Mubarak: Infighting threatens bid for Palestinian statehood

I do not envy your position, nor your developement. I, for one, think the Israelis have a lot to be proud of. I saw presentations on the anniversary of Israel. Unbelievably beautiful. I also applaud the advancements in technology and medicine by Israelis for the betterment of mankind. Not all the world is against you, only those who use you as an excuse for their own outrageous acts of violence.

But, your Arab brothers are occupying and terrorizing other countries as well. Why is that acceptable?

everything can be spinned to say what you want. My statement still stands.

But now where are you? sure not in Gaza. Do I need to be clever to figure that out whether you are from Gaza or not? Are you a very famous person and everyone knows you through out the world? you are so clever!

ALL THOSE BLONDES MUST BE BLINDING YOU AND the facts you post are stricly pointed at the actions of ISRAELIS. What you fail to note is the inabilities of the Palestinians to fulfill their agreements and bend a bit just like the Israelis have done. We have done more for the Palestinians than anyone else in the last 50 years. You likely are unaware since your halfbrained perception of the world is based on the fact that you do not recognize Jews for what they are and do not accept our nation as a legitimate entity.

Nephtaly, I'm really not sure who is pulling the strings behind the scene here, I am just too far away from it in Switzerland to make a credible judgement. But realisticly there are four parties who may have an interest in stirring up a civil war: Fatah may hope that it will be able to topple Hamas through a civil war, Israel may hope that after a Palestinian civil war the moderate forces will have the upperhand, Islamic Djihad and Al Kaida have nothing but to loose from a unity governement and a resulting improvement of the relationship with Israel. Oh, maybe I forgot the U.S. who might have the same reasons as Israel, so there would be 5 po- tential "troublemakers" But which one of those five is behind it...?? To be honest, I have no idea. But I share your thoughts that a civil war may not even be in the best interest of Israel. Still your governement doesn't give me the impression that it's doing everything possible in order to calm down the situation there.

Boy it's cold here. Jake, are you telling me that if a terrorist were to kill your daughter or your wife that you would not want that justice be served, and have him or her get the death penalty? Would you have left Saddam alive? If most people butcher 25 chickens and 3 cows per year and feed their carniverous needs, I have no problem tossing a murderous terrorist out of a 747 over the Atlantic ocean or even better smack into Teheran tied to a missile. Would you not have hung Eichman?

Sam: peace will come when and if the waves and ebbs of conflict, exhaustion, rearmament, and repositioning generate enough let's-try-something-new responses on both sides so that, working from the top-down and also from the bottom-up, preliminary attempts and mechanisms of jaw-jaw (instead of boom-boom) come up with something that sticks, that is a center of gravity towards which negotiations gravitate and to which they can be anchored. It will be messy at first but a direction will emerge. But the Palestinians are going to have to come up along the way with a body that speaks for all the armed factions and controls them--for war and for peace, to pick up the gun and lay it down. I don't think the armchair radicals cheering on the most ideologically intransigent Palestinian dogmatists do anybody any favors.

well the fact is that Arabs, who were far and few in the British governed Palestine, according to Lawrence of Arabia and other historians, only started coming into the lands where Israel is presently situated because of the agricultural development the Jewsish Zionists developed. Commerce and trade was also a reason they flocked around the Jews. I am proud that the acheivements of my people always attract the attention of the world. Sometimes I feel as though the world is against us because of who we are, why we are, and all that we do for the good of man. Envy, jealousy, despise, and resentment are all negative traits which are the underlying roots of the problem. I imagine a future of peace with brotherhood and cooperation, however all of the above must be recognized as a disease which must be healed.

Even Arafat stole over 250 million dollars from your people and used you as a smoke screen to his actions. It is the right of the Palestinians to demand the end of bloodshed and the arrest of their failed leaders who worry more about filling their pockets, while the innocent Palestinians keep on suffering; not because of ISrael but because they are on the wrong course being led by the wrong people. JIHAD will turn into GEE I HAD an opportunity to become civilized, open-minded and moderate, BUT BLEW IT!!!

Unfortunately, most people see things from their own perspective. While Palestinians see roadblocks, curfews,house demolitions and the death of loved ones, Jews see suicide bombings,missiles and the death of their loved ones. Better to stop the suffering now for everyone than to wait forever for someone to win the argument.

