IDF vows 'zero tolerance' for soldiers who refuse orders

Please stop the maddness of sending in Israelis to expel Israelies from "Illegal Settlements". The first time this happened it ripped my heart out to witness this on the internet, and I did weep bitterly over this matter. I am gentile, goyim, evangelical Christian. I have always been a VERY STRONG supporter of Israel, and am nearly always, if not persistantly praying for Israel, Jerusalem, Bibi, the IDF, General Askanasei(sp?), the Kennesset, and those in Israeli authority to make the right decisions, and allow Ha Shem" to guide your thoughts, minds, and actions now in this critical time in world history. Please in the name of Ha Shem stop the maddness, rise up, put away your sin, as individuals and collectively as a nation, turn to Ha Shem, and begin to reclaim what He promised, by covenant on multiple occasions to be your land. Be strong in Ha Shem, mighty Israel, and the power of His might!

jens says: "The illegal settlers live in east jerusalem and the west bank have no more right to be where they are than say a mexican illegal immigrant in texas." Jens helps us understand what "illegal settlers" are, and how they must be defined. Texas was taken from the Mexicans by conquest, as were East Jerusalem and the West Bank by the Israelis forty plus years ago. "Illegal settlers" in this context are those who lay claim to ancient homelands from which they have been driven and which have been unwillingly handed over to others by force of arms. So, "illegal" here simply means failure or refusal to comply with, or resistance to, the terms of conquest. Let's not be mislead by the highflown, lofty sound of words like 'legal' and "illegal." Might makes right, as it alway has. And the 'golden rule' is this: He who has the gold makes the rules.

The illegal settlers live in east jerusalem and the west bank have no more right to be where they are than say a mexican illegal immigrant in texas or pakistani immigrant in denmark. * By the way i am in no way trying to say there is moral comparison between illegal settlers and immigrants in the US or europe. I know many immigrants come with no harm intendeed and will work hard.

We vow zero tolerance for ethnically cleansing Jews. We are willing to lay down our lives to protect Israel`s people and land. It is against our moral and ethical code to rip apart our nation and land. It`s also against the IDF`s code.- Combat soldier Combat soldier # 2 your moral and ethics allows for selective ethnic cleansing? We are willing to lay down our lives to protect Israel`s people and land. It is against our moral and ethical code to rip apart our nation and land. It`s also against the IDF`s code.- Combat soldier. So your moral and ethical code allows for ethnic cleansing of Arabs or non Jews. And this is also allowed by the IDF code. Thanks for clearing this up for us. Not that it was not obvious by deed, but openly acknowledged by so few.

Israel, Iran, and Turkey need to lead the way for Peace in the Middle East: Religious Freedom for All, Free Speech and Free Media, and Racial Tolerance, US style, guaranteed by each of these countries will go miles towards Peace, where "Peace Plans" have failed. These US Constitutional Rights (really Human Rights) have served the American people well.

have you considered that the difference may lie in the manner of HOW the refusal was expressed in each instance? it's one thing to approach a commanding officer to express your reservations about carrying out an order that is contrary to your personal morals and values; quite another thing to bypass your chain of command to publicly express your refusal to carry out orders with a political statement against the policies and edicts of the state. think of this: a few months ago the idf reported that 1/3 of its officers/soldiers have said they'd refuse orders if utilized for settlement evacuations. why was there no backlash and threats over this when it was reported to the government? because those who said they'd refuse were not doing so in open defiance or as a political statement. meanwhile, in the past, many of those so-called "lefties", who have quietly refused to perform duty in the territories because of moral and ethical objections, HAVE been given sentences comparable to these guys.

they've been settlers and their right wing minions FIRST avi, religious and secular alike; and soldiers second. and robert has good reason to question the so-called "combat soldier" because his last comment, "it`s also against the idf`s code", suggests that he's NOT an idf soldier. read the idf code of ethics, avi. it's actually pretty good...and EVERY idf soldier should at least be familiar with the gist of it. it begins with the "the idf spirit", which specifies that "the idf is subordinate to the directions of the democratic civilian authorities and the laws of the state", and "idf soldiers will operate according to the idf values and orders, while adhering to the laws of the state and norms of human dignity, and honoring the values of the state of israel as a jewish and democratic state". the only allowance made for disobeying an order is if it is "blatantly illegal", and i seriously doubt if this would include an edict of the state. it's the sentiment he's expressing that's actually "against the idf`s code". http://dover.idf.il/IDF/English/about/doctrine/ethics.htm

'combat soldier'. A soldier takes his oath and is at the army's disposal to carry out whatever lawful orders he is given. It is not for recalcitrant teenage conscripts to decide what they think is politically right or wrong, that's well above above their paygrade. An army's role is not solely to fight an invading enemy in defence of the homeland, that is a romantic but one-dimensional view. It may as easily be required to provide military support to the civil power, fight a home-grown insurgency, put down a mutiny, assist the civil authorities in an emergency and so on. The army is there to provide assistance as required by the state. Rowdy armed squatters may indeed be a matter for the military rather than the civil police, due to the physical risks involved. There is no possible excuse for refusal to obey orders or for bringing politics into the services. That is the beginning of a very slippery slope that will quickly undermine the effectiveness of a military fighting unit.

