Women who libel Israel

The problem with the analogies used by Rabbi Landau is that a group of reform Jewish males can come to the wall and run a service wothout problems within their own circle with reform siddurim etc. They can't do that in an orthodox synagogue anywehre in the world. There are Orthodox services in Israel where a woman can read the Torah and wear a prayer shawl...so why not at the wall?

This entire controversy is ridiculous. While it is barbaric to arrest women for reciting prayers in a public place (that's all they are doing) what is this nonsense about a wall being a place of worship? And if it is argued that it is the boundary wall of an ancient temple (no capital letters please) this makes no difference. If we're going back a couple of thousand years, why not have animal sacrifices? Judaism today surely means more than worshipping at stone walls. As many readers have pointed out, the Israeli brand of Orthodoxy is surely not a 'state religion' (or shouldn't be) . The women are simply demonstrating against the segregation of women and their inferior status in the Orthodox community, which is fine, but to dignify it as 'worship' is equally ridiculous. The whole business makes a mockery of religion, and makes Israel look pathetic.

David Landau, if you are a real liberal, that must make someone like me who has always identified with Conservative Judaism and progressive politics, a latent anarchist. Liberalism is inclusion and fighting for the right of the disenfranchised. I hate to fall-back on the terribly overused "Chamberlin metaphor," but you just said like the aggressors who deny the right of others have their way for the sake of shalom bayit. This gay, observant Jew who happens to be the son and grandson of Holocaust survivors would soon die that stop fighting people others! Shame on you.

David Landau, if you are a real liberal, that must make someone like me who has always identified with Conservative Judaism and progressive politics, a latent anarchist. Liberalism is inclusion and fighting for the right of the disenfranchised. I hate to fall-back on the terribly overused "Chamberlin metaphor," but you just said like the aggressors who deny the right of others have their way for the sake of shalom bayit. This gay, observant Jew who happens to be the son and grandson of Holocaust survivors would soon die that stop fighting people others! Shame on you.

David Landau, if you are a real liberal, that must make someone like me who has always identified with Conservative Judaism and progressive politics, a latent anarchist. Liberalism is inclusion and fighting for the right of the disenfranchised. I hate to fall-back on the terribly overused "Chamberlin metaphor," but you just said like the aggressors who deny the right of others have their way for the sake of shalom bayit. This gay, observant Jew who happens to be the son and grandson of Holocaust survivors would soon die that stop fighting people others! Shame on you.

The whole point of Anat Hoffman's protest is that while Israel's state religion is now Orthodox it should not be. The government, out of sheer cynicism keeps giving more and more power to increasingly extremist elements of the religious community. I doubt that the portion of the population that is offended by the action is anywhere near as large as Landau would have you believe, and that in any case the official approach to Judaism in Israel should be much more diverse than it is niw.

Have you been to Jerusalem where pictures of women on ads in public places have been BANNED. Now tell me we are an enlightened, liberal, bringing the light to all the non Jews state. Wake up, we are going backwards as fast as the religious parties can make it happen. Wonder who will serve in the army in 25 years time.

Landau has apparently forgotten that Israel is suppose to be a light unto the nations. Irrespective of a difference of religious opinion, Ms Hoffman should not have been treated in such a manner. The State of Israel faces the risk of losing the support of Diasporan and secular Israelis who believe in religious pluralism and tolerance. Come into the 21st century.

If you say manifest truth enough times it must make it right. Right?

"Non-Orthodox Jews in the U.S. and elsewhere may understandably balk and bridle at the assertion that Orthodox Judaism is Israel’s state-religion." Yes, indeed, we might. And we might also wonder why in the world we continue to raise huge sums of money for, and spend countless hours lobbying the US government in behalf of, a state that holds our non-Orthodox Judaism in contempt -- one that refuses to recognize the legitimacy of our rabbis, many of our practices, etc, etc. The problem is, most American Jews simply are utterly aware of how non-Orthodox Jews are treated in Israel and would be horrified if they did know. Hopefully, frank declarations like this one by David Landau, will help us spread the word.

Money talks, so I plan to no longer send money to Israel and I would encourage my other non-orthodox brethren to do the same. I am sick and ashamed of how fundamentalists are protected in Israel. We fight fundamentalists on our borders, but we allow them to dictate to us in Israel - IDIOTIC!!!!!!!

