Rice, Olmert agree on need for multinational force in Lebanon

Please don't believe that all Americans see you as the 'bad' ones. I for one, have watched you suffer long enough. I am well aware of the tactics used against you, and it is unequivically wrong. I do not condone suicide bombers. But Israel will not have peace until they make right this Palestinian situation. I am disgusted be the all around hate towards all Arabs. It is not productive for anyone. I don't want to see innocent Israeli's or Palestinians suffer anymore.and again, tio Israeli's who show compassion to your neighbors.YOU will be blessed. Ahmed, My heart goes out to you for all the losses you have suffered. MY heart aches for all who suffer but when I see a govt bring some of the trouble on themselves.....it has to change, anjd I don't want another on eof my US dollars going towards Palestinian occupation.

You've convinced me of one thing, viz. You've read more on the subject than I have. I've read only Stinnett's book in its entirety. Other writings on the subject I've just read in part. He does not strike me as a fool, and he certainly was no Republican trying to discredit FDR. I am still pretty much convinced that the movements of the Japanese fleet were being monitored and that Kimmell was set up. I wonder why the haaretz editors are allowing this discussion to continue- maybe just to deflect attention away from the topic at hand. Who knows.

Gaza boy, I can't understand how you can thank Condoleezza Rice for for her efforts now after she backed Olmert's cruel assault on the defenseless people of Lebanon. I feel it was so cruel and a crime against humanity. How could Rice choose violence over diplomacy? That seems very wrong to me.Plus violence is no way to solve our human problem, .people need to talk and not hit. and as Pope John Paul II said violence is the enemy of peace and justice. In addition, Rice's support of the Israeli offensive meant she was copmplicit with the invasion of an other sovereign and supports placing innocent lives in the cross fire while the Israeli Army attempts to root out Hezbollah 's infrastructure.That's seems unconscionable to me and quite unrealistic as a goal. Hezbollah is more than a structure but a ideology. Now over 400 people have lost their lives in Lebanon and over a half a million people have been displaced while their cities and vital structures lay in ruins. I can't look at pictures of Lebanon without feeling horrified at what the Israeli army has done to those poor innocent people in Lebanon. It was so cruel and unnecessary. In addition, Olmert didn't even tried and work out a peaceful solution with that democratic government either. Now isn't that just awful too? . Thus I am very upset with Condoleezza Rice for supporting the Israeli Army actions and I feel she should be condemned not thanked as you have done. Morally Outraged, Dutch

Most of the anti-Israel posts ignore a number of important facts: 1) Syria & Iran control Hezbollah and supplied them with the rockets that are terrorizing northern Israel! Iran and Syria are using Hezbollah as a proxy to attempt to destroy Israel and weaken the Western anti-terrorism efforts. Iran is doing everything in it's power to obtain the ingredients for dirty bombs to use against Israel. 2) Israel withdrew from south Lebanon 6 years ago and there was a "UN" resolution demanding that the Lebanese "army" would control southern Lebanon and that the "militias", i.e. Hezbollah, would be disarmed. 3) The Golan, Judea, Samaria and Gaza were liberated in 1967 following the defeat of the Arab armies attempt to destroy Israel. Jerusalem was reunited from it's corrupt anti-Jewish occupation by Jordan was ended. 4) Israel mistakenly offered a state including Gaza, the West Bank, and East Jerusalem to the arabs 8 years ago.

"There are a number of other authors, I believe, who say about the same thing." - Hollingsworth Such as John Toland, "Infamy, Pearl Harbor and it's Aftermath", Double Day, Garden City, NY, 1983. As stated, I would have loved to show FDR sold out the Pacific Fleet. But, alas, there is a great deal of contrary information. See: the 39 volume, report of the 79th congress "Congress's Hearings Before the Joint Committee on the Investigation of the Pearl Harbor Attack" which was the result of a Republican led Congressional investigation into the subject in the late 1940s. From my library, in addition to Toland's book, I can recommend you read: David Khan, "The Code Breakers", Ronald Lewin, "The American Magic," Gordon Prang, "At Dawn We Slept," Edward Van Der Rhoer "Deadly Magic," W. J. Holmes "Double-Edged Secrets," Ronald Clark, "The Man Who Broke Purple," John Toland, "The Rising Sun,' Gordon Prang, "Miracle at Midway," John Prados, "Combined Fleet Decoded."

I know you like to think that you're right about most any topic under discussion, and that you expect others to quail at your pronouncements. I only cited one source. There are a number of other authors, I believe, who say about the same thing. That the "fool" may not have known the difference between a code and a cipher, according to you, does not exactly reinforce your overall contention.

