To the readers whom I have wronged

The top of the day to you Dutch. Your contributions to the forum are considered 'essential reading' by myself and perhaps other folk here... in my case, for your constancy of purpose. I do not contribute so much myself as it is all too easy to get wound up by the right wing 'zealots' who deny ALL other than their own existence, limited and exclusive be that as it may. They really haven't come to grips yet with 'science'... you know, black-holes, global warming, soil-erosion, water shortages ... ad nauseum... ... Such a proud Oral History with accompanying 'scribbles' seems to hold sway over analytical, logical, non-emotional, non-bigoted & verfiable SCIENCE... Dutch, your paragraphs are great but the endings do not match the content... too soft... 'vandals' in your last post fell way short in what you had described within the post.

looking forward to you completing your post. Thank you.

Did the Lebanese Christians announce to the Israelis that they were going to massacre or did they say they were after the Pal murderers who killed Lebanese Christians? Why did the Syrian(Moslem) rulers not punish Christian murderer Hobeika?

I will remind you Peter who killed whom. The peace loving Christian militias under the supervision and protection of the peace loving Israelis were helping the Lebanese people get rid of Palestinean women and children the Israeli way. The following is taken from Wikipedia: 'By noon of September 15th, the IDF had completely surrounded the Sabra-Shatila camps, and controlled all entrances and exits by the means of checkpoints. The IDF also occupied a number of multi-storey buildings as observation posts. Amongst those, was the seven-story Kuwaiti embassy, which, according to TIME, had "an unobstructed and panoramic view" of the camps.' '1,500 Christian militiamen assembled at Beirut International Airport, then occupied by Israel. Under the command of Elie Hobeika, they began moving towards the camps in IDF supplied jeeps, following Israeli guidance on how to enter the camps.'

It was very motivating for me to start the day after reading your piece of literature, I enjoyed every word of it, and for a moment I wanted to believe that the our region might be heading for a better direction. however,I like to think that whatever appeared in your columns up to this day had been reflecting your true views on the issues surrounding you. I've always admired your writings- the ones I agreed with and those I opposed. If and when a writer regrets something he wrote, I like to think that he is heading for a better place in his fight for justice and liberty of the mankind- I want to believe that this is the case with you. I'll be looking forwards to reading you in the upcoming issues. best regards, samar

A useless academic can parrot what (s)he was taught in school, but cannot develop new logic. Case in point: The "1948 lands". "Tosefta,the article you cited is dated 11/26/2001 !" - Lakshmi How true. IThe article said to you that the code-word for ALL of Israel within the Green Line was "1948 lands", valid at least to the end of 2001, and is used in schoolbooks of all Palestinians (not only Hamas). You are now facing the great question: Did Hamas change the meaning of the phrase in the last 5 years, to mean "The Jewish part of the 1947 Partition lines"? An academic who is able to think for his/herself would have probably reasoned: This is unlikely. Textbooks for kids, especially new ones, are not replaced so fast, and the phrase was not coined, nor owned by Hamas. It would have been wiser to invent a new phrase, such as the "1947 lands". This would have been enough of a motivation for the useful academic to check the web in order to be sure. (I did, and the FIRST result I came up with is cited below.) Of course, an academic with just a little bit of understanding of Hamas would have known that it is impossible for Hamas to discuss the Partition line as desirable, since it is contrary to their Charter. But let us say that this is forgivable for people who are not that familiar with the topic. But I have to say, Lakshmi, that this is no good excuse for you. I think the Northridge effect is more widespread than some would like. (Turkish Weekly, Friday , 14 September 2007) "Thousands of Muslim worshippers headed for the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem on Friday at dawn for the first Friday of Ramadan of the Islamic year 1428, as Israel tightened security measures around the Holy City. It is expected that thousands of worshippers will come from all over the Palestinian territories as well as the 1948 lands inside the Green Line." http://www.turkishweekly.net/news.php?id=48543

The Pal.parents who dance in the street when a Jew is killed by their children have wronged both Israeli parents and victims. They should be asking for forgivness. But I will not give it.Allah wont do it either

what was it revenge for? Who was Eli Hobeika and how did he end up as a member of the Lebanese parliament?

being questioned(brought to) the ICJ.Regarding,the Hamas leaders'references to israel as the 1948 lands etc. I am assuming that the link you gave me is by a third party(I will look it up as soon as I get the opportunity).This does not change the fact that when a Hamas leader 'recently'(about a week ago) said,the 'land past the Green Line' he was talking about the land that did not conform to the Partition arrangement.I even recently heard someone say they were thinking of changing the Charter.Nothing in THIS situation is written in stone.En passant & this is my view(not necessarily H's)since israel did not follow 242 it opens up 181.And 242 calls for withdrawal from occupied territories,leaving out the definite article.My view: SC did that because it does not have the authority to demarcate borders,only call for withdrawal.Security issues only.And further,although I have some differences with D'Amato,on this point I agree with him:181 fixes borders permanently.ALL territories,not Arm.L

"5.De facto govt.in Gaza,their leaders continue to talk about the `48 lands,beyond the Green Line. 6.See my post 176,the matter was never brought for adjudication to the ICJ." - Lakshmi Lakshmi, I am not going into any legal arguments about D'Amato. He has his unique view, and people wishing it to be correct are entitled to cite him. But it is NOT permissible to change known facts. Your no.6 is a mild violation of this principle, while no.5 is a very serious one. I will briefly elaborate, first on the mild case: 6. D'Amato wrote his articles on "The West Bank Wall" before the ICJ rendered its decision on the "fence" (2004). According to D'Amato, the West Bank should not even be called "occupied territory" since Israel has some rights there; the Mandate being still in force. (Laughter.) Yet, the ICJ calls it just that, occupied, so they disregarded the D'Amato view. 5. I told you a few times that the term "1948 lands" serves as a Palestinian code-word for all of Israel pre-67, not to the part of it that is the Jewish part in Resolution 181. I gave you even 2 web references which point this out. Yet, you keep pretending that the meaning (when Hamas uses the term) is the 181 borders. This is a falsehood, and it is compounded by the fact that it is easy to find out the true meaning of the term. As an academic, you should look for the truth, not shut your eyes and theorize baselessly. You are presenting yourself as blockheaded as Jeff Northridge is (but he is not an academic). I will give you a reference one last time (below), and I hope this brings to an end this binge of stating falsehoods. "The State of Israel, a member state of the UN since 1949, is not recognized. It is referred to by substitute names such as the lands within the "green line", "interior" or "1948 lands". Its name does not appear on any map, nor do any towns, villages and projects (industries, harbors, railways, etc.) created and developed by Israel. Israel is presented as the usurper and occupier since its establishment in 1948". http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/578102/posts

I'm sepharadi: we don't hold there is an obligation to forgive carte blanche without not only a commitment, but a demonstrated effort, to change one's conduct. An apology without a commitment to change and a real effort to do so is , for all intensive purposes, dishonesty and manipulation cloaked in righteousness.

that the UN is successor to the League(which it is!)and sovereign. 2.Further study of mandates &trusts required before we can pronounce,for instance different types of trusts etc. 3.The validity of 181 does not hinge on the above.Sovereign decision as you yourelf say. 4.Hamas asked Unity Govt.to negotiate,but that Govt. no longer exists,dissolved by abbas himself. 5.De facto govt.in Gaza,their leaders continue to talk about the '48 lands,beyond the Green Line. 6.See my post 176,the matter was never brought for adjudication to the ICJ. 7.D'Amato is ignored for political reasons,because it is not in israel's interests to bring back the 181.Giving up ALL the land it seized during the wars.

Israel should stop the nonsense with Abbas or it will be too late soon. Better stil, if Abbas is serious, Israel should send him to Gaza with an ultimatum. If the Palestinians will not come with a) an acceptable and total sieze fire or b) an acceptable Peace terms; Israel will consider itself in a State of War with the Palestinians and the rules of War will be applied. Israel MUST do that befor the much talked about meeting in Washington. Time for piecemeal Peace or radom negotiations MUST over and over NOW. The landscape of the ME is changing by the day.The future is very uncertain Any unbinding and guranteed agreemts can be soon not worth the paper written on them.The stakes are high and it will be much higher tomorrow. Israel should NOT give up any of its defence options today for dream like tomorrow. Israel tried that before and failed.Israel should do all that with the full knowledge of the people so the people will be behind their Government. Shana Tova.

you need to ask forgivemess from the non-Muslims in your country and their living family members that you have persecuted and killed.

Targetting Israeli civillians,with one exception. You poor innocent victims.Israel sends in tanks etc. What did you expect candy? That's the Arab trick for celebrating the killing of civillians or military alike.

Dutch.You don't amaze me;it is common,the truth twisted out of ignorance as in your-170. Here are the facts: a)figures unsbstintiated.& b) absenace of history.Both made your post a mere piece of rubbish. Let me explain: As for (a) although it is part of (b) yet non of your figures have a credible source.As for (b)all facts are related to its source;the 1948 WAR. 1)In 1948 we have the UN resolution of Two States. 2)Israel accepted the resolution. 3) The Arab Countries plus the Palestinians rejected it and attacked and declared WAR on Israel. 4)Egypt ends that WAR and singed Peace Treaty. 5)Jordan ends that WAR and signed Peace Treaty. 6) The Palestinians with Arab Countries refused to end the WAR and to sign a Peace Treaty. And that is where we are NOW. In state of WAR. To call it an OCCUPATION is NOT true and a LIE & 'twisted the truth'. The Palestinans treating it WAR & Israel the same.It is still the 1948 WAR. WAR is not OCCUPATION. Dutch. Right ?

knows everything,reports selectively and try to peddle their prejudices as fact. G'mar Chatima Tova.

