Hamas: We won't let Red Cross visit Shalit because we can't reveal his location
Finance Minister: Shalit's fate won't be decided by protesters; Shalit's parents urge PM to 'pay the price' to free their son.
By Haaretz Service Tags: Israel news Gilad Shalit Gaza Benjamin NetanyahuStory Highlights
- Steinitz: Shalit's fate cannot be decided by demonstrators
A day before a massive rally for the release of Gilad Shalit, Hamas spokesman Ayman Taha on Saturday again blamed Israel for undermining a prisoner exchange deal that would see the Israel Defense Forces soldier freed from Hamas captivity.
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A member of Romania's Israeli community attending an event calling for the release of captive Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit on June 23, 2010 |
| Photo by: Reuters |
Shalit was captured by Gaza militants in a cross-border raid on June 25, 2006. Gaza rulers Hamas have demanded the release of hundreds of Palestinian prisoners held in Israeli jails in exchange for Shalit's freedom.
"The Zionist enemy is now trying to play games with the names of the [Palestinian] prisoners [to be released in a prisoner swap.] There are several reservations regarding the names, but without these names there will be no deal," Taha told the Arab media in an interview.
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Yuval Steinitz |
| Photo by: Olivia Pitusi |
Taha also addressed accusations against Hamas for failing to allow Red Cross representatives to visit the abducted soldier, who has been held captive in Gaza for four years. "We can't allow the Red Cross to visit Shalit because he is not in a prison. Therefore, revealing his location would be very dangerous," he said.
A member of the Hamas politburo Osama Hamdan said that the organization maintains its demands. Hamdan said that since Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu took office in Israel there has been no progress on the issue of a prisoner exchange, but added that Israel was investing immense resources in attempts to locate the abducted soldier.
Hamdan described Shalit's four-year captivity, away from the eyes of Israel, as a success that Hamas is proud of, adding that the goal of Shalit's capture is a noble one: the release of Palestinian prisoners whom Israel has vowed never to release.
Earlier Saturday, Finance Minister Yuval Steinitz said that the decisions regarding the release of the abducted soldier cannot be made by demonstrators in the streets.
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Noam Shalit, June 14, 2010 |
| Photo by: Dudu Beher |
"The decisions [over Shalit's release] cannot be made in the streets, in a referendum or protests," Steinitz said while speaking in Be'er Sheva.
"If my son were abducted I would act exactly the same way the Shalit family is acting," Steinitz said, adding that "if we want to continue to exist, Israel must be careful not to ignore national security. We cannot act only according to our sympathetic emotions."
"Whoever says he [Gilad Shalit] should be released at any price, doesn’t know what he's talking about," Steinitz added.
On Friday, Shalit's parents Noam and and Aviva released a video in which they urge Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to "pay the price" necessary to return their son home.
In a direct plea to Netanyahu, Noam Shalit said, "Gilad's life is in your hands. There is no time left. Bring Gilad home now, before it is too late. Enough talk. Now is the time for decisions. Pay the necessary price and bring Gilad home."
Noam Shalit assailed Israel's leaders for not doing enough over the past four years to secure the release of his son.
"For four years, an entire country with all the means at its disposal – two governments, two prime ministers, two defense ministers, two chiefs of staff – failed completely by all measures, despite the fact that Gilad is just a few kilometers from Israel's southern border."
Gilad's mother also implored the government to do whatever is necessary to get her son released.
"The state also has a responsibility for its soldiers," Aviva Shalit said in the video. "I believe that after four years in which an entire country has failed to bring a captive soldier home, it must pay the price before it is too late. This is not about a strategic compromise – a greater strategic compromise will be to abandon our values, which amount to friendship and mutual responsibility."
In the video, Noam Shalit also asks Israelis young and old to join his family in the protest march to begin Sunday from their house in Mitzpe Hila to Jerusalem, where they plan to demonstrate outside of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's official residence - embarking on a quest they say will end only with Gilad's return.
Thousands of Israelis demonstrated across the country on Friday to mark four years since Shalit was captured by Palestinian militants.
"This time it's different," said Noam Shalit, Gilad's father. "We've said we would not allow another year to pass without Gilad, and that is what we intend to do this time. We won't go home without Gilad."