Many people on this forum are very uneducated, even my poor Canadian brothers. Everyone here who is calling on the right s of all the arabs, what about the right of all the Jews and others that where forced to live in exile. 1) I demand the right of return for every jew, christian, budhist, and asyrian who where displaced from there homes, had there business taken away, had there bank accounts seized, and lots all of there assets in IRAN, IRAQ, SAUDI ARABIA, MOROCCO, TUNESIA, YEMAN, JORDAN, LEBANON, INDIA, AFGANISTAN, LYBIA, EGYPT,SYRIA, and TURKEY 2) I demand repayment of every lots asset 3) I demand Israel be recognized by the whole ARAB WORLD 4) I demand that Mecca and Medina be returned to the great jewish cities that they once where. If these demands are not met I suggest a formation of resistence groups to fight the oppression, to conduct daily raids on civilians, kill any and all in the name of peace, use civilians as shields, launch rockets from schools and hospitals.

I read the book. The fool didn't even know the difference between a code and a cipher. The purpose of the code which the Japanese had not changed for years was to shorten messages. The Cipher in which the code was encrypted was changed on 1 Dec, 1941 (jn 25b) and the US was reading NOTHING a week later. We were reading the top diplomatic cipher, Purple, but it contained NO operational data. I would have loved to hang a frame on FDR for setting up Pearl Harbor, but after decades I have only managed to prove to my satisfaction that there was no 'conspiracy so vast" to let the fleet get sunk.

"Did I forget something?" - M o L The sham peace meeting with Olmert which was followed by the clear signal about foreign meddling via the Precision Guided Assassination of some UNIFIL observers. The message is "we don't need no stinking International Force, and any International Force will pay the same price. The Bush Junta and Olmert government spoke loud and clear in Lebanon today about their agreement.

I have lived in the region, and studied the conflict for many years, from both sides. Trouble is, you are repeating the well-rehearsed Palestinian narrative, while denying that the Jews have one. Jews have rights to this land too. They did not simply steal land. They fought wars and attacks to defend themselves. I would agree with you on one point you made. "We both have to negotiate, not try to eliminate each other". Thats a good starting point.Maybe we should all admit that there are two rights and two wrongs in this sad history, and begin anew with some faith and good will.

just 1 point... '#2 Usa helped they fighters in Afghanistan just like It helped Israel in 1967, 1973, and just like it helped South Korea because It affected the Usa due to the Soviet Union`s support of the other side.' you think the U.S. WANTED to provoke war with the USSR?

I find depressing that israel soldiers risk , loose their lives in order to conquer land they will hand over to french that will turn a blind eye to Hezzbola operatives. There is no way israel can win the war with hezzbolah since the latter is suported by the UN .., europe and even us. Just imagine if us troops and soviet troops back in 1945 were not allowded to ocupy berlin,destroy infraestructure.., kill german civilians or ocupying german soil . What could they do against the NAZI regime? Nothing. Thats exactly the way the international community places israel. Israel cant ocupy lebanon , cant drive all the way to beirut..,cant destroy infrastruture of harm civilians. What can israel do ? litle. International community is protecting hezzbolah. In such circunstancies the best israel would have to do was to send a couple of missiles to hezbollah felows and that would be it., What israel wons in the batle field it does loose in the diplomatic corridor .

five hours later he has 4 UN observers killed. Now that will make it harder to get anybody onboard that idea and pisses off 1 billions Indians.

Why not give south lebanon back to hezbolah again ? Whoever thinks that spanish troops will face hezzbolah and prevent it from atacking israel is a fool. Since israel cant keep the land either..., the only way foward is to give back the land to Hezzbolah.

Were where Ms Rice couple weeks ago, couple month ago and couple years ago? She is talking about a Palestinian state now. The Palestinians have been getting killed every day with the IDF fire, were where Ms Rice? Now she has the Lebanese problem she starts calling for a Palestinian state or she is using the Palestinian as a pain killer for the Arab population. Arabs might be stupid, but they do know this trick. Its already been used so many times even the 5 years old in the streets of Gaza knows it.

How far should israel go? That's easy, pull out of Gaza, pull out of the West bank, share Jerusalem or make it a city run by the UN and enjoyed by all religons, return Palestinian prisoners, give up their nuclear arsenal, recognize and respect Hamas as the chosen leader of Palestine, pay the Palestinian refugees and their families compensation for land they seized from them years ago, and understand that 1 palestinian life is equal to 1 Israeli life. If Israel wants peace, this is the formula.

the arab will love israel if : 1- israel stop using its unbalanced power against them 2- Stop make the arab pay for some one else holocaust 3- show love to their neighbore so they can recieve some 4- allow immigrant arabs of 48 to come back home 5- stop treating the arab like they are no one 6- quit insulting Muslims and christian as you think your religion is anybetter

I think our history records are different. But let say you are right...you think that the solution was to kill Palestinians and take their homes and land. Look, I do not have a problem living with Jews side by side or even under one country (You can call it anything you want Israel or Palestine). My problem is Israel wants to dominate the area and take everything.

