IDF training Israeli settlers ahead of 'mass disorder' expected in September
West Bank settlers to receive tear gas and stun grenades to prepare for 'Operation Summer Seeds'.
By Chaim Levinson Tags: West Bank Palestinians IDFThe IDF has conducted detailed work to determine a “red line” for each settlement in the West Bank, which will determine when soldiers will be ordered to shoot at the feet of Palestinian protesters if the line is crossed. It is also planning to provide settlers with tear gas and stun grenades as part of the defense operation.
The IDF is currently in the process of finalizing its preparations for Operation Summer Seeds, whose purpose is to ready the army for September and the possibility of confrontations with Palestinians following the expected vote in favor of Palestinian statehood at the UN General Assembly.
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IDF troops taking positions in Qalandia next to a mural of Yasser Arafat during Naksa Day unrest. |
| Photo by: Reuters |
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According to a document acquired by Haaretz, the main working assumption of the defense establishment is that a Palestinian declaration of independence will cause a public uprising “which will mainly include mass disorder.”
The document states the disorder will include “marches toward main junctions, Israeli communities, and education centers; efforts at damaging symbols of [Israeli] government.
Also, there may be more extreme cases like shooting from within the demonstrations or even terrorist incidents. In all the scenarios, there is readiness to deal with incidents near the fences and the borders of the State of Israel.”
As part of its preparations, the IDF is investing a great deal of effort in preparing the settlers for the incidents, with the main concern being confrontations between Israeli settlers and the Palestinians.
Yesterday the army held training sessions for the chief security officers of settlements at a military installation near Shiloh. In recent weeks the IDF has been training the readiness squads of settlements at the Lachish base, which is used as a command training center ahead of September.
The main message the army is issuing is that the demonstrations will be controlled and that the army has sufficient forces in order to deal with every disturbance. In order to be sure, there is also a decision, in principle, to equip the chief security officers of settlements with the means for dispersing demonstrations. These would include tear gas and stun grenades, although that would create a logistical problem as there’s a shortage of means for firing that type of ammunition.
Moreover, as part of the preparations, staff work was performed in which the commander of the platoon responsible for defending each settlement patrolled the area with the chief security officer of the settlement, in order to identify weak points.
The army is establishing two virtual lines for each of the settlements that are near a Palestinian village. The first line, if crossed by Palestinian demonstrators, will be met with tear gas and other means for dispersing crowds.
The second line is a “red line,” and if this one is crossed, the soldiers will be allowed to open fire at the legs of the demonstrators, as is also standard practice if the northern border is crossed.
Each map was approved by the regional brigade commander, and the IDF force that is deployed to the area will be ready to respond on the basis of the lines determined.
As part of the preparations, GOC Central Command Maj. Gen. Avi Mizrahi is planning to issue a message to the settlers. The settlers are pressing for the message to include specific instructions on how they should behave if threatened, such as in cases where the roads are blocked or settlements are breached by demonstrators.
There is concern at the IDF, and especially from the Military Advocate General, that any such instructions will be interpreted as rules of engagement by the settlers.
Also, during the past week the National Emergency Management Authority at the Defense Ministry sent letters to the heads of settlements in which they wrote that “difficulties in supply of fuel and gas are expected, and the owners of stations should be ordered to have full loads of fuel. It is also recommended that the owners of grocery stores should ensure they have sufficient stores. Patrols around the electricity and water supply installations and communications lines should be increased.”
Moreover, the letters said that government offices will be on standby, starting on September 19.
At the Emergency Authority they warned the settlements that the stepped-up readiness will last at least several weeks.
An IDF spokesman said: “The IDF is holding an ongoing professional dialogue with elements in the settlement leadership, with the routine security personnel, and is investing many resources in training forces, from a defensive standpoint and in readiness for possible scenarios. The Central Command has recently completed much training for the emergency response squads, and this training is ongoing. Naturally, we are unable to go into details on the operational readiness of the IDF.”
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Kahanists made up the membership of the internationally recognised and outlawed terrorist group Kachs. Israel now arms outlawed terrorists to protect their illegal settlements....disgusting!
That would be the best of all options!
It's amazing how Israel thinks about the well being of the Arab people more than their leaders do. We are trying to prevent them from hurting themselves. This is beyond kind, it is total compassion for humanity and the sacredness of life. We will keep our M16s near just in case.
This one must be a piece of Cake ! It will bring the Palestinian Leaders running to the negotiation table. This is what the Palestinians will be told by the bulk of nations to avoid almost a world war. This war if it happen the Palestinians can't afford it financially or any otherwise .
Why not tear the curtain of pretense aside once and for all and issue them uniforms with advance troop insignias. That's what they are.
With Hashem's Help we will push our enemy out of Israel.
The United Nation can give recognition but it can't give a freehold ownership of a new state. If ownership is possible just by having the right numbers of votes; the Kurds & Bosnia and others could have been States instantly and without the need to fight for a statehood.
The United Nation can give recognition but it can't give a freehold ownership of a new state. If ownership is possible just by having the right numbers of votes; the Kurds & Bosnia and others could have been States instantly and without the need to fight for a statehood.
How about some real negotiations and a settlement freeze instead of arming settlers. If not now, when? A decent, representative governent in Jerusalem might be a better solutions.
Let's put it in simple language so that even US. pro Israel fanatics can understand: this is another way to prepare the next IDF 's crimes against occupied Palestine. Let the ilegal settlers shoot.
A country called Palestine NEVER EXISTED. The refuges are from Egypt, Jordan, and Syria. In 1948 Jordan illegally seized the old city - which was supposed to be under international control. They expelled all Jews and blocked them from Jewish holy
sites. In 1967 Israel liberated lands DID NOT EXPEL the Arab populace - AND - opened places of worship to ALL religions, When Arab terror stops - there will be no need for armed settlers.
Whoever thought of it will be Jihad man of the month. The only solution to ongoing conflict is negotiations between the two parties for a permanent resolution, which neither side apparently wants, because it would require comprimise. Arming settlers will be grotesquely counter productive and provoke the level of violence exponentially. Bibi, wake up. You will be the premier of israel during the establishment of the Palestinian state you so long blocked and stymied.
