Gingrich defends assertion that Palestinians are an ‘invented’ people
'Is what I said factually true? Yes,' the former speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives said at the 13th Republican debate, drawing applause from the audience.
By The Associated Press Tags: Israel USRepublican presidential hopeful Newt Gingrich on Saturday defended his statement that the Palestinians are an "invented" people, brushing aside criticism that he had unnecessarily made the Mideast peace process more difficult.
"Is what I said factually true? Yes," Gingrich said during a candidate debate in which he drew applause for asserting that it was time someone spoke the truth about the nature of Israel's struggle with the Palestinians.
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Republican presidential hopefuls Mitt Romney and Newt Gingrich at the 13th Republican Debate in Des Moines, Iowa. |
| Photo by: AP |
"Somebody ought to have the courage to tell the truth. These people are terrorists," he said. "It's fundamentally time for somebody to have the guts to stand up and say, 'Enough lying about the Middle East."'
Gingrich's remarks to a cable channel the day before struck at the heart of Palestinian sensitivities about the righteousness of their struggle for an independent state and put him at odds not only with the international community but with many in Israel. Mainstream Israelis, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, support the idea of an independent Palestine alongside Israel as part of a final peace agreement.
Before the debate, Gingrich told a veterans' forum that he supports a peace agreement between Israel and the Palestinians that includes two separate states.
The burden to show a willingness to reach a peace accord with the Israelis lies squarely with the Palestinians, he said.
"When the president keeps talking about a peace process while Hamas keeps firing missiles into Israel, if we had a country next to us firing missiles, how eager would we be to sit down and negotiate?" Gingrich told the forum in Iowa.
Palestinian officials reacted furiously Saturday to Gingrich's earlier comments, accusing the Republican presidential hopeful of incitement and staging a "cheap stunt" to court the Jewish vote.
In footage released Friday, the former House speaker told the Jewish Channel, a U.S. cable TV network, that the Palestinians were an "invented people."
"Remember, there was no Palestine as a state - (it was) part of the Ottoman Empire. I think we have an invented Palestinian people who are in fact Arabs and historically part of the Arab community and they had the chance to go many places," Gingrich said according to a video excerpt posted online.
Gingrich sought to clarify his position later Saturday.
In a statement, Gingrich spokesman R.C. Hammond said that "to understand what is being proposed and negotiated you have to understand decades of complex history - which is exactly what Gingrich was referencing."
"Newt Gingrich supports a negotiated peace agreement between Israel and the Palestinians, which will necessarily include agreement between Israel and the Palestinians over the borders of a Palestinian state," Hammond said in the statement.
As Gingrich has risen to lead in national and early-voting-state polls, he has come under criticism from his party rivals for making inflammatory statements. The Palestinian comments intensified that scrutiny with less than four weeks until Iowa's precinct caucuses on Jan. 3 kick off the nominating contests to choose a challenger to President Barack Obama.
Palestinian Prime Minister Salam Fayyad demanded that Gingrich "review history."
"From the beginning, our people have been determined to stay on their land," Fayyad said in comments reported by the Palestinian news agency Wafa. "This, certainly, is denying historical truths."
Saeb Erekat, the chief Palestinian negotiator, accused Gingrich of incitement. "Mark my words ... these statements of Gingrich's will be the ammunitions and weapons of the bin Ladens and the extremists for a long, long time," Erekat told CNN.
The Palestinians have never had an independent state of their own. The region was ruled by the Ottomans for several centuries, and when the Ottoman Empire collapsed after World War I, the British took control of the area. It was known as the British Mandate for Palestine, and Muslims, Christians and Jews living there were all referred to as Palestinians.
Democratic Sen. Carl Levin of Michigan sharply criticized Gingrich's comments as cynical attempts to curry support with Jewish voters and unhelpful to the peace process.
"The vast majority of American Jews (including this one) and the Israeli Government itself are committed to a two-state solution in which Israelis and Palestinians live side-by-side as neighbors and in peace," Levin said in a statement. "Gingrich offered no solutions … just a can of gasoline and a match."
And while Gingrich sought to reassert his openness to a two-state solution, which has been the position of Republican and Democratic administrations, he said it was appropriate to discuss the history of the region.
"We have a challenge in the Middle East, and this is one where we're going to have a national debate that's going to be very difficult and that people are going to find at times very frustrating," he told about 100 veterans in a theater near Drake University a few hours before the debate. "We can't have an honest conversation about what's going on in the Middle East, we can't even discuss what the roots of the problem are."
After the Arabs rejected an international plan calling for the establishment of Jewish and Arab states, part of the land became the state of Israel. During the 1948 war surrounding the Jewish state's creation, hundreds of thousands of Palestinians fled or were forced to flee their homes.
Just as Israeli identity was forged after a long nationalist struggle staged by Zionist Jews for a state of their own, the identity of Palestinian Arabs was also hewn by their own decades-long struggle over the same land.
Shortly after taking office in 2009, Netanyahu endorsed the establishment of a Palestinian state, abandoning his Likud Party's traditional opposition to the idea. More moderate Israeli leaders have sought a peace deal with the Palestinians for the past two decades.
Palestinian legislator Hanan Ashrawi, a top official in the Palestine Liberation Organization, said that Gingrich was seeking a "cheap way" to win Jewish and pro-Israel voters in next year's election.
Some Israeli politicians on the margins of the Israeli consensus welcomed Gingrich's stance. Danny Danon, deputy speaker of Israel's parliament, and a minority voice among his hawkish Likud party, said Gingrich "understands very well the reality we live in in the Middle East" and said his statement on the Palestinians is shared by "most of the Jewish people, not just in Israel."
Israeli historian Tom Segev, however, said the argument about the existence of the Palestinian people is a thing of the past.
"There is no intelligent person today who argues about the existence of the Palestinian people," Segev said.