Right. But the point to be made is that Pearl Harbor was not a surprise. The Japanese fleet was tracked from the moment it left Japan to the moment it arrived at its attack destination. All the major Japanese codes had been broken. FDR, in cahoots with Churchill, needed the attack to justify a declaration of war.

by attacking Israeli territory, kidnapping and killing soldiers, and rocketing Israeli towns, all before Israel began any response. A token mention of this incident could have been made given the current extenuating cicumstances, i.e. that missiles are falling and Israeli blood is being spilled today in Galilee. Don't you think?

You are not asking the right question. All peace initiatives in the ME are still-born regardless of what Israelis or American or whoever else thinks. The muslim world has been submerged in intellectual stupor with all the consequences (economic and technological backwardness etc.) for the last 1000 years. It was not a problem for the rest of us in the real world until the advent of TV and air travel. All of a sudden the muslims realized that they are the most abject peoples on earth and not the beloved of ALLAH. You see, they think of Allah's favor in very material terms, their early conquests where a proof that Mohammed was a true prophet. Now they are on a mission to reestablish Islam to its former (bloody) glory (watch Iran) and Israel is merely a (small) obstacle on their (not quite yet) victorious path. I am sad to see that in my life-time these morons will set the entire world ablaze (1400 burnt cars in France last fall was just a tiny sneek preview).

Ah, if it were only that. No, Willis, they want EVERYTHING. That is what they have always wanted which is the reason they have NOTHING. If they do not have a group frontal lobotomy, the situation will not change. Their three NOs still hold.

1920 "Nebi Musa" riots resulted in massacre and expulsion of "Old Yishuv" (pre-Zionist) Jews from Old City of Jerusalem. 1921 "Jaffa riots" resulted in massacre and expulsion of Old Yishuv Jews from Jaffa. 1929 Arab riots resulted in massacres and expulsions of Old Yishuv Jews from Hebron and Tsfat (Zafed). 1936-39 "Great Arab Uprising" resulted in expulsion of Jews from various towns, e.g. Lod and Ramle, Galilee. 1947-1949 War resulted in massacre and expulsion of Jews from various areas, eg. Jerusalem, Gush Etsion, kibbutzes in the Galilee and South, etc. Note, I haven't mentioned massacres of Jews before the start of the British Mandate, and in the wider Arab world.

All the symptoms are there for a revolution for a big change in this trouble area since the creation of Israel. The defining movement is here. Israel need to understand that force is not the solution. It is time for it take genuine steps to defuse the crises in this region or else its existence at stake. World had enough with Palestinian and Lebanese suffering.

The main reasons the US is viewed unfavorably in Arab countries are: (1) Past and present support of governments (Egypt, Jordan, Saudi, etc.) that violate the rights of their citizens. Most deals the US makes with these countries, including foreign aid, is often seen as benefiting the government elite at the expense of the citizenry. (2) Perceived US bias toward Israel in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Governments of Egypt, Saudi, etc. encourage extra-inflammatory press coverage of Israeli actions probably as one way of keeping their publics off of their backs. I would say that these two issues or grievances, in the minds of most Arabs, overshadow all that the US does in the region that might be constructive. Note that Arab states lacking oil have various issues with the oil-rich states (e.g. share-the wealth, Islamic fundamentalism, etc.), so US support of the oil-rich states is often viewed cynically and not as genuine goodwill.

as long as the Arabs continue to allow terrorists to operate in their name and in their midsts, Israel must respond to protect itself. Israel defends itself as a response to threats against its existence. If the Palestinians stood up and stopped supporting Hamas, and built their own state instead of trying to destroy ours, then Israel could leave the WB and leave Gaza alone, knowing its borders were safe. Palestians, Lebanese, and other Arabs refuse to stand up, so Israel must take its security into its own hands. The Palestinians have attacked our sovereign state time and time again, after we have withdrawn. We cannot sit quiet if they will attack the moment we let our guard down. The Palestinians give us no guarantees of security. They do not want Gaza and the WB. The Arabs want all of Israel. They were not content when two states were offered before, they will not be content now. They want to use the past to justify a war against us, not to build a future.

While my Rhodesli compatriot Quill Bill explained how the USA is a strong supporter of the Arabs I will try to explain to you how the west sees the Arabs. After the 9/11 in New York, The subway bombings in Madrid and London, the hotel bombing in Bali, the Synagogue, UK consulate and HSBC bombings in Istanbul the west sees the Arabs and Moslems as being terrorists. Born and raised in Turkey I know that most Moslems as well as most Christians, Jews, Hindus atheists etc are good peace loving people but because of Al Kaida, Hisbullah, Hamas, Hizbut Tahrir etc the god and peaceful name of Islam has been high jacked. Worse than that the peaceful majority of Moslem all around the world are not fighting this evil that is destroying the good reputation of Islam. Your best friends are the Western democracies and the Jewish state of Isarel while your real enemy is those terror groups that are destroying the good name of Islam.

