I envy the people who hate Israel

Sweet water and bitter water do not come from the same spring. It is either one or the other. A good friend of mine said something profound. Black Panthers and the KKK are very similar. They both hate each other. If left alone and they do not live together, they tend to leave everyone else alone. Place them near to each other and they do not mix. There will be violence. How can there be peace when two sides who have absolutely different hopes and dreams live in close proximity? Judaism and Islam will not mix if the faith of both is fundamental and committed. Let there be no doubt that the tendencies of both are going fundamental and committed. The well intentioned Obama administration cannot fix the problems in the middle east. This simple fact seems to elude them. I have no solution other than to ask and have everyone pray for the Peace of Jerusalem. Only the creator of us all can find a way through this mess. God help us all!

I am sitting here with my mouth wide open!! Is the the same Haaretz whose journalists I used to have furious arguments with a few years ago, by email? What an improvement, free speech definitely rules and that is GOOD. The other day talking about another article in Haaretz I said that I had never read a better article in the Israeli press, well this one is streets ahead, does this writer know how to aim his hammer, and he never misses. I am not Jewish and I don't particularly like Jews. I'm not anti semitic, it's like some people don't like the French. I've worked for many Jews and I've lived in a strong Jewish area of London. I would never want to harm someone because he's Jewish. This article is GOOD because it's making me think that maybe I'm wrong about Jews. I've only just started to look at Haaretz again after a break of a few years. I'm enjoying it. Thank you very much.

I hate to inform you, that Israel will never be destroyed, replaced, read the bible and it tells you that it will never be destroyed.All nations that come against her will be thoe.and you can take that to the banl.

Dear Bradley, I respect and salute you for for honest and eye opening articles. I have always admired the people of Israel for their ability to live in the midst of such adversity and still survive. However, recent behavior by such radical right wing Jews and their blind supporters throughout the world who think that Israel can do no wrong has drastically changed my opinion. I respect the left wing Jews who realize that it is morally reprehensible the way the settlers abuse and demand that homes are taken from Palestinians for their selfish ends. When will the jews here return to the morally right path that made you God's chosen race. I wait with bated breath. You are an honest and upright person who belongs to the human race and not one blinded by religion and race. Damien Lee

Get sober man ...the booze is a talkin trash. What is tragic is the useless, mindless, tripe of you & your ilk polluting the internet with your bottle breast fed anti semetism.

'A whole society and culture has been raised to cheer the deaths of innocent civilians and to specifically target them so as to strike fear into the hearts of infidels'" Oh B, to the World this sounds like Israel!! Take the beam outa your own eye. Americans are becoming more aware EVERY DAY! We are your only friend Israel. Times are changing. The rightwing nuts over there don't want peace, they are playing games. We are done with games. We are "re-evaluating our relationship" again. It does not look to be in ou countries best interest to support a "friend" who wants endless war and territories which do not belong to them[oh yeah, I forgot, G#d GAVE it to you!] Wake up warmongering Israeli gov'nmnt, the people will replace you. They're not ALL successfully brainwashed!

The Israelis (read 'Jews'), have been there, in the 'neighbourhood', forever, Michael. Read up on history and the Bible!

I?d like to remind Bradley Burston that his father didn?t have the merit of leaving a considerably more comfortable situation simply because?it was the right thing to do.

When will the Muslims GROW UP and a) stop throwing weapons at Israel, b) stop trying to arrest the government officials of a SOVEREIGN NATION for trying to stabilize the territory of that SOVEREIGN NATION, and c) stop stereotyping all Jews as Israelis? Enough is enough. Why doesn't Israel join the space race or show its WMDs to show the Muslims it means business? Is Israel so afraid of the anti-Semitic West and anti-Semitic Arab world?

There is no need for Bradley Burston to "envy the people who hate Israel." He can proudly say he is now one of them.

I envy the narrow myopia of Mr. Burston. Not only does it allow him to fashionably attack Israel but his "concern" makes him look appear as if he actually cares about the Jewish State. Bravo Mr. Burston your concern is sooo touching... frankly you are the one who doesn't understand what possessed your own father to flee the Soviet Union! Did it ever occur to you, Mr. Burton, that it might have been the culmination of a long dream, a dream for whose realization we lived, prayed, cried and died?!?!? Could it have been because unlike yours, his heart was touched by the words: Od lo avdah tikvatenu Hatikvah bat shnot alpayim: L'hiyot am chofshi b'artzenu - Eretz Tzion v'Yerushalayim. Could it be, Mr. Burston, that a real Jew lived in your father's heart, a Jew who was fed up with 2000 of living under foreign masters, in a land not his own?!?!? Did he not long to live freely, as a proud Jew, in the land of his ancestors, in the land of his patrimony?!?!?

I cann't say that I enjoyed your article even if I agreed with some of the things you wrote. How can you be sure that we did this, isn't lt possible that some smart muslim who wanted to get rid of this chap and at the same time implicate Israel did this? As to 28 people involved in this doesn't seem possible really stupid. I certainly agree that Lieberman and Ayalon shouldn;t be in the government and certainly not in the Foreign Office, but don't they say that people get the government they deserve?

The is nothing Israel can do to achieve international approval. It is a rigged game.

You write as if it were proven fact that Mossad did the Dubai hit. Maybe yes, maybe no. But to treat it as fact and use it against Israel is shameful.

I used to love the Jewish State of Israel. So why do I now loathe it? 1. Israel takes great pride and glee in using the US military to do their dirty work. Cowardly and dishonest. 2. They accept giant welfare checks and don't care that the US is suffering. Their AIPAC politicians will bleed my country dry. 3. So many lies on top of lies. No concern or respect for other human beings. 4. Apartheid and hypocrisy. When you support what's being done to the Palestinians, you have no right to complain about, or use, the holocaust. I'm disgusted that your country will bulldoze a poor person's home on their land and hand it over to me, simply because I'm a Jew. I'll earn my property, not steal it, thank you. Ignore the article at your own peril.

or the countries they live in. Even the most patriotic citizen of any nation in the world has to admit that there is a lot wrong with his or her country, no matter to which religion or political direction you belong. Every person on earth has to face that. It's part of being alive. But only love for the people and things/issues that mean a lot to you and understanding for the people and things that you despise can help you. When you want to defeat a person or a concept you have to find out the motivation behind him her or it or you victory won't last long. Gnothi seauton.

A great article. Israel's foreign policies and complete disregard for international law are one of the great human tragedies of history over the last 75 years. Articles like this serve to remind the world that the Jewish people have also provided humanity with some of its greatest thinkers, keystones in so much that is good about how far humanity has come. Unfortunately Israel's perceived values also serve to remind us of how humanity continues to take two steps and then three steps back.

# 483 Maureen Ann. In the second part of your post you wrote,"Hold that sand delecately in yor hands".....etc.etc. In the same vein. There's a saying: if you're flirting with a girl & you want her to remain with you,keep the palm of your hand open,because if you tighten your grip on the palm,she'll escape between your fingers ! I notice from your post that you are well read,& your curiosity takes you far & wide to different cultures,beliefs & religions.See that it doesn't overwhelm you. But the most important of all is what we are endowed with; our brains,where we can contemplate,& delve into the mysteries of the world & try to fathom its vastness,& intricacies of life. All in that nut of ours. By the way is your B.P.M. still a steady 56 ? Surely you excercise !

Bradley, you must realize that there is no such thing as a perfect society. Israel does stand out in ideas and actions that other countries never accomplished. 1. Just recently they had the largest group going to Haiti to search and help those suffering from that countries tragic earthquake. 2. They treat people from other countries with great medical care. And you never hear about this. 3. Look at the advancements in technology, water, energy, automotive, bi-fuel, etc, etc. 4. I mentioned fighting against terrorists. Getting rid of them and doing it quietly. 5. Allowing religious freedom for everyone. 6. The only democratic government in the region. It may not be perfect, but better than any other country around there. 7. Freedom between the sexes. 8. The most honest society when you think that doing the latest war the public gave food, medicine, electrical power, etc to the public in Gaza. Unheard of by other countries.

You and your ilk, blame ONLY Israel for the failure of negotiations. So the onus is on you to define EXACTLY what you expect Israel to do ... "To always remember that Mahmoud Abbas is no quisling nor collaborator"(Zeev) How exactly is Israel treating Mahmoud Abbas as a quisling and a collaborator? "To keep in mind that any agreement with him has to be accepted by a great majority of his people as a reasonable solution to their problems"(Zeev) What exactly does that mean? And what if there is a conflict between what "the great majority of his people" [Abass's] accept and what the great majority of Israeli people are willing to accept? "To negotiate with their representatives in all fairness. And to relate to them not as emissaries of a defeated people, but as equals, with their own national considerations"(Zeev) Again, What does that mean? If anything, it appears to me that the Palestinian Political leaders are the ones who seem to treat Israel as a defeated people because they [the Palestinian political leaders] are the ones who issue ultimatums to Israel (restarting the Intifada ...) and they are the ones who set pre-conditions for even negotiating with Israel ...

Is it just me or shouldn't we all be saying BRAVO that there is one less Hamas terrorist in the world?!?! I say BRAVO if the Mossad did it. My only ? is why it took them so long and why only one at a time?!?!

I was once a Pauline Christian, before I learned of the Dead Sea Scrolls, The Torah and The Qur'an, Zoroster, Buddha, The Great Spirit of the American native belief, Australian Aboriginal Dreaming... we are all part of the Greater - like "teardrops in the ocean." You are so fortunate, Teacher/Instruct. You can see the sand of some of our ancient threads of belief. Hold that sand delicately in your hands, without squeezing your fists aggressively, fearful of losing, or else sand will escape between your fingers. Try it sometime, and see how you will retain more when your hands are cupped, protecting the sand with a care and share attitude. : )

Sent you a response a few minutes ago. We wait and see. Meantime I say this:You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye. Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' and behold, the log is in your own eye.

We have always been chided by Our Lord G*D of the Universe.But HE has chosen us and proof is throughout our vicissitudes we are here and you are in LIMBO with your false faith. Islam was plagiarized from OUR HOLY BIBLE. Were it not for your prophet of DOOM who exactly pointed the inflamatory LIES you would not dare say what you wrote. Are you teaching us JEWS what our prophets (GENUINE ONES I MAY ADD)who did chastise us? We need not lessons frrm your likes. Look into the mirror and see is what I suggest. Unlike your make believe trashy ones written in the quran. If you think you are MORAL,then it behooves you to stop CHOPPING HANDS/FEET which Israel with all its faults does not descend to your HOLIER THAN THOU attitude.

Better go to the other forum before showering your praises. I was not fooled,because I never read her posts.Boringly expected.Perhaps you found one whereby she was projecting mildness? Well in the one I just read on fake passports her attitude gives me the impression a bit milder WITH A TWIST.

I mean by your admision: I can`t do nothing about it Nor can you. Incidently I am glad you are here.I browsed through the Shlomo Gazit and to my consternation NOT! what do I find?Once he retired he went like many of his ilk writing derogatorily about Israel.No surprise there. But who elese was on the same subject PAGE? Finkestein,Noam Chomsky,Goldstone,plus no surprise Jimmy Carter the anti-semitic doofus we have known for eons. That is why I pay no credence to the ones you present here for us to swallow their modus vivendi/operandi. Next time you proffer further websites I will stay clear of them knowing their untruth and twisted logic.

People can criticize their nation becuase they want better but still live there. I don't like a lot of things going on in America but I'm not going to just move to Canada.

Well said bradley..who else has the guts to stop this government destroying Israel ?

"What do you want Israel to do?" ( Tim R) 2nd try. To always remember that Mahmoud Abbas is no quisling nor collaborator. To keep in mind that any agreement with him has to be accepted by a great majority of his people as a reasonable solution to their problems. To negotiate with their representatives in all fairness. And to relate to them not as emissaries of a defeated people, but as equals, with their own national considerations.

# 472 nihad From riyadh. The Curse of Allah is certainly upon the Moslems & especially on the Arabs. This lasting Curse on them is because everytime they slaughter people they shout, Allah Akbar ! and for that reason alone Arabs kill more Arabs than they kill others.Ditto with Moslems. Another Curse that Allah has brought upon them.He has made them blind so they won't see or understand that they themselves cause most of the destruction on their own people. Assassin = Arabic origin. Allah = Hebrew Eloah.They even robbed their god's name from Hebrew !