"Nations are created gradually. I don't think the Palestinians are less of a nation than the Americans," he added.
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Let Haaretz and the New York Times choke on their lies. The truth will not stay dormant forever as long as people like Gingrich are around. Others have the same ability to speak the truth, but won't do so.
Gingrich reminds me a little bit of Nazi's propaganda on Jews. "These people are terrorists...".Gingrich reminds me of Breivik. You either are tolerant or intolerant. If you are intolerant to the other's then you have accepted the world of intolerance, which comes to you as well. I cannot understand the concept of Arabs. It is like europeans or americans. It is not an ethnic identity over here.
Everyone knows that Mr. Gingrich is an Israeli puppet. He is willing to say or do whatever it takes to please his masters within the Israeli lobby in the US. His words reflects also deep racism and disrespect for the native population in Palestine.
But what is the point? These are parlor tricks. We all know better.
he tells it like it really is
Gingrich is basically saying hey i will say whatever it takes to win over the Zionist Lobby because thats the only way to get elected. Basically who cares about the american people I only care about the mafia Zionist lobby. Just for the record. The palestinians are the ancestors of CANAAN this land palestine israel is called CANAAN and they were the first people in that land and they are still there today but they are called Palestinians therefore they are not an invented people. But i know he doesn't beleive what he is saying. He is just saying hey zionist im with you so elect me you have all the power and i am bowing down to you and who cares about americans any way.
For more facts if facts are important to you can be found in Joan Peters book "From Time Immemorial". You can get it on amazon. Peters had originally intended to write a book that focussed only upon the plight of the Palestinians. As she researched she came across some rather disturbing details which are well documented as you will find an extensive bibliography in her book as well.
GRINGRICH IS A BRAVE MAN
Someone recently called Gingrich a stupid person's image of what a smart person is. Right on. Gingrich is ignorant, despite his Ph.d. Does he even understand what the concept of a "People" means? I doubt it.
Listen to my words that I dont wanted to happen becuz a lot of good people are going to die & suffer. But lord rothchild said I will bring those colonist back to colonial status. And I m going sit back the day these same fools find themselves like the palistinians crying, smelly,hungry,asking those theelthy illegals for help compasio they reply most likely is was it u tea bagger who cheered 4 so my race would be inprison 4 earning a living. Wasnt it u who cried build a fence around the entire U.S so no other culture can enter. Wasnt u that want to cheer excutions, war, bullets killing children & women rape oh surely when the U.S economy dies will see if u still chant 4 gingrich & isreal the very cause of the invented americans & the end of america. Sadly becuz americans 4 got what made america great.they 4got that the planet was made 4 all cultures 4 all humans to be free. Sadly idiots like gingrich & those cheering 4 him wouldnt even except that united states should first ask china permission & if other countries would agree sounds preety stupit. Lastly the palistinians were their first. 4 the guy that commented that a rock was found dated 1300bc that truth for isreals exsisted first yea I have plenty in my yard some are called horse apples. Thats truth facts!
What I find a lot more worrying is what he says a little down the article" These people are terrorists,".. How would he feel and behave if someone first stole one room of his house and then , one by one took the others too, until all he had to live in was a corner in the outhouse...and then called Him terrorist for defending his space. If he says that it is time to speak the truth..he should at least acknowledge both sides of that truth. Come of that agenda and get real-the world would be a better place for it I recon.
to them being 'terrorists' If Americans want someone of this calibre to be their next president, what an indictment on their judgement that will be !
Invented people??? with friends like Gringrich, Isreal needs no enemies. one state, all togther, one man one vote, great, a lebanese Isreal is born.
and this was a racist comment
It's called free speech. There's not a court in the United States which would find any of this problematic. Maybe you should live in Russia where you'll fee much more comfortable.
At last an American daring to say aloud the simple truth. All history books lead to the same conclusion ,except of course the "historical" analysis of Hamas, Hisbollah, and Iran.
I think we heard the same comments from the French when they were occupying Algeria just 60 years ago. I think blind power has blinded you !
That's something which a Nazi would say. No? Shocking.
Left wing of Israel is about to destroy the jewish state, we need such leader like Newt Gingrich to save our country. Palestinians should be transfered to Syria, Egypet or wherever they want. People under real "occupation" don't make more and more demands like they do.
first you have to annex the rest of the area. Outcry and you can march to Iran just alone. You force the palestinians to leave e.g. the WB you break (again) international law. The expelling of 11 Million Germans after WWII was another story as today with millions of Palistinians/Arabs. And maybe the next step are the 1.5 Mio Israeli Arabs. And who will do the work ?
this is the same logic which Hitler used, it is better to remember that you have come to Palestine only 60 years back, and you still know your origin countries. so use the Palestinian weakness and kindness to think of accepting you on their land before it is too late for you.
And so many people make ethnic.comments about him. Especially folks how don't know him from beans and yet have the nerve to characterize him. Popularity isn't everything in a worked of many lies often based on politics.
someone with the balls to tell it as it is. Newt you got my vote.
...oh dear... Isreal too will need to start respect others one day if there's to be a chance for peace.
Gingrich is a cheat, a liar and all round philanderer and now proves he is a racist bigot. But I suppose that kind of minset will appeal to some Americans---god help them.
He will not get any where. Americans know him to well. Besides, you obviously have a negative/unrealistic view of Americans.
He did say "some" Americans,no? :-)
The Dutch newspaper Trouw published an interview with palestine liberation organization executive committee member zahir muhsein. Here's what he said: 'The palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our arab unity. In reality there is no difference between jordanians, palestinians, syrians and lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a palestinian people, since arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "palestinian people" to oppose Zionism. For tactical reasons, jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite palestine and jordan.