I try to understand what you say, which, sorry to say, sounds like real nonsense to me: You compare two religions ( even if they believe in the same Jesus) the Catholic and the Protestants to NOT EQUAL RIGHTS to male/ female Jews? I don't follow you. And like you so many others, not Anat!

First, St. Pats and New York's Temple Emanu-El are private property, owned by discreet sects of Christianity and Judaism. The Western Wall is de facto owned by the State of Israel. Unless the State of Israel represents only Orthodox Jews, it cannot single out one sect of Jews for special treatment. If, however, the State of Israel represent only, or primarily, Orthodox Jews, then it can discriminate against other, non-Orthodox Jews. So the issue comes down to this: Which Jews does the State of Israel represent? Answer that question and you answer the question of which Jews can pray at the Western Wall. Whether he admits it or not, Landau says Israel represents only, or at least primarily, Orthodox Jews. He should have the intellectual honesty to answer the question unequivocally.

The Wall is an open place and cannot be compared to Westminster Abbey or any other religious house. I do not see why women cannot pray the way they want in front of the wall and it is a disgrace to arrest a woman doing so. It has nothing to do with the religion of the state. There are women rabbis in Israel and other countries and it is about time this be accepted in Israel too.

There are so many misguided men. There is no mitzvah of obligation to wear a tallit for men. Reb Moshe Feinstein said that women who want to wear a tallit for spiritual reasons may wear one provided it is distinctly feminine. I don't think God created women to be baby machines or to cater to the whims of men. Quite honestly you see authentic Judaism as something that is stagnant and doesn't grow with the times. But the Torah did grow with the times. Now orthodox men are simply afraid of losing control. There is a school in NYC that teaches orthodox women everything they need to be rabbis- however they are hired for similar jobs in synagogues. They can give pasuk to women. The orthodox world is changing. They just move like snails. Women who are orthodox are patient. Those of us who aren't -we lost patience a long time ago. Women who are committed to their Judaism are not relegated to their homes. They are also doctors and lawyers and other professionals. Do you continue to believe that they will fall for the nonsense the orthodox continue to feed women? Rashi's daughters put on Tefillin. There were others who tied tzit tzit to the four cornered garments of their household. The prophet Dvora and then the famous woman who taught men Talmud from behind a curtain. Men were the ones that argued these laws in the oral law. Women's voices weren't heard. They made the decisions about how women should act and how women's minds worked from a man's perspective. Women didn't have options in those days-but they do now and women now have a voice and Anat and the women of the wall should keep doing what they are doing because its time to empower women. The time has come. Accept it. WE ARE WOMEN WE ARE STRONG

Landau, get real. When is wearing a talit by women a crime, and such a crime to be abused by the police? Whatever happened to religious tolerance? Landau, you missed the point.

There are logical, well thought out and reasonable arguments to be made against Hoffman's behaviour at the Kotel. The fact that I disagree with those arguments is besides the point. The fact is, they can be made. And the fact is that Landau's article did not contain any one of those reasonable arguments. His attempts to liken the Kotel to other national religious institutions is shameful for its ignorance. The Westminster Abbey that he describes is not the one that I know. A few years ago I co-officiated there at the remembrance service for a great Jewish dancer. Earlier this year Catholic priests and Orthodox and Reform rabbis were present with the Protestant clergy of the Abbey at a service of Thanksgiving for the work of the Dalai Lama (he gave the sermon). Intra-faith and interfaith services regularly happen at the Abbey, with respect for all clergy, whether male or female, gay or straight, Catholic or Protestant, Muslim, Jewish or Gentile. That is exactly what does not happen at the Kotel. His claim that Protestant clergy would be "carted off by the Swiss Guard" for organising a brief prayer service in the piazza of St. Peter's in Rome is simply risible. Every January the Catholic and Protestant churches of Rome hold joint services together for Christian Unity. The day there is an officially sanctioned service of Jewish Unity, involving all Jewish strands of tefilla, at the Kotel seems like a distant prospect. Yes, the various denominations of priests in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre regularly beat each other up. That's a reason we should behave like barbarians too? That a former editor in chief of Ha'aretz should write an article of such offensive ignorance is simply depressing. I would like to read a well-argued, logical article against Hoffman's stand. Sadly, this was not it. Rabbi Roderick Young

Most religions are to some extent, misogynistic, because we men do not like to give up our power-. The Catholic church does not want women to be ordained, Judaism and Islam want segregation of sexes, and It is bewildering and illogical to people like me. Wasn't god supposed to have created women too? Has anybody asked their gods what they feel about such discrimination?