We religous jews ask G-D, to forgive us and we as humans must forgive also. It takes courage, character to give hodoa(admission) but it must be followed charata and azivas hacheit...All it takes is understanding the opposite veiw even if u disagree. And both sides most agree to respectfully(always) disagree. The eloquence of your words must be followed thru by all Jews especially in their opposing veiws. Hamas and Fatah have shown how they settle their differneces and we must learn from your hearfelt epistle of confessions and forgiveness. IF u are sincere and your opponents are sincere equally u and they will hasten the Moshich and true Klall Yisroel. shanna tova to u.

Mr. Burston, I believe you to be a humane and decent person. What I wonder about is why the newspaper you managed continues to be a font of deranged paranoid delusions? John Boulton could not be approved by Congress as the US ambassador to the UN for a very, very, simple reason, First he had demanded, when he was their politically appointed boss, that State Department analysts lie about WMD. Then he, himself, had lied about WMD. He is a lair, why does Haaretz continue to push the words of a know lair on the subject as if they were true?

I don't apologize for anything,just don't see the reason why. In my humble opinion it's you,Bradley and your cronies Gideon and Amira that should be apologizing for the sickening way you portray the situation in Gaza/WB/Israel.

Dutuch-It amazes me how you are selective with facts!Your figuers- a)none is substantiated b)irrelavent in WAR for reasons follows:- "1948"-Dutch.Thanks quoting that in your post. In 1948 ISRAEL did NOT declared WAR on any country.ISRAEL was the first to accept the UN resolution for partition. FIVE ARAB countries plus the PALESTINIANS attacked ISRAEL.(remember (in violation of the UN resolution). From this POINT the HISTORY of the PRESENT CONFLICT/WAR started.What followed is the result of the 1948 WAR: 1-Israel in a state of WAR with the Arabs who attacked her. 2) Israel in a State of WAR with the Palestininas who attacked her. 3)The State of WAR with Egypt seized & Peace Treaty singed 4) State of WAR with Jordan seized & Peace Treaty signed. 5)The Palestinians refused & decided to remain at WAR with Israel.No Peace treaty signed. THAT IS WHERE WE ARE NOW. In WAR each side supposed to do its worse.And that what both sides are doing. WAR is not OCCUPATION.

Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning? You teach a child to read, and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test. One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures. Then you wake up at the high school level and find out that the illiteracy level of our children are appalling. As Luce reminded me, he said, without data, without facts, without information, the discussions about public education mean that a person is just another opinion.

Hello Smadar, The Partition lines of 1947 are dead and gone. And D'Amato is ignored, for a good reason. Lakshmi promotes the Lines for her own sense of justice. She doesn't live in the ME reality and can afford to fantasize. The Arabs can't, so when Abbas and the Saudis (and the Arab League) consider the max they can demand, it is the 67 lines. Hamas also makes absolutely no mention of these lines. When they were in the Unity Government, they also wanted Abbas to negotiate the 67 lines. The Past is dead; long live the Future.

Here are D`Amato`s points, taken from 2 articles which I will call (A) The West Bank Wall II, 2004; and (B) The Legal Boundaries of Israel in International Law, 2005. 1. The Sovereign which established the Mandate was the League; receiving sovereignty from the Ottomans. 2. With the Demise of the League, "the Mandate simply devolved as a matter of law upon the United Nations and its two relevant specialized organs, namely, the General Assembly and the International Court of Justice"(A). 3. D`Amato actually insists in (B) that "The General Assembly did not derive its legal powers directly from the Charter of the UN, but rather as surrogate for the League of Nations as it devolved its powers of mandate supervision to the UN and, through the UN, to the General Assembly itself." In other words, he denies that the UN organization became sovereign; according to him the General Assembly became a supervisor only and not sovereign. This is, his basic mistake, I believe. The UN became the sovereign. It could even cancel the mandate when it wanted. All the powers of the League went to the UN. WITHIN the UN, due to the Charter, the GA received the power of supervision, and changing or terminating the mandate. There is more than 1 type of trust. You can have a trust in perpetuity or for a limited time. A politician, for example, can put his holdings in a Blind Trust, so he does not run into conflict of interest. Whenever he pleases, he can take back the property (even if he did not finish his term of office; the public might decide to kick him out for it, but the property is his). The League, and the UN, had the right to cancel a trust, or give it to a new trusty. The UN decided in 181 to UNCONDITIONALLY end the trust, and give the territory to the natives. It had the right to do that. Because D`Amato is hung up on the eternal obligation of Britain to educate the natives, etc, he also prefers to see 181 as being initiated by Britain. But it was not a British proposal: "On November 29, 1947, the General Assembly adopted the key "partition" resolution, Resolution 181, ratifying the British proposals (B)." Unfortunately for him, a sovereign has the right to do what he pleases.

in their latest rampage on Palestinian farm land in Northern Gaza! Have your read James Petras' The Power of Israel in the U.S.? Regards

As you know, pearls come into being because of the irritation caused by grains of sand. To some you are a grain of sand, to others a pearl, to many, you're just irritating... At least you keep the discussions going. Thank you for your articles. A good and sweet new year!

also endorsed the Geneva Accord,which is essentially a jazzed up version of Oslo.Not surprising since Beilin was one of the architects also of Oslo.

Here are D`Amato`s points, taken from 2 articles which I will call (A) The West Bank Wall II, 2004; and (B) The Legal Boundaries of Israel in International Law, 2005. 1. The Sovereign which established the Mandate was the League; receiving sovereignty from the Ottomans. 2. With the Demise of the League, "the Mandate simply devolved as a matter of law upon the United Nations and its two relevant specialized organs, namely, the General Assembly and the International Court of Justice"(A). 3. D`Amato actually insists in (B) that "The General Assembly did not derive its legal powers directly from the Charter of the UN, but rather as surrogate for the League of Nations as it devolved its powers of mandate supervision to the UN and, through the UN, to the General Assembly itself." In other words, he denies that the UN organization became sovereign; according to him the General Assembly became a supervisor only and not sovereign. This is, his basic mistake, I believe. The UN became the sovereign. It could even cancel the mandate when it wanted. All the powers of the League went to the UN. WITHIN the UN, due to the Charter, the GA received the power of supervision, and changing or terminating the mandate. There is more than 1 type of trust. You can have a trust in perpetuity or for a limited time. A politician, for example, can put his holdings in a Blind Trust, so he does not run into conflict of interest. Whenever he pleases, he can take back the property (even if he did not finish his term of office; the public might decide to kick him out for it, but the property is his). The League, and the UN, had the right to cancel a trust, or give it to a new trusty. The UN decided in 181 to UNCONDITIONALLY end the trust, and give the territory to the natives. It had the right to do that. Because D`Amato is hung up on the eternal obligation of Britain to educate the natives, etc, he also prefers to see 181 as being initiated by Britain. But it was not a British proposal: "On November 29, 1947, the General Assembly adopted the key "partition" resolution, Resolution 181, ratifying the British proposals (B)." Unfortunately for him, a sovereign has the right to do what he pleases.

D'Amato analysis.Re: Arab League,that is their position.I notice that Hamas leaders continue to refer to the 1948 lands inside the Green Line.And international law experts I spoke to say that the Partition Line is doable.

Akram, It never ceases to amaze me how you twist the truth. The real criminals are the IDF and settlers who are un- lawfully occupying the Palestinian territories in violation of international law and the ICJ in The Hague. How can you talk about the Palestinians wanting to inflict destruction on Israel when the Zionist gangs almost wiped Palestine & the Palestinian people off the map when they uprooted close to 3/4 million people from their home and some 500 villages in 1948? Since 2000--the IDF have demolished over 5,000 Palestinian homes and have left over 175,000 Palestinians homeless again, plus destroyed between 2-3 billion dollars in Palestinian infra- structure (built with US dollars ); uprooted over a million olive treees the Palestinians use for their livlihood & confiscated over one million dunams for more settlements & wall and had the audacity to push them off their roads & ration them on their water while they consumed 20x times. What vandals! Dutch

Shanah Tovah Tosefta, hope you had a well-deserved New Year, and the challenges such as on the other thread regarding the questionable IDF - Syrian bombing, are not upsetting at the start of another year on Haaretz Talkback. I guess some things just don't change. Thanks for the suggested Khalidi's book, "The Iron Cage" which I will look out for. I am glad to hear that the 1947 Partition argument should really be totally ignored, as you mentioned the ICJ and Arab League have not made it a concern for serious negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians. Even my father was impatient with me when I raised the issue once again. Lakshmi made it sound that Hamas's position could be the major stumbling block was this issue of the border/partition of the two-states. On the whole, I think Carter's book is quite good and comprehensive for the layperson in getting an historical overview of the conflict. It's commendable that he has been dedicated to resolving the conflict.