The settlers are armed with rifles and sub-machine guns, and they are liable to use them. If the IDF wants to arm the settlers with stun grenades, I suggest they exchange these less lethal weapons for the Uzis. Do not compound the existing problem. So far, it seems that after a long learning process, the Palestinians are going to act like Gandhi and Martin Luther King. But the settlers might attempt to disabuse them of the idea of non-violence. It will be a shame.
The "settlers" are the vicitims here, not the arabs. These people are taking back Eretz Yisroel from the P'lishtim interlopers and should be supported by all who believe in HaShem. Stop talking for the NWO and UN with your foolish greek mindset. You don't really know what you're talking about. Go live there and walk in their shoes before judging the rightful owners of Israel.
The settlers will defend themselves if attacked. It is a VERY rare occurrence that settlers initiate the violence. It may be good for your misguided opinion but I haven't seen a settler carrying an UZI in years yearsyears.outdated weapon.
Can You say Isaiah 17 and Psalms 83. To the Palestinians who will be left standing? It won't be who you think.
That is called mafia
Your search for compromise seems somewhat hidden!
WHOSE victory?"The final decision" is also well-known thing.Try to defend your own a..shole.
The ball is in their court.
When confronted with a perceived threat, the settlers will not use tear gas or stun grenades. They will use lethal force, which they already possess in abundance. What the Israeli government is actually doing is validating the "threat" so the settlers will not hesitate to use the lethal force.
.then great...but let them celebrate amongst themselves and wait for the next logical step.It does not mean they should immediately look for confrontation. If they do look for confrontation then it will happen and people on both sides will get hurt. No need for that. Celebrate ...do not confront.
Arbitrary “red lines” without marking to delineate limits is means to justify the killing of unarmed protestor. The universal excuse will be “ aimed at the legs”. In addition to training the settlers the government is arming them, WHY NOT PUBLISH A NOTICE THAT IT IS OK TO KILL THE NON-JEW.
I,ve had moltov cocktails thrown at my car and been shot at driving through arab areas - my car was clearly marked as a rental - I was a non-Jewish tourist. The Jews have a right to defend themselves. Arab terrorism killed our fellow Americans on 9/11. We reresponded with force
responded with force. The Jews should be allowed to do the same and defend themselves.
Civilians have attacked our troops in nam, afganastan and almost in every field of battle we have been in. We as Americans have responded with live fire when push came to shove. Are we holier than the Jews you obviously hate? Be consistent. Jews have the right to dfend themselves
Were the civilians unarmed like the Palestinians are going to be.
Once again Israel has got it completely wrong.It would be far more appropriate if the settlers were given flowers to present to the Palestinians and Palestinian flags to hang from their homes.
The arab response would be continued terror. The same response they gave when Israel gave back Gaza.
The IDF should drag this bunch of NoGoods right back to Queens. Problem solved.
You mean the same HEROs who responded to settle the liberated lands when Israel begged people to do so?
u-haul trucks, fill them with their possession and wait for the queue. drive straight to european and american embassies to get visas then leave for their true homeland
they are a light unto the nations.
Israel allows freedom of religion and did not expel Arabs from Israel. The Arabs on the other hand prevented Jews from visiting their places of worship and expelled the Jewish population untill Israel liberated the territories in 67.
she is being sarcastic.
No matter what you say on this short mind finger-up finger-down clicking contest but arabs will have theirs noses bleading again. And only thinks i don't like that Israelis will use non lethal weapons to stop zombies.
the battle of algiers
I think every People in the world should have the same rights as Israel and the US to have whatever weapons they want.
I guess the rockets they are firing into Israel, the kalatchnakov rifles they fire at Israeli civilians, the moltov cocktails the arabs through - all don't count as weapons in your eyes.
Old Chinese made (and often jammed) AKs, 200 dollar rockets they put together themselves, and rocks hard equal tanks and planes and phosphorus bombs. Hopefully there will be no violence, but Israel stopped being the victim when they became ridiculously more powerful than the other side. Terror continues because of Israeli actions.
Israel training the criminal settlers. Just what we need. I hope that these settlers will be hit so hard that they will beg to go back to the hell hole they came from and take Netanyahu and the rest of his criminal government with them.
Placeing their lives on the line to defend Israel - while you sit on your glutomus maximus in Haifa.
I've personally witnessed settlers in their 20's beating Palestinian children, below the age of 8 years old, this is done to intimidate their parents to leave their homes.
How could anyone hate israel? This beloved nation of occupation, annexation, wall-building, settlement-building, semi-apartheid, blockade, collective punishment, rejection of peace, rejection of law etc How could anyone possibly hate israel?
HATE that started well before 1948 towards the Jews, The Jews learned these beloved skills from the HATEFUL Arabs, Fascist friends and useful Idiots to survive and respond to the TERROR against the state of Israel. Occupation = Disputed (UN242) Annexation = Disputed (UN242) Wall-Building = Security needed to stop suicidal maniacs killing civilians. Settlement-building = Agreed, Illegal settlements must go... but NOT ALL are illegal, and Jerusalem can not be 'divided' by foreigners to suit the Arabs and Jew Haters, Jews have been living in Jerusalem since the time of the Romans and the area is disputed. Semi-apartheid = Spin YOU are trying to place on Israel. Plain old BS. Blockade = For Gaza, rightly so till rocket/mortar attacks cease. Collective Punishment = You mean the skirts and children the HAMAS fighters hide behind, the people who voted in the LOVE charter towards the State of Israel, or do you mean the Israeli people who run to a shelter for fear of being hit by rockets/mortars? Rejection of peace = Every compromise, eg. Land for Peace has resulted in more attacks against the State of Israel, not less, Agreed, the Arabs are against peace. Shalom to Israel, but not at the expense of it's peoples, full sympathies to it's people who have tried to make peace with all around. Seeing your venom against Israel Mr Tonly Silver validates the wickedness that is aimed at the nation of Israel and it's people hence bringing more support for Israel.
I thought not.
Settlers don't try to enter the arab villages.
