Ya'alon: I'll forgo Europe trips to allow IDF freedom

"Despite your touchingly naive beliefs to the contrary, even HRW has noted the lamentable state of universal jurisdiction as a practical tool in Europe -- owing to many reasons, but including prosecutorial discretion (which is often linked to foreign policy concerns) and to the limited scope of much of the legislation (in France, you basically need torture as a grounds for proceeding). As a practical example of Europe`s willingness to take a stand, consider Belgium, which did indeed have a very strong universal jurisdiction statute until 2003, when it gutted it after strong suggestions from the US and others that it might be wise to remove NATO headquarters from Brussels to a more congenial country. "

"Despite your touchingly naive beliefs to the contrary, even HRW has noted the lamentable state of universal jurisdiction as a practical tool in Europe -- owing to many reasons, but including prosecutorial discretion (which is often linked to foreign policy concerns) and to the limited scope of much of the legislation (in France, you basically need torture as a grounds for proceeding). As a practical example of Europe`s willingness to take a stand, consider Belgium, which did indeed have a very strong universal jurisdiction statute until 2003, when it gutted it after strong suggestions from the US and others that it might be wise to remove NATO headquarters from Brussels to a more congenial country. "

Israeli courts or their well-established reputation for independence ....Indeed. And the Israeli government has a well-established reputation for ignoring the courts'orders - with particular emphasis on orders affecting the settlers.(Read the Sasson Report). David

I would propose ,now that a lot of officers and politicians are forced to remain in Israel ,to try to make a deal with Hamas changing Shalit with:Yalon,lieberman,ishai,men with blood on their hands or in their brains.

l: "Rubbish." Except..... Ya'alon isn't acting as though he considers this to be "rubbish", lawprof. Indeed, he shows all the signs of being very worried that he will end up in the dock, if not in the slammer. I will assume that he is taking legal advice on the matter, but I think it's pretty clear that if he is then he ain't taking it from you.

During the Gaza War, there was a doctor who lost two daughters. He forgives and wants peace with Israel. He is my hero. He does not want to destroy Israel, but live side-by-side. I would never have problem with people, such as this man, to share my home and my most scared places. The sad part is that many Palestinians want to kill Israelis and try to destroy Israel. What is more important to the Palestinians, destroying Israel or have a viable state living side-by-side?

They have no problem accepting Israeli criminals there, in fact several of them are officials in the White House.

where it started in the 1930's. It was present in the British mandate of Palestine for many years long before the state of Israel.

and rejection of peace in their OFFICIAL media.

Who are you refering to? The survivors of the Holocaust, or the 800000 Jews who were kicked out of surrounding Arab countries with nothing but the clothes on their backs? All these refugees from anti-Jewish violence in Europe and Mideast countries were acepted in and allowed to make new lives for themselves, which the Palestinians became and remained refugees wherever they are becaue this is what Arab leaders wanted for them.

Think about it..... The IDF can commit grave violations of the Geneva Conventions. And you can continue to travel the world. And if you are arrested and imprisoned, well, so what? After all, Israeli politicians are being arrested all the time on corruption charges, and institutionalized graft in Israel is quite unaffected by it. So why should it be any different when the charges are "war crimes" rather than "graft"? The IDF won't care, because they can afford to have any number of politicians take a fall for them. So do a Danny Ayalon and keep on wracking up those frequent-flier points.

Europe is to busy with their own crimes right now.Racial crimes against Jews and Muslims is on a rise.Fringe parties in Europe are getting bigger and stronger.The EU is no better than the Italian parlaiment.Even in wonderful Scandinavia those parties are the third in numbers of seats in parlaiment(denmark,norway). Their hate for the Jews is old,and their hate for the Muslims is the resolt of the great number of immigrants from Muslim countries. We would be the smart one,if we can make peace with each other,because both of us are not wellcome there.The hypocracy of the Europeans is open book,they don't even tolerate muslim head scarf,and they preach us tolerance.

Of course, as an accused war criminal, it's his own freedom that would be in jeopardy if he visited Europe.

Z, I love your passionate posts. But you are wrong, honey. How is Florida? I would take Tel Aviv, or Haifa over Florida. How you are not there? Afraid that you may get arrested on the way to Europe? Dont call me anti semite. Shalom

Jane is right ...before netanyahoo there was Rabin and peres and barak they were willing to go to the 67 border but were declined by Arafat.Biby said what many israeli think, we want peace so we need our counterpart to recognise the JEWISH STATE.the arabs will not recognise the jewish state because in the arab world there is no separation of policies and religion and the qoran says that any soil conquered by muslem can never be in the hand of the infidel.so keep thinking it is biby and the bad israelis that are not willing to compromise untill some nut will open your eyes and claim andalucia as moslem land i would like to see how generous you will be in making consesions with spanish european land.As for myself i too will forgo my visit to europe untill you take a more balanced aproach to the israeli arab conflict.i will go to israel instead.