The bottom line is that a Jewish woman was arrested for davening at the kotel. That is the shanda. The state religion of Israel is Judaism, NOT ORTHODOX Judaism. What can the police do if 10.000 women show up to daven at the wall? They can't arrest all of them. If the police use riot tactics against them, that will only make them and their cause stronger. Right now, Israel is being held hostage by Orthodoxy. May I remind you that the Temple was to be a house of worship for all people. I think that includes the Women of the Wall.

When Moses brought down the 10 commandments he gave it to EVERYONE - men, women and children. The Orthodox takeover of the Wall is a cruel affront to all Jewish Women...Are we simply baby-making machines for patriarchal comfort? Shame on you Landau for making women a lesser species. T'was not always like this - only since the Orthodox have hijacked rebellion in now what is a quasi-Democratic country. As the mother of children who live in Israel I have a right to express my disgust at your prejudices.

you give them too much credit..".it' a conspiracy!?" They are sincere in their activism...if misguided!

You are assuming that the only legitimate Judaism is orthodoxy. The question about sharing the holiness of the Kotel to other faiths is an additional discussion (about the "Jewishness" of the State). You don't provide any argument to explain why "disturbing peace" means challenging the unfair orthodox monopoly. Your article is weak and full of bigotry. Sad...

Most Israeli's are not orthodox and as a woman I am supposed to have the freedom to practice my religion as I understand it. Praying at the wall is only one of the many humiliations non- orthodox women suffer if they if they want fight for the rights that orthodox jews demand in any country they reside in around the world. Of course, we in Israel must remain silent in order to protect Israel's good name. When we are asked by our children and grandchildren what we did to ensure Israel's democratic and ethical charecter I can just say that i didn't want to embarass my people in front of the goyim.

Israel is not Orthodox. It is founded in the value of religious freedom. Should non-orthodox Jews be the only unprotected religious minority in Israel? The Women of the Wall are observant Jews, acting sincerely within the native culture of Israel. To treat them as outsiders, or cynics is to contradict the essential freedoms upon which Israel was founded.

Go back to America and pray in English,with music and all the cool things you reform like to do and let the tradition to us.

Yesterday it was the report that the majority of Israelis would like Israel to become an apartheid state. Today, it is David Landau informing us that the only legitimate expression of religious observance is that dictated by the religious establishment. More and more reasons to become alienated from this country.

Please see my current essay on the controversy about the Western Wall: http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/scaling-the-western-wall/

Let's face it. Israel is governed like a shtetl pretending to be an enlightened westrn country.

The view that Orthodox Judaism is the state religion of Israel will do enormous damage to Diaspora-Israel relations at a time when Israel needs all the friends it can muster, Reform and Conservative Jews amongst them. If the latter groups cannot express their form of Judaism in Israel, it may be time for them to reconsider their support for Israel. Florida as a Jewish state seems much more appealing to those pluralistically inclined.

Conservatives, Reform, etc are not Jewish movements but are rather movements of Jews, along with many non-Jews, who are doing their own thing while seeking to appropriate the processes, principles, and terms of authentic Torah Judaism even while reaching conclusions and enacting practices that are unaccetable in Halacha - according to Halachas rules for determining what is valid and what is not. "70 Faces of Torah", is not a catch-all opening for "Different Stokes for Different Folks". The halachic process is flexible - but that is not synonomous with a I'm OK You're OK free for all that these movements wish to use to justify their radical departure from authentic, Torah-based, Halachic Judaism. Christianity was an offshoot as well - and most no longer consider it within the 70 faces of Torah. Reform and Conservative are going down that same sad path of divergence and eventual separation even as they smugly claim to be the enlightened bearers of the "New Judaism". And all that even before we get to how unconcerned they strive to appear to be in the face of the assimilation so rampant in their ranks. But then again, once youve appropriated the halachic process, mostly remove G-d from relevance, I guess assimilation is not really a problem. Just redefine who is a Jew, invent patrilineal descent, vitiate conversion of deep meaning and true halachic roots, and via an Orwellian manipulation of Torah, Presto - no assimilation problem. Black freaks you out? Fine. But dont pretend that Political revulsion frees you from the reqiurements of intellectual honesty.