Hello Smadar, and Shanah Tovah. I read the Carter book which contains some inaccuracies, but not serious. When he talks about the awakening of the national consciousness of the Palestinians, he probably means: Under the British Mandate, not in 1947. In any case, this is when it happened. To get a better idea o the state of Palestinians society at the time, I would recommend Khalidi's book "The Iron Cage". D'Amato knows Mandate history even worse than Carter, quite amazingly. A number of crucial mistakes. In any case, his legal opinion is idiosyncratic and not accepted and was ignored by the ICJ. Reading it carefully, I even found the basic error in his analysis. It is best to ignore him, although he will continue to be cited by dreamers who still hope for the Partition Lines. They are dead, as even the Arab League knows. But some dreams die hard for unrealistic people.

But for deliberatley slandering Israel(Your Own Nation) in times of great difficulty,and adding fuel to the fre thats allready burning,you are going to have to extinguish it yourself,I am not saying all Israelis are perfect we done some things we shouldnt have at times, I regrett, But to look for fault and conbstantly slander us,just to gain approval from Anti-Semites and Israel Bashers(Yes I know their is a difference) but their motives are up for question,That makes me think of you as a weak and indignified man, IF YOU CAN STAND UP AND SHOW WHERE THE OTHER SDE DOES WRONG TOO,WE can talk business again, until then forget it.

"I ask forgiveness, then, for adding to the conflict in this world. I ask forgiveness for orchestrating anger. I ask forgiveness for lack of compassion in addressing those with whom I disagree. I ask forgiveness for manipulating emotions, for failing to demonstrate respect, for selectivity in recognizing pain, and in blindness to good intentions which differ from my own". I have read this paragraph over several times. These are powerful insights that are the product of a process of introspection that could not have been easy. I applaud Mr. Burston. This is not about abandoning one's core convictions; it is about listening to the "still small voice" that tells us when we are crossing the line into dehumanizing, disrespecting, and just plain hating. I shall try to be mindful of the times I do this, so that I can make better choices. Thanks, Bradley, for the reminder. Please make sure you forgive yourself as well! You may see your sins, but I have rarely noticed them.

lakshmi, I don't know if you saw my response posts to the D'Amato opinion on the 1947 border. can google: Official: PA demand for timetable major sticking point in talks

once you started this "repentence thread"apparently the shock therapy was overwhelming?you knocked the socks off of us.good for you bradley-once you start doing it G-Ds way you'll find its a lonely road to travel down with lots of abuse being heaped on you.i've been enjoying it? for 17 years myself trying to be ethical in an unethical world.G-D have mercy on you if you continue-you'll end up losing friends that "really werent your friends" but you'll feel better about yourself.just another thought-you've put us on the spot-we know "we are bad" but we dont want to admit it in public-----quick change the subject so i can be "normal" again?

for what.. for killing so many inocent people but letting the lin kes of Indaraya lakshami and Labras to continue to live to spread their hate and their lies arround.. How can a loving God make the mistake of sending a earthquake to Indonesia and not using it to get rid of Indaraja and her ilk?

Only a bigot or an ignorant will rebut the genocidal Israeli policy and its cruelty towards the Palestinians. You want Palestineans to lower their heads and swallow their anger forever and even better you want them to disappear. It won't work Jordan, Palestinians have the right to rule themselves whether their failure to flourish is their fault or Israel's fault. Israelis must acquire the humility to admit their wrong doing and the courage to fix it.

A nice gesture ! but I miss the old you. All this humility - it's time to come back and be a voice for sanity.

ex s africa... now israel aparthied transplanted. israel and aparthied s africa were the closest of pals....

asking forgiveness without stamping out the settlements, not continuing to steal their water among other things, not discontinuing the harassment and brutality against the palestinians, is rubbish. your attitude appalling

You haven't wronged me in any way. You have had a difference of opinion, that is not wronging me. I, however, have had mean-spirited thoughts about you because of these differences. As a matter of fact there have beentimes I have absolutly hated you, and Jesus said that if you hate someone it is the same as killing him, and I must confess I have killed you many times this year. Please forgive me. I look forward to reading your columns in the future and I promise to try and not kill you so many times this year! Happy New Year!!

I apologize for thinking that Bradley Burston is a silly hypocrite, asking forgiveness before Yom Kippur, in order to be cleaned up, with more energy to go at it again. A suggestion: if you have an urge to castigate somebody really venomously, the best moment is one hour before Yom Kippur begins: best chance you will survive and be pardoned.

Abeer, I'm sure that in between attending death to the Jews rallies, sending their kids to suicide bomber camps and petitioning the UN for sustenance and to denounce Israel, Palestinians do attempt to feed their families, but you are missing the point. Even the majority that didn't take the revenge path as you put it, supports killing innocents through terrorism (or resistance as you find it more convenient to call it). I don't care what your justification or cause is, this is unnacceptable. You ask what I expect from people living under occupation. You ask what about the roadblocks that disrupt your daily lives. These are valid points and I support the complete removal of roadblocks and an end to the occupation as do most here...Just as soon as there is a government in place that can and will recognize Israel and jail or kill terrorists. I'm not holding my breath because your misery is always blamed on others and you as a society refuse all responsibility.

May they forgive us: those whose land is full of settlements, whose water and olives are stolen and those who are treated with disrespect in check points, etc

only by argument and reasoning,not by any other method.And so far,I have not seen any that would change mine!

rest of us get to squeeze in only a few lines! I hope you understand the difference between using the third person characterisation about someone to one's friends and calling those people names to their faces! Even one of your zionists has acknowedged that I have not directly insulted anyone,posting directly to them. Margie has apologised.She understands where I stand now.

what WE PERSONALLY have done with the UNIQUE, probably never coming again chance to set the two-state-solution peace train on its track. Let me make the beginning. I SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE HARSH, LIKE THE PROPHETS OF OLD. Clearer. More letters, more direct encouragement. AND LESS TALKBACKS! There'll be a terrible judgement on that. What's worse: if the chance never comes back, HOW can one look in the face of the PEOPLES, both Israelis but still much more the Palestinians. It's more than a shame. There's no words for it.

Paradoxically, Bradley Burston is more likely to benefit the people who despise him and call him a self hating Jew, amongst other names, because he tries to put alternative views across instead of trotting out the popular view that Jews are always right, regardless of what they do. Every nation tries that at some time, and history has a habit of proving that venomous racial hatred ends up with a lot of dead people, and yet more venom and desire for revenge. In time, I hope some of the nastier elements in these columns will have the grace to apologise to him - though I doubt it. I apologise to him for not reading his column more often.

I understand openness to new facts,interpretations and understanding to be the cornerstone of knowledge. Like the poem, nobody's version of reality is ever more than just a 'position', no matter how considered.

the proportion of looneys , jackasses, fundamentalists, are more or less the same in all societies... be it israeli, indian, american, iranian..... sadly the number of close minded people in israel seems to have become abnormally higher. otherwise israel would have realised by now, that the peace they yearn for, cannot be attained by "searing defeat" on the pali, or any other mind. this was not the case initially, but this state of mind only set in with the rise of sharon 25 odd years ago.

Post "U.S. warned N. Korea not to help Syria with nukes" Labhras: Hi Lakshmi--You might want to check out moderate margie,s post 76 on the burston thread.She is complaining about rule three,personal atacks.I sent a response re the "you are the swine" episode.You might want to add credence to it. Regards and keep up the battle. lakshmi: 417Labhras,thanks for alerting me ! I`m going there right away,certainly is a phony!Can`t imagine someone like this organising a peace get together!Most likely on the opposite side on the anti apartheid issue also. Regards lakshmi: "post 76,Margie of Tel Aviv,I hope that she will do a mea culpa of her own and make a new year resolution not to insult talkbackers.A few days ago on a thread I addressed one Peter from Canada.It was a harmless post and I ended with some lovely lines of poetry.Beautiful lines! I said to him if he was puzzled & did not understand the reference to ask Peter SM to whom I had once quoted the same lines.The next day,on another thread,a different one altogether & out of the blue Margie Tel Aviv gratuitously burst out &replied to me saying :oh yes, quoting poetry,this is like throwing pearls to swine,and YOU are swine!"........ And here is how our sensitive lakshmi treats other posters: ..."People like Howdy Jeff are not only out of touch,but in his case there is his tunnel vision,he is a Viet Nam vet. and has trouble adjusting to the contemporary world,especially the changed configuration in the ME.Marge of TA is a shrill,strident zionist from former apartheid South Africa(all this info. from their own previous posts several months ago).Ibrahim,quite right in pointing out that fortunately JN is irrelevant,although you would not think so listening to the tone of his voice!" ...."Dagma,J.murphy & the usual zionist crowd,and that includes Howdy Jeff(the honorary zionist!) " ..."But there is a new monkey in the peanut gallery,our own C.K.Tan,who has been jumping up & down even though I explained in my post to Polybios that it was a typo.I meant to say 1.5 billion Muslims,but mistakenly typed 5billion.Oh he`s a real monkey jumping about with that one! Although this is the first time I notice he is actually trying to exercise his feeble intellect and advance some arguments(although mistaken ones)about the status of Jerusalem.I wonder what axe he is grinding.He once claimed to be a business man in Singapore,who did business in Palestine/israel.Probably not doing well there with the recent developments.Explains his bad temper.Notice how jumpy he is."

