Israel awaiting High Court ruling before cutting power to Gaza Strip

Johnboy's knowledge of the law -- which he has displayed many times -- far exceeds your own.

Mark. The creation of Israel was founded on a moral principle. If Israel continues to violate this principle with its own immoral behavior (oppression of the Palestinian people and its ethnic cleansing ) it will lose its right to exist. In this case honesty would be political suicide but the catch here is actions speak louder than words in this case. Dutch (read Michael Ben Yair again.....) http://www.seruv.org.il/english/article.asp?msgid=77&type=article

Allied landing on Normandy? Allied saturation bombing of occupied European/German civilian targets (Dresden, etc.)? Countless battles/air raids killing German/French/Italian/other European civilians? Firebombing Japan? Firebombing of civilian Tokyo, Osaka, etc.? Atomic bombing of Hiroshima? Atomic bombing of Nagaski?

knowledgeble but you in fact exhaust a lot of hot air and show your ignorance in history: Before you continue to puff a lot of "hot air" and historical nonsense read : The Geneva Conventions consist of four treaties formulated in Geneva,Switzerland,that set the standards for international law for humanitarian concerns. They chiefly concern the treatment of non-combatants and prisoners of war.They do not affect the use of weapons in war,which are covered by the Hague Conventions of 1899 and 1907 and the Geneva Protocol on the use of gas and biological weapons of 1925. The Geneva Conventions consist of four treaties formulated in Geneva,Switzerland,that set the standards for international law:focus humanitarian concerns They chiefly concern the treatment of non-combatants and prisoners of war.They do not affect the use of weapons in war,which are covered by the Hague Conventions of 1899 and 1907. The convention change was added at a United Nations conference in 1951 on refugees.

VH: "the war against germany and japan was total and today beyond comment!!" Indeed, victor, indeed. I'll note that just *after* that total war a whole lotta countries got together as High Contracting Parties in Geneva, and set about the laborious task of further codifying the behaviour of combatants during times of war. So I'll ask you, victor, if you think having the Geneva Conventions drafted and completed less than 4 years after WW2 indicates that: 1) This timing was a total fluke, and nothing more. 2) A lotta bored people had too much time on their hands. 3) All the sides in that total war ended up appalled at the bloody slaughter carried out in the name of rightous victory - by ALL sides - and they were determined that it should not happen again. Now, no prices for guessing that I think it's (3), and that anyone who *now* points back to what the allies and/or the axis did back *then* and says "Well, that means its A-OK for us to do it too" is a nitwit.

Until the release of Shalit and the rockets stop Israel has every right and obligation to protect its Jewish citizens. If the Pals were interested in easing their plight they would in fact release Shalit and stop rocket fire. Hams has no debates, no judiciary, no morals and imposes collective punishment on Israelis. Israeli leadership/courts are banannas!

No, Mark Lincoln about Hiroshima, 1945.

what i was pointing out ironically is that post mortems on dresden or any other part of history are worse that superfluous!! the war against germany and japan was total and today beyond comment!!

Who are these judges??????

If Israel wants to be allowed to prosecute unrestricted warfare and outright extermination of the Palestinians all it need do is renounce it's status as the "Occupying Power" in Gaza and the West Bank. Then it may declare that a condition of war exists between the Palestinians and Israel and exterminate them all. Why does Israel not do this? Is it too honest? I don't know. Why can't Israel be honest about what it wants? I don't know. The only thing I do know is it is not willing to be honest? I think that it should be honest. Israel needs to exist and it needs peace. If exterminating the Palestinians is the only path it can see to peace, why can it not be honest about what it wants?

Every August I read the same absurd arguments. Some that argue we should not have used atomic weapons on Japan. They started the war, we had the bomb, and we were going to use it. Others argue that the bomb ended the war, and prevented a "million" (or is it a 'zillion'?) casualties. General LeMay had already notified the President that as of 15 September, 1945 there would be NO TARGETS left for his strategic bombers. The cities hit by atomic bombs HAD BEEN PRESERVED to have undamaged targets to allow assessments of the damage caused by the bombs. Japan was beat and had been suing for peace. In the end the US accepted their final 'demand" and allowed the continuation of the Emperor. Both sides are absurd given the REALITY of the time. Both sides are rooted in cold war propaganda and upon absurd arguments. We were going to use the bomb. It was no worse that what we had done to hundreds of Japanese cities. It did not end the war. The bomb came at the end of the war that is all.