"If most of the Palestinians really wanted peace, the violence and the call to destroy Israel would stop." If most of the Israelis really wanted peace, the violence and the Occupation would stop.

gly you sound almost happy" they will not last" so you can join ahmadinajad he will be happy as you are if Israel will not last.Bad news for you and your pal israel will last and thrieve and inovate and live on its sword as long as it takes for you and ahmadinajad to understand israel will not go away .they are more commited to their country then you will ever be to your own.and they have a history of hardship and endurance to prove it .sorry to disappoint you .

Easy Zv. Do not get too excited. I thing you need to study history more closely. Have a wonderful Florida evening. Ciao Zv.

Wow, ZV. Sisty years ago the Palestenians and Jews were living side by side. Militant Jews who immigrated to Palestine are the ones who caused this contniuous war. They want the entire land for themselves. But please note that Hamas was created by the Israeli security services to undermine Yasser Arafat. Please do not lecture us here.

"European doesn`t quite get it. It is the COURTS that are likely to issue an arrest warrant and try people like Ya`alon, NOT the governments. The two are separate in European countries and the courts generally defend their freedom of action zealously against political pressure" Rubbish. Despite your touchingly naive beliefs to the contrary, even HRW has noted the lamentable state of universal jurisdiction as a practical tool in Europe -- owing to many reasons, but including prosecutorial discretion (which is often linked to foreign policy concerns) and to the limited scope of much of the legislation (in France, you basically need torture as a grounds for proceeding). As a practical example of Europe's willingness to take a stand, consider Belgium, which did indeed have a very strong universal jurisdiction statute until 2003, when it gutted it after strong suggestions from the US and others that it might be wise to remove NATO headquarters from Brussels to a more congenial country.

Hey Zvi, relax. if you are so passionate about Israel, what are you doing in Florida? Israel is patially responsible for the displacement of 6 million Palestenians. And you call terrorists? Come on. Let us be more relaistic and deal with the issues in a rational way where both sides can live side by side.

For Israel's survival, they need to stop sucide bombers and rockets. If a Palestinian state was established on the west bank, gaza and east jerusalem this will not end the conflict. Israel has every right to exist. Many jewish people living in that area since biblical times, have been 2nd class citizens. If most of the Palestinians really wanted peace, the violence and the call to destroy Israel would stop. I would love peace and a justice for both sides, but not at the expense of destroying Israel.

Continue to act like barbaric morons instead of a professional defense force?

Very well said, Richard. That's how most of the world sees it.

Hi Richard, I believe if the Arabs would have higher military power as opposed to Israel there would be no single Jew left in the Levant alive. If the Arabs would have won any war Israel would be destroyed. The reason they haven't done it, because they are not capable to do this at the moment. On the other hand, it's a known fact that Israel had nukes and other WMD since 1960-s. During 2 major wars - 1967 and 1973 when Israel faced existential threat, they didn't use it or threaten to use it. That is the difference. If other side would have it, I don't have any slight doubt that they would have used it against Israel long time ago. So please don't compare those 2 sides.

As an Israeli/American who currently lives in FL; I don?t get upset at the humor or lack of educated people like you who live in sunny Miami and don?t understand what it is like to live in a neighborhood like the middle east where you have neighbors that for the last +60 yrs want to erase you off the map as Iran president Adejeniabad has said. It is in the charter of the Palestinian's government to erase every Israeli or Jewish person from the so called Palestine. First of all, educate yourself and really understand where the word ?Palestine? comes from. Second, I invite you to leave sunny Miami and move to sunny southern Israel and live near the border with Gaza where you would be fearing for your safety as well as your family and friends safety not knowing when the next Hamas (terrorist group labeled by the US State Department, England, Canada, France, Germany,?) missile will land near you. Just an idea to be considered.

I invite you to leave the safety and tranquelity of home surrounding in Canada and move to Israel for 6 wks near the Gaza border where there are people living on the other side of the border who care for nothing but to hurt you, your family, and friends. You make absolutly no sense with your comment. Israelis have tollerated terrorist bombing for a long time. Israeli's dont send their children to blow-up buses, and kill innocent civilians at randum. Unnless, you have experienced or have relatives/friends that experienced terrorist actions, come up with something that would make sense of the reality of life in Israel.

I wonder how long the people of Florida would tolerate it if they were driven from their homes to make way for another people, if they were living under a brutal occupation for decades, if their resources were taken by the invaders and occupiers, if their lives were deliberately made miserable, if they were unable to have a viable economy because the invaders would not let that happen, if their homes were demolished and lands taken for homes for the invading occupiers etc. etc. I don't think that the people of Florida, or any other state, would tolerate it for long and might just resort to an armed struggle especially when non-violent resistance proved futile. Why should the Palestinians be any different? Why should the Palestinians just have to take it?

Having been present during court proceedings in Israel, I was appalled to learn that neither the accused nor their lawyers were allowed to know what "evidence" the prosecutors were using against the accused. Thank God the courts in my country are more democratic and just.

Why are yu so upset if you live in Florida? Let Europe and I srael work out their own issues? Are you a former IDF soldier, who served in Cast Lead? South Lebanon, .....?

or their well-established reputation for independence. It provokes one to asjk what else he may be unfamiliar with.

an Israeli." European doesn't quite get it. It is the COURTS that are likely to issue an arrest warrant and try people like Ya'alon, NOT the governments. The two are separate in European countries and the courts generally defend their freedom of action zealously against political pressure. This is not Israel you know.