You cannot see another community in the history other than Jewish whom God punished continuously.Because they were always against God. they have slaughtered Prophets from god.They did not obey Gods messengers sent to them. But they neglected.This punishment will continue as long as they cherish their Apartheid mentality against others in the world.until they realize the blood of others are also valuable similar to them. in the point of morality Israel do not deserve existence.

Let's face it. We as Jews have been abused for a long time. We are in an abusive relationship with the world. A syndrome has been created, which is not new, and that syndrome is where the abused blames themselves for the abuse. "Oh, I burnt the toast, I deserved to be hit." The author and other Jews who share his belief need to see their malady. Yes, Israel and Jews will make mistakes like any other country or people But they should be judged by the same standards as any other country or people and they should not judge themselves any harsher.

I don't feel sorry for Israel. In fact I feel glad for whomever it was that knocked off a terrorist that sell weapons for the destruction of Israel.If Israel did the job, good work. The proof of what country did the job has not come out yet. Why condem those that did the job? Did you forget those that killed the olympians in Germany? The Mosaad got rid of all of them. I don't see other countries getting rid of those that want to bring on distruction around the world. It is about time the terrorists think twice about what will happen to them.

I agree with him? yes! For instance,and I mean it truefully: I envy my mother's lovely voice She sings la traviata and carmen too I envy my cat for being so independent I envy my sister for being so beautiful I envy my brother for his brilliance in: His knowledge on NUCLEAR PSYSICS I envy Bradly Burston for just being himself. That makes me a troublesome envier I hate. There for,I must try not to ENVY anyone,or anything. For it is self destroying and UGLY.

Funny,funny talk about the Special Olympics. Israel is the best country in the ME because it is democratic for starters,otherwise why is it every other country surrounding it are dictators,islamofascists who chop off hands/feet to punish their own people according to SHARIA/FATWAH. There are many Arabs living in Israel who would not countenance living in any of their bretheren's state(even should they allow them,which they don't).Therefore,Israel must be a jolly good country after all hmmmm.

I repeat my question: "... what do you want Israel to do? Do you want Israel to give in to ALL the demands of the political leaders of the Palestinian people ....?"(Tim R) Stop being elusive, my question was NOT that hard. Or have you got something to hide? Is that why you are dancing around my question?

"Yes, this world is wicked, I agree"(Zeev) ...That's it Zeev? You don't have the same sympathy towards the Jews of East Jerusalem who were starved out and ethnically cleansed from the city, by the Arabs, as the sympathy that you exhibit towards your poor Palestinians? "And the Israeli annexation of East-Jlem was illegal and violates the International Law"(Zeev) That would have been true if the law would have been upheld to protect the Jews of East Jerusalem. But since it was NOT, someone else had to protect and uphold their rights and Israel was a better candidate to do it than anyone else (especially since NO one else was interested in doing so ...) As for your so called "International Law" since it was/is being only selectively enforced, I have as much respect for it as for the Nurenberg laws, NONE! "I can`t do nothing about it. Nor can you"(Zeev) The best way to answer this is with a quote from one of our ancient sages, Hillel. You have heard of him haven't you Zeev ....? This is what he said: "If I am not for myself, who is for me" There is a lot in that statement Zeev. Think about it and if you still don't understand my drift, then ask me. I will tell you how it applies in relation to discussions such as the one that we are conducting about the woes of the Middle East ....

"What do you want Israel to do?" (Tim R) "Our decision makers must be constantly reminded that Abu Mazen is no quisling nor collaborator. [Peace] would require no less than a comprehensive agreement with Israel, acceptable to the great majority of Palestinian public opinion as a significant achievement and a reasonable solution to their problem. Nothing less than that would be, in Palestinian eyes, a sufficient justification for the Palestinian armed forces waging an all-out campaign against intransigent factions. Such an agreement can result only from fair negotiations, and can only be achieved between two sovereign parties, Israeli and Palestinian." Major General (ret.) Shlomo Gazit, first Chief Coordinator of Israeli operations in the territories (1967- 1974), and former head of Military Intelligence (1974-1979). Served two terms as President of Ben Gurion University in Beersheva. In the mass circulation daily Maariv, April 4, 2005. Look for "Israel's contribution to maintaining the calm", in www.jewsforajustpeace.com/

Maureen Ann. In your post # 77 & others. There seems to be a transformation from the style & your relentless negative attitude towards everything Israel. It's as if another person has written these recent posts. But whatever,they make interesting reading. Another transformation: Saul. When he was on his way Tartus,had a fit & imagined he saw a light & a voice telling him about the new religion,(that was born out of the (Jewish/Hebrew religion) He changed his name to Paul & was one of the founders of spreading the new religion together with Peter in Rome,& from there it spread.................

Yes, this world is wicked, I agree. And the Israeli annexation of East-Jlem was illegal and violates the International Law. I can't do nothing about it. Nor can you.

... what do you want Israel to do? Do you want Israel to give in to ALL the demands of the political leaders of the Palestinian people ....? "If peace can`t be negotiated with the political leaders of the Palestinian people, then forming a state will be next to impossible." (Eli W) "I agree completely"(Zeev to Eli W)

It seems that the "Palestinian state" is receiving tentative "paper status" in Europe. The next step is for Israel to start ceding land. The Palestinians have access to up to 100% of "Israeli" land for their state. They cannot receive less than they want. Let negotiations begin...

He takes the bad and leaves the good. According to you in the USA, Canada (particularly holier than thou), the UK (renowned for their whining and winging abilities) and others Israel is guilty of every disaster that has happened on this planet from the Great Flood to the Haiti earthquake. You have accused, tried and convicted Israel for this "assassination" without any proof and only on the word of the Dubai Police. You might remember that Dubai is a country technically at war with Israel and certainly assists the Muslims and Arabs of this world in their endeavors to destroy Israel and continue with Hitlers plans for the "Final solution of the Jewish problem"! You should remember who killed your people on 9/11, killed your people in Madrid, London, Bali, Kenya and Tanzania and who is killing the British and US troops in Iraq and Afghanistan! Time for you to remember that we here in Israel are constantly under attack and have been in this situation for decades and before the so-called "Occupation". So, whatever happened in Dubai will always be our fault and you know what, we couldn`t care a damn. Another terrorist boss is dead and those who did it should get medals from your countries!

NO,EYES TIGHT SHUT IS MORE TO THE POINT IN YOUR JUMBBLED RESPONSE. B HAS ALREADY TRIED AND PUT YOU RIGHT IN YOUR MIXED UP PRESENTATIONS WHICH ARE TOTAL BULL. YOU MADE NO SENSE WHATEVER,IT WAS A LAUGHABLE EXERCISE.

Jason in #454 said, "Israel is by far best country middle East" The trouble is, being the best country in the middle east is a whole lot like winning the Special Olympics. You don't want to be in the Special Olympics in the first place.

where in power are the Isreali's who truly want peace and a two state solution with the Palestinians? whilst Isreali Political parties differ when it comes to Isreli polices, why do they all seem to share to same view of dealing with Palestinians? The marches in Tel-Aviv against the invasion of Gaza proves Isreli's are not being properly pertrayed by Government,press or outside world.

"If peace can't be negotiated with the political leaders of the Palestinian people, then forming a state will be next to impossible." (Eli W) I agree completely. "Our decision makers must be constantly reminded that Abu Mazen is no quisling nor collaborator. [Peace] would require no less than a comprehensive agreement with Israel, acceptable to the great majority of Palestinian public opinion as a significant achievement and a reasonable solution to their problem. Such an agreement can result only from fair negotiations, and can only be achieved between two sovereign parties, Israeli and Palestinian." Major General (ret.) Shlomo Gazit, first Chief Coordinator of Israeli operations in the territories (1967-1974), and former head of Military Intelligence (1974-1979). Served two terms as President of Ben Gurion University in Beersheva. In the mass circulation daily Maariv, April 4, 2005. Look for "Israel's contribution to maintaining the calm", in www.jewsforajustpeace.com/

Tahnks to burston for helping me to get into the purim state of mine. I always enjoy a good laugh. Too bad you cant enjoy the fun.i love when the Jewsih people, and thier good christian supposrters are on the winning side. Chag sameach and enjoy your stay in israel

Well it seems like Bradley is a regular Sherlock Holmes. Even though the Dubai police chief without any evidence,direct or circumstancial,is 99% sure this was a Mossad op,Bradley knows for sure.He knows with absolute certainty that Mossad ruined the names & lives of "immigrants" to Israel.Of course poor dear Bradley doesn't have any evidence other than the edited Dubai tapes & the statements of an official of an unfriendly country.Well hell that should be enough for anyone except one who knows what evidence really is & understands the games played internationally.Bradley doesn't need real proof or even hearsay evidence,he's got his own agenda & that's sufficient evidence for him.Sadly Brad,if I can address you so familarly,you have allowed your own "issues" to make you into a tool for Jew haters everywhere & a joke to those who know the truth.Please take a chill pill or just move back to the US where you can live in the land of Obama.

It truly amazes me how some people can just condemn Mr. Burston for saying what many people around the world have been thinking for years. A prime example of this is the condescending post of superjew, in which he/she tells the aforementioned Mr. Burston to go "back into Putin's loving arms where journalists like you are shot in dark alleyways." Comments like that demonstrate the arrogance, ignorance, and condescending attitude of a great many Americans, especially the far right wing. Mr Burston, I apologize for the way you are being condemned by many for your plight. I realize that it is not easy seeing the country you love descend into darkness and despair. I was very afraid of the direction our country was going under W, and still shudder when I think about the so-called "Patriot Act," as well as Bush's "we'll go it alone if we have to" attitude. There are numerous parallels between our two countries, and for the most part, they are not positive.

Israel is by far best country middle East those who hate Israel either human right actives believe worth risk push Israel civil war over some Palestinians right of return.

Weird how people think alike. I just watched it for the first time. The Last Mimzy from New Line Cinema.

"And the entire world deemed these actions, and the annexation of the West Bank by the Jordanian king, contrary to international law"(Zeev) Deemed is correct but it then went and forgot about it, ignored what was done to Jewish citizens of East Jerusalem. - How many UN resolutions were passed to protest the unlawful treatment of East Jerusalem's Jews? Not many, I bet. I would be surprised if even one such UN resolution was passed .... - So Zeev, show me any UN resolution which called on Jordan to restore Jerusalem to the international city status that the UN decided to adopt for it. And which demanded that Jewish residents should be allowed to return to live there in peace or that even Jewish holy sites should be respected and NOT desecrated .... Contrast that to the hundreds of anti Israel resolutions that the UN passed since 1967. Like I told you before Zeev, laws are meant to apply to everyone, without fear or favour, no one should be above the law. Non enforcement of laws, or worse, selective enforcement of laws leads to lawlessness ... Question, Zeev: What would you do if your neighbours would tell you that YOU have no right to live in the neighbourhood and continually physically attack, harm you and your family. What would you then do if your complaints to the police would fall on deaf ears but your action to defend yourself would result in vigorous action against you in the name of "THE Law". I don't know about you Zeev, but most of the rest of us normal human beings would lose respect for such "Laws" and would try to defend ourselves as best as we could by FIGHTING discriminatory "Law" enforcement AND our aggressive neighbours..... Get my drift Zeev? The UN's dereliction of duty when it comes to Arab transgressions of THEIR [UN] laws, led Israel to take the law in it's own hands and to try and defend it's citizens and citizen's rights THEIR own way, since apparently NO one else, least of all the UN is willing to defend them ....

Let me start with the very last bit. The West Bank is not relevant since we are discussing Gaza political autonomy from Israel and defacto autonomy from the West Bank. Now for your stateless people comment... Zeev... what is being negotiated is the creation of a peaceful new modern state called Palestine. If that peace can't be negotiated with the political leaders of the Palestinian people then forming a state will be next to impossible. If you should suggest that Israel and Palestinians should form this confederation nonsense that will only result in formalized police state due to extremist elements on either side continuously turning all the land into another Northern Ireland I could never agree to such a dumb thing (I know that you did not). Arafat did not to reign in the militants under his control because he used them as a political weapon to provoke the response poor Palestinians see what the big bad Isrealis are doing to us after the IDF response to terrorist outrages.