"you in charge of americas war would no doubt have not used atomic bombs on japan" - Victor Hardman I do not see how the use of atomic weapons upon Japan could have been avoided. They started the war, we had made the bomb and there was never any serious question over using them. The ONLY two men who might have been able to prevent it were Secretary of War Henry Stimson and General Marshall, both of whom expressed concerns, but did not feel compelled to oppose. Not using the bomb would have required overturning an assumption of use, and there was no significant opposition. "preferring to see 1 million usa casualties instead in an invasion ?" - Victor Hardman That absurd estimate was invented many years after the fact. The actual estimates by the planners of both Operation Downfall, which included both Olympic and Coronet, the two major invasions planned by the Allies (US) were far below that number. It is a fake statistic invented for propaganda purposes and is void of credibility.

"Did you know Kurt Vonnegut was one of the rare reporters who witnessed the bombing of Dresden?" - Dutch He was a POW in Dresden. He was later a writer of science fiction. "He might have even written one of his books around it." - Dutch "Slaughterhouse Five." "P.S. Perhaps you know all this...." - Dutch Yes. I also read the most tedious 'Strategic Bombing Survey" conducted by the US after the war.

Doris, the person in Question, lives a comfortable middleclass life as a nurse (go figure) in suburban Mass. Once or twice she traveled to Israel and the territories, and then went public with a speaking tour which portrayed her political beliefs- all googleable, under her real name (which I wont name here..but others have many times).

Maybe if you tried ending the occupation and land theft and illegal settlement expansio,to name just a few crimes perpetrated by your gov against a mostly helpless people.Never thought of that, now did you. Stop playing victims.You are no longer in that role and if you dont make peace soon you will be living in a Bi National State with equality for all. Your choice.

I know its difficult for you to fathom, as your knowledge of geography is limited to the Boston environs, but Gaza is not Dresden, and if the citizens of Dresden were firing missiles against the English (which they were not, of course) than they would of deserved to be bombed. If Massachusetts lobbed missiles at Rhode Islane or HArtford, the same would be true. Cutting electricity is the easy way out.

you in charge of americas war would no doubt have not used atomic bombs on japan . preferring to see 1 million usa casualties instead in an invasion ?

Mark Lincoln-briefly, Did you know Kurt Vonnegut was one of the rare reporters who witnessed the bombing of Dresden? He wrote about it in some press. But he often referred to this experience in his interviews. He might have even written one of his books around it. I forget but I see to think I might have read one. Yet it was well over 20yrs ago. Anyway, he died this spring and Terry Gross on Fresh Air (NPR) played an archive edition of an interview with him and I know he spoke about it there too. Dutch P.S. Perhaps you know all this....

Meanwhile we discuss of electricity, this is the supply of fuel reduction effect (taken from BBC.co.uk): Palestinian medical officials in the Gaza Strip say hospitals there are beginning to run out of vital fuel supplies, putting lives in danger. Fuel companies in Gaza have refused to take delivery of supplies from Israel because they say the quantity offered has been drastically reduced. Gaza is heavily dependent on fuel delivered through Israel but supplies have been reduced over the last month. On Sunday, the Fuel Companies Association in Gaza said it was offered just 25% of the normal amount. Its chairman said accepting such low supplies of fuel would amount to participating in what he called "the collective punishment of Palestinians by Israel".