Do you think it was a coincidence that the Pacific carrier fleet just happened to have been on maneuvers and was spared the carnage that the soon-to-be-eclipsed-in-naval-warfare-importance battleship fleet suffered? Some forward-thinking people in Washington DC, privy to Japan's attack plan - and, also knowing how carrier-based air power would come to dominate sea battles - made sure those carriers were out of harm's way. And, those carriers - Hornet and Enterprise - proved their worth over the battleship when they conveyed Doolittle's B-25 force in April 1942, in the raid on Japan. Although the damage was minimal - with a mind towards things to come for Japan - it proved that the aircraft carrier had become vital for the future projection of air power, something the Japanese had already proven at Pearl Harbor.

Thank God you are not all barbarians- “I, Tsilli Goldenberg, Israeli citizen 'Accuse you - Ehud Olmert, Prime Minister of Israel, Amir Peretz, Minister of Defense, Dan Halutz Head of Staff Chief Commander of the Israeli Army, of committing this bestial barbaric slaughter in Lebanon. I accuse you of committing Crimes against Humanity towards the Palestinian People. I accuse you of deserting our soldiers, when their lives could be saved by negotiations, and I accuse you of starting an unjustified war in my name.” - Tsilli Goldenberg, Masarik 11, Jerusalem 93106 Israel

It is unfortunate that there are 2 different nations that think they have rights to the same land. Obviously who was first is irrelevant because the Jewish people can claim it from thousands of years before the Palestinians, but its changed ownership many times since then. If the Palestinian argument is that they were the last to be thrown off of it, then surely all the Israelis have to do is leave in order to justify reclaiming it themselves. (by the I was the last to lose it therefore I own it logic). The Palestinians need to accept the new situation and make due with the land they have rather than continue to long for the past. What they are doing is the equivalent of the Native Americans trying to take back the land of the United States. Its not going to happen. Surely they realize there are not conditions under which Israel will give up its land.

"Condi, what have you done in the last year to promote the development of a Palestinian state? What has your master done? Your absolute inability to cope with reality in the region is showing." Mark Lincoln Let's see. During the last years of the Arafat administration, it was all about stripping the PA Presidency of power and redesigning the PA. During the first year of the Abbas presidency, it was assuring that there was "no partner." After the 'disengagement' she helped to design the sham that is the Rafah agreement, designed to provide the illusion that Gaza was free. Since the last elections, it been about subverting the Rice/Bush-designed PA government structure established to marginalize Arafat and to punish the Palestinian people for the election results. Did I forget something?

Wow! History rewritten by Sanders. You do have one good idea, however, about a people keeping prisoners. In a gesture sure to save the American taxpayers a fortune, I suggest the release of all murderers from American jails to your welcoming, gracious area. Unfortunately, you have not provided it.

I have come to realize that the palestinians, hamas, fatah, hezbos, Syria, etc...all countries that are islamo-facists, never want to talk or negotiate unless they are being pummeled. I had a muslim roomate once and he never knew the meaning of "common ground" or "middle of the road". I hope that Israel succeeds in this struggle, and I hope that this will be the final battle for hezbos. Good luck to you all!

Jews are indigenous to Israel

1. Do you support the Quartet's Road Map or not? If both sides followed the stages spelled out leading to Final Status Negotiations, do you approve of that specific process to get there or no? 2. For those who say no, what route instead do you favor for reaching peace?

Robert Stinett(sp?) in his book Day of Infamy would dispute your suggestion of the lack of full alertness on the part of Kimmel and Stark. These guys were set up.

By the way, here are the keys to my house and car. You want everything else, you might as well take the lot.

You talk about hiding behind civilians - kist look at these pictures: http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060627/ids_photos_wl/r2222548190.jpg http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060627/ids_photos_wl/r2956278921.jpg http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060627/photos_pl/2006_06_27t145013_450x319_us_mideast_usa_arab http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060627/ids_photos_wl/r1925034423.jpg

There can be no peace between Israel and Palestine. They (Palestine) only want Israel wiped off the face of the earth. Our prayers are with Israel for their victory (and not compromising) in this War. If the Israeli soldier would be released, then all this would stop. And then STOP taking Israeli soldiers as prisoners.

Thank you, Ronnie. When you see it layed out so simply, it boggles the mind how all of this continues to happen. Livni and Rice notwithstanding, I think this could have been solved years with women in charge instead of men. All this macho crap interfers with brain functioning. (Not you,Ronnie ;D)

How did Russian Jews become an Israeli majority? how much Jewish blood is in them? Fact is that there is nothing today which can be called pure Jew. It was just a free trip and a land lute. Lets be honest, who does not like get a free trip to a better life, simmply by killing and displacing native population. It is totally legitimate because the US supports it and GOD gave that land to Jews.

I agree with you...we will never have peace. Our war is going to be years to come.