Better we should sit back and let Israel be bombed and rocketed and suicide bombed to death than actually do something? Not that I defend the killing in Dubai if Israel did it, but come on, when are we going to stop confusing response with aggression? Why do we have to apologize for doing what any country would do to survive and be proud of our survival? We have acquiested enough, but not enough for Mr. Burston it seems. Maybe when enough people go along with his way of thinking and Israel is replaced with that bastion of democracy - and Islamic state.

hatred is not the proper word;hatred=irrational.us israeli dislikers are very rational.we see that israel is the home of the haters.yes,you're right about this;the people who will destroy israel will be the israelis.believe this;nobody has anything against a peaceful,just,and prosperous israel.then all the dual citizens will aliyah us alone.

"So, you see Zeev? Jordan did that ... " (Tim R) Yes it did. And the entire world deemed these actions, and the annexation of the West Bank by the Jordanian king, contrary to international law - and never accepted them. Why are people like you expecting the world to view differently the Israeli annexation of East Jlem, is beyond my comprehension. "Jews have been living in East Jerusalem continuously for millennia ... " (Tim R) I already answered that with the Serbia vs. Kosovo case. International Law does not recognise "historical rights". That's not an Arab excuse, that's a fact. Prove me wrong. " ... but now [you say that] their presence there, is somehow illegal." (Tim R) That is a twisted representation of the truth, aimed at denying it. I already answered it too. What is deemed illegal - not by me, but by the entire world, including our only ally - is not "the presence of Jews in East Jerusalem", but Israel building, and defending by force of arms the rights of Israeli property owners, in a territory outside its recognised sovereignty. Like it or not, THAT is the reality, that you obtusely choose to ignore.

"1) The IDF is not in Gaza" (Eli W) I know that. I already told you how I see the 2005 unilateral disengagement. What I don't know is what exactly is your point? "2) Jordan's Palestinian population is quiet precisely because of Black September." (Eli W) Let me re-formulate my question: Why could King Hussein extirpate terrorism from among his people, and Chairman Abbas cannot? I offered you an answer. You didn't challenge it. "As for peace being made by the occupied. Lets see... There's Germany, Japan, Italy, etc, etc, etc ... " (Eli W) You misread me and missed the point: Peace is agreed upon between leaders/rulers of STATES, never between an occupied stateless population and the occupying power. Without looking as far as Germany and Japan, here is Egypt, our immediate neighbour, whose Sinai was occupied too. You surely wouldn't say that it is THE Egyptian people that attacked us in 1948, and that it is with THE Egyptian people that Begin negotiated and signed a peace treaty in 1979. That would be a very innacurate, childish presentation of what really happened. You surely can't disagree with that. Therefore, why are you expecting THE PALESTINIANS to make their peace with Israel? THAT, I cannot understand. "In this discussion, the West Bank is not at issue." (Eli W) Good lord, what makes you think so?? Are you by any chance expecting Ismail Haniyeh to sign a separate peace with Israel and to forget all about the West Bank?

"It would be illegal too for, say Jordan, to defend by force of arms the rights of Jordanian property owners, in a territory outside Jordanian recognized sovereignty, in Syria for instance, or Israel"(Zeev) Jordan, together with Palestinian Arab irregular forces, the Jordanian Arab Legion besieged the old city of Jerusalem (East Jerusalem), in 1948. It starved the Jewish population out and eventually ethnically cleansed East Jerusalem of Jews. It then made sure that NO Israeli Jews could return or claim their properties for 19 years, between 1948 and 1967 ... So, you see Zeev? Jordan did that ... AND to make matters worse, people like you then come along and quote so called international law which supposedly says that Israeli Jews should NOT settle East Jerusalem because East Jerusalem is supposedly an Arab city ... and as proof, you [the supposed advocates of international law] hypocritically put your hands on your hearts and say .... looky, looky, there were no Jews living in East Jerusalem for 19 years, only Arabs. But you, collectively forget that Jerusalem as a whole had a majority Jewish population for at least 150 years prior to 1948 and that Jews lived in East Jerusalem continuously for millennia but now their presence there is somehow illegal?... You know what I call that type of reasoning, Zeev? I call it aiding and abetting illegitimate claims by Arabs to keep Israeli Jews out of East Jerusalem, NOT international law. PS I know exactly what your response will be. You will go off on a tangent and start obfuscating about irrelevancies ?

sensitive cord, I have never seen that much heated responses. Keep the good work.

Therefore Eli,the only nearest one I saw,was your reply to Zeev and no paranthesis. A pity,because I would have liked to read and get what I would have beng my own impression. Funny business today seeing quite a few deleted by the moderators?But they must have used the auto-pilot doing it willy,nilly. I managed to read mine,altough it ws supposed to be deleted. Cais la--vie

Zeev, you're brain is so full of cluter you simply even refuse to read what you write. 1) The IDF is not in Gaza 2) Jordan's Palestinian population is quiet precisely because of Black September. And in this discussion, the West Bank is not at issue. As for peace being made by the occupied. Lets see... There's Germany, Japan, Italyetc, etc, etc..... To paraphrase Starship Troopers... A shocking but unfortunate general truth of the world... There has been no resolution to any political conflict that has not been resolved through the force of arms or the threat of the force of arms. There are exceptions of course, but they happen to be the exception not the rule.

"UN Security Council Res. 478 pertains to annexation, not protecting the rights of property owners." That is surely the only sensible thing I ever read coming from you. "You mean, these people have no rights simply because Jordan kicked them off the land for 19 years?" No, this is not what I meant. I didn't say that these people have no rights, neither did I say they have. Try to understand what you read. Here is what I did say, "It is illegal for Israel to defend by force of arms the rights of the Jewish property owners in a territory outside its recognized sovereignty." (#336) It would be illegal too for, say Jordan, to defend by force of arms the rights of Jordanian property owners, in a territory outside Jordanian recognized sovereignty, in Syria for instance, or Israel. That will probably be too obscure for your limited mental capacity to grasp, but then ask a grownup instead of making a fool of yourself.

This column is just more rubbish from a self-hating Jewish leftist. Burston, if you are so unhappy living in Israel and find fault with everything Israel does, why not just leave the country? BTW, the Mossad has been conducting operations like the Mabhouh assassination for decades; this is nothing new. Israel is acting to defend her interests as she has in the past. Nothing at all new about that. Tell me why the Jewish people are plagued with self-haters like you, Gideon Levy, Amira Hass, Norman Finkelstein, etc. And please leave Israel since you acknowledge your hatred of the country. You don't belong there!

"The Kingdom of Jordan has a population that is 70 percent Palestinian", said once Moshe Arens -- not exactly your usual spineless defeatist leftist -- in "Eyes wide shut", Haaretz, 05/05/2009. Now, please tell me: How come king Abdallah's Palestinians are sitting so quiet, so peacefully, while "ours" have been proven so inefficient in tackling their extremist factions? Here is the answer I am putting to you: Mahmoud Abbas is no quisling, nor is he ruling an independent country. As long as his people is stateless and occupied by a foreign army and foreign settlements are sowed all over his land, no national leader can effectively tackle his extremist factions. See under Black September, Sep 1970 - July 1971.

"If there was an occupation in Gaza, Hamas would not have been able to take over the territory", you said. Here is what former Chief of Staff Shaul Mofaz said, as Sharon's Minister of Defense, while talking with a Newsweek journalist, on the occupation and Gaza, "Having thousands of Jewish settlers among millions of Palestinians is a mistake, and we will not stay in Gaza forever." In "It Was Unintentional", May 2004. www.newsweek.com/id/105454/page/2 Now tell me, can you reconciliate this opinion with yours, or are you trying to make Shaul Mofaz sounding like a far-leftist supporter of Hamas? "End the terror, then make peace. That is how it has always been done, there is no other way", you said. Big mistake. No occupied population has ever made its peace with the occupier. The time is long past when an Army clashing, not with another Army, but with a foreign and stateless people, could bring a definitive military solution. Trying to eradicate terrorism from among a stateless occupied population has been proven since long, akin to chasing a mirage. This is not what will bring peace to Israel.

There are a great many reasons why the term Islmofascism was coined to refer to groups and countries like Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Al Qaida, Ira, etc. Please.... Israel is a beautiful country if for no other reason than if we were living under the Islmofascits, we would not have the opportunity to debate this and other important issues that right or wrong critcize the ruling government.

Please read my post 423 again. And read it without coloring it with your knee jerk reaction. Read it all the questions you asked were answered there. And if you would continue to read it you will also see an aside written in parenthesis.

Our founding fathers were said to want to show a 'decent respect for the opinion of mankind.' Tolstoy's peasant in 'War and Peace' would find suitable occasions for that aphorism, but Israel here might find that peasant endorsing 'we will not be manipulated, we will defend ourselves.' Israel has to get itself ready and telling others it is is also appropriate.

All so disturbingly true.

And you better believe it.No need to wait until the end of his tenure to deduce this FACT.

Reading your post Sunday (Australia time) I Googled, Bill Ma ha lo Handicapped Children's Foundation. The first on the Google list to appear on my screen was: "Holocaust Survivors of World War11..." - Persia The Land Of First Human Rights Charter" http://persia1.wordpress.com/2009/01/19/holocaust-survivors-from-wold-war-ii-make-hol I have tried several times to Google the name Bill Ma ha lo Handicapped Children's Foundation to see if the same site appeared at the top of the Google page as it did on Sunday. It won't work. I can't tell if your post was for real or if you were only jesting. However, one thing is for sure, I felt as another poster who answered your, "I picked the brains of a San Diego Muslim" post. To the left of the site that I found, thanks to your post, there is an image depicting Cyrus the Great - 'Cyrus Charter of Human Rights.' Human Rights. That was the message of your dream, vision... Thank you for a most intriguing and insightful post Yosemite.

And profiteers who cram these down peoples throat as "truth". Israel, it could be beautiful state. Only if...

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"The practical reality is that for quite sometime a Jewish presence in the West Bank will remain a source of friction whereby any harm coming to a Jew would threaten an incursion by the IDF leading to????" It was the friction of Jews having sovereignty and rights among the Palestinians which led to the conflict in the first place. Jews practicing their religion openly in Jerusalem led to bloody riots. That Jewish property owners have their rights in E. Jerusalem and the West Bank shouldn't come into question. The question becomes one of compromise. Certainly, withdrawing settlements and keeping the larger blocks is what is discussed. I don't understand why so many anti-Israelis, even after being informed that there has been a Jewish presence on that land for over 3000 years... That they were only absent for 19 years... Their viewpoint that the territories are, somehow, exclusively Arab is never affected. I see a solution along the Clinton parameters of 2000 being the eventuality.

Being as is the custom who write here from: Belgium is hardly even handed as far as Israel is concerned.You always are very critical without looking into your backyard being flooded by Islamists. The other ones that are think/like yours i.e From Eurabia are the desruptors and CRITICS of Israel we discard as some trash. We have also the others Israel's criticizers in the majority happen to come from Australia. With exception of the good Jews who live there. Therefore,no surprise you thanking Bradley. Although I do not demonize him as such,but one has to put the entire truth without delving in unwarranted criticism. Bradley's article is somewhat a controversial one.And he knows it well.If you read the AUTHOR'S NOTE: You will gather he in reality is defending not only himself as Jew living in Israel,but also to all Israelis who's home it is and will NOT GO AWAY. Hope you read this (Haaretz permitting)

Thanks for the article. I'm always glad to read when someone in Israel is still able to think like a human being, not like a war monger. It's difficult to see this from outside of Israel. And I have to admit it's very difficult not to hate Israelis as a whole and eventually extend that hate to Jews in general in the light of all which is happening under Israel's direction. I wish there were more people thinking like you. For now Israel is one terrible hotbed of conflict which, one day, might swallow the world.

Where land has been legally purchased is one thing. However, where land has been seized is a completely different issue. It would be hard to find any Jew in the territories that would call themselves citizens of a future Palestinian state regardless of the invitation of the PA to Jews living in Judiah and Samaria to become fully protected Palestinian citizens (and for the sake of arguement I will take the PA invitation as being sincere). The practical reality is that for quite sometime a Jewish presence in the West Bank will remain a source of friction whereby any harm coming to a Jew would threaten an incursion by the IDF leading to???? Regarding a trully just settlement anybody could live anywhere they wanted to. But under the current reality this is just an anarchists dream which could only lead to more conflict. We need to seperate from each other. Find the better parts of ourselves again as we learn to live together as national neighbors. Perhaps over time friends and allies.

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I disagree with the very first line and the very last. Suffice it to say if there was an occupation in Gaza, Hamas would not have been able to take over the territory. What can we learn from it... Until we and the world are fully determined to rid the world of the scourge of terrorism a blight that effects everyone there will be no end to the conflict regardless of the "occupation." Please do not forget that Hamas considers all of this territory occupied. And the suffering continues unabated fueling continued revenge. End the terrorists, end terror, end the conflict, make peace. That's how its always been done. There is, unfortunately, no other way.