I am deeply saddened to read this column. I for one am an American Jew who was raised to love Israel and believe that is is the homeland of the Jewish people -- of all Jews. I travel regularly to Israel and I daven with Women of the Wall. For this author to claim Orthodoxy as the official religion of Israel is to discount the majority of American Jews, not to mention Israeli Jews. Worse, it is terribly alienating to us. Can Israel really risk alienating us? Frankly I find this shameful.

Most of these analogies drawn from other religions really don't make much sense--it's just a hodge-podge of irrelevancies, not a cogent argument

This article is wildly inaccurate. The Supreme Court of Israel repeatedly recognized the rights of the women who petitioned them to pray according to their custom at the Kotel - in group prayer with other Jewish women, with Torah reading, wearing talitot. The Supreme Court held that the Government of Israel is required to make arrangements for the women to be able to do so - such as specific times and days (the women had requested once a month on Rosh Hodesh mornings). It was the Government of Israel which appealed this decision. The Government claimed that the site of Robinson's Arch was a suitable alternative. In a further decision the Supreme Court again upheld women's rights to pray in this way at the Kotel, and expressed doubt as to whether Robinson's Arch could be made into a suitable prayer site, but it gave the Government of Israel 12 months to try and prepare Robinson's Arch as a prayer site. However, it also ruled that if this was not done properly AND if that arrangement was not acceptable to BOTH parties to the suit, then the Government of Israel is OBLIGATED to make arrangements, such as specific times and days, so that the women can pray at the Kotel according to their custom. The Robinson's Arch site is an archeological site in which prayer services are occasionally arranged but it is not a suitable alternative prayer site. The Supreme Court decision is clear: the Government of Israel is obligated to make arrangements for women to pray according to their custom - in group prayer, with Torah reading, wearing talitot - in the women's section of the Kotel.

Landau thinks it's merely a matter of nonOrthiodox Jews objectinjg to Orthodox Judaism as a state religion. It goes much deeper than that. It's an objection to religious and nationalist bigotry of all sorts. Orthodox Jews do not own the Wall, it belongs to all Jews and you can't say the same thing about the Vatican or St. Paul's cathedral. And the State of Israel belongs to all peiople who are citizens without being subject to Orthodox tests. Jews who think it's ok to drive on Yom Kippur ought not to have to deal with a barrage of rocks from Haradi thugs. Arab citizens of Israel are riight to seek equal protection of the laws and should not be told that their children should not register in Jewish kindergartens or that they cannot live in a Jewish neighborhood. Arabs in the West Bank should not be told that they can live there in an area that Israel is infomrally annexing but they can't vote. Anat is saying no to all religious and nationalist bigotry, and we say no along with her. If the religious nationalist bigots think that we are being naive, or self hating or whatever their excuse du jour for religious nationalist bigotry, we are saying no to that as well. If they think we are not being supportive of Israel, they should understand that we think precisely the same of them.

Progressivism is always being accused of being unpatriotic. That's standard right-wing cant. Also, to the extent that something is true, it can't be libelous.

If this had happened in any other country, you David Landau and the other silent Israeli leaders would be screaming "Antisemitism." To any Jew- male, female, Reform or Chareddi. Israel was established as a state for ALL Jews, not just Orthodox Jews. hy has there not also been a massive outpouring of indignation on the part of Israeli public figures, in particular those political and moral leaders who purport to promote civil and political rights for all of Israel’s citizens? And what about the Israeli politicians of all but the religious parties who regularly assure American and other Diaspora Jews of their commitment to religious pluralism? Imagine their outrage if a Jew, any Jew, were arrested, let alone physically roughed up, for wearing a tallit and praying in public in, say, Russia, or Venezuela, or France, or Iran. Imagine the denunciations in the Knesset or on the part of the Israeli ambassador to the United Nations if a Jewish woman anywhere else in the world had been shackled, stripped, forcibly dragged across the floor, and left to lie on the floor of a prison cell covered by her tallit. Read more: http://forward.com/articles/164734/leaders-must-speak-out-on-wailing-wall-arrest/?p=all#ixzz2AETABR8t

I agree. An extreme, right-wing version of Orthodox Judaism is the State religion of Israel. Which is why,,when it comes to religion, Israel has become a mysogynous backwater with segregated public buses and so-called Torah scholars spitting on Orthodox school girls. I, a Jew who davens with Conservative, egalitarian minyans, have simply stopped going to the Wall as I do not care to go someplace where I am not welcome or even wanted.