You really believe that Arabs and Jews will have peace if Israel releases a bunch of criminals and gives back some land??? Come on!!! The fact that there is a huge Muslim movement in the world, aimed at destroying Israel and the West doens't figure into your calculations??? Wake up man!!! Even people who live in Lebanon understand the situation on the ground. Hezballah wants to kill Jews and whoever stands in their way.

"Rice is a Tape Recorder that keeps replaying" - Arab More like a cracked record, spinning away, repeating itself, and getting no where.

Please dude, though I am sorry about your granddad, he usurped land that Jews lived in centuries before Muslims or Arabs visited teh region. If you're going to use history as a guide, you lose. generations much further back than my grandfather and great-grandfather were kicked out of their homes and dispersed. Why can't you just let us live at home in peace brother? BTW Ahmed, please explain why Egypt and Jordan, your Arab brothers, did not give you at least the start of a state in teh WB and Gaza while they controlled it between 1948 and 1967. Your crocodile tears bore me.

The "lesson" of Pearl Harbor has nothing to do with Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The lesson of Pearl Harbor is that if you are in the position of Admiral Kimmel and General Stark and are given specific instructions that hostilities could commence at any time, and to be on full alert; you don't just ignore them and go about life as normal. The lesson was very simple: stay awake, stay on guard, pay attention, be ready; or loose the battle.

IDF blames civlin deaths because Hezbollah and Hamas hide among civilins. Not suprised at all to see IDF using terrorist tactics: From BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5212870.stm

Of course the USA acts in its own interest as you state, but why does that detract from the fact that the US is very, very supportive of Arab and Muslim causes. And by the way, you curiously leave out US's support of Israel as being something in the US's current interest. Take a look back at the first 25 years of Israel's existence. US support was lukewarm to say the least. Europe was Israel's supporter then, both militarily and economically. Israeli policies, like US, Lebanese, Palestinian and other peoples policies is subject to valid and reasonable criticism. But to criticize the US for its support of Israel without even acknowledging its long time support for Arab regimes and Muslim peoples, is driven by one thing only--bias instilled through years of teachings that everything American is bad. American money and blood has flowed to benefit Muslims and Arabs. Rather than constantly erupt in ant-American jingoism, some appreciation is in order. BTW, USA humanitarian aid??

Rice can talk all she wants about an "urgent and enduring peace," and a "sustainable peace." However, as long as the would-be broker of that peace is perceived, and correctly so, to be a country which clearly favors Israel and arms it to the teeth, while failing to offer similar assistance to the neighboring Arab states, then there is no way that any such peace can be achieved. Rice says there must be a way for "people to reconcile their differences." There is a way. That way entails the U.S. disengaging completely from Israel.

my advice to you all is to check the not too distant history to determine who the aggressor is. Israel occupied Palestine and kicked-out the Palestinian people (My family is one of them); Israel occupied Syria, Egypt, Jordan and Lebanon. Israel stayed in Lebanon over 20 years. Israel is the occupier and many UN resolutions were issued against Israel, and not one of them was implemented by Israel. When one Israeli soldier is kidnapped, the whole world goes crazy, but Israel kidnapped a whole nation. In 1948 Israelis killed my grandfather because he wanted to get his stuff from his home in Ashkelon. Israelis killed all of my wife's uncles during the first Intifada. Israelis made Palestinians life miserable since 1948. I have questions for you: What gives Israelis the right to take my land? What gives Israelis the right to take my grandparents home? What gives Israelis the right to kill Palestinians since 1948? What would you do if this was done to you and to your family? Would you still love and support Israelis.

Yehudim ("Jews") were being killed by Arabs here long before 1948. And the two hottest spots right now, South Lebanon and Gaza, are both places that Israel completely withdrew from. Land is simply being used as the phony excuse in a conflict which is entirely religious, ethnic and cultural in its nature. Frankly, I don't know how there can ever be peace as long as 70% of all Arab Muslims support the "honor" killings of women by their closest male relatives because of sexual rumors spread against those women. Peace begins at home. And how can there be peace as long as Arab Muslims are so into the violent jihad that the Koran instructs them to practice. And how can there be peace as long as the Koran, in numerous texts, is teaching Muslims to hate Yehudim.

the issue cannot be solved politically. It must be solved medically. Perhaps U.S. aid can be used to hire a battery of several hundred thousand psychiatrists and as many therapy couches so that those in the Arab world can rid themselves of the decades old and deep seated hatred of Jews which continue to plague their minds.

Israel's true peace with its neighbors will only happen when Israel no longer exists. This is not an option for Israel. Keep in mind, in a supposed future if Israel no longer existed, there would still be a maelstrom in the middle east as the hard line terrorists started using their weapons against each other to establish "sharia law" and influence or "justice" for those that don't agree with them. just look as what Hezbollah is saying they will do after the cease fire to those arab states that dare defy it! There is your peace partner's idea of a future.