The idea that people who are viewed as the 'enemy' should be 'eliminated' is a primary reason for our never ending conflict. It is the mentality that caused Hezbollah to kindap soldiers and Israel to bomb Lebanon, it is the reason that Fatah and Hamas are fighting with each other, and it is the reason that Yigal Amir assasinated Yitzhak Rabin. People should not solve problems by eliminating people, that adds fuel to the never ending cycle of death and violence. Salaam/Shalom

The problem is the Arabs refuse to acknowledge they prefer struggle against peace and prosperity than for it. Their leaders are corrupt. They blame Israel for the problems their own leaders cause them and then they maintain minimal control so the average citizen can blow off some steam but not enough to cause too much damage. Thats the Arab world in a nutshell. They have been killing each other for centuries. How about making peace with Israel so you can do better for your lives. Arabs werent fools in the late 1800s and early 1900s. They saw the prosperity native Jews brought to the area and moved where the Jews were. Well, make peace with Israel and your lives will be alot better than without peace.

green houses down?hos come when israel pulled out of gaza was it so important to lie about the pals forcing them out.in reality u guys couldnt make israel do anything they dont want to.explain to me why you and your muslim brothers started shoting rockets from gaza as soon as israel pulled out.you barbarians dont want peace,your to worried about pride and other bullshit that dont make a damn.why didnt you try and show israel that if they were willing to give up land,as in gaza,you pals were willing to act like u might be interested in peace instead of attacking them to the point they had to go back in gaza and strip your little boy legs.dont insult my intellegance with this crock about all this fighting is because of occupation.you and your pal brothers have wanted to kill jews as long as u have lived.thats the problem with your sick society,you teach your kids all this hate before they can walk,what the hell do you expect.you act like an animal you will be treated like one,you savy?

it?as far as fabricating accusations about islam,get your head out of your ass.why is it all muslims are not terrorist but all terrorist are muslims?i dare do a lot of things there human rights and dont need you giving the right to do anything,you got that?why dont you change your name to something like kill israelies or bash israelies if thats all you want to talk about.the fact of the matter is islam is at the roots of all conflicts in the world today/islam is what keeps women rpressed in your society.islam is the reason muslims have honor killings.get a grip man,you and your religion are nothing but a lie.occupation isnt the ugliest terms in civilization today as you stated.the ugliest term in civilation today is facist islamist.islamic world domination will not happen and until you and your brothers recognise that,wars will be fought forever!you need to try and pull yourself out of the 7th century,be a part of a modern society,until then how dare you even come to this forum!

Israel isnt going anywhere. : ) Oh, and dont be a hyprocrite. Dont yell and rant about civil rights here in the middle east when the leaders of your own people dont even grant them to you. Isnt that why you left YOUR people behind, and found save haven in Michigan?

I will pray for those who died fighting, will keep on fighting, and fight, and stop, think about next generation..and of course i dont want them to be like this. Dont talk so much, see you in battle.

My friend, I beleive you are mistaken. "Those idiots are playing fully in the hands of the hardliners in Israel." I can understand why you say that. There are many talk back post from Israelis who rejoice at the situation between rival factions in the territories, giving the impresseion that we here in the political right want such a conflict. As much as it might expose these factions for who they are, it doesnt not do the State of Israel anygood. The repercusions can be very dangerous, and the situation is wripe for attacks against Israel. This violence is only destine to enter Israel if it is not controlled. This is the stand of the Israeli right. The only thing that can stop the Palestinians from killing each other is the IDF, but any interferance in this issue by Israel is only bate for the anti semites. Israel is pretty much caught in a catch 22 with this.

You are not clever enough to figur out.

Blaming Israel for the sins of Arab Islamist-Jihadists is typical of all Islamist-Jihadists. The fact is the root cause of all the tensions and Islamist-Jihadist terrorisms around the world since ancient time to the present is the rising tide of ISLAMIST-JIHADISM. Until the Islamist-Jihadists know the Prince of Peace, they will continue to venture on the path of the dark forces--atrocities and mayhem. They will continue to blame the Jews and Christians, that is, Israel and America, for all their self-inflicted sufferings.