"but not slighted to individual reader" ML. With complete respect Mr Lincoln, what makes you know about Burston more than Burston knows about himself ?This must be absolute absurdity ! May be you may know about some truths that no body knows (which I doubt) but you can't claim that you know about Burston feelings better than the Man himself. If anyone writes about you this way Mr Lincoln you would laught at him and may be call him, some names.. "I have tracked all the recent 'stories' about Syrian nuclear program .."ML. What a mine of information you are Mr Lincoln ? Such insight knowledge worth millions ! Are you sure 'all' ? Nothing further to 'track' that might cast doubt about your 'findings' ? If you say so. "I have checked sources Mr Burston.I learned that from my Chinese and Asian History Professor Dr Dow many decades ago.."ML.Don't you think what was right 'many decades ago',could be wrong in 'our decade' ? Or is that all a case of 'anything goes'?

"I admire those those who try"Dutch. We all admire any one who tried a meaningful cause. But those you are refering to them have tried and tried and failed.And now they end up in the service of criminals. They brought horror to the Palestinians whom they pretend to help; by allied themselves with their untrustworthy leaders; and brough danger to Israel itself.Those who tried they benefited no one only themselves. No Palestine can be build by empty dreams.The Palestinian leadership inflicted itself on the Palestinians and made the Palestinian cause LOST ITS WAY.It became the business of criminal elements,selfseeking politicians and lost in a sea of international politics. A means to an end for every one and every country. Israel can't wait for the Palestinians to sort their problems. The Palestinians sending many signals including the destruction of the Jewish State?And they elected the party that adopted such a crazy policy ? Gaza is the Palestine that failed.

Kaff,you are al right me old China and fanks for the nice li''le comments.A Shana Tova to you and yours. Now lets discuss Tosefta and 'is smileys. I actually think that Tosefta has a lot of good ideas.I think that he constantly backs up his arguments too.I just dont believe that it will work knowing the people we are dealing with.From that he goes and decides that any centrist-to-right pro Israeli people are blind and he must fight this tooth,nail and smiley. The situation is very complicated and cannot be worked out in a test tube. I personally would like to see a peace.I question Abbas but believe he would go for a deal now and I believe the Saudis want it and would help.Hamas will never be allowed in by Israel and America and Gaza is a perfect bridgehead for the insurgents from Israels point of view and they wil continue to do what they do and clean it up to a point no matter who joins Hamas there.Th Pals have a chance on the West Bank.Will they accept less than they want?

Dutch. I am not here for my defence.I thank Kath who stood for that.I am here to correct serious misconceptions in your post.Uuworthy in a serious argument like the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.Words that you mentioned on your post that has no truth in them;and worse;words that are used by liars & the like of KKK. "Zionist Enterprise" Dutch.Zionism is the most Human Enterprise of all time. It saved human Victims from the fate of destruction. Zionism enpterised to save them and give them safe home single handed.Zionism Enterprised to save a nation that lost almost 40% of its population. Name another Enterprise of that human magnitude "greater Israel".Dutch.Jews have a problem in filling the land they have NOW;what chance they have for Greater Israel!?Isn't that a garbage talk?Empty words to fill empty minds?Brining such nonsense is the product of criminals that no one should defend,unless he has a twisted mind like them. "I admire those who try".Dutch.2

Ronnie hello I haven't talked with you for quite sometime. But,now came the time and we must all join hands for a better future in the coming days. Once the New year is over,perhaps peace will emerge somehow. I wish you and yours **Shana Tova** **L'echaim ve La Briyut** And may all your troubles be litle ones. With love and affection And a great admiration. P/S Tosefta asked me to send him a ryhme. You know what he can be like.He included the smileys he taught me.I am waffling on sorry. Heavens I must not be encouraged!

Mr. Burston I have read your works and have usually agreed. You have much to atone for, but not slights to individual readers. Your newspaper's online edition has given great credence to a tale told by a very few individuals in the United States. This tale makes Syria out to be an immediate nuclear threat to Israel when there is not one scintilla of evidence it is even a long term threat. I check sources Mr. Burston. I learned that from my Chinese and Asian History professor, Dr. Dow, many decades ago. How do I know if an author is telling me the truth? Look up some of his citations and discover if he has used them well, or misused them. I have tracked all the recent 'stories' about a Syrian nuclear program and the original sources are either John Boulton or "Bush Administration" sources. Thus they are not credible given the fact that both have been proven to lie about the subject matter. For this abuse of trust, you, and Haaretz to deserve to atone. Thank you, Mark D. Lincoln

This is the perfect time for Israel to apologize to the Palestinian people for destroying their lives for 60 years and right the wrongs. Get the hell out of their lands and leave them alone so that they can begin to build their lives and breathe.

Dutch hello again You accuse Akram of spouting despicable comments and you associate him, putting him on a par with the Klu kux Clan policies? How inappropriate your vision of Akram who is just a good Jew,and he,is not an overly hateful man. Very sensitive and wants peace to come to pass in Israel/Palis. You Dutch are shameless in your assumptions of him. Poor Akram,he really does not deserve your censure.He is mild and rather meek and just wants an end to the conflict.Is that what you call being a gangster(KKK)? Not on you know, what an undeserving indictment. Feeling strongly about the so-called Palestinians is a worthy cause,Dutch but! Don?t you think time has come for them to grow up, stop killing each other and unite in building a country they are supposed to hunger for? Nah, nah,nah I didn?t think so.All they want is continue with their terror tactics that hasn?t achieved anything bar more misery and strife. They love death too much I fear. If Jews who suffered for over two millennia,and made the desert bloom(even before the re-birth)of the state, pulled themselves up ?by their bootstraps?and created a country worthwhile,producing the greatest minds in the whole world(in proportion to their numbers)Should be a good example to the Arabs/Palis. There I?ll leave you to ponder awhile... By the way, I don?t usually read your posts,nor many for that matter. I tend to be a ?lurker? in (cyberspace parlance),most of the time no patience. But!when the subject requires it, I jump in regardless,and try to fight like a lioness. That is why I am surprised to find some do respond,and am unaware until I come to close the computer. This happened yesterday to the one by Clickfool, notting his new pseudonym: ?Oliver Clickfool? I briefly commented but forgot to remind him(too late) of my good impression on the man Oliver Cromwell Lord Chancellor during the Interregnum.He was instrumental in letting the Jews return to England after their expulsion in the 1300 . Gosh, I did go on a bit now didn?t I Dutch. Went on a tangent and rather prolix. That?s it for now Regards To You

ofcourse is its beauty.Hopkins thought of himself a devout Catholic and you obviously relate to the enraptured soul & its achievements.More like Boehme,Plotinus et al than H.I think.He was thinking of Christ's mastery,perhaps.You may be aware of Freudian interpretations of 'my heart in hiding stirred for a bird.'Not necessarily what he meant to convey,but what the poem conveys(to me) is the flight of the bird.From there to the beauty of the natural world etc.And I consider all the monotheistic faiths to be homocentric and androcentric.Be that as it may. . . I was not comparing one spirituality to another,in this case Gaza,but rather the beauty and achievement of people who,in my estimation,are a valiant group,resisting the Occupation.As an israeli you consider the zionist project okay.I've always considered it a misadventure.Sorry if it offends you but that is my considered position,based on my reading of ME history and the origins of 19th century zionism.

Kath. I hope G-d will forgive me for what I have said to Bradley ! Indeed you are right. Who am I to said what I said to a brother Jew on our days of atonements ? We are all creatures of G-d and no one should judge another in days like thes ! Only Hasham 'blessed be his name'. No doubt I have been out of order. I am glad Rosh H'shana is two days. I will have my chance to morrow to ask forgivness for what I said to Bradley and I hope that my books in heaven will be closed for this year with nothing in the Red. I thank you for that and more Kath. May G-d bless you and all those in your heart for always.

My Best to you in the coming year and may you find health and happiness. It doesnt matter if you are Jewish or not.It is important that you have a good heart and reasonable viewpoint for we are all not mavens even though we think we are.We cannot see the whole picture and while the ultra religious on all sides feel that they can,they too cannot.Where the rest of us have to search they get it filled in for them.I wish you all the best and may we all look for the best and not the worst. Shana Tova,L'chaim.

I for one see no need to apologize to nazis whether they are original or internationalist nazis. And being an internationalist nazi means hating Jews, killing Jews and in favor of the end of Israel as the Jewish nation. Long Live Israel and may the Jewish people overcome her enemies as she has in the past.

Shanah Tova e'metuka. I very much appreciate the opportunities you give us to be informed, discuss, and learn on Haaretz.com. This is one way of being connected to Israel and other people who care about bringing about peace in the region. Thank you and to continued excellence at Haartez in the new year!

Kath, You can butter up Akram Zakaria all you wish but it won't take away from his despicable comments blaming the vicitms of the Zionist Enterprise with its Ku kux Klan policies in the territories. I have little condifence Israelis/Jews can properly atone for their sins against the Palestinian people when they harbor evil designs for greater Israel. Such an opium will only cease with outside help and by cutting off the fuel line. Still, I admire those who wish to try and start someplace. it's very noble and I feel it will all help0 eventually. Dutch

my Mother non-Jewish, I feel myself very Jewish, believable or not, and therefore enjoy the best of both worlds Christian and Jewish. Therefore from my Jewish heart I wish you a Happy New Year 'Shanah Tovah' and sincerely hope that All your sins may be forgiven and sincerely hope you will continur with these Talkbacks so it gives us the chance of a 'Challenge'! and Thanks. However, upon looking back, it appears that the PRO-ISRAEL Lobby have fared better as their arguments seemed far more legitimate. Wonder if you gave it a thought.