That Israel is assumed by the political establishment to even have a "state religion" already violates its obligation under Zionism as the state of the Jewish people. How can Israel expect the majority of world Jewry, clearly not "Orthodox," to view Israel as first line of defense and refuge if it already designates discriminates against them, views them "second class" and "unwanted" unless they "convert to Orthodoxy?

That is the point.If Israel declaims that Orthodox Judaisim is the State Religion , Than you are right. this is not the case,thank G-D.

In past times, there was no separation between men and women either, and that is the way it should be. In this way, there was no slant on any stream of Judaism. The experience of the Wall was yours to express. As long as the Wall has a women's section, there has already been made -- a great religious distinction. Thus, any attempt to stop women from wearing taliths -- or holding a torah is a further attempt to stop the Jewish religious parctices of some. And there is a state religion being expressed

Landau sets up a straw man. Other countries have places for everyone; Israel has only one wall. And as photos do show, it was never the rigid misogynist place that it is now. Was Anat pushing her way into the men's section? No. With attitudes like Landau's, capitulation to the regressive and increasingly paternalistic and rigid rabbis will doom Israelis . He should be regretting the trend of the Orthodox to inhibit religious expression. Instead, he is helping them become the ( he loves analogies) the pre- Reformation Vatican.

First -Landau might think he is a liberal but no liberal would ever concede the Western Wall or the State of Israel to Charedi Orthodxy. A liberal or moderate would call for the wall to have three sections: 1) mens; 2) womens 3) mixed. That Landau defends the control of any religious site of the Jewish people by the Charedim removes any doubt about his being a liberal at least in this area. Second - he doesn't address teh brutal and totally unnecessary and illegal treatment she suffered at the hands of the authorites after being arrested for civil disobedience brings his liberal credentials completely into question. Exactly how does this kind of stuff get passed Haaretz which is famous for its liberal agenda?