U.S. Speaker of the House of Representatives Nancy Pelosi urged Friday for Gilad's release, saying that “today – and every day – the Congress of the United States calls for the immediate and unconditional release of Corporal Gilad Shalit and all of the missing Israeli soldiers.
“For four years, Gilad Shalit has been held captive contrary to the most fundamental standards of human conduct. Kidnapped at just 19 years old, he has been denied access to medical care. He has not been allowed to contact his family," she added.
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The Geneva Conventions are treaty law, and like all treaty law they are binding only on those who have signed them i.e. the "high contracting parties". Israel has signed them, but Hamas has not, and so while Israel is bound by them Hamas is not. No Palestinian has signed those Conventions, indeed, Arafat wanted to sign them and he was told the PLO is not entitled to become a HCP because "Palestine" was not a recognized state.
so bring him to a neutral place. sounds like the same old excuses to me.
But certainly his release at any price must be out of the question. Otherwise you invite more of the same. The Pal leader says it all: "Hamdan described Shalit's four-year captivity, away from the eyes of Israel, as a success that Hamas is proud of, adding that the goal of Shalit's capture is a noble one: the release of Palestinian prisoners whom Israel has vowed never to release." That's RIGHT, he's PROUD!! Because his cause is NOBLE!!! To force Israel to release terrorists, and murderers, who Israel has said - it - will - never - release. I can't imagine the pain and suffering Shalits parent are going through as I said, but I wonder, would Gilad himself want Israel to pay any price? To any caring person, it tears at you. But so does giving in to a bunch of thugs and murderers. I guess it's just such a personal choice where the lines of right and wrong, good and evil seem to blur, in the end you cannot pay ANY price. For me it just doesn't feel right, I'm sorry, but there it is. I pray for the Shalit's and I curse Hamas, the problem is that just makes Hamas PROUD and it sickens me.
I am afraid that unless Israel releases the men in question Gilad will not see his parents, notwithstanding Yuval's comments. But who knows how the policy, if we can call it that, toward Iran, will affect this whole situation. I know what Gilad is going through w/out medical care and total and abject neglect. I pray that Hashem watches over him as long as he is being subjected to such inhumane conditions. Baruch Hashem he has a loving family that will not give up until his safe return.
I am afraid that unless Israel releases the men in question Gilad will not see his parents, notwithstanding Yuval's comments. But who knows how the policy, if we can call it that, toward Iran, will affect this whole situation. I know what Gilad is going through w/out medical care and total and abject neglect. I pray that Hashem watches over him as long as he is being subjected to such inhumane conditions. Baruch Hashem he has a loving family that will not give up until his safe return.
First it is wrong to describe the "kidnapping" and murder of the IDf soldiers by Hamas in strangely weak terms to quote the article: "Shalit was captured by Gaza militants in a cross-border raid on June 25, 2006. " Hamas committed an act of war with a cross-border special opts raid...by terrorists...murdered and kidnapped IDF soldiers. So to characterize it in such pale language is an insult to the Israeli people and legitimizes the action as understandable. Have you guys at Haaretz really capitulated to this war against you and Israel. Again we see the blatant hatred your enemy has for you as Taha stated: "The Zionist enemy is now trying to play games with the names of the [Palestinian] prisoners..." And blah blah blah. The point is Hamas hates Israel to such an extent they will NOT even say the word "Israel", why? Because you don't have the "right to exist" !!! How much clearer can I say this, the end game for Hamas is to destroy Israel, while the end game for Israel and its people is to live in peace among its neighbors. Those are two entirely different sets of goals. Frankly it is the most important issue on the table, NOT the diversions like Shalit, the flotilla, checkpoints, settlements and the myriad of other distractions the Palestinians use to divert attention of the world from their real goal which is, DESTROY ISREAL. You better wake up.
Gilad Shalit should have been released. Mordechai Vanunu and the Palestinian prisoners etc. should also be released. Shalom/shalaam/saluton.
no red cross trust me he's in good condition a prize like that is worth nothing dead or sick .but ask for another tape for the release of more pals
hamas knows they will have to pay for his death plus i'm sorry he's a prisoner of war so you release our soldiers and we will release yours or we keep him for as long as it takes.and no red cross its too risky for hamas
for sure they can let him have some contact with his family. for sure the internationalcommunity so sensitive for the rights of palestinians could do something for the status of shalit.