Sarah Where did I go wrong? What was it you found so inappropriate in my post? Perhaps you can clarify it and will desist in committing such error in future. Regards to You

Scotguy I know now.Thank you for your sentiments and why you have to retaliate when some people here are very need to be reprimanded for their vile use and their feelings toward our Nation/Jews and your defence for us.Nothing needs being ashamed to ask forgiveness.But some things needs more forbearance and it can be difficult. I can now say Shana Tova to you! P/S It was my obtuseness,sorry.

Indrajaya Well,will your reply be in the affirmative? Hope remains eternal indrajaya. SHALOM/SALAMAT

Yes Edith,may all our dreams come true and may next year be a more peaceful one for all of us Jews and the whole of Israel. Thank you Again

Sentiments Roberto Pertaining self hating Jews,and the rest for which I agree with you pertaining to the arabs etc. Quite correct in all you say with great frustration that the majority of Jews feel and feel as you do is a case in point. Remmember Bradley does not act on behalf of the Israeli leaders or our GOV'and needless to say he has no authority as such. You have to read Amira hass and Gideon Levy before putting Bradley in the same category, and thus attacking him serves no purpose. Calm down before you burst a vein. Roberto we are all sinners take note. **Shana Tova**

Jordan, Most of the Palestinean People never sat around festering in a refugee camp crying about the injustices of 60 years. Most Palestinians attempt to go on with their lives, raise their children, attend school, go to work, and provide for their families and very few took the revenge path. What do you exect from people living under occupation that controls every aspect of their life. What about the hundreds of checkpoints and roadblocks that prevent children from going to school, parents to work, the injured to hospitals. Shame on Israel for creating their misery and continuing to confiscate their land, demolishing their homes and crops and cutting off their means of survival.

Choni and Miriam hello I rather like Brad's "A Special Place in Hell" I think it rather apt,considering that we seem to be living in a sort of "hell" here on earth anyway. Meantime,be a bit more accomodating to Brad'. It doesn't seem to have deterred you from coming here to read his articles does it? I will now wish you and yours **L'Shana Tova** P/S I hope you are not suffering too much from the high crime rate in South Africa...

Dutch hello There,there,now.Stop telling Bradley who he should or not listen.Remember Brad'is a Jew and if he so wishes will take or discard Akram's comments accordingly.It behoves you to keep out of our affairs for just this once. This is hardly time for trying to promote your views on matters which do not merit in any case. Have a nice day

Akram to wish you *Shana Tova".You were not forgotten I assure you. The last I read from you was a short missive to me in reply to what I had said.Which was: "PEACE THROUGH VICTORY".I repeated it from WWACD who introduced it here.I wanted to clear this before I get accused of plagiarism. Now about Bradly.Don't be too hard on him,as this is supposed to be our Holy Day and in the coming days it will be "The Atonement"for sins we committed.This applies not only to Brad'but to most of us.Jews firstly of course,but also some food for thought to the rest who come here every day to our "horror" and spew hatred. Perhaps they too will think before they speak. Am I being too optimistic?Absolutely,knowing nothing will change. **Blessings to you and yours**

Bradley, Don't listen to Akram Zekaria and give your support to a state that denies the Palestinian people their sovereign and just rights. You have a responsiblitity as a journalist to speak the truth and not carry the party line. I may have told you some Americans are looking to rein in Tom Friedman of the NYT and William Kristol of the weekly standard and Fox news for cheer leading the war on Iraq. Hence this whole complicity with the Bush Camp & Israel's part in the war on Iraq is unfolding and backfiring and people are outraged as they should be. This has been a nightmare. Plus there is no honor in a state serving an illegal occupation and settlements in violation of international law. Dutch

What are you talking about, Kath? You can't apologize without making racist remarks, personal insults, calling people Nazis or inciting violence? That must be an interesting apology you're holding out on.

Hello Bradley, It's the IDF and the illegal settlers who should be asking for for- giveness as they are violating many of the Ten Commandments by oppressing and killing their neighbors and coveting their land and resources. Plus they have violates the one law Jesus of Nazareth told the scribe to keep, "Love your neighbor as yourself" (Leviticus 19:18) Their crimes have brought great shame to themselves and they have alienated many Israelis from their own country and Israel from many of its neighbors and friends around world. I know some Israelis who couldn't take it anymore and left their country as they saw their evil effect in the trees and fields and in the people and the houses and it disturbed them so much. But some theologians have said sin can have that kind of effect and like a cancer it can keep getting worse. Hence acknowledging the sin becomes essential for restoring health and liberating the soul to find a new way and for a new day and a New Year! Anyway, my peace and love to you! You are doing a great job! Keep it coming, Dutch

and to the censors, shana tova and may you be inscribed in the book of life. I believe, they are doing their job, one is to avoid lawsuits for libel. Libel: a defamatory statement expressed in a fixed medium, esp. writing but also a picture, sign, or electronic broadcast. Black's Law Dictionary. akin to hate speech. Love your neighbor as yourself.

Bradly I always prefer your editorials than the rest of your colegues.I have a soft spot for you,for some weird reason,and have said it in the past. While I for one may forgive you,ultimately it is God's perogative to give you absolution for the sins you may have committed. As an aside,you ask us to confess our sins,but at the same time you still have the announcements to abide by the regulatory ground rullings we have to abide by.That is a tall order,don't you think? That is where I fault you a tad... How can we offer our thoughts toward the ones we may dislike without the strictures you put at the botom of the article. Before I go,I will wish you a special *Shana Tova" and may you be inscribed in "the book of life"...

Why do you make the worst assumptions about Jews and Israel?

The bird's physical flight Hopkins likened to the spiritual flight of the enraptured soul and tried to convey for us earthbound beings the 'achieve of, the mastery of the thing' in the use of his specialised vocabulary and yes, his sprung rhythm. If you're flexible enough to see this then I'm sure that you are broad minded enough to see that there are more sides to the political question before us than the one you adopt so zealously.

Sorry Ibrahim, dont mean people like you who have been living in the region during the British Mandate and maybe even before ... but the Arab Refugees who also call themselves 'Palestinians' just because they took refuge in the shelters in Palestine after the Arab/Israeli War of 1948 and when their own countries would not accept them bac, they returned to the region and now claim Gaza and the West Bank which was capured by Israel in June'67 as their next Home. Their actual Homeland is somewhere among the Neighbouring Arab Countries and they are resorting to Terror to get that land for themsekves.They are the 'Troublesome lot' that Arab countries sent out - and now Israel has to have them right next door!

Someone said she was a Moslem and I was surprised to hear that. I presume nothing. What do you presume about 'ex S Africa now Israel'?

you personally.I can't apologise for 'insulting' your country because I consider it a valid 'criticism' of your country.Re: your assumption that I did not understand The Windhover,that was a rash judgment on your part.He was a Jesuit priest & the poem is indeed addressed to Christ Our Lord,but the major theme is the beauty &dexterity of the bird,the windhover.That was the theme I was addressing.He was a great Nature lover.And his other fine poem on the subject is Pied Beauty:"Glory Be to God for dappled things,for skies of couple colour as a brinded cow,rose moles all . . ." He was also the first English inventor of sprung ryhthm,derived,he said from the old Anglo Saxon ryhthms.Not the regular pentameters of 19th century English poetryof which an example:The curfew tolls the knell of parting day etc. Great poet who also used the term 'inscape'(of Nature) to describe his poetry.En passant,he borrowed that term from a little known catholic saint called Marie Lataste in 13thcentury.

lakshmi is an out and out hindu name. lakshmi is a hindu and not a muslim.... not that the religion makes any difference. why do israelis and americans presume that all indians who are not muslim, ie hindus, sikhs, jains...., have to be anti muslim?

I remember that message. It was involved with a description of 'casting pearls before swine', since you had quoted rather wonderful poetry seemingly without understanding it. I had not considered that you were Muslim and that you would think that 'swine' was a particularly bad insult. If I hurt your feelings personally I apologise. I had not considered you particularly sensitive because of all the insults that you hurl at my country day after day. Since I have apologised for hurting your feelings I hope that you will do the same.

Bradley Burston. It is not from your readers that you need forgiveness.It is from your Country. The country that you did not show her LOVE in most of what you wrote or said. Your Country that needed your support in good and bad time; you neglected her in good and bad time. You said all the things your Ciuntry did not want to hear;being it right or wrong.Your Country that had hard time most of the time last year and was crying for advice and forgiveness and all that she had to hear from yo!u; your usual..bla..bla that dosn't give her comfort and redress. A day of atonement is not a day from man to man.A day of atonement goes further than that; to things that G-d has given to man and man neglected and did not man appreciated.. As the saying goes by Kennedy Ask not what your Country can do for you,but what you can do for your Country.. You will have your chance in the coming year ! Shana Tova.

Not really a beer person. Anyone that wants an Israel to come back to should make Israel their concern. For the time being it is still extremely important to keep America and Israel on the same side, we have mutual enemies and should therefore be putting a great deal of effort in to our mutual development programs.

"forgiveness" column which caused me to read it thereby wasting my time and further wasting my time by having to write you to tell you that it was a waste of my time? L'Shanah Tova

However, it does not mean that we trust you...