This is an open letter to the Women of the Wall. I am stirred by all the emotions, morality and activism that is becoming another divisive issue facing our people. We are now facing another immanent holocaust that should preclude a collective unity among all of our people. Instead, we are more concerned about making social statements that has nothing to do with our peril nor our Jewish saga. Judaism is a monolithic religion because our Torah explicitly gives us 613 commandments that must be singularly and collectively observed. It is by no means a religion that could and should endure secular interpretations based on "social feel good" or "egalitarian" interjections. This divisive interjections dilutes the needed glue of cohesion to a loose and open ended interpretation of our commitment to G-d. Reform and egalitarian causes opens the hole of tahom wider by adding more confusion to our people, which destroys any potential future for the meek and children. When Moses came down with the second Torah from Mt. Sinai, he gave it to the women because the men were not on a spiritual level of being the care takers. However, women by Torah law had to cede it to the men because of issues of purity and the Avodah. The only one that could approach the Torah are the Cohanim. Therefore, the only tradition held by Jews regarding the Mitzvah of approaching the Torah is for men, because they are the ones that need the spiritual elevation. Jewish women inherently are elevated spiritually above men. They are the gate keepers of our existence by creating the family and spirituality of the home. In effect, women create Judaism, not the men. The greatest Mitzva of Torah to Judaism, is the gift by women. A lesser understanding of that role which Jewish women play in enhancing the world; by perpetuation of generation and spirituality of the home, renders them to simplicity and ignorance. On our daily prayer "Blessed Be He did not make me a woman" has many modern interpretations mostly ignorant. To the reform or the egalitarian women, they take it as a swipe, therefore interjected their counter prayer. If the modern woman knew that this prayer was created out of tears Jewish men had in their personal grief and horror they witnessed happening to their wives and daughters, then they would sing a different song at the Wall. Hannah was the first Jewish woman in Torah that uttered and prayed to G-d. Her prayers were full of tears because she wanted to have children. She did not pray to G-d to open her womb to any behemoth who could inject sperm into her for thrills and self adulation, then wiped it out at any abortion table. Hannah did not pray for contraception to be disseminated freely by schools and the federal government. Hanna prayed because she kept her Mitzvot and wanted to propagate Tzadikim to the Jewish world. When Hanna prayed, she did not utter her words out loud in songs and folly to make a social statement. She did not dawn on men's commandment of wearing Tallit for the purpose of being equal. She did not wear a men's kippah to aggravate and stir an infantile social cause which has no added goodness in the religion of our fathers and mothers. Hanna kept Shabbat holy. She also observed all female commandments especially Nidah and the laws of Kashrut. Her children did not date nor married out of our faith to wipe out any semblance of our commitment to G-d. She understood her special and unique roll in Judaism and succeeded. Israel is a secular democracy and does allow free expression to all people but has the right to certain reservations. This means that fools, children and adults may retain their infantile state of mind, as long as it does not disturb the peace, health, security and welfare of the nation, should have their rights to frolic with nonsense. However, it would be nice for Jews who visit or dwell in Israel to exert their energy in learning about their history, legacy and saga by incorporating the lessons of our wise ancestors. It would be higher for the women of WOW to protest and get arrested in front of the White House for a more moral cause, like bombing Iran; before Iran obliterates 7,000,000 Jews and non-Jews in Israel. In closing my diatribe in sympathy for the Women of the Wall's cause; when these women learn to keep their female Mitzvot as did Hanna or when they clearly choose to emulated Sara, Rivka, Rachel, Leah, Ruth, Bat Shevah, Deoborah, Ester and so many more Jewish women who brought to this world kings and prophets, instead of emulating Hillary Clinton or Gloria Steinman types; when they reclaim their wayward children from the corrosive secular life's trappings of the garbage anti Israel/ anti-Semitic left wing education, tattoos, punk rock, rap music, drugs, unbridled sex; then feel they must descend to the lower spiritual level of men by foolishly taking on his needed Mitzvot, I tip my hat to them and let them pray, dance and sing at the Wall. However, if they are liberated egalitarians demonstrating in men's faces while they inspire for elevation in spirituality, by disturbing his decorum with song and dance, then the unique traditions and beautiful decorum that maintained us over 3200 years, yields division and folly with out legacy to the perpetrators. P.S. Your Twitter and Facebook account is attracting and inflaming Israel bashers and Anti-Semites. Maybe a little dose of wisdom should be swallowed in this time of Jewish peril.

There is nothing in Judaism prohibiting women praying even iout oloud!

Very true Mr Landau. But wouldn't it be true to say that part of the reason North American Jews are reluctance to make aliyah is precisely because they do not recognize their religious and political affinities in the Israeli political system (regardless of their religious or political tendencies)? This is not to say that they are any less Zionist. There are as many Jews in the diaspora as there are in Israel (in fact, a little more). The rate of aliyah from this part of the world has been painfully slow. Part of the reason for this is that American Jews not only feel by an large happy to live in a constitutional democracy, but feel that the separation of state and religion has in fact been the safeguard of their religious beliefs. I would even say that it is not simply a safeguard, but a very fertile field in which Judaism has florished. Even more importantly, American Jews in particular, rightfully think they have historically contributed to their society in very significant ways, and therefore feel very much a sense of shared destiny in its ideals. I'm not sure you could say Ms Anat Hoffman feels the same way. If there was a mass aliyah of American Jews (and Gd willing there will be), I wonder how the Israeli religious establishment would respond to it.?

Nonsense, David Landau (whom I usually admire)! Woe to us all had you written the same editorial in the US during the anti segregation demonstrations and acts! Your logic leads us (backwards) to a Jewish Orthodox Religious State of Israel in ALL aspects. Why stop at "women at the wall"? After all, Orthodox Jews are the majority in Israel, as you say. Let's run Israel according to the Torah - is this what you want or think is best for Israel? "Orthodoxy" is not a religion - Judaism is - and one of our strengths is the diversity in approach of understanding and practice - in Israel and throughout the world. Shame on you, David Landau, for de-legitimizing and splitting our people. Please publish a retraction! barry.berger@gmail.com

That business about Israel being the "only democracy in the Middle East" and a "shining light to the nations", that's out the window.