The news flash pertains of the NATO killing accidently many CIVILIANS in Afghanistan. This is an example to show how they castigate Israel when they have to deal in such confined territory as Gaza where civilians are killed. Particularely when those civilians are exposed purposefully to gain pity from the world. Thus accuse Israel but omit mention the atrocities committed by the USA. One law for the rest of the world fighting terrorists,another for Israel who is supposed to be sitting DUCKS and no retaliation? I give up

It is the last thing Israel would do. As for your assumption Israel is small so it must show supreme strength to her enemies and indeed the rest of the WORLD need to be in regard of this this. Wrong there sorrry.Israel does not act in the manner you assume just to prove its strength. We have to fight to survive and the last think on our minds is THE SHOWING OFF our strength. Britain once ruled the waves and is now in a very sad state of decline. Well all big powers have a limited time span. And Britain now is definitely on the decline. I bet the time will come when the US too will diminish in its NUMBER ONE STATUS.Tho'I hope not. Good reminder and post much appriciated.

The true question is: "Does Israeli want to be part of the Middle East, moreover, the World or not?" Sacrifices have to be made, but with great sacrifices come great benefits. Israel neighbors incredibly oil rich states, which in the absence of a Palestinian Israeli clash, would be willing to work very closely with Israel. The reality of the matter is that Israel must take risks, accept the idea of sacrificing some its ideologies, whether religious and/or political and look for the long term future to achieve a more sustainable, friendly relationship with its neighbors and the world. Israel is part of the Middle East and the world, and everyone else is going nowhere so it's about time to accept that and move on.

You seem to be an honest man. Just ill-informed. I suggest you read "Fatah?Hamas conflict", in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah%E2%80%93Hamas_conflict And "How Hamas took over the Gaza Strip" too. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6748621.stm Supposing, for the sake of argument, that everything you just said is correct, then what? What can we learn from it, from the fact that Hamas, whose name, up to the first Intifada, no one had heard, is now in total control of Gaza -- on how to end the conflict? Ps: Is there something, in my #362, that you disagree with?

Israel is small so it must show supreme strength to her enemies and indeed the rest of the WORLD need to be in regard of this this. Britain once ruled the waves and is now in a very sad state of decline. The over intellectualization of every event has led to British terrorists able to defend themselves with Legal aid while their victims are unable to get legal aid. Margret Thatcher was held accountable for a shoot to kill policy against the IRA, one which very much mirrors the position of Israel today. Israel is in a very different position to the UK. Its strength is its survival and must never be compromised. Write all the articles you like but you can only do so because there are those brave enough to do the difficult, dangerous and dirty work. If Britain had more guts maybe the second world war may never have happened. Appeasement and compromise dont work when countries are calling for Israel's destruction. Unfortunately Strength = Respect.

"This is one of the few times that I will have to partially defend Zeev. However, it isn`t the protection of life that is at issue. The issue is that under international law (specifically, the Geneva Conventions) it was and is illegal for Israel to confiscate land for whatever purpose in territories that is considered "occupied"" Apoloies from here on out, the letter between "f" and "h" just failed on my keyboard. Perhaps, we're talkin about two different things. I'm not asserting that annexation is legal. I'm saying occupyin and protectin the rihts of members of an ethnic roup, in a non-soverein territory, cleaved off in a civil war, where no resolution has ever resulted reardin borders, affords the riht to see to the interests of one of the parties. That includes protection of property rihts, and the riht to develop as a society, just as members of the other party have. They can build too, can't they, in PA administered territories? Who sees to "Palestinian Jews' " rihts?

This is one of the few times that I will have to partially defend Zeev. However, it isn't the protection of life that is at issue. The issue is that under international law (specifically, the Geneva Conventions) it was and is illegal for Israel to confiscate land for whatever purpose in territories that is considered "occupied" that is not recognized as modern day Israel by the relevant international agencies.

Excuse me, Zeev... Within Gaza, there is no Israeli military or political presence what so ever. Do the Palestinians make their own laws. Of course they do? Do they "police" themselves? Of course they do. Do they decide what to do with what resources they have? Of course they do? Are countries allowed to control the flow of resources and people through their borders? Of course they do. Is there a border fence? Of course there is. Are there military patrols along the fence of course there are? How the Palestinians in Gaza gained the freedom to govern themselves without interference is irrelevant. They now have that freedom. What they do with it is their choice. The consquences of those choices are for lack of a more sugar coated way of saying it cause and effect. Do the Palestinians under Hamas squander resources on Kasams, Katushas, RPGs, Suicide Bombers, Cross Border kidnappers, etc? Of course they do. Does then Isreal have the right to seal off that border? Of course they do.

Do you honestly think MI6 or CIA or KGB or the Chinese intelligence or Pakistani ISIor Saudi GID are anymore moralistic when it comes to killing their enemies. The US uses drones to target Taliban leaders, often times vaporizing civilian caravans. Get off your high horses. All this hoopla is BS for public show. All the intelligence services are aware of who the real enemies are...the Islami Jihad monsters that hatched in Afghanistan between 1986 and 1996 with the incubation provided by the ISI, the GID (Saudi intelligence services) and the CIA.

Growing in south of lebanon and experiencing the atrocities of the israeli soldiers commited against my people made always wonder if all israelis condone such actions or just maybe 75% or just 20% . but 20 years later and 20 years after reading israeli newspapers and the responses i have come to a conclusion that most of you are either brainwashed by deceived by your own government . it does to you what it has being doing to the rest of the world for many years. most of you misunderstood the core of this article , some of you labeled the writer an antisemite the others called him selfhater jew and all what this honorable man is trying to do is save his country from an imminent destruction if it continues behaving the the same way. so as a proud lebanese southerner that always loved peace for all of God's people on earth I tell you all that I envy a man like this one because he really loves his country unlike most of you who will be blinded until the destruction of the GREATER SO CALL

Stick to your line Mossad. Neither deny or admit. Silence is golden. And it also infuriates the 'others'. I love it. Old Yiddish saying; "So call me pisher".

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Another confused soul stranded on the left field.

It is out of ignorance that you assign ownership of our land to others. Had you read Josephus' account of The Jewish War against the Romans your might understand to whom this land belongs. It belongs to the tenacious. Like our ancestors that faced Roman might, modern Zionist pioneers are not about to abandon our claim to the Land of Israel. In 100 years, the Arab populations of Hebron and Shechem will be dwarfed by Jewish cities, much like Yafo is but a suburb of Tel Aviv built 100 years ago on adjacent sand dunes. Former Ambassador Yoram Ettinger recently published the results of a detailed population analysis exposing a 66% distortion in the Arab population concluding: "Inflated numbers have provided the Palestinians with inflated international foreign aid and inflated water supply by Israel." Doomsday demographers that predict the end of Israel, if we do not immediately withdraw from Judea and Samaria simply can't handle the truth.

Just leave the country and spare us this cheap leftist disappointment. There is nothing left of these Oslo promises so give it up and stop blaming Israel and it's government for your failures. 2000 years and your still singing the same old antisemitic songs. A pitty. And so STUPID.

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Bradley, Just what in God's name is wrong with you? You can't even attack Israel's enemies without lamenting for yourself thatIsrael is not the Utopia you stupidl thought it was. Istrael is is made uip of human's human's with flaws and foiubloes, but a hell of a lot better than most countires omn this planet. You hate Israel? Good. Just get the hell out and oh and by the way some of your resources behind so that some of us who cannot afford to move there but who are willing to accept Israel as it iscan do so. Yeah go on and get angry. Tha's all you know how to. I and a bunch of t

"It is illegal for Israel to defend by force of arms the rights of the Jewish property owners in a territory outside its recognized sovereignty." (#347)" On which planet?

Hey Walter that's a bit harsh.not to mention finding the Islamisist way to you your liking wow..The bitches are they? To keep them quiet and then the MEN can rule SUPREME...HA HA HA HA HA You are not a married man for sure. failing that you belong to the jihadists point of view. But fear not,their women are slowly but surely are trying very hard to change the status quo. What will you do then. I have a feeling through the bitterness you show, much anguish was attributable to the "woman" you might have had an affair,or MARRIED to a curmudgeon. Cheer up you ain't dead yet.

John Spear the British mandate for Palestine included what is now Israel and what is Now Jordan. Trans-Jordan occupied the West Bank between 1948 and 1967 destroying Jewish synagogues taking the headstones from the Mount of Olives and making latrines and walkways. Transjordan comprises 75% of the Palestine. The Jews and Israel were supposed to get 50%. The British Arabists have pandered to the Arab oil for many decades now. Virtually all the countries in the Middle East were formed last century and are newcomers.75% of the population of the new Jordan are Palestinian Arabs. If you look at facts you'll understand why many say Jordan is Palestine and why the Hashemite Ruling class does not want the West Bank despite their previous occupation.

Way back to when I went mishugah! Those were the days!

"I cannot remember exactly what I wrote in my original pot." Try #358. You are very much mistaken. I don't care at all for the Pals. And I doubt that sharing my supposed wealth with them would be enough to solve the conflict. "We in Israel are still unable to internalize three basic things. First, we have not yet freed ourselves from the mindset of an occupier facing the occupied. We are unable to relate to the Palestinians as an independent entity with its own national considerations. Our decision makers, on both the political and the military and intelligence levels, must be constantly reminded that Abu Mazen is no quisling nor collaborator." Major General (ret.) Shlomo Gazit, first Chief Coordinator of Israeli operations in the territories (1967-1974), and former head of Military Intelligence (1974-1979). Served two terms as President of Ben Gurion University in Beersheva. In the mass circulation daily Maariv, April 4, 2005. www.jewsforajustpeace.com/ Now tell me: Do you really believe S. Gazit is caring for the Palestinians?

Self love. If he envies the israel haters is he also an Israel hater? Of course he is.

Hey, Bradley! How come you have censored all my talk backs for the past year? Just curious.

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If it was only "to live in the Land of Israel, the Land of their forefathers, the homeland of the Jewish people" (your words), we Jews, would not have needed zionism and a Jewish state. We and our ancestors were doing all that, long before Ben Gurion and our Declaration of Independence. You are sorely mistaken. Zionism was never meant to be a Jewish crusade aimed at repossessing Eretz-Israel and our holy places, from the infidels' hands. We all know how all crusades have ended: In total disaster for the fools who had launched them. Don't make liars out of us. "Once its own place and status had been secured, Israel HAD NO HIGHER AMBITION or more urgent task than to attain a relationship of good neighbourliness and friendly collaboration with the peoples of [the Middle East]." From Israeli foreign minister Moshe Sharett's speech to the General Assembly, 11 May 1949, following Israel's admission to the United Nations. Yes, you read all right: "Israel", not "the Jewish people". Christian evangelists and our own religious fanatics are always mistaking one for the other.

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Zeev I cannot remember exactly what I wrote in my original pot.Suffice to say I stand by what I said. [you] Zeev who lives in Beersheva a huge desert town..BUT with a great difference. i.e the majority of its inhabitants are very well off verging on the very RICH. Good of you to care for the Pals,so why not SHARE your wealth and stop being a two faced DOOFUS? In hopes that my original post surfaces,I wish you lots of happiness in your LIFE IN BEERSHEVA. P/S For your information I live in Israel.

Cogent and informative, unlike most on here.

IF YOU DON,T LOVE ISRAEL LEAVE....

I was about to enumerate the numbers of the killed by the CIA,MI5 and the rest of minor ones. Although not so minor,for the Jihadists are doing their outmost to emulate the ones mentioned above. Thanks for your post I nearly misundestood and was ready to chide you,until I read it to its conclusion. Good on you...