Johnny many thanks for your kind thoughts re our daughter. Unfortunately our Aliya did not go well for her and we had to return to SA. We wish you and your family a Good Year filled with Health and Happiness. Let us all forgive Bradley but we do wish he would change the name of his column. I find it so offensive. May ALL the Jews in Eretz Yisrael be blessed this year and may the captive soldiers be returned to their loved ones safe and sound. With best wishes Choni and Miriam Davidowitz.

In my belief, you may only receive forgiveness if you give it readily to others. In you I see a person who strives for justice, but still, we have had our divergences. Of course, you have forgiveness, though in the end, it is not mine to give. And, I ask you the same.

Thanks lakshmi, Looks like mine did not get through.I only repeated the gist of her post.Oh well, win one lose two. Regards

will do a mea culpa of her own and make a new year resolution not to insult talkbackers.A few days ago on a thread I addressed one Peter from Canada.It was a harmless post and I ended with some lovely lines of poetry.Beautiful lines! I said to him if he was puzzled & did not understand the reference to ask Peter SM to whom I had once quoted the same lines.The next day,on another thread,a different one altogether & out of the blue Margie Tel Aviv gratuitously burst out &replied to me saying :oh yes, quoting poetry,this is like throwing pearls to swine,and YOU are swine!

for voting for James Carter, who almost solely gave Iran to the Mullahs. I do not expect immediate forgiveness but hope to have it at some future date.

L'Shana Tova

did you have fun this year??

your posts will have credibility only when you decry racism directed against jews as much as that directed against Palestinians "May the Good Lord Forgive you for your hatred and racism." May your Good Lord help you to be a balanced man -amen! p.s. cut the moral hystrionics -not totally convincing.

Abeer, I'm sure most here empathize with your pain, but really, things happen. Even if you don't agree that Atabs have caused plenty of injustices to Jews and the Jewish people, plenty of people in the world have survived these kinds of hardships (and worse) and gone on to make something of their lives. People who sit around festering in a refugee camp crying about the injustices of 60 years ago bear a certain responsability for their own misery. This conflict would have been over a long time ago if the Arabs/Palistinian people focused on moving forward towards peace and prosperity rather than on killing and revenge. Shame on you and your people for choosing to admire and commit mass murder to somehow avenge your own failures and disappointment. I apologize in advance if your people spend the next 60 years following the same flawed strategy only to obtain similar results.

QUE TE PASA ROBERTO? HOW CAN YOU HATE SO MUCH? HATING IS AN ILLNESS, YOU KNOW...

LECHAIM ! SHANÁ TOVÁ !!!

Bradely, who is gonna apologize to these people: My grandma and grandpa who passed away while still dreaming of going back to their home in Haifa where they were born and raised. My grandma who died suffering from Alzheimer but the only thing she could remember was how she was evicted by gangsters at gun point from her home along with her 3 months infant who got sick in in their way to Lebanon and got paralyzed. Who will apologize for my dad who ran under bullets (in 1948) all the way from Acre to the Lebanese borders and was never allowed back to see his mom and dad. He was 18 and he was their only son. They passed away 20 years later and he never did. and to other hundreds of thousands of palestineans who suffered and still suffering. Shame on Israel and shame on you Israelis.

Although I've no complaints myself, if I did i'd forgive you. Consider yourself well and trully mocheled.

Why do you insist that Palestinians are murderous thieving terrorists? This is the hieght of blantant racism, reminiscint of the Nazis. Give me a break...My children? they are murderous thieving terrorists? You claim we aren't really from Ramallah, a village founded in the mid 1500's. You claim all those villages destroyed by the Jews in 1948 were not really there? Lady, you are a piece of work...May the Good Lord Forgive you for your hatred and racism.

"There isn`t enough forgiveness in the World for you!" Yakov How hateful can one be? Your hate will eventually consume you. I pity you.

And if you do so, I ask myself for forgiveness to you (even if we didn't communicate through Ha'aretz talkback), and not to any other person, as I have a different relation to every person according to what they think and how they behave. So to you I would say that I regret that when I expressed my opinions, I've not taken enough into account the sufferings of the Palestinians and that even if I don't deny the Pals'right to self-determination, I've no supported enough this right. And I must admit more often that the Pals had "bad luck" to be the non-jewish people living in Palestine in the time of the Nakba -well, their only luck is that it gives them an opportunity to show they can be pragmatic, courageous and generous-.

To read you're asking for forgiveness to every jewish people is strange, as you don't explain precisely WHAT you are asking forgiveness FOR... The fact that you have different opinions than mine doesn't mean that you have to ask for forgiveness. But if you consider that Israel is just a colonialist power, even in its 1948-49 borders ; if you consider that the Jewish People is not a people because itis untypical, and has no right ot self-determination ; if you think sionism equals racism ; if you think that the Pals have no responsability in their own situation ; if you think that targeting (with human-bombs or with rockets) civilians is not "terrorism" but "resistance" ; if you think that the Pals refugees have a right to settle in Israel and to cancel the Jewish peopl's right to self-determination,etc..., then yes you can ask for forgiveness for such things.

we (me and obviously many other readers) would like you stop stop Israel-bashing. And please go on with your Israel-bashing only when 1)Egypt,Syria,Lebanon,Jordan and Saudi Arabia will be democratic (I don't even talk about Irak...) 2) these countries'regimes AND THE LARGE MAJORITY OF THEIR PEOPLE will be respecting the Jews (which means an ability to read the Koran "from a distance"), and respect Israel's right to exist IN SECURITY as a State for the Jewish people 3) the Pals will have given up their will that the Pals refugees can return IN Israel 4) these middle-East quoted in 1)will be bashing themselves in one of their important national newspapers.

I think the personal and professional vidui is an excellent way to begin the new year -- From experience, I can personally recommend sending e-vidui. Thanks to Mr. Burston for his sincere apology, and reminding me I need to get cracking and write mine for 07!

I do not forgive any of the self hating jews who, consciously or not, strive for the disappearance of Israel,by negotiating with our sworn enemies.I do not forgive liberal Jews who believe that Arabs have same or even more rights to Palestine than we do,who talk about "dialogue" with jihadists like Abbas, Arafat and companions.Shame on you! You are a disgrace!

I wrote an earlier response, but the Haaretz censors are working overtime. I agree with your analysis, as it contains many valid points. I also think some people on here use any platform of convenience to attack Israel and the Jews, and this has proven to be one of them for some posters here. I support recognition of the Armenian Genocide because, as a Jew, I believe that "Never Again" applies to everyone, and I find the act of genocide to be morally repulsive. Thank you for your reply and L'Shanah Tovah to you!

I apologize for never having read your articles until today. Shana tova!

thank you for your article. I apologise for bothering you with my e-mails asking for your consideration of my think-pieces. The Sunday Times has bought one article and is considering another. For the sake of international exchange of reasoned 'this is what I experienced' articles, perhaps I might try again in the New Year? DC

I do NOT apologize for loving (most of) the articles Bradley Burston is writing. :)

I admire both of you for caring for your disabled daughter. I have no idea what kind of facilities there may be in Israel to care for her. Years ago, in the ghettos of Eastern Europe, anybody "not normal" was kept in the "poor house," all together, and regardless of disability. They just rotted away inside, and the little food that they had to eat came from the "tzdekah" at the little synagogue. To me, it is a "mitzvah" that your daughter has caring, loving parents, who want to be with her. L'Shana Tovah to both of you, to your daughter, and to all of the rest of your family.

The problem with these traditions is that people go through the motions but are rarely being honest. If you do something wrong, you have up to a year to ask forgiveness. That's stupid and disingenuous. Don't you think?

Whatever for? To apologise in thinking that Arabs, some who misappropriately call themselves 'Palestinians' and for good reason too because they are actually murderous, thieving terrorists who are claiming Disputed and not Occupied Palestinian Land for themselves when their Homeland is actually in one of the neighbouring Arab countries....? or the Lebanese under Hezbollah and their Leader Nasrallah who one might even say are also Terrorists with their avid hatred for Israel and their aim to destroy it. To whom would you like to apologise for such people who openly state they wish to destroy a Sovereign State called Israel simply because it is Jewish. These people aren't exactly angels you know.

You make a very valid point. The poster I responded to once used the Armenian Genocide as a way to attack Jews concerning the Shoah. He talked about how Jewish groups have tried to block recognition of the Armenian Genocide. However, when I took him to task for it in the past, asking him what he is doing to have these Turkish crimes against humanity recognized as such, he meekly said that he does not want Turkey in the EU. In other words, this was just an issue of convenience for him in his diatribe against us. Personally, as a Jew, I wish to have the Armenian Genocide recognized as such because I loathe all acts of genocide, and because for me "Never Again" applies to everyone, not just to Jews. But I agree with you, that it is interesting how some people happily use other peoples misery as a platform to attack others and to lessen their sense of guilt for their own past misdeeds. All the best.

The following will be grounds for deletion: 1. Racist remarks, as well as slurs on the basis of religion, ethnicity and gender. 2. Use of the terms Nazi, Hitler, to describe the actions and policies of Israelis, Palestinians or other parties to the Israel-Arab conflict. 3. Disparaging remarks, personal attacks, vulgarities and profanities directed at other participants in the forum. 4. Advocacy of violence against individuals or religious, ethnic or racial groups, including statements which may be construed as urging attacks on leaders, officials, security forces or civilians.