The fact is Arabs in Lebanon, Syria and Palestine have a lot of common ancestry with Jews from around 2000BCE. It is called northern Semite. Their common ancestry with the southern Semite Arabs of Arabia goes back to an even earlier time about 5000BCE.
Prior to partition, “Palestinian” Arabs did not view themselves as having a separate identity. When the first congress of Muslim-Christian associations met in Jerusalem in February 1919 to choose “Palestinian” representatives for the Paris Peace Conference, the following resolution was adopted: “We consider ‘Palestine’ as part of Arab Syria, as it has never been separated from it at any time. We are connected with it by national, religious, linguistic, natural, economic, and geographical bonds.” In 1937, a local Arab leader, Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, told the Peel Commission, which ultimately suggested the partition of Israel: “There is no such country [as Palestine]! ‘Palestine’ is a term the Zionists invented! There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of Syria.” Prof Philip Hitti, an Arab-American professor at Columbia University testified befiore the UN General Assembly that, "There has never been a country named "Palestine" in history." (1946) The representative of the Arab Higher Committee to the United Nations submitted a statement to the general assembly in May 1947 that said “‘Palestine’ was part of the province of Syria” and that, “politically, the Arabs of Israel were not independent in the sense of forming a separate political entity.” On May 31, 1956, Ahmed Shukairy had no hesitation, as current head of the Palestine Liberation Organization, in announcing to the Security Council the observation, “It is common knowledge that Palestine is nothing but Southern Syria.” Assad stated on March 8, 1974, "Palestine is a principal part of Southern Syria, and we consider that it is our right and duty to insist that it be a liberated partner of our Arab homeland and of Syria." “There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity… yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel.” Zuheir Muhsin, late Military Department head of the PLO and a member of its Executive Council, to the Dutch daily newspaper, “Trouw”, March 1977. Yasser Arafat was quotes in his official biography as saying, "If there is any such thing as a "Palestinian people", it is I, Yasser Arafat, who created them. After admitting so openly and often that they are NOT "Palestinians", why should we think they are suddenly a people?
according to newt americans are an invented people. in the times of the bible no one even knew that america exists. newt is certainly no newton. god beware if he becomes the president of the usa.
Palestinians are the people who did not accept the offer by the UN in 1948 of a state of their own. History says they made a mistake.
Assuming this man is right, the Palestinians were "Invented" long before his fabricated country existed. It is either that this man is so intelligent that we cannot deeply understand what he is saying, or that he is so naive enough to be eligible for US presidency (following the foot steps of low-IQ Bush)
Actually setting out to kill a race is hard genocide. But denying a race's existence is a classic 'soft' way of abolishing them. It's happened regularly through history.
Newt Gingrich wants to be US-president: not he will run for US-president; ASS he has others like Mitt to BE DOING {that} for him - he's only in to keep them he cannot handle nor control out - cos Jeb Bush will have to be at least the running mate for Republican Party to Win in 2012
This is an obvious admission of character why gingrich is the worst of the 3 leading candidates - he is an instigator - when we should be focusing on the economy and looking for common denominators to build relationships, he's throwing gas into the fire. It's a choice between Perry and Romney. Perry is best for the US and for Israel. Romney is great but not nearly as effective and good as Perry.
Modern Israel is not, whatever Zionist myth may say, a direct continuation of ancient Israel. It carries the same name, has some people of the same religion, has some of the same gene pool, and covers some of the same territory. That's pretty much it. It's not the same political entity. You can call it a re-foundation if you want, but basically it's a modern country using an old name. For what it's worth, there was a territory in the Roman period called Palestine was has some of the same gene pool, covers some of the same territory and has the same name as modern Palestine.
is that the natives do not belong there because they didnt go by the name Palestinian, a lame point at best. It is like saying that the Indians of the Americas dont belong there because they didnt refer to themselves as Americans. The true Americans are the trash that migrated there from the slums of Europe.
Newt isn't alone in his views it seems that a Palestinian leader named Zuheir Mohsen in 1977 had this to say in a interview with a dutch newspaper." The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan"
Well, that is true, but that is not a thing a US-citizen w/c/should say to anyone.
Newt should read the excellent best seller of Israeli author Shlomo Sand: THE INVENTION OF THE JEWISH PEOPLE. But I don't think he can read.
Jews are mainly the descendants of ONE ancient nation that lived in the land. Palestinians are the descendants of ALL ancient nations that lived on the land, including Jews.
The area had been known as Palestine for most of the last 2000 years, and once a nation was formed by there by those not Jews it could only be called Palestine.
belongs in the fringes of ultra-right. Not with a so-called mainstream contender for the republican party presidention nomination. It's a disgrace and his advisers would be wise to shut him up on the sublject. If, heaven forbid he get's elected he will have to deal with the issue and not in slogans.
Gingrich will change that statement when he changes his drawers. And forget what the statement was to begen with. The problem is that he uses these kinds of statements to get into the pockets of rich Jewish doners. Retardedpublicans will say anything to anyone just to get in office. But as dumb as it is for him to quote such madness. It is even dumber that their are those who will support him.
Gingrich will change that statement when he changes his drawers. And forget what the statement was to begen with. The problem is that he uses these kinds of statements to get into the pockets of rich Jewish doners. Retardedpublicans will say anything to anyone just to get in office. But as dumb as it is for him to quote such madness. It is even dumber that their are those who will support him.
... the Palestinians are worse. For every difference they have nothing to fight with except killing & lies. They are greedy and unkind. It was Lawrence of Arabia who said: Don't tell the Arab what to do but just tell him he is right and to do what you think. A false pride that worth nothing in history.
If you love Israel so much---bon voyage---you wont be missed.
The Irish do not need any help to "beat themselves up." They have done a great job.
Americans are an invented people. Should they return to England, Ireland, Russia, Sweden, Italy, China, and the othrr countries they originated from ?