You would think that Talkbackers want the Settlers to enter the arab villages!, no way, why lower the moral standards? Why push a violent agenda!
When they burn their houses, vandalize their mosques, and beat their children. Seriously, these events happen frequently enough. Much more often than so called attacks on settlers.
Netanyahu is preparing for Israel's final stand His Ghadaffi moment, arming the citizenry in the folorn hope that they will be able to fight off the rebels, in this case normal decent Israelis and the Palestinian people
who thought this up? crazy provokation that will make all previous intifadas look like child's play. the only intelligent course was to stop expansion of settlements and negotiate. bibi will hide in israel and make Peres take the flack at the UN.
Settlers are being trained in order to provoke and they are the ones who will start the fighting not the Palestinians. Looks like Bibi is starting up anew kind of IDF, not knowing that in the future they will turn on Israel once they will be told to leave the illegal settlements.
Here is the IDF: the most powerful army in the Middle East - by a long, long way - and it so apprehensive about its ability to face up to civilian protest that it is arming a vigilante force. The moral that can be drawn from that is this: colonies established inside occupied territory are not defensible. You might want to contemplate that, because That Ain't Exactly The Message You Dudes Want To Send To The World.
There is so many different worlds and i don't really like yours but witch one you talking about?
Really, how much does it cost the USA to maintain this pointless outpost of empire? Are you worth it? In dollars, in reputation, in American blood?
so it is about money
Better spend $$ on our own people
and leave these poor people in peace, on their own land, in their own country
can we mess with the rich pals then? they're probably actually the land owners anyways.
I suspect the confrontation problems will not occur at the large built up settlements but at the small illegal outposts that are scattered all around area C. The relatively few people living in each outpost are going to be quick to shoot if facing a large contingent of Palestinians - and not at their feet. I hope the people living in these outposts leave before mutual violence occurs.
The question becomes, why does a population go violent when events go their way?
You can only blame . Indeed, as foreign minister in 1998, former Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said Israelis should "run and grab as many hilltops as they can". This proves that Israeli leaders are obsessive-neurotic-paranoid with delusions of grandeur.
This is scaremongering and giving the settlers a license to kill! Then Israel doesn't have to investigate and slap a settler on the wrist. If you think the settlers will not go looking for targets, I have a bridge to sell you.
what do you do when stones are thrown at you??? throw one back or run and hide, leave everything behind?? f that,
You go home to israel and leave the Palestinians to live in peace on their land
I suspect the confrontation problems will not occur at the large built up settlements but at the small illegal outposts that are scattered all around area C. The relatively few people living in each outpost are going to be quick to shoot if facing a large contingent of Palestinians - and not at their feet. I hope the people living in these outposts leave before mutual violence occurs.
Now I have your attention, lets put somethings straight: 1) Settlers are not extremists - the government gave people the choice to live there, and they accepted. The vast vast vast majority are law abiding people (as in all countries). 2) Israel has strict gun laws and allows people to carry guns if needed. People who live in 'dangerous' areas are allowed to own a gun (as long as they pass rigorous testing and profiling). So many men already own guns for their own safety (and very little shooting incidents occur unlike in schools in the US). The fact that there are so few incidents compared to US, UK (where guns aren't even allowed!), Norway, shows these people are responsible. 3)Giving the settlers these extra non-lethal deterrents will help prevent a full intifada and help to prevent a loss of lives.
what the hell is the israeli army doing, arming the settlers is the same as arming al qaida or any terror group!! this is not acceptable, if the settlers fire their arms against palestinian unarmed citizens the war will start, but i doubt these settlers have 3 million bullets with 100% accuracy of shooting to kill.
Never again means NEVER again. No retreat, no surrender.
Just make peace.....you idiots. Lines based on the 1967 borders with mutually agreed upon land swaps. Share East Jerusalem. Allow refugees to return to Palestine and compensate the vast majority who will choose not to......get over it, Greater Israel is a pipe dream. You barely have enouch JEws in the world to expand settlements..... Just Do It.
No wagging fingers at the despicable terrorists though, oh no. Only at the Jews defending themselves.
It seems more and more clear that Israel is in fact turning into SOuth AFrica ca. 1980. Or Rhodesia. The tactic of no negotiation and use of extreme violence against civilians... Fascism.
Would you prefer they fire live gun fire?
Settlers are illegal, they should go back to Brooklyn once and for all.
Obviously it is evident that this Occupation of the West Bank charade is in fact a smoke screen to hide Arab real intentions.They want more than West Bank,they want all of Palestine from the river to the sea as they say themselves....is Israel in Palestine by any chance?
AND NEVER WILL BE.
there are millions of arabs willing to storm the fences of the setttlements and risk getting hurt or killed, and thus justify their rabid israel hatred. this is the worst possible scenairo as it has drawn red lines that will be breached. so what should israel do? Negotiate immediastely, stop building, and talk of borders and jerusalem. with the sinai a porous threat, israeli forces cannot cover all the settlements as well. bibi has no plan but stalled and delayed. chickens coming home to roost will be Israel's most dangerous hour.
The same existential threat to Israel persists today as it has for some 63 years now. Israel wants to negotiate, Pals refuse to deal with a PM they don't like, and want to try to bully Israel into accepting their demands. One has to wonder, with Israel holding all the cards, why the Pals would repeat the same behavior over and over, expecting different results? I think Einstein had a definition for that type of behavior. He called it insanity.
the Arabs, as well as killing each other in their own countries, continue to fan hatred towards the Jews that have their own homeland, attacked by rockets from 'un-occupied lands' as well as the potential of a new Intifada from the West Bank in the name of a new State legitimised by an Anti-Jewish United Nations. The world will pay a price for not coming down harder on the Arabs for NOT seeking a peaceful route with understanding. It is indeed a most dangerous hour. For those alive today, think twice before taking on the nation of Israel who have suffered greatly for not giving up their heritage and percieved rights to the historic Holy Land.
ROFL
that is the reason Einstein refused to lead Israel.