Come on Bradley,this is a trite play on the YOMIM NORAIM theme --but we recognize crocodile tears and can see clearly the man doth protest too much...Brad--your whole JOB --your raison d'etre is TO STIR CONTROVERSY---that is what HAARETZ pays you to do.... we see the con from the getgo,and so we even doubt if you really in private believe half the words you write...that you stir up so much anger in retorts,is not a peeling reveal of any "TRUTHS",but rather a predictable concession to "ENTERTAINMENT" and superficial leftist analysis of issues...everything is farcical black and white,tugs at emotions and baits by design for a reaction.We see through this deliberate trap --essentially a ratings ploy to get more readers by Haaretz (controversy is good business).Apology not sincere--rejected.

May all your dreams come true the next year.

Dear Mr. CHGODMK I may be wrong, and if I do, please correct me. I leanr from your quote that you want the Armenian 'genocide' to be recognised as such. From what I see most people around here who are so desperately seeking recogition of the killing of the Armenians have the intention of diverting the attention away from the shoa. Something like: "Yes we killed the Jews, but look at the Turcs how bad they are." As if other people's mistakes could make up for ours. I don't like to abuse other people for making our mistakes looking less ugly. By doing that we only make things worse. If I'm wrong, please tell me.

My guess is that the reason we are not hearing from Ballistic on talkback is that she is on a "roll" in (las) Vegas at the crap table. When her hand gets tired, perhaps she will return to the keyboard on her computer. Ballistic would always say to drink coffee. Well, tonight, we will drink wine following the Rosh Hashana kiddush, and I wish to you and to your family a Happy and Healthy New Year.

Firstly Ari; A shana tova to you and all your family. Speaking of aplogies, I must apologise to you for being a wanabee. There is nothing more I would like than to be living in Eretz Yisrael. Unfortunately it is not possible for me to be there, but the time will arrive soon when all Jews will be united in Israel. Until then I think it would be "nice" of you to apologise to all the wanabee Jews who you love to critisise and slander. You would do well to rather criticise those Jewish leaders who would like to see parts of Eretz Yisrael Judenrein and replaced by Arabs who seek the destruction of all Jews in Israel. May we all be blessed for a healthy and prosperous 5768, and may we see the complete and true redemption of the nation of Israel soon.

Best wishes for a healthy and happy new year to all...Margie,Shimon,RonnieW,ChanaS,Lynn,Gabe,Cipora,Danite, Johnny,PeterSM,PAUL,DavidT,JeffN, my good buddy FOX of course,ScotGuy,Jane,Brant,Jake,BEN JABO,Jacob Blues,Maurice and to many others whom I haven't mentioned. It has been a pleasure reading your posts, agreeing and disagreeing but all the while expressing interest and hope for the future. At the end of the day we are all one and have to stand side by side to be counted. Kol tuv v'shalom l'klal yisrael

Maybe it is time for the Israeli public to ask for forgiveness from the millions of displaced Palestinians.

love

Censorship doesn't work because if you happen to ruffle their feathers by criticizing a person or a point of view that they hold dear to their hearts, anything said about that person or view will be construed as unfair, vulgar, or petty in their minds. I finally managed to get in a jab at Barak, which Haaretz supports and considers another Moses. This, after numerous attempts (without vulgarity, but I admit, with some satire) to criticize him as being way over-rated. Still, I can understand their censorship, after all, they are only human, but believe me, censorship is best described as a clumsy tool. Don't give it wings and a halo.

shana toba.Love

Dare we call it operational success to have created a Stephen Murray? Dare we call it an operational success that you appeal to the likes of Stephen Murray? His post should be printed out for all of your staff to see when you pat yourself on the back for another sensationalist story.

You forgot to add your name to that list. L'Shanah Tovah! May you and your loved ones have a blessed new year.

I enjoy reading your blogs, (of course) i don't always agree but you always provoke thought. thanks

totally forgiven. But up THERE, who can tell. When you enter those 'Pearly Gates' and an Angel takes you by the hand and leads you to .....? to face your Judgment, keep a copy of this Article 'To the readers whom I have wronged' and it might just help get you off.

THAT THESE TALKBACKS COULD BE SERIOUS IF SOME OF THE LUNATICS YOU ALLOW ON WERE EXCLUDED ! A FEW NAMES DORIS CADIGAN,NATALLIE DURSON , BALLISTIC, MARYLIN ,JOHNBOY,CLICKFOOL ,NICK FERIMAN ,LABRHAS AND SO ON AND SO ON !

No need for you to apologise on behalf of Bradley Burston who has done so himself with Style, Honour and Sincerity. You may be assured that your Apologies may be needed some time in the future... at a certain time... and at a certain place.... but for the moment Bradley needs no-one to do it for him as he knows exactly what he says.

"They go through the motions of questioning but not actual questioning." And some people who complain about this are guilty of doing the same.

Stop your nonsense. All you have done on this site is insult and defame the Jewish people. By the way, you have NOT answered my questions yet. Do you recall your "passion" for the Armenian Genocide, so powerful that it led you a few months back to insult Jews regarding the Holocaust? Well, what have you been doing about this concern, other than attacking the Jews? Do you post on any Turkish news sites and attack them for their previous crimes against humanity, or do you just use this as a convenient platform to attack the Jewish people? Over the months, we have had many Turks on this site. Why have you never even bothered to confront them on the Armenian Genocide? I've been campaigning to have the US Congress to pass legislation recognizing the ARmenian Genocide, but all you do is attack the Jews. Don't apologize to the Arabs, who must obviously love you. Apologize to the Jews for your acts of defamation against them.

Saline and Johnny Weintraub wish to Bradley Burston and his family, the Schocken family, and the other journalists, staff, and, yes, to even the censors who do not publish my posts when I get a little too emotional, a Happy New Year 5768, and well over the fast.

L'Shanah Tovah. May the coming year bring you every blessing and joy.

The real apology should be to the reading public for having to put up with the vulgarity, slander, and personal attacks that go on in these talkbacks. Anyone can agree or disagree with what is written in this column but the posts that are allowed by the seemingly nonexistent censors have no limits. If you post censorship rules, enforce them.

It would indeed be sad, and more boring, if Bradley stops writing all those things for which he is apologizing!

should we not ask forgiveness to both the Jewish and the Arab people. Their problems were caused in Europe in the first place. If we would have respected our Jews as we should, there would not be a problem in the ME right now. So I ask forgiveness to all the people in the Middle East.

I bet you will be celebrating by taking a day of and contemplating What your appeasing agenda is doing to Israel (LOL)(LOL). I'd wish you a Shana Tova but I know full well that you are just a plain Leftist who does not believe in Jewish symbols.

... and I apologize for all the wrong that has been done to the Jewish people.

Bradley, It would be more appropriate if you apologised to the majority of your readers for the continuing lack of enforcement of your talk back principles. A number of regular posters use this forum for personal attacks on others, or for posting racist comments. I have stopped participating in these forums precisely because Haaretz lets these small minded individuals post their vitriol and hate.

You're totally right!!!! Israelis and Palestinians should forgive one another. If they believe this is impossible, starting by INVOKING HaShem's/Allah's BLESSING (bracha/baraka: oh these sister languages, these brother peoples!) on "the enemy" - and doing this over and over again!!! - finally DOES THE THING. The poison leaves one's heart, and a new aera begins, with all of a sudden UNDERSTANDING of "the other side" - and the capability to REALLY FORGIVE. Try! IT'S JUST AMAZING!!! Shana tova! And tomorrow beginning blessed Ramadan!

To all of Israels supporters Abi Gezunt to the rest of you who cares.

Bradley does NOT need to switch sides, he LIVES in ISRAEL. You wannabee armchair sitters are the ones who need to face facts and SWITCH

Many people here cannot look at themselves. They would be aghast at what they see if they looked too hard.They are stuck in what they are and what they are told they are. They go through the motions of questioning but not actual questioning.I am talking on both sides of this great divide of Left and Right. Most are just into impropaganda. So you've thrown yourself out there and made yourself vulnerable but in reality journalists are always vulnerable. What is that great saying about doing ones business in the wind?

to apologise after putting yourself in harms way more than enough times, than most of the cowards on here that hide behind their poster names...they ofcourse will never apologise. For that would mean their bigoted opinions would be called into question (heaven help us). Whilst people like Bradely attempt to atone, all i can see for is more vitriolic abuse from cowardly haters (on both sides) who quite frankly amaze me with their never ending one sided drivel. Dont worry Bradley most of them dont even live in Israel!

To say you are sorry, to show regret, is to understand you have done something wrong and thus stop doing it. If you are truly sorry you will stop, and just as you are a big enough man to say you're sorry, so are we to say we accept your apology. However, if you continue, than you are not really sorry, and we will not accept your "apology"

would be a nice and positive thing only if it lead to some concrete results - that is Bradley giving up his "writing" for good. As it is, however, it looks more like cleaning up the table so that more load of dirt can be put onto it in the future.

The only thing that makes an apology worthwhile is if repentance is done and the act not repeated. If you continue your anti-Israel rants into the New Year, you do not deserve to be forgiven. If you really are sorry, you won't repeat them and then I think we all can forgive. Let's hope this wasn't an empty, politically correct, page of empty words.Shana Tova

Fundamentalist Islamists have caused more grief to the entire world than anyone else in this century so far. They brainwash their own children into becoming suicide bombers, and their smaller children dance in the streets with glee when Islamists succeed in killing hundreds, if not thousands who choose to worship in a different manner than they do. My own religion says I must forgive them, and so I do. But I do not and cannot trust them to ever repent of their own evil ways or to shun the bloodthirsty god they claim to worship.