I was in Gaza enjoying the Israeli bombardment and I am still in Gaza enjoying the pro-Israeli talkback in Haaretz. The question that need to be directed to you is How would you look to the faces of the victims themself of resistancy to Israel whom one of them is myself. Talking to some body who loves to be humilated is really wast of time.

"Hamas who are Iranian really" - Now what makes you think that? Could it be because Iran has offered them assistance to the tune of $120 million? Do you need me to remind you that Qatar has actually given Hamas more money than Iran? Of course not, you're not one to let an inconvenient truth get in the way of a blindingly simple story.

Human Rights: suicide bombing and intra-Palestinian civil war cannot be explained by pointing the finger at Israel and Israel alone. This is a two-sided conflict and although following the 2000-01 intifadah Palestinian supporters can ignore Palestinian unilateralism and revanchism and psychologize the conflict, Israeli unilateral withdrawal ought not and will not occur--it just won't happen and "occupation" doesn't explain the current intra-Palestinian jockeying for power. Sometimes, the explanation for conflict is that young men with guns will find a way to use them. Sad but true.

I am not representing the Islam in this forum to defend it. There are so many who can do that. The logics say, I wonder how dare you to fabricate accusations against Islam if you aren't even aware of its basics. First read about Islam and then give the right to yourself to talk about it. I wouldn't dare myself to talk or debate on other religions if not fully aware of its fundementals. Occupation is the ugliest term in all civilizations and need to be resisted & eliminated by all means. Dignity & honor of human will not get along with slevary (occupation).

Its alright about Klaudia, she just forgot to brush her teeth.

While "Human Rights" might be a palestinian, what got it to do with Indrajaya? get lost and do not interfere with arabs affairs. Honorable "Human rights", where were you when Israel's tanks moved in to Gaza? How WOULD you look at the faces of relatives that are victims of resistancy to Israel..? Shouting? cursing? shooting and the most pathetic way...blogging? Dont drag the next generation unto your shoes because of PRIDE. Can you change bit?

Kidnapping for ransom,suicide bombings, drive by shootings, assassinations and basically killing those they don't like is an inalienable and fundamental right of the palestinian people as their chief spokesman - now in camel heaven due to a look-alike mistake - said throughout his miserable little life on earth. A right they have been practicing for decades. And if Mubarek really wanted to help palestinians he could lower the bribe amounts at the Rafa checkpoint so good people like the Durmush clan can get their weapons in cheaper and Hamas would get to keep more of that hard earned money they smuggle in thus allowing for a more widespread practice of this inalienable right of the palestinian people.

Fortunately, Your parents have survived the Holocaust, but what about who had pulled his parents out from under the wreckage. Horrifable isn't it? Holocaust is nothing if it compared with the suffer of Palestinians through out the years of expulsion & occupation.

your post # 45.another thing,islam does have every thing to do with whats going on in the middle east and the rest of the world today.islam is the cause of no human rights for women in your society.you see,we in civilized countries know your motive of world domination for islam.you use the "occupation" as a smoke screen for your real motives.you and your muslim brothers might as well give it up,islam will never control the world.before that happens,there will be total world annihilation,dont you forget it!!!!

I'm a bit confuse here.

What I have understood from your posting is the barbarian attitude & force are the ones who can control and win. We are not waiting niether for The UN & USA who legitimate your existance nor EU or even the Arabs to help us in our destiny of struggle. Ourself who will be able to achieve the endless we want, soon or later Barbarianism will never last or standstill as long as the faith in the Palestinian soul watered by the brutal actions of the Israelis.

I will remind you of that so lets wait and see. And don't dream on it, we wont need helps because nothing will happen.

Sam, Don't you think that all these terrifying actions mentioned in Eckestein posting from the humanity point of view are valid to justify the Palestinians violence. The devil himself feels with shame when he sees such an awful actions committed by a human.

My parents survived the Holocaust having lost most of their family members and gone through hell themselves. All they wanted after that was a normal life. Are the Palestinians going to deny themselves a normal life because they can't get everything they want?