This innocent kid was obviously moved to Iran years ago through a Gaza smuggler tunnel to Sinai and from there on to Iran, just like Ron Arad was or possibly still is. Hamas is just pretending to negotiate and will never agree to a swap, because they know the only reason "Prime Minister" Haneyia and the rest of the Hamas political leadership have not been assassinated by Israel is Gilad Shalit is a hostage. As soon as Gilad is freed the immunity from assassination the senior Hamas leadership currently enjoys is lost and they know it. They will therefore never free Gilad even if Israel were to offer to exchange 10,000 Palestinians for him.
If Hamas' leaders really believed in the myth of martyrdom, they'd welcome the possibility of Israel launching a raid to recover Shalit. Moreover, this shows how they're cowards, only attacking Israeli civilians, but never willing to confront the IDF directly.
Hardly a word that could be applied to Hamas. It's the IDF that is cowardly, only willing to fight people who are unarmed.
Who bomb little girls while they sleep with the F16 fighter jets 1000's of feet in the air. How Brave. Any member of Hamas is brave to fight occupation against the worlds strongest military forces.
Who on earth cares about one mingy Israeli soldier when one considers all the innocent Palestinians murdered massacred by the IDF....
Oh dear Mary is it the age...? yes, Hamas=Coward
Wake up falks. Recall how hezbolah negotatied the exchange of Lebanese prisoners for 3 Israeli soldiers few years ago. At the end the IDF soldiers were returned ... bones of soldiers killed. Hams killed Shalit long time ago. Its a unescapable fact. Thats why they can not let visit Red Cross visit Shalit. We are not dealing with civilized people. The nature of Hamas is terrorist and murderous.
I think you are 100% right. Sadly, I think Shalit family should not retain the hope to find him alive. We are dealing with people with no respect for life. Thats the enemy, and we need to treat them as they deserve.
I hate to break it to everyone, they will NEVER let him go alive... He's probably near starvation every day and they don't want the Red Cross to see what they've done to him. Israel needs to unfortunately classify this poor innocent man as a casualty of war, but make sure his blood came at a very high price, a VERY high price IDF... Make it so...
Adding insult to injury. should Israel not reveal where Arab prisoners are, and then keeptheir famiies from visiting them? No. Instead Israel not only allows families to visit, but it also allows inmates to take University degrees so they dont waste their time when in jail. But Gilad Shalit may be rotting somewhere and nobody, not one member of the red cross or any other country can get to see him. That poor boy .
Laughable excuse. There are many ways to have RC visit while maintaining secrecy of hiding place. This is not difficult
go ahead...
Your silence exposes your true color ... RED~! Just another bunch of hypocrite,two faced ,double talking anti west dung beetles.Everyone knows now when you speak it's time to change the channel .
Sir, the heading is incomplete, it should continue."..because we fear an Israeli military action to free Mr. Shalit."
Why doesn't Israel put a $5,000,000.00 reward for the safe return of Shalit. Let Israel arrange for some third party country to extend safe haven for the person or people who get him out. At the same time let Israel publicize the list of prisoners they are willing to free. Surely the families of these 100's of prisoners would agitate for his release. They have to start thinking outside the box.
Subject says it...and I support the "peace process", a two-state solution, or a one-state solution, or anything that reconciles the people if Israel / Palestine. Speaking, also, as the father and father-in-law of Soldiers (members of the US Army), I tell Hamas to release Shalit. An ordinary soldier is loyal to their "battle buddies" and the mission, but government leaders do not much listen to soldiers. Hamas would do well to release Shalit...no strings, no bargaining, no swaps...just release him. To an American, casually looking from the outside, Hamas appears no better than a street gang or the Mafia.