have you considered that the difference may lie in the manner of HOW the refusal was expressed in each instance? it's one thing to approach a commanding officer to express your reservations about carrying out an order that is contrary to your personal morals and values; quite another thing to bypass your chain of command to publicly express your refusal to carry out orders with a political statement against the policies and edicts of the state. think of this: a few months ago the idf reported that 1/3 of its officers/soldiers have said they'd refuse orders if utilized for settlement evacuations. why was there no backlash and threats over this when it was reported to the government? because those who said they'd refuse were not doing so in open defiance or as a political statement. meanwhile, in the past, many of those so-called "lefties" who have quietly refused to perform duty in the territories because of moral and ethical objections, HAVE been given sentences comparable to these guys.

Israeli males face compulsory military duty. However, Israel is selective in defining who it is compulsory for. There is one group Haradi (I do not know if this is the correct name) who can refuse. Israeli Arabs are exempt. I would think that this inequity, and the failure to integrate the Arab minority into Israeli society as equals, is a latent danger to Israel and the IDF as much as any other issue for Israel and maintaining a viable armed service. I am sure that a well armed and well trained Israeli Arab battalion would have no such qualms about removing the settlers. Just as A Jewish IDF battalion has no qualms about restoring Jewish rule in an Arab neighborhood. I do not believe that the integrated American army would be overly stressed in restoring order in a black neighborhood or a white neighborhood. But then again?.. Order must be maintained in any military organization. But when personal allegiances, as Hitler insisted on, or religious zeal as Al Qaeda insists on, replaces the sense of purpose of a military for national defense, governed by a code of ethics, then it can only distort and corrupt military discipline. If Israel had integrated the Arab population in its military it would serve as a moderating influence and also give a balance to it that would serve it well in all aspects of Israeli society and national asperations. Another missed opportunity. Probably never to come along a second time.

B"H The soldiers that refuse the orders to fight against fellow Jews are heroes. It is this Barak that needs to be sent to jail, not the soldier heroes that refuse to carry out the wicked command.

Note the desperation in this talkbackers post.

Look at what happened in gaza? Why reward the PALs with more land closer to israel? Not more land to the PALs until they all prove that they can refrain from terror and terror support. Give fatah a list of the 10 random terrorsts on the wanted list and give them a week to arrested them all. Do it and we'll talk. Dont it and we take more land.

...the IDF vows 'zero tolerance' for soldiers who refuse orders! Do it IDF, or Israel will cease to exist.

A soldiers job is to fight another countries military, if their state is threatened.Most Israeli soldiers have, and always will lay down their lives to protect their beloved mother land. It is not the job of an Israeli soldier to go into battle against thrir own people who are no threat to the mother land. It is dispicable for this Judenraat government to force this moral dilema on these brave soldiers. I to would refuse these orders.These soldiers are not political tools. Morality rules.

Makes me sick that the same strong language was not used when Leftist refused to serve over the green line and when some pilots refused to participate in activity over Gaza. Some people have short memories and why 9 out 10 times, its someone on the Left who gets away with hell.

I am not for or against settlement destruction. But to use the IDF in such a manner when so many pro settlement soldiers are enlisted in the Army is wrong. The IDF should protect the Jewish people from outside or internal enemies of it's citizens. It is a political maneuver to use the army against settlers legal or illegal. The police should be used and done in a respectful considerate manner if it has to be done. The IDF is wrong and is being manipulated.

The answer is 2nd Lebanon war which hezballah change the balance of power in the region; this would result to be more save for IDF not to go again to war and stay home besides their moms.

All of them are combat soldiers- religious and secular alike. Every last one. And the Bnei Akiva 12th graders who also vowed not to expel Jews? Almost all of them are going to be bound for combat roles in elite units. Your doubting just shows that you don't know who and what the combat soldiers are.

You are in the army not in a philosophy symposium. Polical considerations don't justify refusing orders, this undermine discipline. The IDF is not a debate society. If you dont like goverment decisions, use your vote in elections. We have not anexed the West Bank so speaking about "the land" is irrelevant. Same about "the people". There are different opinions in our people. You dont have the monopoly ot knowledge.

I question whether No. 2 is really a combat soldier. Remember the New Yorker cartoon awhile back: A dog is an a computer and says, "On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog."

There is a very old method of dealing with troops who refuse orders, they are simply shot! In order to maintain military discipline, an example must be made. In a combat situation, the chain of command must be maintained or the military will collapse. Soldiers are not shoppers in a supermarket, they cannot chose whatever they would like. A refusal to obey a direct order in any army is mutiny, and the solution is always the same!

We are willing to lay down our lives to protect Israel's people and land. It is against our moral and ethical code to rip apart our nation and land. It's also against the IDF's code.

Zero tolerance for settlers who ravage other peoples land and destroy their livelihood would be a good policy also.