Thank you for continuing to post here even though you get all kinds of criticism. Still, that's par for the course. Yet I find your posts very reassuring and validating and I appreciate that im- mensely. Sorry, I haven't always taken the time to tell you this. I should and your commentary on Dresden is on point. I recall some of the pilots who were involved in the bombing for the last anniversary say how awful they felt and if only they had know more about the situation on the ground they would never have carried out their mission. They were so broken up about even 60 or more years later and one can see why--the destruction was savergy and the loss of life great. Dutch

Alexrod, It's too bad you view constructive criticism of Israel as hate, Perhaps you ought to read Edward Corrigan's scholarly piece- Jewish Criticism of Zionism. http://www.mepc.org/journal/9012_corrigan.asp Plus criticism between countries is fair game and in a way it keeps us all in line and I believe prevents us from becoming tyrants. Mo man is an Island and certainly no country. We are all interde- pendent , especially in this global age, The other thing our walk through this life and through this world is the same and I find a great brotherhood and goodwill in this too. It reminds me of something the American scholar and philospher Ralph Waldo Emerson said in 1844. Athough he was talking about Emancipation in the British West Indies--I feel it's very universal: "It is a doctrine alike of the oldest and of the newest philosophy, that man is one, and that you cannot injure any member, without a sympathetic injury to all the members"

...hmmm.......and the same authority allows it's country to have rockets scudding into Israel from those people who look to Israel for electricity and jobs.......hmmmmmm.What a strange world we live in. hmmmmmm

First of all I have never seen or heard of any Arab peace marches. Don't be absurd! Give them a knife,a goat,a camel & a tent.Those are the only things they need.Did you ever of Arabs getting the Noble Prize in,any of the sciencs!? Did you? Unlike the great Jewish minds,Noble Prizes in,physics,medicine,mathamatics,tech.Hi Tech. etc. etc. & etc.By the way did that fool from Iran hear about EINSTEIN,OPPENHEIMER, EDWARD TELLER (ATOMIC Scientists) And especially for the Arabs & moslems.They were again Jewish Scientists who found a vaccine against POLIO (their names,FALK & SABIN) which must have prevented millions of moslems,even iranians,from hopping on one leg! Maybe it would have been better for the world.By The Teacher/instruct(or) ISRAEL FOREEVER! AMEN!

And it was an atrocity. It was also part of a policy of destroying factories in the areas to be occupied by the Russians. The High Court is trying to prevent a war crime. Gaza is occupied territory. Israel is legally responsible (by it's own demand) for the welfare of the citizens of Gaza and for Israel to engage in collective punishment would be a war crime. You might well be a Proud War Criminal, but your nation does not deserve to be smeared by your pathology.

israel should move the transformers into random areas around sderot. these transformers would have 1 task adn that is supply gaza. if they break, are hit by quassam or malfunction for any reason then they will get fixed when there is nothing else for israeli's to do.

The terror that the Qassams and mortar inflict upon the communities bordering the once occupied Gaza is unfortunately very very real. That more Israeli casualties have not been inflicted to date is simply a miracle. The whole region is traumatized, and the situation will only get worse if Israel doesn't mount a ground invasion into Gaza- Their weapons will continue to technically advance, their range of firing will increase and the load of explosives on their warheads will increase. For this we can thank Hammas's friends in Syria and Iran. This is an intolerable situation for any country. It is Israel's right to protect herself. The misery inflicted upon the Palestinian territories is self-inflicted by the Palestinian monsters that have no other ideology but to destroy Israel. If the bulk of the Palestinian Street do not agree with them, why haven't we ever heard about their existence, nor viewed their peace marches on CNN/Al Jazeera? The answer is rather simple......

Neil, I am afraid you are the one with abnormal thinking wanting to cut electricity off to your neighbors for firing 4th of July type rockets that rarely cause harm. Indeed, I heard there are more people kill- ed on Sderots roads in any given year from motor vihicle accident than in the last 7 yrs of Qassams. So where is the huge threat or imminent to thousands of Israelis you are talking about? It seems to me its all fabricated in your mind of fear .It certainly isn't based on today's reality. Dutch

correct,EVERYTHING ELSE IS WRONG.

I do not think so. Only In Israel you will find discutions about like this,while Kasams keep comming and the civilian population is terrorized. A NORMAL country would grind those saviges into a finest powder without even thinking,never mind discussing. But we, as Jews, always trying to find the good side of the enemy.In this particular case it will never happen.