I'm in no way supportive of Hamas; but realistically, within the context of the situation, you cannot label Hamas as "no better than a street gang or the Mafia", without the same applying to Israel. One BIG problem with casual American observers, is that everything is taken at face value, without any effort expended on learning the whole story, much less its history - and this is well suited to Israel, whose hasbara provides for 95% or more of the news Americans receive on the subject via the media. By the way, this is also reflected by the difference in views between Americans and Europeans - where in Europe - reporting on the subject is less influenced by powerful interest groups, and therefore provides a more balanced and objective perspective.
I'm in no way supportive of Hamas; but realistically, within the context of the situation, you cannot label Hamas as "no better than a street gang or the Mafia", without the same applying to Israel. One BIG problem with casual American observers, is that everything is taken at face value, without any effort expended on learning the whole story, much less its history - and this is well suited to Israel, whose hasbara provides for 95% or more of the news Americans receive on the subject via the media. By the way, this is also reflected by the difference in views between Americans and Europeans - where in Europe - reporting on the subject is less influenced by powerful interest groups, and therefore provides a more balanced and objective perspective.
Of course demonstrators can make a difference, THAT'S called democracy: pressure your leaders so hard, long and far that they finally do what their people want them to! Obeying as a principal and blind faith in ones leaders, errr, I think we all know which country it took where...
It is easy to demonstrate in Israel but not in Gaza. Demonstrations should be done to press Hamas to free Shalit because his freedom wont risk the live of the Gaza people but the release of terrorists endangers the israelis.
Wouldn't make a scrap of difference for the people of Gaza. Israel promised it would end the blockade if Hamas called a ceasefire, which it did. Not only did Israel not end the blockade but it was Israel that violated the ceasefire, as it always does. Why should the Palestinians return one captured militant Israeli while Israel holds thousands of Palestinian men, women and children, many of them guilty of nothing?
If it is a pro Israel cause you are correct if it against the blockade or starving civillians or bulldowzing houses etc etc etc. you are risking your life.
I find Steinitz's statement offensive. Israel is a democracy and public opinion DOES matter. At the present time Netanyahu and Barak consider the price too high. The challenge facing Noam Shalit is to change that. If he can mobilize the public and the demonstrations swell from 1,000 to 10,000 to 100,000 he has a chance. He may be able to get the Palestinians to join in-- they have a lot to gain too. If the cause fizzles out, it is because the people have decided not to pay the price.
...those released terrorists will go back to doing what they know - that is blow up buses, cafes, restaurants, shopping malls... streets... I will. My friends and family all live here in Israel and so we are the targets of Hamas. the price of releasing those terrorists is too high not just because statstics show that 7 out of 10 Palestinian convicts revert to terrorism, but because future extortion will be even worse. No negotiations will ever change Hamas' charter which calls for genocide against the Jews. Unless and until they change their charter, there's no point in negotiating with them.
Hamas Charter does not call for genocide, in fact it states very clearly the opposite. Article Thirty-One: “As to those who have not borne arms against you on account of religion, nor turned you out of your dwellings, Allah forbiddeth you not to deal kindly with them, and to behave justly towards them; for Allah loveth those who act justly.” (The Tried – verse 8).
If Israel does not know where Shalit is located, let it kidnap a very senior Hamas person, such as Khaled Meshaal and exchange Shalit for him. Time to think about such an option, even if 4 years too late. Incidentally, two of the Western hostages in Lebanon in the 80's, Terry Anderson and Thomas Sutherland, waited in captivity some six and a half years to be released, in conditions not better than Gilad Shalit. So the Shalit family should not be so desperate, especially since they received a few communications from their son, including a video. I know they are afraid and heartbroken, but there is also national interest involved.
The Jewish tradition (and law) is to pay a great deal for "redemption of captives", but not an unlimited amount. The case of Rabbi Meir of Ruthenburg (13th cent.) is well known; he forbade the payment of an exorbitant amount for his own release and died in captivity after seven years. Netanyahu agreed to the release of even murderous prisoners, but only if the most dangerous will go into exile abroad or to Gaza, instead of being released to their homes in the West Bank. This strikes me as a fair position. The rest is up to Hamas. Note that pressuring Hamas about Shalit's release by imprisoning 1.5 million civilians in Gaza did not work, is immoral as a collective punishment, and according to some legal experts constitutes a crime against humanity. It is time for the Shalit family to turn to pressuring Hamas by trying to shame them in the Arab world as prolonging the imprisonment of their jailed colleagues. Let Noam Shalit give some interviews to this effect to the Arab press and al-Jazeera. This might even work.