Sooner or later it vwill happen. Do not cry then
Jewish palestinians return to an area west of the jordan.. and arab palestinians east of the jordan.. this was done to cease the racial tension that started in 1920 during the hebron massacre.. prior to any state prior to any settlement.
Why after 2000 years So called "Palestina" by Romans, was so deserted and empty? They want to come back to live in tents they built or get new homes, houses Jewish built? I think people like who you dont live in Israel should just shut up and mind their own problems.
He is a man living in America ! We want to hear your final say about the subject ?
I'm Israeli and agree with him. I base my conclusion on a quote from Yasser Arafat's authorized biography, where he is quoted as saying: "If there is any such thing as a "Palestinian people", it is I, Yasser Arafat who created it." That's about as official as it gets.
Why then he descripes them as being invented? The displaced persons in the camps in Germany after 1945 mostly wanted to go to the USA, but weren´t allowed to do so. Zionist organisations had worked for that too. Gingrich (sounds very German) seems not to know about the responsibility of the USA
for 1,000's of years. Can they name one person, who identified themselves as a Palestinian from 200, 500, 1000 years ago? They are Arabs, from differing Arab tribes that happen to have migrated to the Holy Land for differing domestic reasons, and never identified themselves as anything but part of the prevailing culture or ruler-ship at the time. It is the International community and weak short-sighted Jews that over the years gave the defeated Arabs an identity with which to vent their shame and miraculous defeat at the hands of Jews.
Then why are some Palestinians Christians?? If they were a roaming tribe of Arabs then why are they not all Muslim. I think you ought to go back and do a bit more research and stop dipping into your hasbara bag of tricks
this guy is so pathetic and desperate for some attention that he will steep to the lowest levels a human can to try be relavant. the things people would say to get jewish funding. disgusting.
You forget that there were people living in the area long before Hebraism was invented and that only a minority of the inhabitants of that area adopted the new Hebraic faith. The others stuck to their pre-Hebraic religion and their descendants became the Arabs, the Christians and the Jews who lived side by side, peacefully, on the land prior to the arrival of the Zionists in Palestine. Do not make the history of this part of the world start with the birth of the Jewish religion. This is propaganda!
Right on! Right on! Right on!
on twitter some lunatic Israel-firsters now claim that Palestinians are only invented to harm the Jews....obviously Gingrich would agree with that ludricous assertion
I tried, unsuccessfully to find any references to the term "Palestinians" with regards to Arabs before 1948. In fact, the term normally was applied to Jews living in Palestine and not Arabs. Prior to the "Jerusalem Post" for example, it was called the "Palestine Post". Likewise, even though the West Bank was under Jordanian rule for 19 years, I can not find any reference to the term "Occupied Territories" prior to 1967. The PLO only came into existence in 1964, 16 years after the State of Israel was founded. Can someone please point to a reputable document which mentions the "Palestinian People" prior to 1948 or for that matter, the Soverign country of Palestine, ever ?
There has never been a Kurdish country, doesn't mean there shouldn't be one now. If there is a people with an identity, then undoubtably they will call for a country. Besides that, Palestinian Arabs have been living in Palestine far longer than most Jewish immigrants like Netanyahu, Ben Gurion, Lieberman or the countless of Jewish immigrants of the past 60-100 years. So a historical perspective has to be established correctly.
http://www.torah.org/learning/basics/israel-nutshell/chapter3.html
Jesus could not satisfy you. How can the pals. You lot are truly beyond redemption. You can read Martin Gilbert's History of Israel. He mentions, European jews migrated to PALESTINE.
It was established in 1917 and was then crushed by the Turks in cooperation with the British. The Kurds are actually a part of the land and have had kingdoms and republics. In this case they are similar to Jews. What are the Palestinians? Native sharecroppers, felahin from Egypt, fat Ottoman era notables and economic immigrants from Syria. It was a desolate backwater in 1850 wilh less than 500,000 thousand people, Jews, Muslims and Christians. It was only after Zionists came here and developed the land that the Arabs started flocking to it. That's the historical perspective.
The Jews were not the successful farmers and landowners you try to portray. By 1947 they still only owned only 11% of the land designated for their state in the Partition Plan. There was no desolate backwater as indigenous Palestinians were renowned in the region for their farming expertise. Jewish population statistics only increased substantially from the 1920s onwards with massive illegal immigration leading to the British being forced to restrict entry.
G-D chose to assign Eretz Israel to His/Her Chosen People. The UN came millenia later to officialise modern Israel. Case closed.
Only difference which the author neglects to mention is that the Nation and People of Israel has a history of thousands of years while the Palestinian Nation and People goes back about 40 or at most 60 years.
You betcha! Another lying, slippery, sniveling individual who was fined $$$ for ethics violation. The hypocrite who was most vocal in his criticism of Clinton while he himself was caught by his neighbor in flagrante delicto and in his driveway all while his wife lay on her death bed. A man with 3 wives, 3 different religion, surely he will make Judaism his 4h has no credibility and lack morals,. Americans know what he is and the Jews knows his price.
obama has done immeasurable harm to israel and the entire west. he had made possible the rise of the muslim brotherhood and salafi extremists in egypt and lybia. he has refused to support the sanction on iran's central bank, a move supported by 100-0 senators. obama refused to allow the us military to destroy the downed secret uav in iran. obama has humiliated israel's leader and has undermined the negotiations between israel and the pa. as meir dagan has said, a weak united states, weakens israel. the united states has rarely been so weak.
Indeed! He should have started more wars and wiped more countries out of the surface of the earth! Since he has not done that, but encouraged democracy in the Middle East he has done "immeasurable harm to Israel".
now, who wants to wipe out a country besides the terror regime of iran?
obama has done immeasurable harm to israel and the entire west. he had made possible the rise of the muslim brotherhood and salafi extremists in egypt and lybia. he has refused to support the sanction on iran's central bank, a move supported by 100-0 senators. obama refused to allow the us military to destroy the downed secret uav in iran. obama has humiliated israel's leader and has undermined the negotiations between israel and the pa. as meir dagan has said, a weak united states, weakens israel. the united states has rarely been so weak.
