It is time to enforce the law.

when the catholic church apologises for 1800 years of persecution then normality might ensue. its covert activities against jews persist until today!

we just keep on having news about Danny Ayalon diplomatic achievements, he is just as smart and efficient as his boss. BIBI, please get rid of this bunch of incompetants, they cost us too mach. and please do it even if you'll have to call new elections. I am afraid that a good part of our common future depends on that. So, please fire them...

The jews have always collected taxes illegally even in christian churches . Jesus did not approve of it and chased them out of church . Its time the jews converted . Zachariah the tax collector did .

What can you say?

Israel government must adhere to standards accepted by rest of Western world in which churches and other institutions of various denominations, recognized as support of loyalty and otherwise strong statehood, are granted sums to maintain presence, according to state means and parish needs. However, not a single country exempts churches from taxation, particularly when large financial or other projects, take place under the auspices of various religious institutions. And specifically it applies to banking and other commercial activities, in which churches ( or if you whish, their financial institutions ) operate with trades, stocks on commercial exchange floor. The demand for a wholesale release from under taxation, just because the title says "Vatican" is unprecedented. Such demands have implications for laundering money and denying states correct taxes. Church or no church, commercial activities with intent to make gain are not that "Catholic" and will be taxed.

In three brief articles that I have just read in Ha'artez, Israel has offended or attacked Turkey, Britain, the U.S., Norway, and the Vatican. The spirit of Avigdor Lieberman truly stalks the land.

From 1555 to 1870 Rome's Jews were forced to live in a ghetto, behind locked gates, and treated as pariahs "by order of the Vatican". That type of treatment for over 300 years does not and ought not endear the Vatican to most Jews. The current Pope talks a good line, but let's see some positive action from him towards Israel.

"Any [other] country would have threatened to withdraw its ambassador long ago over Israel's failure to honor agreements," Rabbi David Rosen said. " Untrue. Israel has quite a history of failure to honor agreements. Israel is also quite good at failing to abide by international law, UN resolutions, even its own charter. Yet somehow, most Western nations continue to tiptoe around Israel and pretend that this is not the case. An unusual situation, and one that probably will not last much longer.

Why hasn't he been promoted yet to a job where he can do less damage?

With the massive theft perpetrated by the Vatican for centuries - is it expecting tax exemptions on the proceeds of crime ???. After centuries of persecution they only recognize Israel if it gives them blanket tax exemption - wow they are so generous in the Vatican. Notice how upset they get when they do not get tax exemption but how difficult it is for them to pay victims of child abuse - look at Vatican City and you will see where the funds are going - with luck maybe you can sneak yourway to the treasure vaults and see why the cry poor. Shame on you Rabbi to defend the obscene - but then you are both the servants (tax collectors) for God (and sorry collector and spenders - as God does not see a cent of the proceeds - he has no use for it in any case - there is not much you can buy in fantasy land).

what was looted from the Temple and Jewish homes and communities over the last 2 millennium. If they want to recall their ambasadors let them recall all of them. Every single priest, nun, missionary messianic member and altar boys, I am sure they wont let those behind will they?

What do you expect from anti-Catholic bigots? Every time the Catholic Church is mentioned, you hear about every bad thing that has happened in the last thousand years.

Could it be that the process of beatification of Pius XII is a masked response prompted by the actions of Israeli bean counters?

"Meanwhile, some Israeli politicians and Jewish leaders were angered by the Pope's proclamation last month that Pope Pius XII is eligible for for beatification, despite evidence that he may have turned a blind eye to the Holocaust." Which evidence? If there is evidence then the following "may" is out of place. The meaning cannot be other than you are dreaming to be awake.