Landau's statements are fundamentally and simply wrong. The State of Israel does not have a state religion. (If it did by the way, which limb of orthodox Judaism would it be ? Yeshayu Leibowitz? the extemities of harediut? the rabbis of Tsohar? Those who wrote or endorse "Torat ha-Melekh?) The Kotel is a public and national site. To support the exclusiveness of "Orthodox" Judaism in this respect is to exclude and insult the bulk of Israel's citizens and, I suspect, a vast proportion of ordinary Jews like me around the world. David Landau has expressed himself in this vein before. He is frum and cannot seem to step away from the obvious limitations this fact imposes on his judgement. Is this what we learned at the Hasmonean? Maybe? Certainly in ist present incarnation. Bottom line: you cannot be "liberal" David and hold to the opinions you seem to espouse here. Make your choice. PS. Insofar as you have represented this exclusivist view in your work for the Economist you are surely bound - in the mere cause of truth in representation - to correct this utterly false picture of Jewish life and thinking.

Trouble with the Conservative and Reform movments is that Mesoati for most Jews in Israel means something tha resemebes Normative Orthodoxy than it does "liberal non-Halachic" Judaism. The spokespeople of that poin of vew predominate most of the synagogues of his coutnry. It is possible that "if" he mass of Conservative and Reform jews came on Aliyah, we might see a change, but alas, the large pecetange of olim from North America tend to be Halachically Observant and accept the authority of the Rabbinate.''' It is not clear that Rabbi Anat is praying to God, or, attracting attention to "her cause"--the women who walk by and pray, that ignore her and speak thier words, as do the men on the other side, they are praying, anyone one else is just. 'As our sages tell us, "Whoerver looks for honor, honor escapes them, those who keep away from honors, are sought out to be honored."

YES! ISRAEL would BE much LESS HATED IF THE STATE RELIGION WAS MODERATE/SECULAR Judaism, instead of ULTRA ORTHODOX ZIONISM

"It is plain silly to deny the manifest truth that Israel's state-religion is Orthodox Judaism" -- So, this undeniable fact is the problem.

but your examples about Christianity are wrong.....I have been to multifaith services in St Peter's and other catholic churches. you're just making things up to justify your own sexist agenda.

This seems a hefty claim for a country with no constitution. The analogies drawn in this article are so poor. No, a mormon or catholic cannot lead services in Westminister Abbey. But a female protestant should be able to. By asserting the "otherness" of Anat Hoffman and Women of the Wall, he is denying the fact that this is a movement which INCLUDES many modern orthodox women.

And aren't all those lefties trying to fight for racial, ethnic, religious and gay rights so ridiculous?! For that matter, isn't everyone who believes in humanistic western values? Hell, lets take it further. Aren't people who hold the door open for senior citizens terrible?!

Actually, the Israeli Supreme Court has ruled that Women of the Wall are allowed to gather and pray on Rosh Hodesh "as is their custom". I have been present for these 7AM monthly services where Jewish women of every religious stream gather together to pray . It is not just a bunch of progressive women but also Orthodox women, who in the US and the rest of the Jewish world increasingly pray in their own services without men. At these services where women gather and sing out loud, police tape every aspect of what the women do. Male police come into the women's side to review the tapes. There may be gender separation for men but not for women. Then the police arrest women for minor "infractions" such as wearing black and white ("men's" tallitot) or wearing a tallit gathered on their shoulders ("in the style of a man".) It is clearly harassment. The service at which Anat was mostly recently arrested took place on Erev Rosh Hodesh. Around the world, this is when most Jewish women gather for their Rosh Hodesh celebrations. The rabbis who control the Kotel don't want the presence of women praying in a organized service to creep from just 7AM once a month to also include the previous evening, even if it is the centennial celebration of the founding of Hadassah, the largest zionist women's organization. Hence the brutal treatment of Anat Hoffman, not because she was praying out loud at that Kotel but because she was praying out loud at the Kotel 10 hours too early. . Could the author please explain how his theory and examples are relevant given that women may pray and pray out loud once a month in the mo,rning? And why can't they celebrate the same holiday when it begins the previous evening?

The Wailing wall can be a place of worship for ALL forms. We don't have to operate a goddam monopoly on rights and acceptability of prayer. For crying out loud, why does the Wailing Wall have to be like Westminster Abbey, or St Peters Square.