I am not sure if people could negotiate during a war. There needs to be a period of about 2-3 weeks of cease-fire, not just with Lebanon but also with Gaza and the West Bank, to return saneness and calmness to the minds and hearts of decision makers in the region. After that period, and when all sides cool down, then would be a good time to work on a viable solution that is 2 sided and not dictated from know it all?s in Washington. In my opinion, The reason Camp David failed was because Syria and Lebanon were not involved in the negotiations. Any future plans should bring a full solution to the whole region. Arabs are extremely connected culture wise, especially in terms of Palestine, Lebanon, Syria, Egypt and Lebanon. So it?s not possible for one of these countries to be at war with Israel while the other country at peace, for the people will feel very offended. That?s why any real solution needs to be worked out with the Leaders of the 5 nations.

Well unfortunately, u are too far to know what is the reality there! it will be better if u return back and see! Yes arabic people need peace as u need it! Do u think we enjoy seeing our children getting killed? or not able to live or our houses stollen or distroyed by u?! or knowing that some stupid of us will kill ur children? Common,,, have a look on the history of the area before u arrived and u will know! Now you are there, we BOTH have to negotiate not to try to eliminated each other, it's not possible for both parties to do so... killing will lead to more killing! if I will loose everything, children, house, family... so what's the point of living? Sure i will join groups like Hamas and Hezbollah... Isn't it what u are trying to do by urging others to fight?!

You ask why can't Israel have deals with Palestine, Syria, and Lebanon as with Jordan and Egypt? Simple. Jordan and Egypt are willing. Palesinte, Syria, and Lebanon are not.

It will be cheaper and less costly in terms of human life if Israel, per many UN resolutions, withdrew to the pre-1967 borders. Cheaper to take down the settlements and relocate the settlers, rather than continue with this mindless and unjust war. The US, saying it wants a sustained peace, needs to insist on this resolution. If Israel needs more security, build the Wall along those lines and allow an international force in to enforce the peace. Israel has for some time been acting out the "abused child syndrome". It is time to grow up.

Usa helped Kewait and Suidi Arabia because it wanted their Oil and it got a lot of it free. And also 2 HUGE free military bases 1 in Arabia and 1 in Kewait. #2 Usa helped they fighters in Afghanistan just like It helped Israel in 1967, 1973, and just like it helped South Korea because It affected the Usa due to the Soviet Union's support of the other side. #3 Usa supports Egypt and Jordan because Egypt and Jordan are in the group ,"Usa puppies in middle east.' They do what ever Bush tells them WHAT EVER!!!!!! They even help the FbI especially Jordan by spying in the Usa even! u ask why??? because when they get caught they just run back and are innocent lol. there is #4 and #5 and #6 but you still wont understand what I mean, we just think different.

Many (not all - not most) Arabs seem to have a tendency to call someone who attacks innocent civilians that is not Arab from within Arab civilian communities"Justified resistance" Whether they attack the US, Israeli, British, Australian, Spanish etc... civilians And when the price of those attacks are exacted then most Arabs cry violation of Human Rights. Now answer me who is being duplicitous here? If indeed, you are of Arab decent and a person of decency and peace, then protest Arab / Jihadist inspired Terrorism. As long as you don't, they will hurt you more than they will hurt everyone else.

Let the Islamic world give all the aid to the Islamic states that need it - and let the west look after itself and the victims of Arab terror in East Africa. We in the west should be calling out to our leaders to stop ALL aid to Islamic states who hate the west!

You're right, it IS Israel's fault that the Arabs keep demanding more and more. The Jews who bought plots of land going back to the 17th century at inflated prices, needed labourers to help with clearing it. The land was inhospitable and in the 17th, 18th and 19th centuries Arabs didn't want to live in swampland. Jews gave them well paid jobs, and as always, they bite the hand that feeds them - just look at what they do to America now, and it's the country that gives them the most aid. If all aid were stopped, they'd have to stop fighting and start becoming self sufficient. We, in the rest of the world can't afford these welfare queens who DON'T want to work. I'd rather the money went to the Sudanese and Somali refugees.

to the assertion of free prisoners and free palestine made in #3. why? Israel moved out of gaza to be thanked/repaid/rewarded by increased cross border missle attacks and increased infrastructure to carry out attacks across the border. If the pals really wanted peace they should respond to increased autonomy with increased quite.

Come on Mark, What can Condi do to help the Pals? They don't want an Israeli state to exist? You are mr. Military...when has negotiating with a terrorist (or lax on terrorism) gov ever been able to be reasoned with. The only way there will ever be peace in the mid east is when these Islamic states recoginize ISraels right to exist. Do you think a democrat would have been able to bring peace to the mid east? Did Clinton?