If demonstrations can stopped a war in Vietnam, it sure can free a single soldier.
Absollutely agree with you, the people must pressure the government and speak out. the family have waited long enough. Now it is the turn of the people to speak up and support the Shalit family, and Gilads life.
If Binyamin wanted Gilad freed he could do it any day of the week. hamas truly wants to get rid of him and have named the price for an exchange of prisoners. It isn't even "you free yours and we free ours, but rather just some Palestinians for this captured soldier. Binyamin have opted for letting Gilad rot and we all can understand why.
I feel sorry for the Shalit family but you cannot put a whole nation in jeopardy over one soldier. You cannot pressure Netanyahu to make a decision that will cause harm to the Israeli populace. When dealing with demons you have to tread carefully.
We dont care your IDIOT POLITICAL GAMES Do what ever ....... But free shalit.... Think that SHALIT IS YOUR CHILD
For some odd reason we always feel the need to warn them before we launch an operation, supposedly for humanitarian reasons, so maybe you would have more luck storming the place on your own.
That is the pay off for Galid Shalit. The deal was formed. Israel and US said no. If you demonstrate for the Palestinians release, you get him freed and create peace and good will feelings as well. win-win.
Steinitz can't even respond to a human hurt with kindness. Only with fear. Somehow the "people" are less concerned with their own security than he is. Another example of reactive, unimaginative speechifying.
Israel is ready to pay high price for G.Shalit. But hostile antisemitic Hamas blaim Israel for WHAT? Shalit can be free by PERMANENT INTERNATIONAL PRESSURE on Hamas without any MONEY TRANSFER. Sincerely, Vladimir
Everybody already knows what the Finance Minister has said. It is four years and two PM's who I'm certain would each like to be able to tell Noam and Aviva Shalit that their son is safe and has been returned have not. It seems to me that an important third party has to convince Khaled Meshaal that the greatest PR victory Hamas has ever known would be in the unconditional release of this young man, (that would almost inevitably be followed by a release of many Palestinian prisoners).
Well, if 2 governments have patently failed to negotiate Gilad's release, what on earth does Steinitz suggest? That his parents and his family, of which I am a distant member, should just shut up and forget about him? It's all very well for Steinitz to appear as a hard man, but both he and his government have done little or nothing to achieve Gilad's freedom, and that's becoming a sadly typical fact of this 2nd Netanyahu government. It makes a lot of noise - like this statement - but does nothing.
In my opinion it is a shameful display of self-interest to see in the news every day that someone is "begging" for the release of an Israeli soldier. Begging before the likes of the Hamas terrorists is surely not going to get the desired result. It will only bring their contempt.
He was CAPTURED.
Israel now and then remind us that there is a war againsta Gaza and palestine. So if there is a war Shalit cannot have been kidnapped ot sabducted. He was simply taken prisoner. POW!
Captured soldiers have rights under the Geneva Conventions. HAMAS is holding Gilad Shalit hostage and making excuses for their rejection of the Palestinian ICRC obligations. The ICRC should come down hard on HAMAS and note that they will be expelled from the organization if it continues to stonewall.
Check the dictionary for the meaning of Kidnapped and captured. He was on regular patrol duty when he was kidnapped.
He was a soldier on active duty, and he was engaged in a fire-fight. And at the end of that fire-fight his gun was on the ground and his hands were in the air. He was captured, and the guys who still had THEIR guns in their hands, and who were pointing them at the soldier whose hands were in the air, are his captors.
Their rights derive from the Geneva Conventions, and those conventions are TREATY LAW. They therefore do not apply to this soldier's captors, since they are not signatories to the Geneva Conventions. Israel has signed them, but nobody from the Palestinian side ever has.
Shalit family urges Barak Obama coz Hamas has already captured Shallit around four years Neither Israel can release Shallit nor Israel ppl.So Israel should go and give some provocation speech to US so that Us will fight against Hamas and Hizbullah.