You cannot give up your heart and expect to live. Plas should go to other Arab countries where they are welcomed. That's where they came from. (Arab, do you really want to live in the Jewish homeland?). Why not be closer to your people and way of life. You don't want to live around the Jews.

Honestly, I get fed up with these repeatitive words from you. Muslims, women rights, Arab countries, Ottoman. Is that all what you have in your mind. Instead try to find a human reasons to justify the use of most sophesticated weapon to committ massacrs & butcharies against the hopless Palestinians.

Why are you always involving the Islam in your ugly comments & posting, We the muslims won't dare to say any ugly words about other religions, simply because it is strictly sinny & prohibited. If you want to be constructive in your posting, concentrate on the conflicts & disputes rather than conveying the Islam in this confrontation.

Actually, the civilized world is getting pretty fed up with the Pals and the rest of the Arab world in general.Who do you think will come rescue you from your own terrorists( Al Aqsa, Islamic Jihad, Hamas etc etc)? Who's going to stop the bloodshed in the streets of Gaza? 1- The UN ( don't make me laugh) 2- The USA ( oops, their hands are full in Iraq) 3- The EU ( well you might rustle up a few French antisemites.... but will they actually do anything but shoot off their own mouths? I doubt it.) 4- Kofi Annan- ( Now that he's retired, maybe he'll come riding in on a white horse and an aerosol can of pesticide since he's opposed to guns) Seriously, who do you think will put an end to the endless kidnapping and assassinations in Gaza? The Israelis COULD, but give me one good reason why they should risk life and limb to restore order for a peoples who have nothing but violent hatred for them. Looks like you're going to have to stew in your own juices .Bon Appetit!

"Is there no point at which Palestinians say to themselves - enough of all this violence, let`s settle things and get on with a normal life?" Nope, because by the time they get to half that sentence, Israel drops a bomb, razes a home, destroys farmland, isolates a village, sends missiles on innocent peoples homes, shells a city, settlers poison drinking water (in Hebron), a settlement expands and is built, a soldier humiliates or kills someone innocent. So unfortunatly the Palestinians will have to keep struggling until they get what they, as any other people on Earth is worth - a decent and free life, which does not include opression or even the slightest bit of humiliation from teenage pimple-faced soldiers. I'm sure you'd understand, had your country been at the hands of a brutal occupation force, the 4th strongest in the world. Until then, try putting yourself in their situation. /Sweden.

ARABS ONLY COMPLAIN WHEN ITS ISRAEL LET ME SEE SYRIA IRAQ SAUDI ARABIA , EGYPT , SUDAN LIBYA , IRAN , YEMAN ,ALL MEET THE DESCRIPTION YOU GIVE IN YOUR POST !! AND MUSLIM WOMEN HAVE NO RIGHTS AT ALL NO HUMAN RIGHTS ALL ARABS IN THE OTTOMAN WERE FELLAHEEN AND OWNED NOTHING AT ALL

Words words words..... We fed up of hearing words about the two states, the peace, the mutual recognition & rights, fed up as well of shaking hands. For the last fifty years The Palestinians have gone through a fierce brutal aggression that exercises humiliation, devestation, destruction, organized thievery of lands & lives in almost minutly basis while the world watching and send sympathy. Eruption is always the result of depression and We the Palestinians have been saturated with hatred & abhorrence and ready to do anything that allow us to regain our rights as long as the world keeps lecturing & wording us rather than taking actions.

Amid the choas and stupid Hamas who are Iranian really , one Man can really bring this to halt , and hopefully sign a peace agreement and build a Pal state GO ABU FADI !!!!!!!!

For best actor: The nominees are: 1- Saddam's " dignified " performance on the platform of doom 2- Haniyeh and his Hamas henchmen play acting as " social reformers" 3- Abbas and Fatah pretending they are not a terrorist organization but a quasi govt who will actually lead the Pals to statehood 4- Olmert and Mubarak pretending to believe in a unity govt 5- The leftist media who hyped the unity govt The competition is steep. And the Oscar goes to...... ???