"However, Einstein declined, and wrote in his response that he was "deeply moved", and "at once saddened and ashamed" that he could not accept it: All my life I have dealt with objective matters, hence I lack both the natural aptitude and the experience to deal properly with people and to exercise official function. I am the more distressed over these circumstances because my relationship with the Jewish people became my strongest human tie once I achieved complete clarity about our precarious position among the nations of the world."
If that child had the chance to inflict the same abuse on the abuser then Yes! An eye for an eye! The palestinian government deserve far far worse!
Because Palestinians caused the Holocaust and all the anti-Semitism in Europe. Of course!
The concept of arming civilians sounds quite familiar to me ...
All emancipated Israelis male and female, must complete IDF duty and serve in the reserves when completed. When war is declared on the country, reservists are called up.
facing the settlers stun grenades , palestinians will find justification for throwing stones and using fire arms, and the whole thing escalate into a major ongoing intifida of unprecedented animosity. israel should have negotiated years ago. bibi's stone wall cannot hold back the tsunami of history.
This is how Israelis will need to defend themselves. You're crying about tear gas to defend ourselves. We cry about your stones and terrorist acts.
Is that the Arabs have never stopped since 1948 to fight against Israel as a nation, if the Pals push too far with 'their' state in terms of bringing another fight by way of intifada against the Jews, I would not put it past the Jewish people in having had enough and waging a war against it's neighbours and the right wing of Israel will have their way pushing Arabs out of the West Bank (Samaria and Judea) not unlike how the Arabs did in their lands to the Jews.
Ahem. What if you lose?
It's look like the Kristallnacht (1938) but now the Palastinians are attacked. People will never learn.
It will be just as final...
Poor Israel---just cannot get it right.
mujadhin from all over. the settlers are the symbol of israeli chutzpah and them throwing grenades and other non lethal devices will play into the hands of palestinian extremists. zahal cannot conceibably cover all the settlements nor the borders, so the real answer was to have expedited negotiations years ago. bibi stonewalled, and will be responsible for the tsunami.
What, settlers abusing weapons? No, we know that couldn't happen. The "Canonise Baruch Goldstein" movement has given us assurances.
that they dont carry that weapons with them ?
brilliant yet flawed. partially arming settlers is a recipe for doom. it just takes one mistake to trigger a violent riot, and even if trained IDF officers are present it will be the source of unimagineable violence and repercussions. the Palestinians now have a goal, to provoke exaggerated encounters and use them to build on. reboot.
When I read the name of the operation I think of something new. New plants or a new future, I think the name is completely misplaced.
I will protect my family and land.
Thank you for defending us in Tel Aviv. Without a Jewish presence in the west bank we would be bombarded by rockets.
Nissim, we need help, we r in san francisco, get your tank ready,LoL
remember the nakba
Maybe it's time to go out of the settlements... it will be cheaper to Medinat Israel instead of sending our children learning how to kill
Arab will only see it as sign of weakness and be encouraged to attack the center of the country. You have to stand your ground and fight. If you run you will never be safe.
That might prevent escalation from either side. Good idea? Bad idea? I'm not even sure if settlements have internet.
They're illegally occupying the land.
This should not be only for the settlers, but should be extended to all Jews of the world, including those in the Diaspora outside of Israel, one people, one voice, one hand ...
If this insanity goes ahead there will almost certainly be big war. At the bare minimum Jordan and Egypt will and Turkey will completely cut off relations and isolate Israel. There will definitely be another Palestinian uprising as well. I even foresee Obama turning around and supporting the Palestinian's reasonable state bid. Why is the Israeli right so terrified for going back to the 67 borders? Israel has won all their wars for survival why can't she defend some older borders? Why is Bibi so against making meaningful concessions for a lasting peace?
Settlements are legal. In fact it is the arabs occupying Jewish land that is illegal.
you sound like one of those American tea-baggers your comment does not make any sense at all unless you are talking about New Jersey
If they get educated, learn a trade, and perhaps stop murdering Jews, they would be a little bit more welcome in Israel. Arabs worked freely for many years before they came up with this stupid claim about Israel being their land. It turns out the arabs occupy Jewish land. However, arabs do have many rights in Israel. They walk more freely in any type of clothing which would get them killed in Iran and many other arab countries. They work and would rather be in Israel than in Gaza under Hamas. Much safer option they tell me. They have Parliament members vtoing for their rights. Any Jews allowed in any arab state able to hold down that post?! Exactly, no! If I walked in their neck of the woods they would slit my throat. But they are safe to walk freely in Israel, eat in the restaurants and shop in the malls. So get the facts right before writing on here and engage your brain a little more.
who's going to keep the (now trained and armed) settlers in check? Or do we just rely on them acting decent and orderly?
stupid is as stupid does
I don't support settlements by anyone who thinks they could be evacuated needs his head examined.
the squatters can become legal citizens of a Palestinian state subject to its laws, its police and prisons
Doesn't that make the settlers by definitions armed combatants? Looking for a fight are we?
Israel supposedly a normal decent country is giving civilians the same weapons that Assad in Syria is using to slaughter hundreds if not thousands of his own people
This paints the human shield and combatant sign on each and every one. It also makes each and every settlement an official military target, so no claims of terrorism can be valid if they are attacked. Sometimes, it would be wiser if some right wingers and IDF people thought and read some of the international treaties past Israeli governments have signed and ratified.
Just being cynical
the pretense that the colonists are civilians has lost whatever tatters of defensibility it may have had. these people are part of the Israeli military. As such, perfectly legitimate targets
These "settlers" are certainly Israeli civilians. Don't try to justify the unjustifiable.The thought of Jews being able to defending themselves when attacked must really annoy you. As if your name is Josh...
Yeah... The far more likely scenario is that a lot of Palestinian farmers are going to get stun-grenades thrown at them.
If I am not too wrong, then tear gas and stun grenades can also be lethal weapons, if used indiscriminately. So the only difference between the PA and the IDF/Settlers would be, that the latter ones keep on occupying another people's land, while the first mentio- ned keep on wiith their struggle to free themselves from that pain. Make your own moral judgement about who is (more) wrong and who is (more) right here....