Based on those points, Ali, and it is not an exhaustive list, you must admit that the US is generally supportive of Arabs and Muslims alike. There is an unmistakable history in the way Arabs view the USA--reducing American ME policy to a single issue--support for Israel. This is very difficult to understand since Israel is, after all, a functional democracy with a "First World" economy. There is some affinity between the political and economic systems of the two countries. Doesn;t an alliance, complimenting the USA's alliance with Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and others, make some sense to you?

Please don't forget us.

If that is how Arabs view the US, they best get their eyes examined. Consider this Ali: 1. The US provides as much in economic and military aid to Egypt as it does to Israel under the Camp David accords. 2. The US fought a war in 1990 as proxy for Saudi Arabia and Kuwait. At no other time in history has the US fought a war and sacrificed its soldiers for a foreign nation. 3. The US supported Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo militarily and economically. Same as to Muslim fighters in Afghanistan during the Soviet occupation. 4. No other nation has the clout that the Saudis have in DC, not Israel, not the Europeans--no one. 5. The US stood by and allowed a Muslim nation-Pakistan-to develop nuclear weaponry. 6. Arabs/Muslims have suffered far less than other peoples at the hands of American foreign and domestic policies (See, Sough/Central America, Native Americans. 7. US forced Israel into ceasse fires in 1967 and 1973, protecting Cairo and Damascus.

In responding to #5's demand that Israel return all lands, and accede to every Arab condition and pre-condition,I never suggested we do any of the things on your list.That is your interpretation. What about negotiating in good faith? What about the simple acceptance of Israel to live in peace as a separate entity in the Mideast? Joe; are you going to tell me that Hezbollah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Syria, Iran, et al, are simply minor irritants on the road to peace? Evidence would suggest that the day has not yet arrived when the majority of the Arab world has a sincere desire to negotiate, rather than destroy Israel.

Nagasaki and Hiroshima were bombed for much less by the Americans after Pearl Harbour.

I don't think many in the west & Israelis have ever tried to see the world through Arab eyes. In the current hysteria that would merely be seen as trying to appease terrorism. But until the United States can conceive of how duplicitous, self serving and hypocritical it appears to Arabs, it will always be convinced of its own rectitude.

This will happen only if we continue to exclude ourselves from the ME and antagonize the whole region. I think the Arabs are not opposed to "Jews" existing and residing in the area . What they object to is the fact that we are creating an exclusive club to jews and denying the right of the indigenous people . Eventualy the indigenous people will outnumber us. What are we going to do then ? 1- Kill them , which will further the conflict , increase hatred and will not give us peace. 2- Kick them out and maintaining on their eclusion , which will further the conflict . 3- Accept them as citizens but with less rights ( an Apartheid system) and that will not certainly bring us peace. 4- become a minority ( eventualy ) and live in Palestine/israel . Our status then will be determined on how we treat the indigenous people now and in the near future. Our status will be determined on how we treat those people.

I'm sure you condemn Israel for failure to comply with pertinent UN resolutions. The UN certified that Israeli withdrawal from L was complete in 2000. 6. Release Lebanese prisoners? Who are they? Many are convicted murderers. Do you really advocate the release of criminals? 7. Golan Heights: And what will Syria give??? 8. Egypt/Jordan - Huh? Peace treaties exist.

A number of error Ron: 1. "Return" WB and Gaza will not work since it would be returned to Jordan and Egyupt repectively. Those were the prior sovereigns, and neither saw fit to hand that real estate over to the Arab inhabitants. 2. "Return of refugees." You are not a serious broker of this is on the table. Refugees resettle everywhere throughout the world except for one, cynical exception--Palestinians. There is no practical avenue to "return" former residents, evin if it is restricted only to those who can prove they were evicted rather than those who chose to leave to wait out the elusive Arab victories foirst in 1948 and again in 1967. 3. Release of Palestinian prisoners. OK, but all of them??? You don;t see a basis to hold those like Marwan Barghouti who either killed or participated in teh killing of Israeli civilians??? 4. Lebanon. Sheeba Farms? UN says its Syria. I'm sure you condemn Israel for its failure to comply with pertinent resolutions, right?

There will be no peace in the middle east even if you free Palestinian and other arab prisoners, they will return to old ways according to S. You are actually right, for as long as Israel does not PAY all its crimes against the Arabs (land grabbing, ethnic cleansing, assasinations, rape, and other heinous crimes), they will return to their old ways, killing the very people who never showed mercy compassion with them, who never showed mercy on their fathers and forefathers. All of these actions right now in Lebanon, West Bank and Gaza are the fault of the ZIONIST RIGHTEST JEWS who claimed and grabbed the lands of the Palestine Arabs, enraged by disregarding their rights as people who had lived their for hundreds of years in peace, prosperity and mutual respect.