Yosemite why the comedy? It was you who wrote on the imagined heir presumtive to the == White House should Obama leave office(soon I hope)You then went on who would be suitable to take the reins. Not myself...sending me an amusing reply shows a disregard to the seriousness of the situation. It takes all sorts I guess.And you have a funny vision that tells me YOU CARE NOT who replaces Obama. Hey,by your tone I think you did vote in the democrates? bully for you and take your seabiscuit,and shove it. I was trying to be serious,and you? A BIG JOKER

You have emotion but great moral confusion. The Inquisition under those false and hatred doctrines murdered and tortured innocent Jews, simply for existing and living peaceable and practicing their religion civilly. The Shoah in Germany was an extention of the sickness and evil of the Inquisition carried on to a new level of inhumanity. If you are a truly concerned human, put your emotions to the millions of innocent Africans who have been murdered in the name of Islam, a modern genocide taking place right before your eyes. The security measures and military actions of Israel against the multitude of Palestinian terror groups and militias and criminal clans is neither inhuman or unspeakable, and you would be most foolish to consider them so. A whole society and culture has been raised to cheer the deaths of innocent civilians and to specifically target them so as to strike fear into the hearts of infidels. It is most unfortunate the decisions and path of Palestinian-Arab-Muslim

"ARE WE NOT ALL SETTLERS TOO?", you asked. I don't know about you, but I and my family live in Israel, where we Jews are majority, where Arabs are Israeli citizens too, with full civil and voting rights. We do not live in occupied territory, amidst a stateless population. WE are not settlers. Since when does a good jew - as you most likely would describe yourself - believe what our enemies say? Or are you selecting, from all what they say, only what you find convenient to believe and propagate?

You delegitimize your own existence and right to exist by following the foolish facts, arguments and hatred against those Jews who simply try to live in the Land of Israel, the Land of their forefathers, the homeland of the Jewish people. land that was not won by conquest, but in yet another defensive war of the fledgling State of Israel against Arab Muslim neighbors and invaders who believe that the State of Israel stands in the way of their scriptures, scriptures that are interpreted that Arab-Muslims are supposed to rule the world,that is their destiny. Despite their scripture saying that at the end of days Israel would be returned to the Jews. Every Jew in the State of Israel is a settler and according to Islamic law either needs to be a dhimmi,a second class citizen, or convert to Islam or be dead. The means are jihad, at the economic, social, political, ideological levels making false treaties, committing acts of terror and war.

If not Obama, Romney, or Huckabee then a horse should run. Maybe Seabiscuit? If the horse stamps once that means yes. If it stamps twice that means no. Then there is the dog ofcourse. Don't vote for the one with the tail between the legs! Regards!

that targets its enemies abroad. Luckily the CIA, MI5 etc have never engaged in such activities. Burston, you are part of the problem. You are endorsing the double standard that when Israel does the same thing every other country in the world does, it is uniquely criminal. From where I sit, Israel has always been and continues to be more moral than other nations. Too bad you don't understand that.

It will not help you nor anyone else to re-write history. Gaza never was granted full autonomy, not even a partial one. We abandoned it in summer 2005, UNILATERALLY, as only some dimwit would have done, who, after having put a property up for sale, leaves it behind him claiming he had found no suitable buyer to his taste. Having been left for anyone to take possession, Gaza is now an islamist enclave we cannot live with, nor defeat, we who, as you reminded John Spear, knew once how to crush three Arab armies, in six days. Every folly and its price.

"Jewish resettlement of the Land of Israel is destiny", said you. That's ridiculous. Jewish settlements in occupied West Bank are not 'destiny', they are the rotten fruits of a perverted version of Zionism, or, more precisely, of our deluded leaders decision, taken soon after June '67, to view the newly conquered as our genuine possession and to launch their suicidal settlement project on a land outside our sovereignty, as if we were the last of colonialist powers, and the stateless population we had taken control of, had consented to stay forever our silent and obedient subjects. "The endless war that the settlers are trying to impose on us, which they need like fire needs oxygen, is endangering our future and fanning the flames of a new wave of hatred against Jews in the Diaspora. No normal society can flourish in the oppressive conditions generated by the settlement enterprise." in "Post-Zionist settlement", Haaretz June 20, 2003, by Professor Zeev Sternhell, former head of the Department of Political Science at the Hebrew U of Jerusalem, and one of the world's leading experts on Fascism. 2008 Israel Prize for Political Science. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeev_Sternhell

If I am Catholic and criticize the Inquisition, am i a self-hating Catholic? If I am a German and criticize my governments past or present, am I a self-hating German? If humanity's injustices and brutality make me cry out to God, Please! Stop them!!, am I a self hating human? Don't let the real self-haters use your sense of ethnic solidarity to coerce your agreement with the unspeakable acts they are committing for their own selfish, grandiose, vicious, short-sighted reasons.

I did not read your post because I knew what your saved posts you keep to present at every occasion is the same. Shamir was on of the best.."his "NOME DE GUERRE" Was Michael because he was proud of him. As for terrorists you have forgotten yours Labhras with a convenient loss of memory. You waited hudreds of year to rid Ireland form the Brits'.Even now you are still dependent on the UK We thank Shamir and Begin who fought the Brit's and we got rid of them. You? not quite totally there as yet,even with the GOOD FRIDAY agreement.Things are better,but NOT as it really should be. So I say to you:PUT A SOCK IN IT

You have saved me the time and effort on the subject pertaining the settlers. Who are the settlers? The Settlers are the back bone of Israel. I do not include the very orthodox ones,who have just a couple of caravans they built. But equally I still,like you think they are the true LOVERS of Yisrael,they love and want its survival. As for the rest..like Bradley,myself and the rest of my family:ARE WE NOT ALL SETTLERS TOO? WE returned to our roots where we belong(AFTER A SHORT HIATUS) and back where we belong inspite of our adversaries. We have tried to subdue them,by becoming normal and this means they could have acquired a state long ago. Trouble is:They blame it on their MANTRA of occupation which is nothing BUT an excuse. Their true ambition is,and they will never achieve: The annihilation of our democratic and good governance of our country.That means we PROSPER,and they stagnate. Your post is much better than I would have liked to present. BH

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John... Jordan occupied parts of "Palestine" (West Bank) from 1948, which included parts of Jerusalem. until 1967 when the surrounding Arab armies massed their troops along Israel's border. Instead of waiting for the onslaught, Israel pre-empted, routing the Arab armies and winning a stunning victory in 6 days. Israel then held the West Bank, the Golan and Gaza. And because no Arab was willing to negotiate a peace deal with Israel until Anwar Sadat Israel was caught in the unenviable position of "occupying" those territories. Part of the conditions of the the peace agreement signed with Egypt obliges Israel to find the means to to grant autonomy to the Palestinian populations in the West Bank and Gaza. And when granted full autonomy, Gaza turned into a military dictatorship gaining power through force of arms. A government that vows never to accept a permanent peace with nor existence of Isreal; which smuggles arms aimed at civilians with while international law turns a blind eye.

Mr. Burston, You are right on. I wish your articles would appear on the op-ed page of the Hebrew online and print versions of Haaretz. You would strengthen the voices of Gideon Levi and Akiva Eldar and counter the rants of Arens and Harel. Please!

Yes the Republicans are going to win the next round.And what is wrong about Romney? At the time of the elections and Obama on the stump he promised the earth and delivered nothing but rhetorical uppity hog wash. The ratings of the dimmicrates are going down fast and hope the Republicans win. Wonder if you are one who voted for the first,rather than the latter. The econmy is dire,the disgruntled populace is showing their true feelings now.Uneployment,home repossessions and the rest you know. Obama's claim to fame(ugly) was the low bow to the Saudi king we will never forget. other than that he has done nothing worthy in his endeavours in the ME.Except demanding Israel to FREEZE our building that is necessary for our people. As for Clinton to take the throne? NOT IN A MILLION YEARS. So,wo else is there bar Huckabee the one we can approve of.Most certianly NOT Nader !!!!!!!!

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What is Judaism without Jewish identity? What is the difference between envying those who hate Israel and the Jews and the very definition of what a self-hating Jew is? If your Judaism and Jewish identity are different than the Laws of Moses, is that not the definition of the Erev Rav? If your vision of Israel is to be like all the western nations, then is your projection that Israel and the Jews should be the very best Democracy, so as to be a light unto the Nations? How would the very best Democracies respond to a 60 year boycott, a 60 year campaign of delegitmization and elimination, 60 years of terror, incitement and perfidy, thousands of rockets, daily calls for its destruction? Did not Gush Katif teach you the folly of retreat, abandonment, and trusting in the "good"intent of our cousins who are teaching from their Scripture that the only Good Jew is a Dead Jew, and that dear Sir is the voice of Hate, which includes assimilated Jews, pandering Jews, pacifist Jews,

"As for fighting to divide the land, I plead guilty. It is the settlement movement that for decades has done the heavy lifting of delegitimizing Israel, It has no monopoly on Holiness, no monopoly on destiny, and certainly no monopoly on Judaism and Jewish identity." Thank you for your honesty and understanding. Only Holiness has a monopoly on Holiness, the question is do you have any connection, have you ever had any experience that would lead you to believe that you have ever experienced the most precious Jewel of human existence? If Islam defines all Jews living in the Jewish Homeland as Settlers (including you), and you for decades have been deligitimizing Jewish Settlement in the Heartland of the Homeland, have you not been part of the of the Delegitmization of Jewish Existence in Israel? Jewish resettlement of the Land of Israel is destiny. If you delegitimize Jewish settlement are you not delegitmizing Jewish Destiny? What is Jewish identity without Judaism?

What made you hate Israel so much ? "... when israel will be hit with a powerful earth quake to flattened is all " David What about the palestinians; fatah & hams charters ? Don't you wish a fire will burn & consume both of these charters & the like of them ? There is more threats & hate in them than in what made you not have compassion towards israel ! no country would accept to be ereased from the map ! Isn't just that what the palestinians & arab wants ! Besides, there are many palestinians & others live in israel; what do you expect will the 'powerful earthquake will do to them ?! And in what other destination the palestinians will claim their palestine; if any will be left of them ?! Or isn't hate made some nuts nutters ! And that is what you made clear on your post !

It appears to me that the Israseli leaders and policies that Bradley Burton likes have brought Israel to its current state. I would like to read Burston's take on this thesis, or any better explantion that he has.

And by doing so Bradley pointed out in that response exactly how he really feels about HIS COUNTRY AND ISRAEL.i.e Defending Israel. Read and notice--he recanted what some accused him off i.e Leaving his country YUP he sure DID AND AM GLAD .

Your views on Israel appear pretty dualistic, Black&White. Actually, feelings aren't able to understand the reality, but only a clear mind. Work on it, sweetie.

The Republicans are getting ahead furiously. I hope they manage to get in. What's wrong with Romney? You should never try to vote for that doofus Nader..We know about his reputation. Still,the most important thing is that Obama WILL NOT GET A SECOND TERM.Judging by the ratings plummetting down wow,not much hope when the voting comes in the MIDTERM electioneering. You do sound downhearted on the Republicans. Methinks why so? I bet you voted for the DIMMICRATS? If not than I apologize for the wrong premise...ha ha ha

Who ever heard of Judea and Samaria being called by such a strange name as west bank? Bull! Besides it is not occupied but it is: DISPUTED--Until that is Abass behaves with good intentions and rids himself of the: AKSA-M-BRIGADE who's boss he is.Plus he should sign out of HIS CHARTER. No better than his ersthwile chum RATIFART. Same side of the coin. And at this rate chummy,there will never be A Pal' state IF AT ALL. Meantime Judea and Samaria is JEWISH WILL BE FOR GOOD.

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Paul from vancouver could not have put it better. Previously my feelings toward israel were that they were the persecuted - over time this has changed - and now i feel that they are as much the persecutor - and have very negative feelings (hate is a strong word) toward Israel generally

I am not sure what you guys are thinking over there. But at this stage of the game - the way you conduct your affairs is making most Australians with an interest in international politics consider you to be no better and no worse than Hamas!! We see no assumed rightness to your position either geographically or politically and consider much of what you do (eg Dubai) equally as repugnant as any acts committed by Hamas or other terrorist organizations. In other words you are vey much starting to look like terrorists yourselves to many people here.

Hello Alistair, The good far outweighs the bad when it comes to those who rubbish. There is still a part of me (the child within) that longs to believe Israel is the Holy place my Sunday school lessons taught. It's probably something like the reason why adults decorate the Christmas tree. Reality can be harsh and disheartening, but also beautiful. So many times I have read something on Haaretz and followed a link to something else (Rabbis for Human Rights for instance) and I tell you, it enforces the reality of something good in everyone. I call it God. BTW, I've got enough Irish blood in my veins to prevent those, who brand me an anti-Semite, from getting under my skin. : ) Best wishes Maureen Ann.

Is it to do with being part of the knee jerk cheer squad for those who refuse peace now or ever in the future, whose idea of justice is a bullet in the brain for their own people whose only crime is disagreement?