SWAP SHALIT WITH ONE THOUSAND OR TWO THOUSAND PRISONERS YOU HAVE A LOT IN RESERVE AND YOU CAN CATCH THEM AGAIN SO DONT WORRY IN THE END YOU WILL GAIN
Israeli gulags. Shalit has supported collective punishment of Palestinians sons and daughters so he has no right to expect sympathey for his son who was after all an instrument of oppression. You win some you lose some in war. Well that is what all the zio apologists are ramming down our throats ad infinitum.
Look for swastikas, broken windows and violent, irrational lynch mobs stampeding their way across Europe. We who are sane, have no interest in freeing terrorists, nor protesting on their behalf. They can rot in prison, forever.
Palestinians in Israeli prisoners if you want to - go ahead.
You head is stuck up your back side so you cannot see
the palestinian prisoners enjoy many rights and are far from living in a gulag. They have regular visits from their family and are open to red cross inspection. They even have the opportunity to educate themselves and earn a degree. Before you spout off about something you have no knowledge about, do some research.
Israeli POW facilities may not be gulags. But you haven't been keeping up much on the Israeli press. The Palestinians POWs from Gaza or those designated "Hamas-related" haven't had family visits since Shalit was captured. the ICRC hasn't said whether the Red Cross has visited them, either. They don't make many public reports. And the Knesset just recently voted to continue the policy and make it harsher.
You forget the app. 7.000 palestinian prisoners on the fancy Israeli 'administrative detention' whom cannot take an agree... that's difficult without books and when you don't know how long you are forced to be in that gulag. Visits? Hmm once in a while... but it takes days for the families to go and they have to apply for permission which they often do not get... many rights? Hmm not for Palestinians...
Bibi, if you release just one terrorist, you are a traitor, do not agree to the Shalits blackmail, they have lost all sense of reality and would be ready to have many innocent families murdered by Hamas in order to free their son. I think it's selfish and disgusting !!
If your son would sit in jail you would not talk that way, and hey the energy you throw out comes back to you, so take care
I never said that I wouldn't act like the Shalits do right now (I may even have gone to Gaza myself and demanded to see my son), but that doesn't mean the governement should listen to me and endanger the life of other people and the strategic position of the state of Israel !! Then again, maybe I would have been more patriotic than Gilad's father and understood that my son fought for his country and was ready to give up his life for it and so wouldn't have wanted to be responsible for the freeing of hundreds of murderous terrorists in his name !
theory is fine, but when you go through the experience its entirely different, may you never know such pain
Your PM has enough trouble because of your Ehud Barak. Gilad Shalif is soldier, not very good but soldier, however.
Finnsih how low can you go, to insult a boy in jail whose parents agonise each day
Sorry Sara..a soldier does not fall asleep at his post..I would not want to be in a fox hole with someone like that....
Unfortunately, not just Gilad's life but all the people these released terrorist will kill when they are let out . I speak as the father of a combat soldier in the IDF (my son agrees with me ) and with huge emapthy for the Shalit family's suffering . Gilad's life is not worth more than scores of other Israeli victims of terror. We must not give in, neither to terror nor to blackmail.
... is self-propagating... precisely the opposite is much more likely... ultimately we all want to get on with living normal lives... the Pals aren't some rare species that prefers eternal warfare and mayhem... terror attacks are born out of desperation...
The Palestinians have NOTHING of Israel's except one soldier. Taken as a belligerent. Meanwhile, by far the MAJORITY of Palestinians have never lifted a finger towards anyone, nor have they voted for ANY of the states that have engaged in war with Israel. They did not dispossess Jewish folk from the Arab States. They were children in 1948. Some have been dispossessed twice. Their Arab brethren have argued their legal case in the UN and in the League of Nations for almost a century. Fought numerous wars on their behalf, hosted them for 62 years at huge cost, passed legislation to ensure the Palestine refugees their RoR, which is illegally ignored by Israel.
Look at that: "Their Arab brethren .... Fought numerous wars on their behalf, hosted them for 62 years at huge cost, ...etc." Hosted them???? the refugee camps in which they lived 60 years - without any possibility to get out or in - THAT you call "hosted"? Oh God! You are not normal.... poor CJ!