OH, LETS WAIT TILL ANOTHER THOUSAND ISRAELI'S ARE MURDERED TILL WE GET TOUGH AND CUT OFF ALL THEIR FUEL AND POWER!LET THE SCUM HAMAS MOVE THEIR ROCKETS ON THEIR BACKS, SO WE CAN KILL TWO BIRDS WITH ONE STONE!I THINK WE NEED TO RELOCATE THE JUSTICE MINISTERS FAMILIES TO SDEROT TILL THEY START THINKING NORMAL!

What you both do in your spare time?? I don't access these talk backs often but when I do there are the terrible twins vomiting out their hate for Israel. Haaretz what esteemed people you welcome into your house.

So they can make the qassams more easily and launch them at the Israelis, who are not entitled to have their human rights respected.

" Justice Minister Daniel Friedmann has repeatedly said the High Court should not be able to adjudicate such matters. He also opposed Attorney General Menachem Mazuz's striking down of the security establishment's preliminary plan to reduce electricity to the Gaza Strip." Some justice minister telling the Courts what to do. He ought to be ashamed of himself for wanting to persecute the Palestinian people for their political choice in a free and fair election and for wanting to inflict harm on the Palestinian people. What a criminal mindset. It shames the very reason for the creation of the state itself and those who were persecuted by the Nazis (see URL below ) Dutch http://www.seruv.org.il/english/article.asp?msgid=77&type=article

Just for a matter of factual knowledge: The predicted increase in Qassam range in the near future, or alternatively the moving from Qassams to the longer range Katusha rockets using existing technologies, will put the Israeli city of Ashkelon in range of Qassam fire. Southern Ashkelon holds one of Israel's main electric power stations, and will be a cool target. Let's ignore the people of Ashkelon for a moment (what do they matter anyway) ... What will the high court have to say about the possibility that Palestinian Qassam fire will result in the damaging of the power plant which is generating the electricity that we are supplying to Gaza? I think they should file an injunction against the Palestinian "militants", and order that they stop firing the Qassams immediately, as not to cause undue problems to the Palestinian civilian population. It is collective punishment.

Hello Silvienne, Wait until the world sees and hears how they have been so cruel and unkind the Palestinian people. I doubt if they will be welcomed again anywhere. ( http://www.uruknet.info/?p=38730 ) Dutch

The Nazis attacked England. England bombed Nazi Germany. Such is the nature of war. England's failure to do so may have meant their occupation, and perhaps the loss of WWII. The Palestinians are bombing Israel, and are doing everything in their power to intensify their attacks and increase their technologies. Their attacks are largely against Israeli civilian targets.Israel must respond. The pseudo morality of our High court is really quite unpalatable. One must first protect ones own safety and security before considering the rights of one's enemy. Shame on our court system. Remove our judges and send them off for 6 months mandatory community service in Sderot. If that were realized, I am sure the High court would change their rulings pronto.

It is not the responsibility when people are at war to supply the foe with anything. Did the UK send gasoline to Hitler's army while the Battle of Britain was raging in its skies. If prisoners are taken in the course of a battle, they are given medical help for their wounds. (Actually the Arab prisoners in Israeli jails are better off than the Jews living in Sderot.)

I see no signs of srtarvation among the children parading in Hamas suits, carrying weapons or the overfed women also seen in pictures. You want to see starvation, look at scenes from Africa. Electricity and fuel could come from Egypt, just as easily as the weapons the Hamas "militants" so easily acquire.

I do have an objection to the fact that Israel bombed and put out of commission Gaza's own facility to generate electricity independently of Israel, and then have systematically prevented the United Nations from replacing the parts destroyed by Israeli aggression. It is as if Israel wants the Palestinian people to fail in Gaza in building an economy, trading with the rest of the world, and ensuring that Palestinians can look after their kids. Which is afterall what the vast majority of Palestinians want. I think its because Israel is not so much a miracle, but a state reliant on US taxpayers money' and if there is no perpetual war with the Palestinians there would be no money. More people are killed on Israel's roads than killed by Qassems. That is the simple fact of the matter. This is not about Qassems it is about the establishment of a Palestinian state.

dear ignorant talkbackers from abroad, since you have no understanding of our culture, nor of the palestinians, your opinions here are useless and myopic at best. this will stop the qassam fire, and we should let them all camp out in the schools and hospitals and let them experience what israelis in sderot experience DAY TO DAY until they decide that they want a better life - for their lives to improve they will have to allow ours to -- by ending Qassam fire. speak to arab muslim friends of yours and they'll explain to you why only this psychological approach will work to stop their terrorism. as it is, you simply do not understand. thank g-d you can't vote here.