"the arabic countries have chosen peace many years now. your problem however are the palestinians, the real land owners." Even the ones who only lived there for 2 years? Did you know that BOTH Jews and Arabs were Palestinians prior to 1948? Only the Arabs were the real landowners? Jews who purchased land from Arabs don't own the land? That's handy. Do you often steal what someone purchased from you? "you either try to kill them all and steal what is left of their country, orelse accept their "right to exist"." Over 1 million Arabs live in Israel. How many Jews were kicked out of their homes in Arab countries? Will you insist upon them getting their land back which WASN'T purchased? How about the Jewish Palestinians of the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Is their property Arab property as well? Who walked out of the Clinton talks? Who rejected a partition along ethnic lines and chose war instead in 1948?

"SDHS doesn`t know what he is talking about. The entire world, with no exception, is telling us: It is illegal for Israel to defend by force of arms the rights of the Jewish property owners in a territory outside its recognized sovereignty, " You mean, these people have no rights simply because Jordan kicked them off the land for 19 years? The entire world thinks you look like an idiot in stating that a country has no right to protect people who are fighting over territory left from a civil war, given it is one of those countries from that territory. It's called a border dispute. Who will protect the property owners' rights? Hmmm? The UN? "OR, in other words, to behave as if its final borders have already been drawn and mutually agreed upon with the other side." To behave as if a fiction which has never occurred HAS occurred? That's just dumb. "UN Security Council Res. 478" Pertains to annexation, not protecting the rights of property owners. Try again, and be less of a fool.

the arabic countries have chosen peace many years now. your problem however are the palestinians, the real land owners. you either try to kill them all and steal what is left of their country, orelse accept their "right to exist".

"Is it illegal for Israel to defend the rights of the Jewish property owners [in the occupied West Bank] until final borders are drawn?" (SDHD) Yes, of course it is. SDHS doesn't know what he is talking about. The entire world, with no exception, is telling us: It is illegal for Israel to defend by force of arms the rights of the Jewish property owners in a territory outside its recognized sovereignty, OR, in other words, to behave as if its final borders have already been drawn and mutually agreed upon with the other side. UN Security Council Res. 478, adopted on August 20, 1980, declared Israel's 1980 Jerusalem Law null and void and required that it be rescinded forthwith while affirming that it was a violation of international law.

"It took the Spaniards eight centuries to complete the reconquest of Spain, yet today no one denies the legitimacy of Spain or its right to exist in the community of nations." says he. That's correct: Today no one denies the legitimacy of Spain nor its right to exist in the community of nations. But when Steve of Mevaserret is wrong, he is terribly wrong. 1- Prior to the Reconquista, there was no nation called Spain. 2- At the time, there was no UN Security Council. 3- Criticizing our leaders' foolish policies is not denying the legitimacy of Israel nor its right to exist in the community of nations, nor its right to self-defense. MosheI Arens and Israel Harel are doing it here all the time. But that, in Steve of Mevaserret's eyes, is kosher: Attacks on our government should only come from the ultra-rightist wing, the one that still rejects the Two state formula. and 4- Keeping prisoner a foreign stateless population is the least effective way for a nation to defend itself. "We are heading downhill towards near-catastrophe. If we go on living by the sword, we will continue to wallow in the mud and destroy ourselves." Yaakov Perry, one of the four former Shin Bet chiefs quoted by Chris McGreal in Jerusalem for 'The Guardian', in "Israel on road to ruin, warn former Shin Bet chiefs", November 15, 2003. www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/nov/15/israel

You are right, consequently israel in NOT a democracy. sicut erat demonstrandum.

Love the Author's Notes features on the talkbacks. Great Idea! Wish more columnists did that, too.

Excuse me Walter but I must say you have a lot of nerve..."Israel should square with the palestinians" and the palestinians in this case have absolutely not culpability at all? At the end of the day,if you know your history,the palestinians started this conflict and took it to heights of horrible destruction and death all over the world. Have you forgotten about this? It seems so. There will never be peace with a people such as the palestinians who covet hatred towards Israel and the Jews...this is a reality. What makes me even sicker is that people like you,who know nothing about the core problems that confront Israel,are supporting the palestinians in their quest. With remarks about destroying Israel from the outside you join the forces of evil..have you no concept of what the islamic world is all about? Have you no idea of the carnage they want to unleash on Israel?Obviously you have no concept at all about the region except to blame Israel for everything.

When did Jordan occupy Palestine? it belonged to Istanbul since 1453 fall of the Roman Empire, together with Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, Sirya, Bagdad .... etc. Which planet were you talking about?

But, these issues should be discussed individually. By throwing them all together, it sounds more like a rant, a good one at that. Let's keep it simple: Sharon's stroke was devastating. Israel needs a strong, savvy leader. In the 2000s Sharon was that man, and he could have done wonders for israel had he stayed around. Gaza was just the beginning. Watching Kadima flail in Leb. was heartbreaking. Which brings us to Netanyahu. I just don't like this guy at all. He's awful, as perfectly symbolized by what his Foreign Ministry is doing. Despite short sighted media stunts, he's an awful negotiator and will easily be played. Israelis have always been obnoxious, so laughing at olims' accents is nothing new. And the Dubai affair, it's complicated but doesn't warrant the same castigation as Lieberman/Ayalon yet. If Sharon was alive, none of this would have happened, including the Leb 2006 debacle, and I say that as a Labor centrist. Hang in there, Bradley.

one sided comments-the one against Israel.

...I certainly agree with your last comment. We are seeing it now in the US with the Tea Party movement and the fragmentation of the Republican Party. A lot of this fragmentation is driven by fear. Fear of having to recognize the rights of gays. And women being able to decide what does or does not grow inside their own bodies. And recognizing that unrestrained capitalism is a Bad Thing(tm) and that properly and prudently regulating it is not akin to "socialism". Perhaps most importantly going armed with Uzi style weapons to American political rallies in a show of support for the 2nd Amendment and that is simply not conducive to a 21st century mindset. Israel's fear is at this point entirely self-driven. The rational folks in Israel are under the control of the extremists who believe in colonialism in a way that in yesteryear was called antisemitism. They claim it all, and they hold Israel in thrall of nationalistic fear, currently descending into fascism from fear of peace.

It is lamentable that the existence of the State of Israel has not cured a pathology Freud termed Jüdischen Selbsthass. The absolute refusal by the Arab side to accept Israel's right to exist remains the cause of the Arab-Israeli conflict. All the Jüdischen Selbsthass in the world can't hide that fact.

Mitt Romney vs. Obama? I don't think Obama wants to run for a second term. He's undecided. If I were him, I'd give it a lot of second thought too because he could probably become a billionaire just for making speeches and the World is going to be really crazy with this massive arms buildup in the Middle East and Iran nearly obtaining nuclear missiles with help from Russia and sympathy from China. So one supposes that Obama could hand it over to Hillary. The logical choice then would be Mitt Romney with his knowledge of economics. But there is Paul again with his isolationist agenda and he might run as an independent along with Nader doing the same. That would make a fight between Hillary and Romney even. Then again people are presently unsatisfied with the selection. So who else is there? Who is going to stand up to all the new challenges? It's a toss up right now Bradley! That's bad!

I was not commenting on Israel's political state. I agree that Israel is a nightmare that will keep getting worse until it either is destroyed from outside (pretty easy to do, at this point) or it settles square with the Palestinians. The point was that "hatred" is an emotion that is easily reduced to its core element (fear). When you see hatred, of any kind, you can get closer enough to study it, you will see that it is fear. Fear turns into hatred perhaps through some complex social alchemy, but changing it back (to fear) is easy. Its just an observation, meant to inform, not offend.

But the case it's not hate Israel but the criminals that turn Israel in what it is today! Good sense people hates criminals...

till Lebanon became a base for attacking Israel. After Israel kicked out the invading Lebanese army in 1948,it was all quiet. It was your choice to heat it up again. Love it when you people cry criminal.How many of each other have you murdered while shouting Israel.

i'm afraid i've come to the point of no hope. day after day, struggle after struggle, we loose. day after day, those same "talkbalks" in israeli sites like this reveal the truth about what's going on the israeli public opinion (elections and random conversations everywhere in the country project the same insights.). again: go back to where you came. again: go to gaza, you self hating jew. i've had enough of that. i hate it. and years of activism have proven me there's nothing i can do. i need to find me a new place to call home.

Now how about admitting you dont have conclusive evidence,the full story and no idea what factors were taken into account before the decision was made,if it in fact was made by Israel

Maureen Ann ,dont get dishartend,people only rubbish your posts because thats what the do to anyone who is not agreeing with self centred right wing views.You come across as a caring descent person that puts people first.I love your posts and many others like you, Esther Ta is one and there are many more like you.Please post more and who cares what the extremests think.Good for you Maureen Ann!

the author gets it and the rest of Israel wants to fly him somewhere else. Talk about Legitimizing his viewpoint. You also probably thing Germany lost its war because it was evil ( which it was ) it lost it's war because it started its war thinking it was superiour to all other nations on earth. After the fall of the german "superman" we have lived to see the rise of the "SuperJew" Dont be suprised when you get the same result as germany too

"Note the part about soldiers without uniform. Gee, I thought that is illegal---oh yes --only when Hamas does it." Gee, I thought the Stern Gang was dissolved prior to 1948 and the Geneva Conventions were drafted after that. Do you need a lesson about how time works?

"James, you cannot give what you do not own..." And you cannot have what you've never owned stolen from you. "...and Gaza is still legally occupied by Israel, I know this because Israel told me so." Now you're hearing things. Tell us who the Israeli administrators of Gaza are... "The West Bank is belligerently occupied by Israel. I know this because the Israeli high court told me so." Israel also told you that there is a dispute over the territory. You weren't listening to that part, where you? "The Golan Heights and East Jerusalem are illegally occupied." You are a liar. The territories are not illegally occupied.

So by your logic anybody Israel considers its enemy is fair game for assassination? International law doesn't agree. There are a lot of leaders in Israel who are considered by any to be criminals, so I guess you have no problem if Hamas or anybody else decides to bump them off. Israel must learn that it will be treated as it treats others. Open season on criminals? OK, let the games begin.

Very refreshing and honest read. The responses certainly reinforce your arguments. It always amazes me that we (don't know about Israel, but in the US) teach history, and yet people openly espouse fascistic dogma-- leave the country if you disagree. They can't grasp that the function of a democracy is to allow the people to change the government, not to require exile for an opposing viewpoint. Carry on, Bradley.

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of the M.E. is a walk in paradise

"It took the Spaniards eight centuries to complete the reconquest of Spain, yet today no one denies the legitimacy of Spain or its right to exist in the community of nations." says he. That's correct: Today no one denies the legitimacy of Spain nor its right to exist in the community of nations. But when Steve of Mevaserret is wrong, he is terribly wrong. 1- Prior to the Reconquista, there was no nation called Spain. 2- At the time, there was no UN Security Council. 3- Criticizing our leaders' foolish policies is not denying the legitimacy of Israel nor its right to exist in the community of nations, nor its right to self-defense. and 4- , Keeping prisoner a foreign stateless population is the least effective way for a nation to defend itself. "We are heading downhill towards near-catastrophe. If we go on living by the sword, we will continue to wallow in the mud and destroy ourselves." Yaakov Perry, one of the four former Shin Bet chiefs quoted by Chris McGreal in Jerusalem for 'The Guardian', in "Israel on road to ruin, warn former Shin Bet chiefs", November 15, 2003. www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/nov/15/israel

Not to mention this: TO "THE VICTORS GO THE SPOILS" Negotiations,negotiations...How,how many times Philippe?And with who? The other side seems not to have the capacity to forget their past misdemeanours,and come to the table,sort out the problems they began since 1945/48 I takes guts and honest determination which the Arabs lack.

SoM: "Europeans that believe that millions of Jews vanished from their midst without resistance or defiance, cannot comprehend our refusal to return territory captured in an existential war of self-defense to those still bent upon our destruction." Neither Abbas nor Assad is "still bent upon your destruction", Steve, if they ever were. SoM: "We will continue to rebuild our ancient nation in the Land of Israel." Then that is "territorial acquisition", and not "self-defense", and your entire thesis falls down. SoM: "It took the Spaniards eight centuries to complete the reconquest of Spain, yet today no one denies the legitimacy of Spain or its right to exist in the community of nations." International Law has changed since El Cid, Steve. BOTH Israel and Spain are expected NOW to live by int'l law as it exists NOW. One does. One does not.