Esther I agree totally with you, but the Israeli government is using Shalit as a pawn to ostracize Hamas. Bibi and co. do not want a peace deal and do not care about Israel or it's people.They just want more and more land - nothing will stop them except huge international pressure.
Esther I agree totally with you, but the Israeli government is using Shalit as a pawn to ostracize Hamas. Bibi and co. do not want a peace deal and do not care about Israel or it's people.They just want more and more land - nothing will stop them except huge international pressure.
Dig a grave, you will find peace at the bottom. Peace is not possible for those who only want Israelis dead. Peace is also not possible for those who wish to do to the Balkans what they did to the Byzantines. They will also not make peace with India, Russia or you. Peace will come when you are dead. Find peace in death if that is what you want, I am content to live with War.
they are internment camps essentially
About refugee camps in Lebanon: "The total number of registered refugees in Lebanon is 409,714.[1] There are 12 official camps with 225,125 refugees. The Palestinians' Lebanese camps became ghettos as the Palestinians were barred from citizenship, finding certain jobs, or traveling abroad.[2] Some of these refugee camps, overcrowded and filled with angry refugees, helped seed the beginnings of Yasser Arafat's Fatah group; guerilla attacks on Israel were launched from some of the Palestinian camps in Lebanon.[3] Enough you researcher?
If it was your son sitting there you would be talking differently
This is nonsense. If we were to do what is being urged by some here and start to think outside the box, there is no reason to suppose that they will kill when they are let out. There are issues. Israel has kidnapped elected Hamas PA members stewing in jails. When they are released from prison at last, they are not even allowed back with their families. These people were democratically elected for goodness sake. How about trying to talk to them? The Palestinians are wanting their state. Many of them are willing to live alongside us in peace if the deal struck is fair and takes into consideration the claim to right of return even if it is not return to the places they came from. No point in running away from facts, they have to be faced and dealt with calmly and, if possibly, peacefully. It's not a problem that will go away. If Jews clung to this place for millennia, why do you think Palestinians won't?
Crowded, yes, dis-satisfied, yes. However, their refugee laws are no different from most other countries. Can a refugee in Australia automatically get any job, automatic citizenship etc etc? No. Not unless they forgo refugee status. Which in turn means they LOSE the right to return to their own country. This must annoy you. They have tenaciously held onto their RIGHT to return. The Arab States have instituted legislation to help them maintain their RIGHT to return to their OWN home, because that is what the refugees want.
.. it's the only way your story will float!
Do they have the same rights as Lebanese citizens? No. They are not Lebanese citizens, nor do they want to be Lebanese citizens.
They are the only refugees in the world who are trying to return to a place they have never even seen.
oh really Esther...what was the desperation in 1948? You are the most unrealistic fool on this forum. After years of seeing what the palestinians are capable of you still find them reliable as peace partners...really you are in a fog.
why don't you ask the lebanese why they treat the palestinians like they do...brother to brother they treat them like untouchables are treated in India. No one likes them..Kuwait threw out 300,00 during the gulf war because they sided with Hussein.
Lift your game...
Why his parents dont ask teh Governement of Israel to finish the occupation, so that everything would be setteled. The world then can pressure the Hamas to release this poor guy. How long Israel would continue living in a state of terror, has anybody an answer to it?
...That should have been said out aloud some time ago... all the rest is paraphrase... there is no certainty at all that immediately after release of Pal prisoners, Pal mayhem will break out... just the contrary is far more likely... a wave of joy and relief, getting down to just living in the best possible way... for all of us... give it a chance!
They never riot in the countries that actually oppress them. They like killing the small and weak. They like a fight where they outnumber their enemy greatly and if the enemy does not resist, they slaughter with impunity. When they are released, they always return to Jihad. They take every success as a sign of their impending triumph and all of your deaths and so they go forth in boldness, slaying gleefully every step of the way. Give it a chance? They have had fifteen hundred years of chances.
This is Reds-under-the-beds-style nonsense. Maybe you ought to make it your business to meet one of those "theys". You might be surprised to learn that they come in all shapes, sizes and humors, just like the rest of humanity.