Well its good you began your comment with "if i am not too wrong" well you are! There is a significant difference between a defensive instrument to offensive one. This without getting into what you would call "moral Judgement". by the way when you will be part of this conflict (never mind who is wrong or right here) i mean not seat in where every European country you are and judge, people might listen to your definition of moral judgment till that point dont pretend to understand it!
Er, get your facts right love. Al Aksa are clearly terrorists aimed at murdering civilians. Israeli's are innocent civilians defending their homes. Wish it was the other way round but sadly not. The arabs occupying Jewish land should go back to the many arab countries they belong to. And the arab countries who kicked out the Jews from arab lands such as Iraq, Iran, Algeria, Libya, Yemen etc etc should compensate the Jews for the property the arabs stole from them!
could define the entire 'settlement enterprise... now organizing vigilantes to 'defend' what they have stolen likens to incitement to civil war...
More like, if I invade your home, throw you out and then you come to hurt me..........
...it has to be the last time we have war. in other words got to finish the job this time
WE WILL FINISH THE JOB THIS TIME, BEST TO TAKE NO NOTICE OF AMERICA AND ENGLAND, BECAUSE THOSE TWO COUNTRIES HAVE ALWAYS STOPED US GOING THE HOLE WAY, ESPECIALLY AMERICA.. ENGLAND HAS TO FOLLOW AMERICA BECAUSE ENGLAND IS A WEAK COUNTRY NOW,
...they'll do something wrong. Panic. Run. Endanger themselves more. Kill someone. You don't throw a fire suit and oxygen tank at the homeowner and tell them to fight their own fire. This is more difficult. Amateurish, foolish leadership of Bibi.
Disgusting, disingenuous and dangerous.
as the "order" of late is unsustainable.
The IDF cannot abandon the settlers to the palestinian masses and they must be able to defend themselves. Best that the settlers get professional training that way they know when to shoot and when not to and it will hopefully help avoid itchy trigger fingers so good the the settlers and good for the arabs.
Maybe the EU can train the Palestinians, I think thats fair. The International Court in The Haque is watching.
Since you are so worried about abandoning the settlers to the "palestinian masses," why not evacuate them? Were Americans not just evacuated to avoid the hurricane Irene? Same kind of situation.
Of course Israel could not do the most sensible thing and honour its signed agreement with the Egyptians and implement Resolution 242 and allow Palestinians autonomy and their own state. Just like Israel was lax and remiss in implementing its signed agreement under the Road Map to freeze ALL illegal settlement building. Seems Israel is disinterested in peace and telegraphs it to the world loud and clear.
Its part of the peace agreement. By the way settlers already have Automatic rifles. Why do you object to them having tear gas to fire on rioters trying to invade their homes? Would you prefer they fire live ammunition?
Yes, and you also use white phosphorous against civilians.
The idea is nuts. Even if only a few do it, Pricetaggers will invade towns and villages and use the weapons. The only place where peaceful order will be maintained is in Area A where full PA security is in place.
Clinton Blamed Arafat in 2000 for not taking a deal and not Aggas by insisting opon 67 borders and a "wrong of return" for so called refugees leaves little to talk about. And, when the Pal Spring goes by way of winter they too will have little to show.
for the settlements in the West Bank? No settlements, no settlers, no need for unrest.
... especially because the legitimate owners will be so close at hand...
and you never will.
why not hire blackwater and other mercenaries for wholesale slaughter of palestinians? i hear eric prince in nearby... then again, the violent and often brutally neurotic settlers ARE mercenaries unleashed on unarmed, civilian, indigenous population. SHAME ON YOU IDF! just watch the world reaction and mass boycotts after videos of hooligans killing unarmed protestors flood the internet. if God gave you the land, does HE need you to defend HIS gift with arms? not much of a God then, eh?
Getting ready to invade Iran for the greater glory of some Gulf State.
Richard Dawkins was too gentle when he spoke of the ugliest, nastiest character in fiction and they tried to build a country around this nonsense? Oh! the USA makes two countries
we will win this, the world will side with palestine especialy after the first shot!
You will lose and many will die, but you will lose.
You might want to reconsider i.e. Israel always maintains a distinction between (a) the peace-loving and oh-so-innocent settlers and (b) the army that must - simply must! - protect those Innocent's Abroad. But once the (a)'s start fighting alongside the (b)'s then the world will simply see a brutish occupier and its thuggish colonists. Do you really want to see that plastered all over the world's press?
Every time IDF protects its citizens, they are automatically accused of excessive force. So who is better than "Jewish qassams", Johnny? Armed settlers against terrorists. Is that fair & square? Ohterwise, how else could I have responded to the suddenly outrageous lefty moralists. Fogel family wasn't in Gaza. Maybe if they had that ammo back than, they still be laughing at the numerous Pal terror appologists suggesting they brought that heinous crime upon themselves.
I understand that you have a "need" for vengeance, sure. But in the world of the here-and-now how does Israel think that this development will be to its advantage? The IDF is by far the mightiest army in the Middle East, and if it can't defend the settlements without arming some ragtag vigilantes then why was it such a good idea to place those settlements there in the first place?
I don't think they need more training, their daily terror against the Palestinians, reached above the limits
Evacuate the precious settlers right now, before it is too late.
We here in America are also looking toward some "civil unrest" come election time. I'm not asking for violence, but I am prepared for it if it comes.
It's time to get with the program... it's not about "me! me! me!" anymore... toughen up buttercup - the party is over. Civil unrest will make no change to the direction the USA is heading and has been on target for years. Paying a taxes and not spending beyond your means might turn things around but civil unrest will do squat.
We've been getting hit with rocket attack for years. Perhaps you and your loved will experience the same - hopefully not.
who piggy-back on grass roots Pals to leverage its own hateful agenda
so when was the last rocket-attack originating in the Westbank? Please enlighten me!
They don't need to be hijacked by extremist elements. Could be entirely peaceful or civil disobedience like the social protests. The pali's will get tear gassed by settlers then shot when they cross the line no matter how peaceful. Compare with Jewish protests
So Mohamed, what democracy do you live in? I'm sure you speak of it from experience, right? Syria? Saudi Arabia? Egypt? Yemen? Lebanon? Algeria? Morocco? Nigeria? Sudan? Iran? Places of true morality and upstanding governments, where democracy, rule of law, and human rights are virtues to be honored and respected. I'm just saying... takes one to know one.