Sanders, Israeli Jews are all from Israel now. German Jews were a proportion of the pre-state Israeli yishuv's population; they came before WWII--after the war there were not enough surplus German Jews available to do much of anything as the Palestinian Mufti of Jerusalem's buddy Adolf had killed them all. Then, actually, the Mufti relocated to the Middle East and he and his ilk agitated for *another* Nazi campaign against the Jews, this one to be fought by the Arab League which, fortunately, lost, even with the initial help of Britain. On this theme, incidentally, for those who encourage the Palestinians "not to take it anymore" from the imaginary "European" Israel--the war you see now could well be the war that will be fought against the Palestinians should attempt to ramp-up a large scale intifada. With Jews from Israel doing the fighting. And winning.

Come in Condi, out of your fantasy land. Condi, what have you done in the last year to promote the development of a Palestinian state? What has your master done? Your absolute inability to cope with reality in the region is showing. Your mission will fail. It already has failed.

Nathan, you are paranoid like most Israelis I talked to. You cannot keep building army and live behind walled cities. Israelis have the right to feel secure, and that cannot be done by killing everybody else. It can only be done by having a fair deal with Palestinians. You keep screwing them up, they will keep doing the same. Violence breeds violence. With all this violence, the world has lost its sympathy for Jews. If that makes you more paranoid, then you have to change your ways.

Nathan, you cannot expect to have everything you want by beating everyone else into submission. This is how criminals conduct business. Israelis must realize that at this point the Palestinians do not have anything to fear for. You stereotype Arabs as terrorists, but look at Jordan and Egypt. Why cant Israel have deals with Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese on similar terms.

Spot on, Willis. Israel has never seriously negotiated a comprehensive peace deal with all the big issues on the table--East Jerusalem, the Right of Return and/or compensation, complete prisoner exchange, the Golan, etc, etc. Look at what touched off this latest conflict--the capture of an IDF soldier near Gaza. The Israelis screamed about kidnapping and hostages when hundreds of Palestinians, some of whom have yet to be charged with a crime, rot in Israeli jails. They are "terrorists" not hostages; "detainees" not kidnap victims. Or take the alleged pullout from Gaza. The Israelis pulled out of Gaza but stayed in the West Bank, which effectively continued the state of war between the Palestinians and Israel. Olmert's promises of a West Bank pullout, had it actually happened, would have left East Jerusalem unresolved and Golan. Now it's "whoop ass" time and the pictures of dead babies circulate around the world again. It's a very old song.

According to maven Ronny, Israel will have peace if it gives in to every Arab demand and condition including the impossible "right of return". I think Ronny would like to see this happen because then his Arab Pals would seize the tiny remaining "piece" of Israel and finish it off.

In a realistic world, you cannot deprive people and expect to live in peace next to them. Palestinians see Jews living well on their fathers lands. Israelis see Palestinians depriving them of the "Eat your cake and have it too" dream. Realities are different, for everything there is price. The days when Jews form Germany displaced Palestinans and took their homes, furnitures and farms overnight .. those days are over. Now Israel repeats 1948 and asks Lebanese to flee, then bombs them while fleeing, same happened in 1948 to Palestininas, also Israel invaded in 1982, and left unilaterlay, only to repeat their demise.

"Israel would be well served by ending all this talk about another radical Arab state next door." Israel is in a quagmire. The winds of change are blowing. Freedom for Palestine is inevitable, whether Israel likes it or not.

The reality is that Israel has a large Palestinian population who managed to get support of Arabs and Muslims. Partial solutions, which is an Israeli idea, such as Oslo have hurt the interests of Israel. In a way, Israel created its own delima. This is the price of stopping half way on Oslo. I guess Oslo came in with a built-in penalty for quitting half way. Noting short of 1967 boarders is fair to the Palestinians, and Israelis understand that. On the other hand, the Jerusalem issue centers around the Temple Mount/ Aqsa Mosque, which needs some innovative solutions.

Israel knows damn well that peace is possible, but not without cost, as folows. Peace with Palestinians: 1. Return of West Bank and Gaza 2. Return of Refugees 3. Release of Palestinian prisoners Peace with Lebanon: 1. Return of Shebaa Farms 2. Release of Lebanese prisoners 3. Maps of mine fileds Peace with Syria: Return of Golan Heights Peace with Jordan: 1. Peace with others Peace with Egype: 1. Peace with others

The prospects for a state for Arabs living in Gaza and the WB has been set back for a decade, at least. How could anyone in their right mind think that Gaza and the other territories would be anything other than a repeat of South Lebanon. Israel would be well served by ending all this talk about another radical Arab state next door.

Try to be realistic and think about the future of your children, people in the area need peace desperatly but seemingly this does not concern you as long as you live in USA. Peace can only be based on justice. free prisoners free palestine

Rice also told Abbas "how very much admiration there is for you in the United States for your courage and your continuing leadership of the Palestinian people." 'Courage' and 'leadership'????? When are they going to show up?

Why should so-called 'Palestinian' prisoners be freed? They will return to their old ways - killing Jews. This meeting is a waste. There is no so-called 'Palestinian' partner for peace.