They are in Sudan, Serbia, India, Spain, The Ivory Coast, Indonesia, Cyprus, Kirghistan and Northwest China and in all of those places, They Are Fighting The Same War since Badr. If we lived on the Moon they would try to kill us there too.
Cowards
A dead Shalit would be a huge bonus for those hell bent on the continued dispossession of the Palestinians.
All other things have failed. The illussion of Israeli politics that it dictate all the conditions has causes much suffering.
Europeans settled on the stolen land can simply get the hell out of Israel. Whole world is lot safer that way. Do you expect Palestinians to take it like native americans?
In case you need to be alerted and reminded Israel is the home of the Jewish people. Jews have lived there for centuries, remember Jesus? Who are you to say get the hell out of someones country..only ignorant fools would make such a remark.
Yeah.It would be a solution...But happens that the Jewish People lived on the Land of Israel for thousands of years before the Romans invented the name"palestine" and the Jews are a very stuborn People they will stay on the Land for another 6000years at least, far after islam,moslems,palestinians and all the enemies of Israel will be only a blip in the memory of Mankind
Would that you live in Somalia. Or at the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan. Or in Baghdad. And enjoy SAFETY there, without Israel.
We will find the rock you crawled out from under and return you to that.
My children are 8th generation in Israel, this has been our home for generations. do you expect them to take it like native americans? for this is their homeland, their great great grandparents lived here side by side with Arabs. you talk like a child in the playground hitting out, but that is no solutionand only breeds hate and contempt. so please lets be adutlt about this and find a solution for us all, not sling dirty words at eachother it is useless.
It is this type of remark that promotes hatred. It is this type of remark that shows the darkness of your soul and the destruction in your mind. Your enemy is your biggest mirror, and what you see reflects that in you yourself which you do not see but proclaim to hate. so , first solve your own personal problems, bring some love into your heart and that is what you will then have to throw out to the world, even your so called enemies, which are your biggest teachers. if you could have the strength to see that you would finally thank them for being your mirror. so lets start forgiving and going forward into a better world. or do you want to stay in the darkness. if so that is your choice
Face the music, Shmuel. They're just like us.
Lets work on this, Israel has been around since 1948, have all the females given birth before the age of 10 ?
when it's sovereign territories were unilaterally declared, telling the world what was and what was not Israeli.
You can forgive them while they cut off your head, burn your cities to ashes, wade through the blood of your children and grind your civilization into dust. If that is your prerogative, then that is your fate.
The Ottoman Survey of the Gaza Area showed only sixteen families and half of them were Jewish. You didn't really think a Million and a Half people were Native to a few city blocks?
get a history book immediately. The land of Israel has been populated by Jews for thousands of years..palestinians is a generic name for people who lived in British Mandated Palestine such as Jews and arabs. Please do not show your ignorance and hatred..it is painful to read.
Ever since the Roman era. Far longer than any state or kingdom of Israel ever existed.
This would be a great peace offering and put pressure on the Arab side.
Isreal you really really need a pr dept.Why not 2-3-5 times every day write and then write again showing jews were there thousands of years.Who do es the world think was there in the year 200 300 etc OOPS NOT MUSLIMS. You must do it again and again and again stupid as it sounds.Daily likr the arabs do.Takes that to get some people to think about it.
Freeing Shalit would involve leadership, something Netanyahu knows nothing about
The fact that he is still held by hamas gives both the IDF and Mossad a black eye. Get busy and get him out!
are stupid or what you´ve done it allready & u did kill over 1000 civilians with out bringen back Gilad last new-year as usual u lost again .........or where u in coma in that time ;-) ?
Only in The Middle East, are people with rockets hidden under their children's beds, called "Civilians".
A very well made point! Thank you!
Shalit is a soldier, Tenenbaum a mafiosi - that's the big difference in rotten israel. For the future there is only one solution: DON't join the IDF. The army doesn't defend the country anymore, it's just to secure the dirty private business of a handful criminals who don't care for Israel and the people.
... so we got him out delux... maybe the problem is that Shalit is so innocent...
We can make Gaza pay for their Hostage Taking Terrorist ways, but we can never, ever, EVER, be allowed to give in to their monstrous demands.