David Landau may be right this time But he has a foul and dismal record of besmirching and libeling Israel. Indeed it was he who told Condi Rice to "rape Israel".

Exclusion of women in the public sphere, segregated buses... An advertisement with a picture of a woman on it was defaced (the woman's face was painted out with black paint) in my neighborhood in Haifa for crying out loud.

Start with your conclusion ie. that orthodoxy has a legitimate monopoly on the Israeli public sphere and then argue backwards. The point of Hoffman and many many other Israelis (including the enlightened orthodox) reject this monopoly. This monopoly does not limit its usurpation of individual liberty at the Kotel, it is spreading to putting women in the back of the buses, removing pictures of women on ads, covering up young girl dancers at public functions, forbidding women from signing in public functions, totally denying gays any liberty, creating a structurally poor class of welfare receiving families whose men do not work and whose women are required to birth endless children to meet the social pressure, etc. etc. The Wall is one very loud manifestation of this disastrous state of affairs. Well David, you may start with the conclusion and work backwards, but us simple citizens do not accept this axiom as writ in stone. We want a normal pluralistic society where everyone's dignity and rights are protected in particular in the public space.

The idea of a "state religion" is itself benighted and by its nature indefensible.

We are all Jewish. The haredim do not "own" GOD. "All paths of the Torah are paths of Peace". It is equally true that "All paths of Peace are paths of the Torah". "The love of the Jewish people is equal to all the other mitzvot together."

Honestly, none of your hypotheticals seem like wanton provocation to me. If a faith is so strong, another denomination praying on its turf won't erode it. Have the Orthodox no faith in their own strength? And weren't Anat and Hadassah already keeping themselves in the Women's section of the wall?

... is ludicrous. I don't understand why you use many hypothetical situations in Christianity to legitimize what happened. Even if the Christians act exactly as you expect/want them to act, it wouldn't make Anat's arrest the right thing to do.

Israel's state religion is Judaism. If this is no longer the case it is only because one branch of Jewry - the orthodox - are successfully imposing their will on the rest of us. What is happening at the kotel is only the tip of the iceberg. The country that was meant to be a homeland for all Jews is increasingly becoming only attractive to Jews who support the aspirations of the nationalists and religious. So be it - but don't be surprised when they are the only ones left to provide for the economic and security needs of the country.

Is it a written law that Orthodox Judaism is the State religion?

yeah, let's change that.

Although I vehemently disagree with Landau on almost everything, he is absolutely right about this. What Hoffman is doing is nothing more than a provocation made in order to get publicity. It has NOTHING to do with "piety" or "serving G-d". The Reform have their own synagogues in Jerusalem and are even allowed to conduct prayers at Robinson's Arch near the Kotel and they can do whatever they want. Everyone who comes to the Kotel , both religious and non-religious come in order to pray in the Orthodox manner and they don't want to see the decorum disrupted. End of discussion

Sophism! I loved the analogies that try to mix different religions under the umbrella of "Christian" and the utter b*lls*t of suggesting there is "There is pluralism and freedom of religion in Britain." Wasn't David Cameron who recently stated that UK's multi-culturalism is dead? Isn't the same State still deeply divided on religious lines in Ireland and Scotland? Britain is no example to the world on what regards to religious tolerance.

Israel claims it would be the homeland of all jews, therefor it has the responsibility to act like so and not just as homeland of the orthodox/Ultraorthodox! Israel claims also to grant religious freedom to all people living in Israel, therefor it has to provide possibilities to ALL jews to pray at the holy sites, which dosn't belong to the orthodox/ultraorthodox, which dosn't belong only to the jews in Israel but to all jews in the world! Israel is not the owner of the kotel, it is the trustee of it! Personally, Sir, I find your attitude to defend misogyny and religious coercion shameful and benighted and I fear its time for people like you to recognize that the majority of jews in the diaspora don't favor suppressing women or religious coercion! If Israel really wants to enjoy the full support of the diaspora jews in the future it has to wake up now, otherwise a big bad surprise is waiting.

I've attended several services and events at St Pat's where Protestant, Greek & Armenian Orthodox Clergy have been co-officiants. Your argument is full of gaping holes.

fast....