I guess that many people here in the Nordic countries are too negative toward Islam, but more seldom negative toward Judaism. Some of those extremely negative to Islam and anything having to do with Islam seem to be non-religious people being extremely irritated at the expansion of the monotheistic religions that they thought they had left behind decades ago. At least to latter group seem to emerge in a Swedish language blog, at a Finnish newspaper, arguing for and against outlawing the construction of minarets as proposed by a the youth organisation of the marginal True Finns party. A funny twist of the Swedish speaking supporters of this True Finn proposal is that the True Finns seem to be very opposed to the special rights of the Swedish speaking minority in Finland. continues Jens Jarva

The latter party is less anti-Islamic, but would not miss a good opportunity to attack Muslims. Still this big (24-33%) party would mainly like to lower taxes and social benefits as well as privatise, while rapidly spending the Norwegian oil fund on expanded social benefits. Beside this it loves to come with populist poorly thought through proposals and protests, that make headlines. continues Jens Jarva

Who are the most outspoken supporters of Israel here? Besides the obvious ones you seem to have a strong support in American oriented churches and in Norway also a rather strong support among ?more ordinary? actively religious Christians. Then you have a group of supporters that I would not even wish upon my worst enemy, if I had one, namely the Danish peoples party and the Norwegian Progress Party. The former being a very national-egoistic party, which could have the slogan Denmark and Danish customs first at any cost and in every detail. Still, they love to support Jews, Israel and USA, as much as they love attacking Muslims. I wonder who they would have attacked a hundred or two hundred years ago. continuing Jens Jarva

Are we very anti-Sionistic? Well, there are those who consider Israel to be a western colony, much like USA or South Africa. Then there are those who do not like the idea of a state based on religion instead of occupants, much as they might oppose the role of religion in Iran, Saudi Arabia or even USA. But I believe most of the Nordic citizens would be unhappy if the Jews were forced to leave Israel or were totally marginalised there, and I cannot think of a Nordic politician who happily would accept the state of Israel disappearing. continuing Jens Jarva

Are people then very anti-Semitic in the Nordic countries? I do not think so, even if a few Neonazists can seem much for those abused. Then there are probably some of all those agitated over the poor treatment of Palestinians, who do not distinguish enough between Jews and Israelis on one side and certain Israeli politicians and supporters on the other hand. Last and hopefully least, a few of the local Muslims might abuse some Jews or just understandably protest against for example the Gaza war. What is perceived as anti-Semitism is something entirely different. continuing Jens Jarva

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Still, your little fight does not directly concern us very much, were it not for the ripples from it that affect the rest of the party and the risk of commandos from your region fighting their war in our house. Something they did in Lillehammer (Norway) in 1973 when they executed an innocent Maroccan waiter, and in Copenhagen (Denmark) in 1985 when they blew up bombs outside an American airline office and the Synagogue. It is a little hard to accept commandos acting in this way, whether they come from Israel, Iran, Russia, USA, Palestine or somewhere else. continuing Jens Jarva

In the eighties, you could stumble over Voice of America or Radio Moscow, while searching for Luxembourg's music station. Not really listening to them, even if you stopped a moment at them, due to their infantile misinformation. Today, you occasionally stumble over news items about seemingly poor official Israeli complaints to for example Nordic official. Complaints that no one can take seriously, even if they are closer to sane reality than some of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's comments of the Holocaust. continuing Jens Jarva

It is indeed so very sad that the few lonely voices like Bradley's the seek introspection in the name of peace are attacked so ruthlessly and so predictably. Does telling this man 'go back to the soviet union' resolve the issues he raises? Does it give those who propose it some strange visceral therapy? Unfortunately for some, the view espoused here is becoming mainstream in the western world, the battle for the hearts and minds of its citizenry lost and Israel, driven by it's colonial settler movement increasingly isolated and hence turning inward. So very, very sad.

You all seem to sit, as we say, on the edge of the chamberpot, or in English to stand up against the wall. Quite a different situation from us in the Nordic countries, who calmly can sit down and ponder over our relatively affluent lives. It is easy for us to come to the conclusion that the institutions, minds and compassion of your region are heavily damaged by the conflict. It is equally easy to react to the fact that people with a violent undercover background seem to be common at the very top of your political landscape. continues Jens Jarva

I rather pity the inhabitants of your region, Mr Burston! It is hard to imagine a region from far away, but it is easy to be a little upset when someone is murdered or kidnapped in your own house. In my, very imperfect, imagination, Israel/Palestine seems like a spot of dust with direct access to Dante's inferno; with American style cityscapes as the first level on the way down. Still, I probably do very little justice to sceneries, architecture and life in the region. Nevertheless, a religious Christian (or any other kind of monotheist) would have a very hard time selling me the ?stairway to heaven? view of Israel/Palestine. continues Jens Jarva

Stop pretending that this Hamas terrorist was a head of state. He was not. He was a killer of Jews. He belonged to an oragnisation that wants to wipe out the Jewish State. If indeed this was Mossad, very well done indeed. The team showed courage and poise. They went to the heart of Arab land, filled with video cameras, and carried out a mission without a hitch. The terrorist is dead and the team escaped. Dubai can make all kinds of claims: we have them on video, we have their passport numbers, we are on to them, but truth be told, they have no idea who they were or are and never will.

The great 11th century Rabbi Shlomo ben Yitzhak of Troyes ("Rashi") influenced by the massacre of Jews in the Rhineland by the Crusaders en route to the Holy Land reminds us "One day the nations of the world will tell the Jews, this land is ours; you stole it from us. And we will reply: the land belongs to God; He alone has the right to say who will live there. And He gave this land to us." (Quoted in Elie Wiesel, Rashi, 2009).

A basic right held dear by the community of nations as they deny this right to only one nation--the Jewish nation of Israel. Europeans that believe that millions of Jews vanished from their midst without resistance or defiance, cannot comprehend our refusal to return territory captured in an existential war of self-defense to those still bent upon our destruction. We will continue to rebuild our ancient nation in the Land of Israel. Palestine was not the only country overrun by expansionist Islam. It took the Spaniards eight centuries to complete the reconquest of Spain, yet today no one denies the legitimacy of Spain or its right to exist in the community of nations.

"Is it illegal for Israel to defend the rights of the Jewish property owners [in the occupied West Bank] until final borders are drawn?" (SDHD) Yes, of course it is. The entire world is telling us: It is illegal for Israel to defend by force of arms the rights of the Jewish property owners in a territory outside its recognized sovereignty, in other words, to behave as if its final borders have already been drawn and mutually agreed upon with the other side. UN Security Council Res. 478, adopted on August 20, 1980, declared Israel's 1980 Jerusalem Law null and void and required that it be rescinded forthwith while affirming that it was a violation of international law.

"... what other countries.." Zeev. 'Israel is NOT ' other country ' ! Israel is the home of the only true Stateless, Homeless, thousands of years wonderers ! The Jews are far.. far in the front of the queue of the world refugees, waited for their home/Israel for thousands & thousand of years ... Don't ever think or imagine any one can ever take Israel from the Jews ! The story of Israel & the Jews; is once in the history of mankind !

Just a short one:TO THE VICTORS GO THE SPOILS. This has been the case for many countries for years.That is all I wanted to say. Thanks

But a disputed territory.Go to the court of law and find out.Failing that,read and learn. Judea and Samaria is part of Israel now and will be foreever. Who ever heard a place called "west bank". Come forward to the 21st century and if you still persist in your assumption TOUGH on you. Ours it is,or when Abbas decides to behave as he should(long time from now for sure or,IF EVER) Then we will see. Meantime eat your miserable hearts out. Do I care what you think/say? Not in a million years. THINK CHCKEN AND EGG,then come back to discuss what is JEWISH and what is not.

"Not to mention that international law stipulates that a country is not obligated to return land gained during a DEFENSIVE war. Which was the case for the west bank and Golan in 67."Phillipe Dont bother looking for it Phillipe---no such law exists. But one that negates your calim does. It is referred to as "The inadmissability of territories gained through War". Go on Google it. The truth will set you free.

We do not appreviate your cavalier attitude about stealing Passports from citizens of another State. It is a crime and while you may view the whole matter as a joke---we do not. So keep up your cavalier attitude---it will smack you right in your kisser one day soon. Also tell your war criminal leaders to stay away from Ireland----arrest and a free trip to the Hague awaits them---compliments of the Majority of the Irish people. You see--we dont like agressors ---we know all about that.

If Mossad did carry out the assassination then whats the big deal, they killed an enemy of the sate. The whole point of intelligence agencies it to defend the interest of the state sometimes that might be simple intelligence gathering and at other times it is things like assassinations. Mossad is not meant to be a public relations organization. Sometimes protecting the countries interests involves things that are unpopular. 1981 bombing of Saddam Hussains nuclear reactor made Israel no friends, even the US voted to condemn Israel in the UN. 2009 Operation Cast Lead made Israel very unpopular in the west but it was carried out to defend Israels interests. Israel was even condemned for sntaching Eichman and it was such a diplomatic incident in the UN that the plans to go after Mengele whose location had been learned were called off. Israel got condemned for kidnapping Vanunu Israel has & will continue to do things that make it enemies but are in Israels best interests

... he doesn't believe in miracles ! Now he himself performed a miracle !

See CASE # 2056/04 Beit Zourik V Israel in which the ICHJ (Israeli High Court of Justice---they dont get any higher) ruled the West Bank---formerly Judea/Samaria ---biblical nonsense taken from a book written by a Jew for Jews??? To be held under "Belligerent Occupation" Ergo not sovereign Israeli territory. You do respect the decisions of the Highest court in Israel----don,t you James???.

See CASE # 2056/04 Beit Zourik V Israel in which the ICHJ (Israeli High Court of Justice---they dont get any higher) ruled the West Bank---formerly Judea/Samaria ---biblical nonsense taken from a book written by a Jew for Jews??? To be held under "Belligerent Occupation" Ergo not sovereign Israeli territory. You do respect the decisions of the Highest court in Israel----don,t you James???.

...and Gaza is still legally occupied by Israel, I know this because Israel told me so. The West Bank is belligerently occupied by Israel. I know this because the Israeli high court told me so. The Golan Heights and East Jerusalem are illegally occupied. I know this because the United Nations Security Council told me. It is no longer possible for Israel to hide behind hasbara propaganda. Facts are now easily verifiable. Your nonsense, as well as a lot of other stuff that gets passed off in the talkbacks, is verifiable blather.

Not to mention that international law stipulates that a country is not obligated to return land gained during a DEFENSIVE war. Which was the case for the west bank and Golan in 67. (it still can do so within the frame of peace negotiations.)

"Keep calling them 'another people', it sounds more sweet to the ear." (A. Zekaria) Only feeble-minded want to hear sweet words instead of being told the truth: It is utterly wrong, in our age, for a democratic country, to rule another people, be it a stateless one or not. What other countries, much more powerful than we can ever be, have learned a long time ago at great expense, we, a supposedly clever people, have not understood yet. Ultimatively, it may lead us to disaster. "Persistence in error is the problem. There is always freedom of choice to change or desist from a counter-productive course if the policy-maker has the moral courage to exercise it. Yet, to recognize error, to cut losses, to alter course, is the most repugnant option in government." Historian Barbara Tuchman, twice winner of the Pulitzer Price for General Non-Fiction, in her "March of Folly - From Troy to Vietnam", 1984.

Not only was he a member in good standing of Stern Gang, he was a leader. Here is the humerous part. "n office, Shamir implacably opposed trading territory occupied since 1967 for peace ? he believed it part of the Land of Israel ? and was equally intransigent in opposing Palestinian self-determination. He refused to negotiate with the PLO as a terrorist organization. Pot calling kettle black---eh James. heer is the first verse of sterns anthem. "First stanza Unknown Soldiers are we, without uniform And around us fear and the shadow of death We have all been drafted for life. Only death will discharge us from [our] ranks Note the part about soldiers without uniform. Gee, I thought that is illegal---oh yes --only when Hamas does it. Do you apologists ever get embarrassed. Would you like a small sample of the many terrorist acts carried out by your hero. Or would that upset your priostine view of this fromer terrorist/murderer.

Glad I did for I tought I was hallucinating,or my vision impaired. well I have found you--only because I read bbsn referring to you as Cippy? Good posts all three.