Bradley places Slowman in a job for which he is not suitable. Slowman is just too incredibly slow. He cannot keep up, angering the posters who get angry at him too. Bradley thinks he is doing a mitzva with a slow man, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Don`t make somebody work in a job he cannot perform. And look at how much time Haaretz gives Slowman for his vacation. Slowman spends his vacations too very very very slowly. What other censors can do in a week on their vacation, it takes Slowman at least a month to accomplish. If a relatively new censor is entitled to a two-week vacation, Slowman should be getting a two-months break. this is only basic fairness, for God`s sake.

Should I apologize for making remarks about Barak since Haaretz never prints them? Well, okay, I'll go ahead and apologize for calling Barak another Peretz. I take back my remark that he is a paper tiger and squeaks everytime he tries to roar. I am sorry I said that.

You are an enemy of the Jewish People. May you share the fate of the rest of our enemies.

Israel has 5.4 million Jews and is surrounded by almost 400million Arabs in territory 640 times the size of the Jewish state. Surely if the Arabs were so badly treated and oppressed, they should be able to handle this small "insect"

Yasher Koach Moshe! May I add that your comments apply to all of Haaretz.(except a few). P.S. Bradley; True T'shuva means that you will never resort to the same sin again, so until you switch sides and become a religious zionist, your apologies have no credibility. Shana Tova to all Bnei Yisrael

I don't think I've been wronged by Burston. It took a moment to swallow his "Confessions of an anti-German racist", but then I realized that I grant him this. Recently I thought about applying for a EU-funded position in Israel, and one of the possible employers seemed to be even content about my CV. But then I realized that I wouldn't want to pursue my professional career in Israel while the country's girls and boys are sweating in some army camp, would possibly defend the offspring of a nazi-soldier together with the infrastructure of their country while dying themselves on the borders. This I didn't want. So, finally we Germans should accept to be subhuman beings, at least in comparison to Jews. We belong to the fauna of the muds in middle Europe and, if at all, animal protection guidelines should be applied to us. It is beyond my competence to absolve Bradley Burston.

Internet says (you can verify) the muslim period of atonement used to be on Yom Kippur, and is taken from the Jewish religion's day of atonement as observed by Mohammmed. It was later changed to Ramadan. May God inscribe you in the book of life this year after atonement for all your sins.

if we keep that day as moses wrote for us all.leviticus 23:26-32.if we do not keep that day as moses wrote our sins will not be forgiven for the year past------no matter what our own personal opinions and religious beliefs are.i hope that all of us here do as moses said----those that do are sincere in asking for forgiveness---and in forgiving others.happy new years to all

.... but as long as there are israeli sopporters/ israelis like you... its not going to be forthcoming. try and figure out why?

the moment after the click i realised id punched the wrong name apologies bradley/rosner

The tomb of Tutankhamen has the beautiful goddess Ma'at, goddess of justice, on the four corners of the casing. Ma'at guards the king as he goes to heaven and his confessions will guarantee his journey to the other world above and not below. The confessions of Ma'at, see the book of the dead, might be the basis of the 10 commandments. Therefore, I confess to all wrongdoing, so now let me pass to the other world above. "Confession is good for the soul." We forget in Judaism that a lot of our religion comes from many ancient sources, including Zoroastra, I believe. Shana Tova and may God inscribe you in the book of life this year.

Quite noble these apologies, dying to see one from Jihadists Muslims who murder with glee. We owe nothing to our enemies, it is they who owe us more than apology. Get off Israels land NOW. Then, perhaps we can talk.

I apologize to Burston & others for having too often responded in anger and for failing to find a way to speak to that which is human and positive in supporters of Israel who cling to the occupation. I do not expect similar apologies from supporters of Israel who continue to smear President Carter, General Zinni, Timothy Garton Ash, Tony Judt and others as examples of ?the New anti-Semitism?, and who keep mainstream American media largely free from an honest discussion of Israel?s occupation and America?s role in it. I do expect that change in the occupation regime will eventually come from international pressure and boycotts, not from expressions of kindness and goodwill.

Before I started reading the Haaretz pages I was under the assumption that the Palestinians and Lebanese were unreasonable, murderous terrorists. Thanks to reading Haaretz I see that in fact the biggest obstacle to peace in the Middle East is Israel thanks to its illegal occupation of Palestine; through its Apartheid regime in the illegally occupied territories and through its daily use of collective punishment. I apologise for misjudging the horrible conditions the colonial power is inflicting on you.

"For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you." GOD bless you B.B. and all those who read,...heed!

Asking for a seasonal forgivness is worthless unless the person really means it and his/her behavior changes to reflect that new forgiven person. I've seen too many drivers with grim faces as they pass by a deadly road accident, then I see them driving like crazy 1o meters after the accident site! I ask every talkbacker, especially the religious ones, to read the 10 commandments again and then tells us which commandment s/he will live by during the next year!

Forgiveness is to too light a subject at this time of year. True forgiveness requires an about turn, a complete change in direction. Much of what I get at this time of year is true to tradition but not to the heart. You can usually tell, a couple of weeks after Yom Kippur and we are all at it again. What will be so different about your column in a few weeks? You're only responsible for your own actions, not the worlds.

Now that absolution was granted to you, even in the language of the pope, by a person with a sad record of more than 50.000 hate mails against the Jewish State and its citizens, it makes your column more suspicious than ever. Fortunately this atonement business will go on for one week only, and thereafter you will be entitled to sin again, because in one year from now there will be another day of atonement. What a wise entity that created this machinery! Nevertheless, have a peaceful New Year.

...the point rosner is making... It is BRADLEY, Ravi.

you dont celebrate... you dont mourn... you only keep trying to sear defeat on the pali mind. youre missing the point rosner is making.

Indeed,you should have stopped bothering about Israel long ago! Extremists, from every side, are not useful. Start worrying about the Socorro Fat Tire Cycling...and leave us alone.

you have a right to say what you like bradley, i have mostly agreed with you, but, i am not offended in any way , i listen, i might not like, but it's not an excuse to wish death on any who speak their minds. all those you have rejected your forgiveness are not worthy of life itself, sleep well, fear not, for those who fear will die early.

...I ask forgiveness... In Islamic tradition in Indonesia, we forgive each other after the fasting month of Ramadhan, usually (next Ramadhan will begin soon at September 13 of 2007). I just know now from Bradley that Jewish people has such tradition too in the beginning of their New Year. I ask for forgiveness to every Jewish people, to you too Bradley.

...I ask forgiveness... In Islamic tradition in Indonesia, we forgive each other after the fasting month of Ramadhan, usually (next Ramadhan will begin soon at September 13 of 2007). I just know now from Bradley that Jewish people has such tradition too in the beginning of their New Year. I ask for forgiveness to every Jewish people, to you too Bradley.

You forgot to apologize to HaShem for scorning His covenant and teaching others to do the same, for ridiculing people who believe in Him, for despising the land that he swore to our forefathers, for undermining our strength and emboldening our enemies, and for contributing to the disastrous situation in which Israel now finds itself.

If not for the faint hope of a reply getting past the censors, I am sure I would have stopped bothering long ago.

I think all Ha'aretz online readers understand your role is to be provocative and generate interest,comment, and response. A Happy New Year to you, and a better year for us all, and the people of Sderot.

Nor do we mourn them either. When will you get that through your head? It's a shame that this basic lesson was forgotten by the left a long time ago.

Bradly, does this mean you won't be doing any of the things you apologised for any more? If so, yours is a sincere apology and I admire you for it.

If everybody only tried to do this and especially if they actually forgave others the world would be a much better place. On my part, I ask people to forgive all the stupid things I wrote, and to all the offences I innadvertedly may have made. I admit I find it very hard to forgive offences made to my people in these forums but think the real roadmap for peace is Jews and Palestinians to start to forgive each other. May the Almighty show us this path and lead us out of this madness in the new year.

Admitting fallability and asking forgiveness is a noble humanistic gesture, Bradley. But for those who have taken offense to your writings because of religious differences... I don't think you need their forgiveness. Many of those who take offense--Jewish militants, murderers in Islam's name, and their respective silent supporters--they need to ask the world's forgiveness for their Dark Age backwardness and hate.

Sleep easy, Bradley. Te absolvo. Go forth and sin no more.

I do not see any need for an apology. People have different opinions.

The fallacy behind the generic atonement you offer is that it requires no true introspection. Without doing the hard and painful work of a thorough self-analysis, which would presumably take up too much of your precious time, you want (as do too many Jews at this time of year) a shortcut. While it seems uncharitable for anyone to reject your seeminly well meant apology, it is really not an apology at all, and is only intended to project an intellectually and spiritually humble image. Well, as the poet said, "Vanity of Vanities...". You (and we) ain't getting off the hook that easy.

i'm sure i said something that got my talk backs"ignored"till just recently-but guess what bradley-my memory is so short i dont know what it was i must have said-please try to forgive me and thank you for letting me say this and be here.i feel the same way-if i have offended anyone here-please try to forgive me-if i do it again-dont sit and stew-tell me off right away.have a great new year everyone.

mainly for not using big letters when writing words that deserve it [eg. Israel, Jew, etc]. unfortunately i decided to make this sacrifice to improve my efficiency. hopefully You will understand. as for my views i apologize for not being able to understand the extremists on both sides.