If the Pals stay on their side of the fence and away from the Jews there will be no trouble. If they breech the fences, there will be casualties. The Pals can come to the table, they really do have to do this. Israel can not leave their citizens to the tender mercies of the Arabs-That Would Be a Disaster!
Indeed, the Arab Spring will give momentary democracy when the Arabs will choose Sharia Law and cease being a democracy out of choice, truly submitting to this Islamic ideology, and squandering an opportunity to have true freedom of choice.
that Israel will never leave the Westbank and if fact will do anything, even arm and train a hooligan-settler mini-army to stay on those precious lands..... Well....might as well annex it than if you/re not going to let it go, like, ever
That stood in the way of Palestinian statehood with Plan Dalet. Now they are using the Kahanist settlers in some other unnamed plan. Will anyone in IDF that is honest enough please tell us what letter of the Alphabet they are on since Plan Dalet was executed? Perhaps its up to numbers by now. With the world watching lets see what happens when they try to take the west bank from the Palestinians and arab armies go to their aid..will they try to claim once again that they were attacked?
So these ultra Zionists are being assisted by the State by of Israel by way of arms and training (as if they arnt already armed to the teeth). Given the illegal nature of these people's claim to 'Greater Israel', I hope that there are enough foreign cameras to record the brutality of these people and the cowards that hide behind them. These people should not be armed by the State of Israel, they should be forceably removed, forced to give up their illegal land aquisition and made to pay compensation to the traditional owners of the land.
Compare And Contrast.....
whats the connection with the australian aborigines???,we are talking about the West Bank,an occupied territoty under the international law,nobody recognises the settlement but the far right wing occupans,they should live with the Iranian Ayatollah ir in Saudia Arabia,same thing with different colour!!
What a perfect way to create paranoia.
We would accept older tanks and leave the top of the lines one for the IDF.
What's the matter? Can't you remember the example of Bashaar al-assad? How soon they forget!!!
In 1920,.Haganah was born to protect Jews against Arab terror.90 years later,Jews are organizing another Haganah like movement to stop (again) Arab massacres against innocent people like Fogel family.Arab mentality did not change.I wonder how many of 9/11 terrorists were Arabs....
Am y'israel chai
ISRAEL PREPARING ISRAELS for the coming war. In September Israel Will Attack Iran. Training civilians has great significance that showing a big war to come
and should be legitimate target
wchich means fight with settlers
so you hide behind your cildren ?
great job IDF, that will make an already illegal settlement that much more friendly. And should you ever get the common sense to evict them, I'm sure they won't use these against you or anything...
Very sad, but that is what happens when you move to a hostile neighborhood. I never contemplated moving into the dangerous part of town, where I knew that people of my ilk would be the obvious targets.
so when the Israelis do something wrong they are to blame (which i agree) but when a baby is soldered in its bad with a knife she was living in the wrong place, or when a family drove in the south of Israel and murdered in their car they what took a wrong turn. Really people you claim to seek morality how about you start with setting a standard and judge all by the same standards!
OK, lets start with the law of Thou Shall Not Steal. So you stole the land that did not belong to you, no one but jews think its their and only based on their own religion, yet you expect the whole world to bow downt o your religion and your desires? Tough. THOU SHALL NOT STEAL - you stole and everything that has come since then is all your own making. Simple to judge now? The palestinians were there legally, the palestinians did not drive you from israel, that happened centuries ago and even according to some of your own rabbi's taking the land by force like this is AGAINST your own religious teachings. So tell me again, morally, who wronged who first?
It's also going to put the screws to Obama who will be caught between sensible policy on one hand and fundamentalist Republicans on the other who will be the settler's cheerleaders when they start bashing Palastinian heads. What an impossibly screwed up situation the settlers have put Israel into. Israel's ultimate choice will be to do some combination of ethnic clensing and bantustans on one hand, or retreat into pre-'67 Israel with emboldened and outraged Pals for whom peace and a two state solution are not on the agenda. Got to hand it to the religious nationalists. Those unlettered and narrowminded folks who never read a Shakespeare tragedy sure managed to conjure up one all by themselves. Wish I could skip the ending on this one. I suspect that it will make the last act of Hamlet look like a nice family get together.
Israel put itself into this situation by giving the land thieves support and protection. Israel could have, and still could, stop this PR disaster, but they won't.
Am Israel Chai...
is much more educative, interesting, arousing, amusing, exciting than reading the Torah. Besides, no one seems to understand the Torah, why do they have to keep reading it over and over and over and discussing and discussing. Not for me!
understand and perfect their world and by extension the non torah world. the Torah and the people who read it are the basis for western civilization. Jewish achievement , which far exceeds, any other starts with the Torah. whatever Shakespeare wrote was written long before in the Torah. the Torah is very interesting if you think. If you don't then the torah is certainly not for you
Overall the perceived Jewish achievements in arts and culture etc may well be offset/degraded by the Jewish bankers in the US who at all levels have severely 'mismanaged' (I'm being generous) the economy... So may we add the Lehman shock as an 'achievement' also???... Better to be quite and definitely less arrogant as people will begin to dislike you...
Overall the perceived Jewish achievements in arts and culture etc may well be offset/degraded by the Jewish bankers in the US who at all levels have severely 'mismanaged' (I'm being generous) the economy... So may we add the Lehman shock as an 'achievement' also???... Better to be quite and definitely less arrogant as people will begin to dislike you...
maybe this blatant act of lawlessness will cause obama to grow a large pair, not veto the UN vote, and deport all AIPAC lobbyists.
Many Israelis carry guns. They serve in the army. Giving them tear gas canisters isn't going to impact their ability to fight an army. In fact, giving the settlers clear instructions will make them less likely to take matters into their own hands (as people might tend to do when they see a mob headed toward their house).
When you project violence, you receive violence. This does not sound like an act from G-d loving heart. It sounds like violent fear.
Idiot.
How about : Plan for war, live in peace! Or, those who beat their swords into pruning hooks will prune for those who don't!