In case you have forgotten,Hamas did not acquire Gaza,but it was Sharon who decided to relinquish it.And with dire results. Hamas has turned Gaza into a fortress of mal FUNCTIONERIES with nothing to offer his people. Nothing bu grief that they are having to deal with. The population is up in arms for not receiving their due to have the wherewithal they need. If proof needed they are spending their monies on weapons,and to hell for their people. Had to remind you of your misconception that Hamas took it.THEY DID NOT.Stupidly(by Sharon) giving it AWAY.

When I read his to an Israeli he said he made a mistake which he supposedly recanted. Zeev never changes even when he has to try several times to have his posts out. A dog who will not let go OF HIS BONE is our Zeev.

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I pitty all those lacking the mental capacity to grasp that criticizing national leaders for their misguided policies, is not undermining the country they happen to lead. zoe from Athens, I hear that a lot of your fellow citizens are criticizing their leaders these days for having foolishly led your country into a financial disaster. I pitty all the dimwits who believe that all decision makers can err, except in Israel. "A phenomenon noticeable throughout history, regardless of place or period, is the pursuit by governments of policies contrary to their own interests.' " Barbara Tuchman, historian, twice winner of the Pulitzer Price for General Non-Fiction, in her "March of Folly - From Troy to Vietnam", 1984.

(How can you be a superjew when the central foundation of Judaism is Israel and making Aliyha) So how is Canada? Enjoying the Olympics?

"Cippy, we don`t illegally occupy Afghanistan...of course basic logic and facts have long been beyond you." Speaking of facts being beyond you, Jordan captured the WB and E Jerusalem, kicked out all the Jews, then attacked Israel again 19 years later. It's illegal for Israel to occupy the territories and defend the rights of the Jewish property owners there until final borders are drawn? Grow up.

Ditto. I can't say 'tears ever rolled down my face,' but I unthinkingly bought the whole Israeli schtick: Leon Uris' 'Exodus,' the heroic military victories, etc. They were just right (and White). I never thought about it -- until Israel managed to rub my snout in the truth one too many times. And once one starts SEEING...

'At times like these, I envy the people who passionately, frankly, with all their hearts, despise Israel. Hate Israel enough, and the Jewish state's failings and blunders, its self-satisfied blindness and its resultant self-destructive policies, cause not pain, but delight. ' Couldn't have said it better myself. I assure you, you are correct.

dictates what is accepted as legal. That the US occupies Iraq and Afghanistan is beyond question. That China occupies Tibet is also beyond question. That Britain occupies the Falkland is another LEGAL occupation, and on and on. Basic logic, I am afraid is not a strong suit of hate mongers covered with white sheets.

Will not write a long response. One of the best Israeli leaders that we have had:Is none other than YITZHAC SHAMIR. He served his country with distinction,he was never accused in any monatery scandals. He was of a straight forward patriot of the land Of Israel and its people right to the very end of his Knesset tenure. Tough,thorough and honest,even better than Begin. Just wait now for the accusers to come out of the woods to claim his erswhile connection to the Irgun etc,etc. Which it is thanks to them we managed to rid our HOLY LAND from The British. I rest my case.

This is the first time you called the palestinians "anther people" and not " stateless " as you always do ! I very much hope you are right & the palestinians reached a state where one can talk to them like all "anther people" ! The fact that the palestinians 'demands' & not ' talk ' made this conflict the tower of babylon ! Keep calling them ' the other people ', it sounds more sweet to the ear .

Too bad you don't live in Israel, since you like it so much.

For in our minds we conjure up so many scenarios as to Shalit's whereabouts. Is he alive,is he well? Your dream has some dire scenes ...because we are unaware of his state OF HEALTH in the dungeon they may indeed are KEEPING HIM. Why?because Hamas is trying to prevent our security forces to enter the precincts of Gaza that are full of booby traps. Reason why our people have not been able to enter,although they may have a good idea exactly where he might be. While I thank you,your vision is dire.

(You) "have serious, and mounting doubts, about the way in which we are confronting Hamas, which, in my view, has only benefited from the way we have fought them in particular since they took over Gaza by force." Okay. We're all ears. So is the IDF. What do you suggest?

...of course basic logic and facts have long been beyond you.

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Yes indeed we Jews are lucky. As you so well said:Envying the young men and women of israel that fight for their homeland with courage and determination. Zoe they also DIE for their beloved country. Something Bradley omitted in his article. As for making "aliyah" leaving behind well organized life? Alas not many are as enthused to leave their comfort where ever they reside. But the faithful and patriots for Israel do so without a second glance.Which is an admirable steps they decide to take. Zoe,we want more of them to follow the ones who have so far made ALIYAH.When they do ,I too will have my ultimate dream to come true. Don't pity the diaspora Jews,their choice. However, should there be in need whereby they need a safe haven ISRAEL is here to welcome them with OPEN ARMS. Thanks

Fear not, Israeli, you did misunderstood me. Between #234 and #250, I had no time to change my heart. The latter, addressed to Steve of Mevaserret #237, was only a try at being sarcastic. Not too succesful, so it appears. Sorry. But I am quite sure that those here who know me well got the message as it was intended to be received.

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... achieved nothing about peace but only brag about it ! "I envy the people who hate Israel" But you are one of those who don't love Israel Bradley ? Your article is enough proof for your hate of Israel. So, by simple logic do you 'envy' yourself' ?!. If that is nothing except a nonsense brag that makes your article nonsense and stupid ! And contribute nothing worth reading ! There are many of those who agree with you on this talkback, but that is no surprise. Mice always follow the piper ... Specially when the piper play the wrong tune and the mice are deaf. Mohamad al- Mabhuh business sending Iranian weapons of death to Gaza ! A man that all lovers of peace supposed to hate. What makes the Left & Burston is one of them, sorry for his death ?! I wonder !

Gilad Shalit. I think it might be that he is being held at a Gaza Orphanage for Handicapped Children at the Present Moment. About 3:00 AM, I asked where I was. The answer was San Diego. I saw a white building. I entered it. I willed a door to be opened. There was a room with bars or wires. I couldn't clearly see Shalit. Children were playing outside. A painting outside Shalit's room looked like a hanging yellow rug with rounded patterns. I got the words Bill Ma ha lo Handicapped Children's Foundation. I got out of bed and Googled the terms plus Gaza. There was something about a Handicapped Children's Orphanage in Gaza. A photo of a white building with dead Gaza Policemen being laid out in front of it. That's all I got. So far. Good luck!

i envy the young men and women of israel that fight for their homeland with courage . i envy all those who make alliya, leaving behind a well organized life , to make the dream come true. i pitty all those israelis and diaspora jews , who fiercly undermine israel.

the opinions you expressed in this article appear to be hysterical. The fact remains that your piece lends credence to those that hate Israel and anger those that love it as evidenced by the responses of the Talkbackers. Because a piece such as yours published in a news outlet does not lend itself to full exploration and composed exchanges (again, evidenced by your response to # 2) I believe it is better suited to academic discussions in some kind of forum other than a news outlet....the kind of discussions that many of us routinely have about Israeli policies and the impact of those policies on the Jewish people.

the opinions you expressed in this article appear to be hysterical. The fact remains that your piece lends credence to those that hate Israel and anger those that love it as evidenced by the responses of the Talkbackers. Because a piece such as yours published in a news outlet does not lend itself to full exploration and composed exchanges (again, evidenced by your response to # 2) I believe it is better suited to academic discussions in some kind of forum other than a news outlet....the kind of discussions that many of us routinely have about Israeli policies and the impact of those policies on the Jewish people.

The haters are so blind they can not even recognize when someone's heart bleeds when they see their love self destruct.

There is nothing to envy. It's like seeing your big brother fail. As a Palestinian refugee longing to return to a modern, functional and peaceful homeland the idea that your options are going from bad (PA or Hamas) to worse (Israeli government). What a shame. I had a secret wish that the idea of a two state solution would fail so I can be a citizen of Palestine/Israel and live in Haffa/Jaffa.

Our governments, past and present - with the exception of the one that had Tommy Lapid in it - have also doing all they can to turn Israel into an Iranian-style theocracy: religious legislation favoring the ultra-Orthodox; denial of legitimacy of non-Orthodox branches of Judaism; causing the collapse of secular education by insufficient funding (today only a little more than hals first-graders attend government schools); continued coalitions with the repressive, blood-sucking haredi parties. I, like Burston, see Israel destroying itself, but by more means than he sees.

ceren If you think Bradley is brave,then it goes to show you are but a puppet of Erdogan. Therefore show your bravenes by trying to change the fanatism of your country's Govt first before praising Bradley in this instance. It would then prove how real bravery is.

Expert or not we Jews/Isaelis will prevail and we are never ever going to disappear according to your presumptionsness. And no there is or never be A SHOWDOWN now OR EVER.Only in your misbegotten thoughts that never vary.

Blessed are those who say the truth in the face of evil and stupidity! I have no doubt that the majority of the right wing fanatics would stone Burston if they can! He beautifully characterizes the pathetic policies of the Israeli government. Unfortunately, good politicians like Isaac Rabin who would bring any hope for peace are likely to be assassinated in this hysteric state!

If I mistake me not,have you had a change of heart,or have I misunderstood your premise i.e After Operation Jonathan in Entebbe, only jew haters and spineless leftistst dare question it. Well Zeev methinks your view point has changed. Or have I once again misread your meaning behind it...finding @ 156 correct? I do hope i am right.

If and when it happens poor Bradley will also not be with us,but long gone to HIS MAER. However,us the remaing Jews will be pulverized should Iran decide to use its NUKES. But poor Bradley has had a lapsed memory in his recent articles. I will add something that someone referred on GIFTS. Here is a sample:Beware of Greeks Bearing Gifts" Achilles, the greatest of the Greeks, and Hector, the greatest of the Trojans, I think Hector= Obama=America. So, I will join Achilles and free ourselves from the USA.? For I have no intention for us Jews to be the slaves of the Hector. And the story goes: One thing the Greeks had that the Trojans lacked was the cunning of an Odysseus. Perhaps we should emulate Odysseus? Gee anything to be free Don't want to be Troy either... Odysseus devised the idea of a Trojan Horse. When the "Trojan Horse" was left at the gates of Troy, the Trojans thought the Greeks had left it as a parting gift because they had given up and sailed home. The Trojans welcomed the gift and took it within their walls, little knowing the belly of the beast was filled with armed soldiers who would destroy their city. And I am not prepared to be a TROJAN .Don't want any gifts thank you.

What's the struggle? To hold on to the illegally occupied Palestinian territory:? To complete the starvation of 1.5 million Gazans; To annex the West Bank to ensure there will never be an independent sovereign Palestine state; To continue to be in violation of more UN resolutions than any other country in the world? What a grand struggle! Not many people in the world hope you win.

Before July 4, 1976, it was understandable that some people would doubt our right to build settlements on a land outside our recognized sovereignty, and to be the last democratic country to rule another people. After Operation Jonathan in Entebbe, only jew haters and spineless leftistst dare question it.

i appreciate you bradley burston, for your braveness against fanatic nationalism.you are not alone.

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Yes Kol Hakavod to the killers of the terrorist scum in Dubai! And AMEN to that brother. One down,several to go--WHOEVER did it,it was SUPERBS JOB.

Unquestioned loyalty for the Father Land was good then?......PEACE EVER?

Envy and massacres committed by the AMERICANS: From what I read in the CIA documents the US has killed over 6 millions. Bradley should devote a special article[if he dares] to publish for all the world (who knows) anyway,and then accuse Israel who's life has been threatened for 61+ years,and continuous unabated.

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A heart felt thanks for the LOVE you have toward MY COUNTRY ISRAEL. TYou do approve us warts and all. We do not have many warts--except for the likes of the detractors of anti-Israel/IDF who come here from to delegitimize MY country writing spurious posts from their comfort of their chairs we call" ARMCHAIR WARRIORS" with nothing but spewing derogatory and hatefulness. Now with this latest by Bradley they will prolong the agony. Bravo Brad' you sure downgraded your reputation by joining the other [your] Partners in crime who's names I will not disclose for they are WELL KNOWN here to many. To Bradley: Please,please return to your beloved country the USA,because that is where you BELONG. My disappointment with you,especially on this suject has reached its APOGEE. I comend the IDF/IAF even if the accusation on the Dubai episode was carried by our Mossad(which is suspect,not proven)Congratulations to them IF INDEED IT WAS THEM.

....when it comes to the "Holy Book", but if I am not too ill informed, then at least for the Jewish religion the outcome will not be a very happy one, should it really come to such a (final) showdown one day.