I doubt if Obama is capable to learn. Again just like the Palestinians repeating their mistakes.
and gingrish sound like blabla to me
Why does the author of this Haaretz article assume that just because the Speaker is correct, that means we don't want to allow the Palestinian Arabs to have a State of their own - we do. But it is a fact that the Palestinian Arabs as a People is something that was only created in the 1960's. This is simply a fact and any intelligent debate on the subject will prove this.
Palestinians have existed for thousands of years and so have Jewish people. In this age of internet etc does it make sense for human beings to kill each other for the sake of land? when already a lot of national barriers are breaking down because of new ways of living. The solution is borderless countries or may be I am too idealistic?
that Palestinians are an invented people? Then I guess it must be same with the Venezuelans, the Canadians, Mexicans, the Americans, the Kuwaitis, etc. Not to mention all the artificial countries in Africa whose borders were all fixed by European colonialism. No wonder Saddam invaded Kuwait, he said the same thing too, Kuwait was an invented state carved out of Iraq. And what did we have out of Saddam's policy? We all know what happened, right? There will be more wars and agony if people like Gingrich becomes US President because Palestinians exist, millions of them both in Palestine and in diaspora, and they will make sure that people notice their existence. Gingrich is more extreme than many Israelis; many Israelis actually recognize the existence of Palestinians alongside them. I hope peace-loving Israelis shut up Gingrich for the sake of Israel itself..
Lets ask about: 1) temple mount 2) Hebron 3) Joseph's Tomb 4) Rachel's tomb 5) and a half dozen other places that I guarantee every arab leader will be unwilling to commit to stating that Jews have ties to these locations within Israel ...
At the moment many Muslims are barred from visiting their holy sites which are under Israeli control. Let us join together and wish for a 2-state settlement which will provide both Jews and Muslims with the best opportunity of being able to visit holy sites which lie within each other's countries, in friendship and peace.
answer the question, not find a tangential statement where you can hang your political hat -- I'm not commenting on access - I'm asking about Jewish ties -- which akin to Gingrich - the arab population says the jews have none.
no one is asking for more- the only people that are asking for more are the so called Palestinians that are already sitting on the vast majority of ottoman and mandate Palestine - you may call it the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan - an autocracy run by a small minority that insists on not integrating their Palestinian refugee brethren into their land - denying them citizenship and everything else so that they remain political pawns ...
american jews have no real understanding of the situation in the middle east. they cannot grasp the simple fact that islam regards all of the land between the meditarranean and the jordan river, all of jerusalem, all of the land between lebanon and the sinai, all of that is regarded as holy muslim land. the difference between abbas and hamas is one of nuance and tactic.
Two cheap & opportunistic politicians who will do anything for power. One verbally denies the existance of people and the other uses force to remove the existance of others.
thanks Newt for you words of wisdom, now a pledge to maintain the status quo on the Supreme Court and you'll have my vote.
thanks Newt for you words of wisdom, now a pledge to maintain the status quo on the Supreme Court and you'll have my vote.
"Mainstream Israelis, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, support the idea of an independent Palestine alongside Israel as part of a final peace agreement."
american domestic policy is a disaster, however election fever is always based in foreign policy as its so easy to criticise and distract, and so hard to tackle the real issues. this slimeball is simply playing for votes. frightening to think that so many people in the u.s.a. believe this tripe. personally i hope he wins - the damage he will do will help to destroy what is left of his awful nation.
One bader than the other
Please cool it! 1. Whether any entity is a nation or not depends on the definition used. 2. The existing states, and nations in them, could serve as guides for formulating the definition for a nation. 3. Not every nation must necessarily be a state. An interesting case in this reaspect would be the Kurds. If the Palestinians are a nation, wouldn't the Kurds be? If the Palestinians deserve a state shouldn't 40M Kurds with an ancient culture, language, and territorial settlement? What have you done lately for the Kurds?
any leader should have integrity and this guy apparently does not have it. Hypocrisy is to lie at yourself and your people for minority votes. It is true though if we said that the American People are invented too as America did not belong to them, but to Red Indians.... so If Palestinian Are invented ,,,,, so is Americans and Israelis as well
Integrity and truth lies in the eyes of the beholder. You could disagree all you want, BUT, the facts will still remain and bear the truth. And as far as that right goes, disagreeing with the Islamist fascists, is a no, no, where they rule. So if you truly see the light, go live in their domain.
As you said the facts will still remain and bear the truth! As the Holy land belonged to the Ottoman Empire... then Israel is an Invented Country as Well! But you could argue that it is the promised land of the Jewish people... and i could argue, Palestinian are descending from The Canaanites who lived here thousands of years ago.... those all are facts, but you choose to believe whatever you like... the fact that it is OK to deny any People's right is so stupid even to argue with......
As you said the facts will still remain and bear the truth! As the Holy land belonged to the Ottoman Empire... then Israel is an Invented Country as Well! But you could argue that it is the promised land of the Jewish people... and i could argue, Palestinian are descending from The Canaanites who lived here thousands of years ago.... those all are facts, but you choose to believe whatever you like... the fact that it is OK to deny any People's right is so stupid even to argue with......