Because the people who respond to Palestinian extremism with vandalizing mosques and beating children can be trusted to do the right thing with training and weaponry.
and the Palestinians fire upon the vehicle, then in the words of Ehud Barak, the Palestinians are guilty of terrorism. On the other hand, if the Israelis gun down demonstrators inside the occupied Palestinian territories, its justified self-defence. Quite dizzying heights of hypocrisy, really.
have been blown up by Israel, and I do not mean just Operation Cast Lead, houses have been blown up in the many "incursions" to locate terrorists in the West Bank.
The settlers and all Israelie's have the right to protect themselves and their families. I live in america and I tell you that the majority of americans have a gun and most have several. Anyone tresspases on my property I will not hesitate to let them meet Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson who lives with me, they inter at their own risk. I would like to enourage all Jews living anywhere, but especially Israel, shoot first and take names later. Learn self defense and teach it to your children because these morans does not care about you or your family. They are well known to be baby killers. The hell what anyone says against protecting yourself. Hang tuff!!!
Thanks goodnes in civlised countries fools like you are not allowed to have guns. Pathetic.
they intend to fight shoulder to shoulder with the militarized colonists to expel the palestinians from "judea and samaria"
i HATE MY COUNTRY!!!!!
This land was not given to Joshua/ Moses and the rest on a silver spoon. The command was to fight for each inch of Grain, by force. So it is high time Israel armed all Jews to drive the enemy back to the Arabian Pensular. Indeed Palestine is nothing but Israel other name. A name by an other will smell just as sweet.
Israel is the only country in the world where such a nonsence is used in a political dispute
Not so! America has Manifest Destiny.
The rule of the worlds most barbaric and deceitful regime and its army is coming to an end for forever. I do not know how they will survive when their poisonous rule will come to an end in the occupied territories as they are not used to living without cruelity.
What you see is Jews arming themselves to defend every settlement. I have no idea how that translates into 'the occupation is coming to an end'.
That is the reality. There are no vigilanties.
If arabs do not threaten israeli land there will be no problem. If they insist on storming checkpoints let them come the citizens will be prepared. Why do palestinians think they will ever be handed israeli land, its as hopeful as a fairy tale mohammed
the point is that the Westbank is NOT Israeli land! they are defending land that"s not really theirs to defend. Bit screwed up I'd say
warned jordan not to attack us in 67. no prize for agressors.
we attacked first. but you forgot to mention little things like egypt kicking the un forces ot of synai desert and inserting large forces all of the sudden, blocking tyran naval passage doing a naval seige on israel, other arab forces massing in the west bank (jordanian, egyptian and expenditionary from s.arabia and iraq) the syrian support of PLO terrorism and blocking the water flow to jordan river. what you said was correct but without the real context, so your not a liar but half a liar (which is not so different).
And a few flamethrowers for when the Religion of Peace starts lobbing Molotov cocktails at Jewish kindergartens.
Most people cannot shoot the .44 magnum well enough to be effective. The 12 guage is limited to about 50 meters. Stick to what works: M-16 rifles, seven spare magazines and 300 rounds of frangible ammo per "settler".
How many residents of Shomron do you know probably none.Well guess what most are peace loving friendly hard working human beings ,how do i know well i just happen to know quite a few of them.
Or do you just read about them on websites that reinforce your own viewpoints? Most are not "racist thugs." They're regular people who moved to a settlement because it's cheaper to live there. To Haaretz: this article is rather unclear. Are individual settlers being armed or just the security chiefs? Honestly not clear from this article.
Be careful that G-d is not uprooting you.....
than the arabs in israel, you know (actually i have the feeling you dont know) those in lod, ramla, haifa, in the south, the triangle area and so on, must also leave and go to the new palestine. you cant demand one country for the arabs (if we ignore for a second that they have many other...) and another both for jews and arabs, which might turn into an arab country aventually and them merge with the neigbouring palestine.
IDF must provide settlers with guns,ammunition, grenades, and LOTS of them.
How, exactly, do you suggest that those weapons have gone from the Gaza Strip to the West Bank, Aron?
... all the Lefties and anti-Jews now getting frothy mouthed by this concept. Up until now, their expressed attitude was that any violence the Pals did was perfectly OK because of the (pick one or more: Occupation, Fence, Home Construction, Checkpoints, Blockade, Matzo Balls) Funny how a little common sense precaution can freak out a coward.
frothy? damn right I'm frothy.
They sealed themselves off. Israel wirhdrew and received thousands of rockets and terror attacks. What would u do.
They sealed themselves off. Israel wirhdrew and received thousands of rockets and terror attacks. What would u do.
I wil bring my own rifle and ammo!!! Huh? Please!Please! Pretty please!!!!!!
Wow! This is the next best thing to being given a life-time free terrorist hunting license and a bucket of ammo!j
Netanyahu has made it ABSOLUTELY clear what the intentions of Israel are. To start a war which will justify the ethnic cleansing of Judea and Samaria.
Gaza: 100% Arabs ,no Jews....West Bank: 96% Arabs,4% Jews....hmmm.It looks like ethnic cleansing is almost completed,Mark
you aren't giving any support to it. What do you guys do when the Mexicans cross the border into the US? When you shoot at them, (Arizona) Is that a declaration of war on Texas.
It is the Israelis who cross the border into the West Bank. So the Palestinians have the right to shoot at them, just as the US shoots at Mexicans crossing the border into the US. Silly GPS.
Actually we don't shoot at them. INS rounds them up and puts them on a plane home. Not very exciting.
It is about to hit the bottom.
To ensure that mass slaughter will happen in September. Who arms people who have a long record of committing crimes including murder? Who arms people who have every reason to cause disorder and strife? Who wishes to ensure that what ever happens in September it results in an infitada which will benefit none but Settlers and the IDF?
You have no credibility here.
then so can tear gas and stun grenades when used by settlers.
who arms such people? those who hope to create a pretext for the expulsion of the palestinians from the west bank, that's who
The PLO has tanks, armored personnel carriers, RPGs, heavy MG, sniper rifles, mortars, rockets, bombs, and we need more than flash grenades and tear gas. We need mortars, we need heavy cal. MGs, we need flax jackets, rifles, handguns , RPGs, and plenty of ammo. We request light tanks too, todah.