THIS IS BENING WORKED OUT IN ARAB LANDS , GAZA BEING ANO 1 CONTENDER!! ITS APOWER VACUUM AND THE VACUUM MUST BE FILLED

Most interesting assumption. That of course means that Sunni & Shia will stop killing each other. Indonesian Muslims will stop killing other Indonesian Muslims, peace will reign in Somalia. Fatah & Hamas will stop shooting each other in the streets and all the Muslim slaughter of inncents will draw to and end.

I hope the Israeli governement will make a special move 2007 in order to prove that all the conspiracy theories around are wrong. I personally haven't made up my mind on that one. Therefore I will make my judgement solely based on the facts I will see on the ground.

Even Hamas is offering a 20 year truce.So, the macho "no deal" response of Palestinian supporters outside Palestine-Israel is not representative. Neither is the macho response of Jews arguing against any settlement. Most people don't want to spend their whole life at war.

I disagree about the land being stolen. Of course being an American we may have done that to the Native Americans (American Indians). What is done is done regardless. If you cannot live side by side with a 2 state solution then I am afraid many generations of Palestinians will not thrive and prosper as they should. I truly hope there is compromise and middle ground, but I am getting pessimistic also. I still think you are being used as pawns by other ME countries to keep the pressure off of them. Have a blessed day.

Blah blah blah.... Why must you say no peace until israel is dismantled? What makes you think that the Hammas vs. Fatah war would not happen if Israel were dismantled? Israel had nothing to do with the Lebaneese Civil War starting. Israel has nothing to do with the Sunni vs Shia war thats been going on for 1300 years. Muhammud, let me tell you something about peace. Peace is not obtained by destryoing your enemy. Its by shaking his hand. Remember, and eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind.

The very same proponents of labelling Fatah or Dahlan or Abbas "collaborators" marked for death, have encouraged the formation of independent sectarian militias that retain their freedom of operation even after national institutions are supposedly agreed upon. Now it is decided that this or that militia is no longer suitably nationalist, but the problem is the proliferation of unchecked armies; each faction that gains a share of national political power rushes to proclaim its own semi-public militias (Al Asqa, Hamas' armed outfits) legitimate, incorporating them into existing security organizations or adding them as new "state" militias, while outlawing the militias of their opponents. This is a recipe for continued conflict and outside meddling. The problem is not Dahlan, but a half-baked relationship of the state authority to armed executive force.

Muhammud al-Swain: you are in the United States. You are preaching a holy war that not only is based on mistruths (the "Zionists" are not criminals, Israel is a UN-sanctioned state, Palestinians are not landless) but would result in the termination of any hopes for a Palestinian national territory. In the past year 600 Palestinians have died in the conflict with Israel while some 20,000 Iraqiis have died in their civil war. The jihad you call for will fatally disrupt the relative safety Palestinians enjoy in contrast to other conflicts in the world.

So, does Mubarak want them to continue perpetuating their savagery and lawlessness? Without law and order, there will never be peace, let alone statehood.

There can be no peace until israel is DISARMED and DISMANTLED. Our land was stolen and our people massacred by the zionist criminals who (on a daily basis) deny us our civil rights.

No need for Palestinians to stop the infighting if they are not going to negotiate a reasonable compromise with Israel and just look for opportunities to kill Jews. Is there no point at which Palestinians say to themselves - enough of all this violence, let's settle things and get on with a normal life?

..."they sure need to have better leaders..." Israel won't allow that to happen easily. The more rotten the leaders, the happier the Israelis will be.

The dream that should come true is to get rid of those collaborators who came to Gaza first to trigger a civilian war as they did in everywhere they had been before.

It seems that civilized life in London has washed out your brain as much as Dahlans. Dahlan who are you defending is a well known symbol of thievery & corruption in Gaza will never be the best for Palestinians but could be for Israel. The man who created the death squads in Gaza to terrify, kill, manipulate & deprive the penniless people to build an empire of towers & buildings in Dubai will never be our man. As I said earlier he should be wiped out along with the others whom their names listed in the corruption list which kept in hold by the useless pretender Abbas. this is Just to referesh your dead memory & bring you back to the Palestinian painful environment,

"Hamas is a terrorist organization who in no way represent the Palestinian peole" Hamas wouldn't be honored to represent defector who serve the Paletinian's. enemy. Hamas has internationally won the 73% of Paletinians publicity. In regard to your rotten assumption, the 73% of the Palestinian who have still wanted Hamas to represent them are traitors. Wouldn't be better sometimes to have the mouth shut rather than to scatter shits....