"Is what I said factually true? Shame. You're openly displaying your lack of knowledge. You sound just like the Neo Nazis in Germany who keep denying the holocaust as if they've never studied history or even went to school! Why don't you conduct DNA tests on the Palestinian people. These show that our ancestors have always been living here!
what do you even mean? This is the most inane comment on this board by far - and that's saying a lot. next time think before you type
According to the Israeli Central Bureau of Statistics, fully 68% of the Jewish population are either Mizrahi or part Mizrahi (ancestors coming from the Middle East and North Africa). Where exactly would you propose sending them?
israel is an invented new country
sorry but i dont think that israel now is not connected by anyway by the new european israelis which come from europe
You should check the records on that one Nadja. The name Israel is not on that stele. What is on it is a word that looks like Israel, in english. Petrie, and his colleague, couldn't decipher it. Petrie said: "It looks like the word Israel" - his colleague said: "That must be it" and so it was - a bit of lazy, non-professional translation.
That's what has happened with "the history of the Palistinians"..... After 60 years the world for the most part has swallowed the lie. Gingrich is simply saying: wait a minute... you don't know the truth. You have been HOODWINKED. Let's correct the mistakes and debunk the propoganda. Good for you Newt. PEACE (if it is possible) must be based on the TRUTH!!! Even if some leftist Israelis or politicians have been forced to swallow the line and story, the facts still remain. They must be undone and exposed in order to ever have a real peace, not just a piece of paper that will actually lead to more war. The war of final destruction against the Jewish people.
Depends which side your on.
If you blow up civilians in a public street just going about their business then you are a terrorist
OTHER ARAB COUNTRY LEADERS, not Jews. why: SO THEY COULD KILL OFF ALL THE JEWS. THEY LEFT ULTIMATELY BY CHOICE. All of Israel's wars were wars of defense against aggressive Arab invaders.
how is possible the creation of israel was an invation and occupation from the start
Saying Palestine was like saying the "Balkans" or "Asia" or "North Africa". It was only the name given to the region by the Romans and continued to be used by others like the Turks and British. You can call those who lived there "Palestinians" if you want to but they comprised many people - Arabs, Muslims, Druze, Jews, Maronite Christians, Hashemites, etc... Israel or the People of Israel and the Land of Israel have been here for over three thousand years. We are happy to let Palestinian Arabs have a state. The question is are they ready to run one and do they even deserve one?
the whole argument is built on fantasy. What the Arabs want is not peace BUT A PIECE so they can then use it to finish off the Jews. There is absolutely no chance of real peace until all the Arab lies have been exposed. Keep going Newt, you have just STARTED to expose the TRUTH.
A word of caution to those who like this resist man. If he thought winning the elections would require denying the Holocaust, he would do it ever so gladly. This is very cheap stunt aiming at winning Jewish American support. I am sure no one with the right mind would take him seriously
"Land without a people for a people without a land" rubbish. Who else will he deem non people if he became president. Bomb shelters will be in high demand throughout the world. Mind you, the indigenous folk of North America might give consideration to these comments and decide the USA is a suspect nation also.
Right wing supporters of Israel who buy our politicians so they can puke their fiction on global stage which in turn gets us the hatred of the entire muslim world. And they love it. Muslim hate of America means more treasure and blood spilled fighting their enemies. These opportunists may be supported by a small minority of evangelicals, but the vast majority of America (including Jews) are turning against Israel as a result.
Politicians go where the money and support is. Even Obama was too cowardly to take on the most extreme government in Israel's history (although I fear it will be relegated to second place after the next elections in Israel). The last true arbitrator to the conflict to reside in the White House was Pres. Clinton. Europe should be pushing itself forward to fill that role but it has more pressing domestic issues to deal with. So where do those of us who still believe that it is in the best interests for both Israelis and Palestinians to have a 2-state settlement look next for a chink of light? Sadly, I don't know.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3n5-yG-6dU Is Azmi also ignorant?
real nice guy
... I buy Gingrich because I am Jewish. The Pals obviously prefer the other side. Both sides have killed the other plenty and, so far, we won BIG: look at our nation and look at theirs ... That's our fault? No way. It's their fault - in spades. Remember the NONONO?! So, more power to Gingrich ...
anyone but obama. a second term with obama would destroy israel's security completely. iran would get the bomb. they already have the top secret uav because obama refused to give the order to destroy it. shavua tov
Invented or not, they are there and unless someone wants to remove all Arabs west of the Jordan River, some understanding has to be made. Otherwise the blame game and killing goes on. Nevertheless, I do believe that The PLO's and Hamas's ( The Palestinian?) position is somewhat unreasonable given the reality of their people's condition. It is better to get half a loaf today than the faint possibility of getting a whole one sometime in the future Ben Gurion understood the necessity of making hard decisions when he agreed to the 1949 partition. Notwithstanding, lately, logic has no sponsor so the blame game and the killing will most probably continue until the Palestinian people become socially disfunctional, economically destroyed and mentally exhasuted. Right or wrong, it's all such a pity, horrible waste of time and even more so of human life.
I don't like Newt, but what he has said is true. What he needs to do to defend himself is show the quotes from the PLO themselves that state that the Palestinian 'nation' is an identity created to further the fight against Israel. So if one of their own leaders says the following, why doesn't that create the same outrage? Zuheir Mohsen, former leader of the PLO “The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.”
he is truly twisted
he got my support with that assertion
Jewish - Israeli scholar Shlomo Sand disclosed evidence that the phrase 'the Jewish people' is a myth. We also know, as a fact, that Jewish right-wingers - AIPAC - bribe American politicians. One just needs to know.
More like a Frankenstein horror flick. Brought to life by some unGdly whackos, who believed they could triumph over Gd. Either way, "invented, not invented", Newt just got my vote!!!!!
How low some people can go for AIPAC ....
while Palestinians,with strap-on xplosives killing innocent people: men,women & children.
If the Palestinians are given one tenth of the chance of good education they will get ten times the nobel prizes of Israelis, also lets not forget that most Israeli prize winners owe their achievemnts to western education mostly in America, and with their dual citezenships when they win they are declared as Israeli winners!!!