They should flick the switch, think of the environment and the melting ice flow.

I endorse the comment by john. Denying medical treatment to enemies is sub-subhuman.

they attack us every day with their rockets,so lets give them weaponry electricity,all they need to attack us more. Court of Justice please dont forget that Israel did NOT supplied electricity before 1967.

"its time to stop all power supplies to gaza includes those to hospitals. terrorists and terrorists supporters dont deserve any medical treatment." shame on you. just shame on you. i hope that one day you will recognize the terrible meaning of what you have said above.

A very small nomenklatura of judges is ruling Israel. Olmert, and Co ( Ramon and others ) are cleared only when their political behaviour is approved by the nomenklatura. Amazing to see also that the corrupted politicians are discovered only when their policy is in the "wrong" direction.

Any Israel haters see the irony?

Is Israeli High Court now in charge of every military operation down to the squad level? The Romans featured fights between Jews and the lions, except instead of weapons, the Jews were buried up to their necks in the Coliseum ground and then told to defend themselves. One Jew managed to turn his head from side to side while an enraged lion pounced on him from one side and then the other. Finally the lion attacked the Jew from the front and as the lion came down upon the head of the Jew, the man took a hefty bite out of the lion's testicles, at which time the crowd shouted as one, "FIGHT FAIR, JEW!" Sound familiar?

qassams are an act of war! no country that has an ounce of self respect supplies its enemies with power !

Gaza is already blockaded, starved, cut off from its neighbours, unable to import or export goods...the lives of Gazans are a hell on earth. They have nothing left to lose, and so they'll go on firing Kassams at Israel. Why not?

The Supreme Court Junta is not elected by, and does not represent the people of Israel. It has no jurisdiction in matters of foreign affairs, such as the war with Gaza. The government has a responsibility to the people, and should not listen to the supreme court when they enter domains beyond their jurisdiction.

Why does Israel have to provide Palestine with power/oil? If they cut it off completely.... and then turned it back on again DOES ANYONE THINK THE PALS WOULD THANK THEM? Why doesn't Allah or Mouhammad or the teddy bear or whatever just give them their own power plant, then they wouldn't have to rely on Israel. Or, if God isn;t going to Zap them with energy why don't the good men of Hamas go out and build a few mindmills? Or Solar Arrays? Or better still..... WHY DONT THE ARAB NATIONS THAT HAVE ALL THE OIL SHIP IT TO THEM? I think it is clear that if every Israeli packed up and left the territories to the Pals everything would fall apart. The entire country would be in starvation, civil war and power-blackouts within a week. Guaranteed.

Israel cannot even take care of it's own teachers, never mind the ppl of Gaza. Take care of your own business and stop the whining already.

I'll bet you a Philly cheese steak the power stays cut, the fuel stays rationed and the crossings stay closed. It's your evil nature. But prove me wrong!

If cutting the juice will do it, then do it. Unfortunately such action will not stop the Qassams. But Israel needs to keep the pressure on Gaza in any way possible to stop this lunacy. If nothing works, then Israel will continue taking measures against Gaza and it will be the Palestinians who will suffer. Is that what Hamas and the other terrorists want? Seems that way. After all, nothing else will ever be accomplished by firing rockets into schools in Sderot.

this is not a court matter. teh PALs in gaza have publically announced that they will do more to harm israeli civilians. they desertve nothing. IDF should ignore any court order and act in self defense of the residents of sderot. better yet, move the High Court to sderot and then watch how quickly they come to their senses. again, this is not a court matter. the PALS in gaza want to kill israeli's, those same israli's provide power to gaza. its time to stop all power supplies to gaza includes those to hospitals. terrorists and terrorists supporters dont deserve any medical treatment.