This once more totally irresponsible behaviour of the Palestinian political leadership (on both sides) is undermining and hurting the Palestinian cause tremendously. Those idiots are playing fully in the hands of the hardliners in Israel. And it seems to me that Fatah (for whatever reasons) is at the moment the source of the trouble. If the Palestinians want to have their own state, they sure need to have better leaders. Period.

I seem to remember Hamas leaders "importing" in millions of millions of dollars of Sudanian and Iranian "donations". Surely that money's going to important Palestinian "infrastructure", like ballbearing manufacturing plants, fertiziler plans, mortar plants, etc.

I am sure, some are learning this lesson very fast to their own detriment.

Dahlan's political career and rise to power is "made in Israel." He is a stooge and a puppet. He only knows how to get rich; and doesn't know what is good for Palestinians. If Dahlan knows what is best for Palestinians, he should have made every Palestinian as rich as he got in a few short years. Dahlan from a poor refugee camp boy to Gaza's number one millionaire. Way to go Abu Fadi!

Who do you think you are? do you think you know more than Dahlan what is best for Palestinians?

He knows what best for Palestinians, he knows how to control things on the ground.

What is the worst thing in kidnappings of Palestinians by the Palestinians? The fact that it seems a normal procedure to them. What is the worst thing in kidnappings of journalists by the Palestinians? The fact that it seems to be a normal Palestinian procedure in the Western eyes.

..."It represents the Iranians, instead..." Yeah, right. Thanks for the result of the brand new way of thinking. Why don't you say that Ahmadinejad is a SUNNI after all.

It is really unfortunate that a faction like Hamas is governing our people. Hamas is a terrorist organization who in no way represent the Palestinian peole. It represents the Iranians, instead.

the visible result of the permanent tsunami in his brain.

...Your hatred towards Jews is the only explanation of your shameful Israel Bashing... I got tears in my eyes, huc..hu..hu..

you tell now? Will you apologize foe your wrong accusation of MOSSAD and Israel? NO! Instead of being honest, you will continue Israel Bashing. Why? - Because you are JEW-HATERS. Your hatred towards Jews is the only explanation of your shameful Israel Bashing. Shame upon dursons-clickfools-marilynsAustralians-indrajayas and other Leftists-Islamofascists.

..."Peruvian journalist freed after six days of captivity in Gaza Strip..." Smart move. Be friendly to the journalists, you got nothing to loose.

"not statehood for Palestinians. Palestinians are losing credibility more and more every day. Really an incredulous situation. They are ready to implode." And Israel has internationally recognized sovereignty over Gaza and WB. No one else claims sovereignty except the Pals and that will never be allowed. So we have a one-state solution, like the USA back when the Indians were confined to reservations and didn't have citizenship. Main difference: Pals are a majority in Gaza + WB + "Israel".

to work in Gaza. They don't want to be kidnapped. Fox News does their reporting from Jerusalem.

more and more one is reminded of mafia movies in Chicago! It's all about money, and who control what, who will make pay whom for such or such favor!

"If they attacked one Fatah person, we'll attack two more" - Dahlan is the most despicable and slimiest human being I have ever unfortunately come across. He is the epitomy of what is wrong with Fatah today, he represents the ruling class that benefited financially from Oslo at the expense of millions. That said the desperation amongst Fatah ranks is absolutely rife. Without their control of PA coffers they are unable to personally pilfer money to themselves and their "associates".

what a fine thing watching them human rights people calling for some more murder. dear human rights guy, if you want to i could send you just a short list of people who are monetarily supported by israel. very corrupt palis. human rights people on their way to whipe gasa and westbanks of the map ... hihihi

So, it's now a matter of blackmail and not statehood for Palestinians. Palestinians are losing credibility more and more every day. Really an incredulous situation. They are ready to implode.

Mohammed Dahlan is the symbole & figure of the thievery & corruptionin in the Palestinian community, supported emotionally & monetarily by Israel & USA. If the Palestinians want to regain the stability, somehow this collaborator should be eliminated