Palestinians are not the only ones doing the killing in this conext, do you want to make a count just to compare?
is right: the Palestinians are an 'invented people'. The truth hurts,but you can't dismiss it just because you don't like it. Gingrich, for USA President !
If the Palenstanians are invented then Israelis are just a bunch of European immigrants whom were imported 10,000 at a time. They are also the invention of the British Mandate for 'PALESTINE"
All people and nations are invented and the best example is America
Your ignorance supercedes your foolishness.
although you are blessed with both, now that we've seen your teachings....it is a shame that you call yourself a teacher!!!
How could Newt, "the historian," not know that?
Dr. Sands of TAU, also another "historian", previously studying French films !
What day is it today?
And this will never change! http://unispal.un.org/unispal.nsf/3d14c9e5cdaa296d85256cbf005aa3eb/392ad7eb00902a0c852570c000795153?OpenDocument
I think Mr. Gingrich should sometimes remember that he is a citizen of a country built on genocide. Or is he suggesting the Native Americans had "somewhere to go" and should have gone there?
the palestinians were a peaceful people or farmers and merchants before these lies destroyed their reality and changed their lives to the worst. the zionists, the zionist american politicians, and the american politicians living in zionist pockets spread lies before the creation of israel, that the palestinians were savages, and uncivilized. and that creating israel wouldnt harm them or affect them. im sure we can all see the lies now.
just don't know when to shut up. Is it really necesary to repeat this tired propaganda? No it isn't but he's obvously trying to suck up to (rightwing) jewish voters....
It's true that the Palestinians are "a made up people", but so are all "people"- the USA, Brazil, Saudi Arabia are "made up", too. Even older "peoples" Germany, France, Russia at some point crystallized into a "people". Gingrich's statement is correct, however this does no "de-legitimatize" that the Palestinians are a "people" or consider themselves a "people".
It might be true of what you said . But it does not mean that the people of that land from ancient times have no right to come back there ! Israel accepted the division of 1947. The Arabs waged WARS against Israel & rejected to share the land !
You say they should 'have the right to come back there' but what Jews have demanded and got is the right to reoccupy the land after 2,000 years and kick out the indigenous people. There is no provision in any country or any law for the descendants of ancient tribes to return en masse, let alone take over the country. There would be fleets of boats full of Germans, French, Danes and Norwegians queuing to reoccupy the UK, Albanians marching into Croatia and Serbia, just about every tribe and race in the Middle East descending on Iraq, Israel and Palestine, the Red Indians appointing their new POTUS and so on. That is why your axiom is a non-starter. There is no such right and no nation would accept a modern-day invasion by people whose forbears had lost the land thousands or hundreds of years earlier. There is no point Jews and Serbs bleating on about their 'ancestral lands', they were kicked out of them many centuries go and life has moved on. The only exception since the UN was formed has been the unprecedented and bizarre decision to take land from the indigenous people of Palestine and award it to another tribe that had dispersed 2,000 years earlier. It was said it was the least the Allies could do after the horror of the Holocaust, but that still did not make it right in either legal or practical terms. It is also said that the real reason is that Truman caved in to intense Zionist pressure and pushed through the measure against severe doubts in the UN. It goes against the grain that, Israel having been granted this exceptional - and impossible to justify in legal terms - gift of someone else's land, has never said thankyou to anyone, offered their apologies or assistance to the displaced Palestinians or rewarded the world by being a constructive participant in the Middle East. All the world got in return was Jewish demands for more Palestinian land, Jewish claims that it is all their land anyway, Jewish desires to ship the indigenous Palestinians to Jordan, Jewish refusal to let the refugees return or even to fulfill its legal requirement to offer them compensation for lost homes, land and businesses, Jewish intransigence in dealing with the issues, Jewish manipulation of the body politic in North America, Jewish illegal acts in defiance of the UN and international law. Those that speak about Jewish rights all the time, as per Akram Zakaria, always seems to evade the corollary that Jews have responsibilities to the international order too, which Israel has shown no inclination to observe or recognise throughout its 64-year history of self-serving disputation and incessant whining. Forget about the 'ancient people' Akram, start living up to Israel's responsibilities today, where it has a very long list of apologies and remedial, placatory actions to catch up on.
Israel accepted the partition for less than 24 hours---read below to learn the facts. """""" One day after the UN vote to partition Palestine, Menachem Begin, the commander of the Irgun gang and Israel's future Prime Minister between 1977-1983, proclaimed: "The Partition of Palestine is illegal. It will never be recognized .... Jerusalem was and will for ever be our capital. Eretz Israel will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And for Ever." (Iron Wall p. 25) * ""Shamir has said Israel must keep the territories in order to accommodate the immigrants. "A great aliyah [immigration]," he said, "requires a Greater Israel."(5) He has insisted that, although Soviet Jews are not being directed to the territories, any Jew has the right to live anywhere in the land of Israel, which for most Israelis includes the territories.
Even though palestine was already and always ruled by other peoples, in this case the Ottomans for a very long time.... They were never stripped of their land! We must remember that in the case of Palestine, these were peoples - Christians, Muslims & Jews, that were living in peace for a very long time, and they were stripped of their SECULAR land for a religious case - ZIONISM. The same unfortunate thing is happening back to the Zionists, and that is muslim terrorism now. It is absolutely no justification, there can never be any for violence. However, if we are to look at history, what we see is a large mass of people that were displaced simply for the zionist movement, and this is the struggle we are talking about. it is sad to see that a person with a knowledge of history will allow a sentence such as "Remember, there was no Palestine as a state … (it was) part of the Ottoman Empire. I think we have an invented Palestinian people who are in fact Arabs and historically part of the Arab community and they had the chance to go many places," .....Oh wait - We (Americans) did that to the native people of this land, we made it into the American empire and now, well, those natives, they are on OUR land, so they need to move....... The same damn thing happens over and over again in the world. And i just wish SOMEONE would acknowledge past agressions rather than always harping on today. For every asshole palestinion terrorist that is out there, there are 1000 palestinian people that were thrown out of their homes by gunpoint, simply so Zionists could colonize.