Because making it a level playing field would mean that it would be OK to launch missiles at apartment buildings because an IDF officer was home visiting his family in one, that if there's a vehicle stuck in rush hour traffic with an IDF or MK person in it, the cars and buses around it are no reason not to launch som high explosives, that gunships can target the Israeli fishing fleet if it goes more than a mile or two off-shore, that destroying every airport in Israel is permitted, that arresting everyone who buys Israel bonds and putting people who once trained with the IDF on no-fly lists is standard practice.

of Arabs waging a loosing war on Israel. Search for faults in the right places.

2nd pargraph of your intervention applies 100% to your friends the Phillistins imported to increase the demography of thieves leaving on handouts from EU. UN, and ISRAEL

Stop taking these leftist lunatics so seriously. And no sane European country would lay a hand on an Israeli. We know better than to anger the US.

"Fortress Israel" is battoning down the hatches. in our Global intertwined world, they won`t last long as a fortress." - gly At this time Israel has convinced itself that it 'don't need no stinking world!" Just as Hamas blames Israel for everything that goes wrong, Israel blames anti-Semitism. Thus you are wrong, any action by the world to change the course of Israel will serve only to strengthen it's resolve to shower contempt upon the world.

"The Palestinian have a right to a state, but it seems they would rather keep trying to destroy Israel." - Jane The Netanyahu government has made it absolutely clear that there will be no Palestinian State. The Netanyahu government has totally stonewalled all efforts at reinstating peace negotiations, and even insisted all previous negotiations be voided and a complete restart required. Efforts by many nation, the USA, Egypt, Turkey, Jordan, the EU, and Arab League, and even Saudi have been rebuffed by expanded settlement building and diplomatic humiliations. The horrible fact is that the only Palestinians with any credibility left in Palestine are Hamas, and worse. The Olmert government stalled, but Pharaoh Netanyahu has blatantly stated that Israel will never let the Palestinian people go. What have the Palestinians left? They cannot await for 10 plagues to free them. Israel won't, the world won't. Netanyahu has chosen another round of horror for both Israel and Palestine.

Though Ya'alon is in no danger visiting US lackey Britain, he might be arrested in some other EU nations. It is prudent from both personal and national interest to not leave the country.

make it iti-for-tat - maybe then the europeans will then get the message of their silliness with a crimes court it's already a kangaroo court - just make it apparent to those who do not have a clue about it - which is like 90% of the worlds population

In our Global intertwined world, they won't last long as a fortress.

"I would like to see any other country tolerate for many years constant rockets falling around their homes." I would like to see any country tolerate for many years roadblocks, occupation, house demolition, assassinations, land theft, water theft.

There are many Israelis who can no longer be safe in the knowledge that they can travel the world with impunity. Ya'alon is stating that the occupation of palestine is worth the isolation of a self imposed iron curtain. It is for the Israeli people to decide if he is roght or wrong.

If you were part of an unarmed population whose resources and land were being systematically appropriated by religious fanatics backed by a modern army, would you really want to make peace with them or their country? If your answer is 'yes,' then you're either the biggest wimp to tread Florida soil or a liar.

he said according to the article that he yaalon doesnt see travel cancellations as a big loss. Perhaps he can explain to the public why he and many other members of the government travel as much as they do overseas if its not a big loss not to travel. Did he put his foot in his mouth again?

his travel plans. Every single soldier who served during Cast Lead will have to consider whether it is safe to travel. And we haven't even started on Lebanon2 yet. The plan is simple to isolate and paralyse normal interaction between Israelis and Palnet Earth until you end the occupation. Or normal decent Issraelis refuse to shoot Palestinians or serve in Occupied Palestine. It worked before with South Africa it will work again. It really is that simple.

What I find interesting that the Palestinians have a few charters aiming to destroy the state of Israel. They send in suicide bombers to murder as many people as possible and the money they get they use for the armed struggle. Many opportunities have been missed for a viable state. They would rather live in filth than create a state that can make their lives so much better. You cannot blame Israel for what most of the Palestinain politicans and parents have decided for their people and children, I would like to see any other country tolerate for many years constant rockets falling around their homes. My heart and prays go out to all the innocent people that have been hurt or have died. They should look at the elected leaders. Israel has every right to protect itself. The Palestinian have a right to a state, but it seems they would rather keep trying to destroy Israel.

The next time a leader or his/her government official of a known and labeled terrorist group, or a country labeled as a terrorist country by the UN, US state department, EU,... (i.e. Iran's Adejenabad, Libia's Kadafi, Syrian's Bashar al-Assad, Vanezuela's Chavez and many more) should all be detained for crimes against humanity. Many of these terrorist lead countries have a long history of committing crimes against their own people and others. Let's not forget China who is one the 15 members of the UN Security Council, consisting of five veto-wielding permanent members (China, France, Russia, United Kingdom, United States). So, they want to pick on Israel fitting for its survival and freedom in a tough neighborhood like the middle east? Hummmmm, just an idea.