Israel...
that Isrelis are not compatable with the Palestinians. Perhaps they are the ones who should leave Palestine......at least from the illegally occupied and settled lands.
ever hear of Pakistan and India? Gandhi approved of that population transfer because he knew there could never be peace any other way... Learn some history
holy mosesjesusbuddhamohamed and all lesser gods!!!! are they arming the hooligan settlers for PREEMPTIVE attack on future protestors? protestors who will inevitably include righteous israelis and brave internationals? where's the US/UN outcry?
When fighting the PLO anti-democratic killers and their fascist bought off internationalist allies this is very humane of Israel.However, If the PLO and fascist international attack liberated Judea there should be a high price.
despite what they may tell you, arabs in israel rarely protest peacefully. If they had the opportunity they would do as much damage as they could
with all due respect, the world saw arabs of many nations protest peacefully and in a dignified manner despite being brutally beaten and killed. as for people under occupation, well... does anyone expect them to give flowers and chocolate to the occupiers?
yeh, not a good idea
After the Palestinian state is formed there will be a steady pressure on Palestinians to examine where settlers are located. The past Israeli position, basically "No negotiation, we own whatever we want to own" will be catastrophic. Masada 2 high tech.
Again.
The standard issue should be an M-16, 7 magazines and 300 rounds of frangible ammo. Then assign seven 'settlers' to each squad of IDF and intermingle them with the soldiers. When September has passed, let the 'settlers' keep the guns and ammo. If they use up their ammo, issue them some more. Note to 'settlers': Police up your empty brass. It can be reloaded and issued again.
The definition of a democracy is that only law enforcement officers operating according to law have the power to use force. Israel, as an apartheid state, of course, does not abide by that stricture. Suppose the government of the U.S. were to are "Christian Self-Defense Patrols" against the non-christian population.
Tthe analogy leads one to ask: How long have you lived in the United states?
Take off the "Christian" part, and that in fact is what you have in many areas of the U.S.-Mexican border. The army cannot be everywhere at once.
Read up on Nathan Bedford Forrest
No doubt these Lions of Judah will use the weapons responsibly. Good to see a modern Western democracy like Israel forming militias as well. I'm sure this will end perfectly.
comes from the settlers on their rampages and the haredim in their ghettos.
They are the biggest threat to Israel today!
The whole idea stinks. Israel is beginning to arm unruly civilians, to cause further bloodshed? This is really ridiculous.
In that the Palestinians WILL attack the Israelis and cause as much injury or death to Jews, would it not be better if the PA and all concerned tell their people to stay away from the disputed Settlers?
Good idea to be prepared. Non-lethal dispersal methods.
M-16s are better dispersal tools when equipped with seven magazines and 300 rounds of frangible ammo. There is no recidivism when they are properly applied!
Was Crossed the first day you Israelis allowed a Jewish settler into the Palestinian Lands under Occupation by Israel. That is the only red line that has been crossed and now you will keep killing but it does not alter the fact that Israel is still occupying and oppressing an entire people.
Pardon me but is handing the settlers Stun Grenades and Tear Gas really necessary ? I'm sure they're armed to the teeth already and many have used their weapons " in self defense" against shepherds, Palestinian civilians and peace activists .
were kicked out of your ancestral home and driven into the desert for 60 years, and when you asked why you were told because god gave the land to another people, would you fight for it? I would.
So now we've got, IDF, IAF & IDS
best news of the time KOL HAKAVOD TO IDF and ISRAELI we will defend our home land and family leftist stay out of it akiv eldar move out
Either Haaretz is scooping the competition or is making up the story. I just visited 3 other Israeli news sites and the Palestinian Maan news. Not a word about this story.
Chaim is, indeed, claiming a scoop. He does so right here: "According to a document acquired by Haaretz,"
mind you when the Syrian army is trying to protect their assets from extremists they are condemned, but it's o.k for israel to do so, even worse is they are arming civilians, sound familiar?.
Assad has already done it, his father killed 30,000 of them and stayed in power. Israel? oh, shooting them in the lags bather you ah?
A lot of dead people could attest to that.
Shooting at the heads is a better deterent. It prevents recidivism. Just ask Bashaar al-Assad.
ISN'T THAT WHAT THE GOVERNMENT OF ISRAEL WAS SUPPOSED TO BE DOING ALL THIS TIME?
They should but knowing Bibi I sorely doubt it :(
I can just see the seething going on and the hateful postings to follow. I wonder sometimes why Haaretz or the writers do this. I guess anything for a paycheck and advertising money ?
and the world says nothing, incredible.
Who is this world you are referring to here...?
What happened when the three young American journalist crrosed the border into Iran? Two years later and they are still in jail!
It is Israel that has crossed the red line many years ago, 67 to be precise. As a member state of the United Nations, one must adhere to the rules and laws of the establishment. Israel's membership should have been revoked many years ago, perhaps even stripped of it's status as a state until it complies with the international bodies of law. Time to make room the newest member who is eager to have a nation to call it's own, Palestine...
You are a fool and so is anyone who things arming already heavily armed settlers is a good idea.
The Jordan river is on your GPS!
and the only one that the Americans worked really hard for the release was the spy. The other 2 a poor idiots that will probably be left to their fate.
it is you who is a fool... besides the fact that you clearly know nothing because settlers are not heavily armed, the arabs on the other hand, are!
You both are fools. What would Palestine achieve by protests-- nothing. What would Israel achieve by arming settlers -- more violent radicals which will kill their own people when settlements are evacuated.
You better read the correct histroy book, before opening your mouth, Israel was attacked in 67, she beat her attackers down then expanded the borders. Had they not been attacked they wouldn't have expanded. Israel should have destroyed the PLO in the 70's and 80's.
why is no one outraged? Because american media is afraid to cover this. Settlers will toss a stun grenade a the first Pal who sneezes. Chaos will ensue. Settlers will shoot to kill. The first anyone will hear of this is "Settlers defend themselves against violent Pal mob"