"Christians,Muslims &Jews living in peace? When did that happen? The history of this land is full of wars and blood. Even in times of peace, Jews were not allowed to build synagouges taller than mosques or to ride horses as not to be taller than walking Moslems. It is a well known fact that the only people who established 2 independent states on this land have been the Jews. This is a fact which you cannot argue with.
Those muslim arabs came out of arabia to take Israel and Jerusalem because the had imperialist tendencies and were obsessed with mimicking judaism... Now muslims feel an inherent rivalry because as long as we exist so too will evidence of islam as a fabrication. Jews suffered harshly in their resistance to ancient and modern imperialist invaders - and we are prepared to fight eternally to maintain it! Those who think our 2000 year old claims are spurious reflect the immaturity of their person and culture - we have our own multi-millenia time lines!
There were hundreds upon hundreds of states in the history of man. There were independent Christian and Muslim states after the Maccabean revolt against the Seleucids, until their absorption by the Roman Republic. Ancient history is irrelevant. Today there are men, women and children living on the land that they have always lived on. They deserve justice, self-determination and peace. Some of their families have been there for a couple of generations, some for centuries.
Are the Americans not an 'invented people' by the same definition?
Saeb Erekat, the chief Palestinian negotiator, has stated on record..what you say will get you killed. If you openly show support for israel, if you openly state that palestinians are not a people but a region. it will be your undoing. "Mark my words ... these statements of Gingrich's will be the ammunitions and weapons of the bin Ladens and the extremists for a long, long time.
The world needs to get cleansed from evil zionism. In free and democratic Western societies, zionism is a dangerous threat. Just look at Israel of today and even blind people can agree that it is worser than Iran.
But that is a minor Issue. Why do not engage Ratna and make a factual argument or do you agree with him.
A: Yes, they were "invented" in 1948. Q: Are the. Palestinians an "invented people"? A: Yes, they were "invented" in 1921.
Iraq is a Mesopotamian nation, with an admixture of Arabic culture and Arabic language. Egypt is a Hamitic nation with an admixture of Arabic culture and Arabic language. Libya,Algeria and Tunisia are Amazigh nations with an admixture of Arabic culture and Arabic language. Jewish Israelis and Pals are originally Hebrews / Israelites who early in course of time have switched into different tracks: some developed what NOW is Rabbinical Judaism in different forms, others Samarians (who mainly were exterminated) and a huge proportion were forcibly converted to Islam in 1012 AD by the Al-Hakum Edict and REMAINED within Islam. A small porportion have also converted into Christianity. It is a HEBREW nation, with different variations of the Abarahamitic religions and two different - but closely related - semitic languages. The American nation is a true mixture of many nations, and just recently invented. How dares he DENY the existence of the HEBREW nation in its two main streams: Israeli and Palestinian ?
I Suggest that Joe starts reading History and also the recent investigations in modern Genetics pertaining to the question of close relationship between Jews and Palis. "Mockery" per se, is still not considered being a bona fide scientific speciality....
If the Palestinian Arabs return to their original religion, Judaism, the Palestinian problem will have been solved. Then we will only have an internal Jewish problem - orimitive tribalists vs. a Western democratic society.
...that is one good idea, The other good idea is that they keep their present religion, but stay 100 % loyal to Israel and the other Hebrews of that nation. For example as many Druze and and also many Bedouins. The fact - beyond aggressive and chauvinistic "Islamistic" ideas is - that face to face many Moslems retain that Islam is nothing but the logical consequence of Judaism. By time the one state solution comes nearer and nearer. Ways to manage that situation are dearly needed. An acceptance from BOTH sides of their COMMON Israelite / Hebrew origin - might be one key to resolve the problem.
Gee, I seem to recall my history classes talking of a certain global conflict that started because of a "problem" with a certain people. Tell me Yonatan, what is your Final Solution to the Palestinian Question?
But humans and chimps DNA are 96% matching. That would mean Hebrews and Arabs are closer to chimps than to each other (according to the "study" you quoted)
...Eh Joe - I didn´t start "quoting" yet ? And BTW, there are no "Arab narratives" on this matter - in fact the irrational resistance to the concept of Israelis and Palis sharing the very same Israelite/Hebrew ancestry is not welcomed at all in the world of political pan-"Arabism". So please, hold your horses until I start quoting, will ya´ ?
No one in North America who follows Israeli news talks any more about when the Palestinians developed their national identity. We only talk about: "We are all here, and now how to proceed?"
It's time to the people West to stop crying over the "innocent Palestinian" and start to know the truth. They are not victims, not less than the Israeli people at least. We have endured decades of terror under their leaderships and we are not weeping and playing victims role like them. And the fact that they are Syrians and Jordans is well known.
May he win!
the arabs voted no to the UN partition plan, YOU had to ethnically cleanse future Israel of it's arab majority (Plan Dalet) in order to at all be able to anounce the jewish state on arab-owned land without their say (democracy?). And, don't mention nazi-cooperation, it could bite you in the ar__! The falsifying aspect is deep-rooted :)
Start reading history books - more than one. You're not worth the time to argue with.
Your choise, and try looking beyond jewishvirtuallibrary!
Gingrich is guilty of treason, just like every other single Israel Firster in this country, and people who support them likewise support treason. Thus, they should be treated just the same as those who commit said treason.
He did not say Israel before America, he said Israel before Palestine.
;)
and who killed all those jews in hebron in the hebron massacre in 1917
You can say that again!
Don't forget the Zionists terrorists also bombed Jewish neighbourhoods in Arabs lands to get them to emigrate to Israel
If you repeat. What you wrot you 3 times you end up believing it . And that what grinishovicho did