Ban Ki-moon criticizes UN Human Rights Council for singling Israel out

You're like dog shit on a shoe, although you probably smell worse.

"why should the Palestinians give into those land thieves in Israel?" Dutch continues to show her unmitigated antisemitism: Jews were never here, Arabs have all rights and declaring unconditional war on Israel's existence in '48 was correct. "It is Israeli settlements and settlers on Palestinian land" 1) What Pal land? They turned down a "land" by rejecting UNR181 2) The Arabs ethnically cleansed all Jews from that land. 3) So why does she support ethnic cleansing of Jews? "root cause of this conflict". Ahhh, so settlement that happened after '67 are the cause of war declared in '48. Poor little dutchie's backwards world. "I feel people should be good neighbors and Live and Let Live!" She lies again. She constantly supports the Arab war to exterminate Israel and the Jews (other than those who will either convert or accept dhimmi status). That's why she won't demand the Arabs unconditionally end the war they unconditionally began. None of her foaming rambles change that.

Bill, I suggest you get over your whinning about Leftist enablers. Israel is a nation that waves the flag of democracy and use its army and 21st century warfare against a civilian population. It would be unthinkable for the UN Human Rights Council not to call it into accont. It's a public responsibility. End of story! Dutch

David, Forget your unconditional surrender it is not going to happen on either side--mostly likely. Besides why should the Palestinians give into those land thieves in Israel? It is Israeli settlements and settlers on Palestinian land that's are the root cause of this conflict. Hence the total surrender should come from the Israeli side. To address the other part of your question -indeed there are vicims on both sides but ask yourself a simple question who is driving and building the settlements? It isn't the Palestinians. Please don't make things complicated when they are simple and straight forward and I don't want anyone to get beaten up. Force and violence solves nothing and only delays justice as Pope John Paul 11 told the IRA & Protestants in N. Ireland. I feel people should be good neighbors and Live and Let Live! Wouldn't it be great if the settlers came up with their own plan instead of kicking up their heels & giving us a headache? Cheers, anyway, Dutch

Well, Brant it's too bad you want to continue dig in your heels and paint this conflict and me in black and white terms. Although , I admit many aspects of the conflict that are- like the power structure between the occupier & occupied. It is completely out of banance and isn't that the problem to begin with? Israel is the brutal aggressor dictating its will to the Palestinian people on their land at point gun with its inhumane checkpoints and enclaves. Yes, Hamas is vicious but they are really like Boy scouts when one compares them to vital stats of the IDF with a 4:1 death ratio. Now that's something you are many others apologists seem to lose complete sight of and that bothers me greatly. Perhaps because you feel only Israeli life is scared or blood is red and Palestinian life is worthless and like water? I Hope you can see the issues of inequality here and can you blame me for screaming and throwing the book at Israel? Dutch

Of course, Israel accepted UNSCR242 ('67) and the Arabs rejected it multiple times, but, gosh, Camillo has some weird addiction to 1950. There's no clue where it came from but it's so far off base you know Dutch just had to pop up in support. Notice that neither demand the Arabs unconditionally end the war they unconditionally began, just lie about Israel to justify that war. Dutch, as usual, has to declare the people who have defended ourselves for 60 years somehow aren't victims. I sure that's because Jews deserve everything we get because we done killed yer lord, huh dutchie?

CASTIGATES EVERYONE ELSE !! REMARKABLE YOUR HYPOCRISY DORIS ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU DISTORT HISTORY TO DO SO !!

Hey Tossi, once again trying to google "understanding". Tossi wrote, "I TRIED to understand Canada`s dissent and therefore I did some WORK,..." Yes that is the essence of you Tossi. You are not in a job or a place in your life where you can actually experience life on the ground. Instead you pass judgment on many things you know precious little about, after doing some "WORK". Sorry my intrepid propogandist, you CANNOT GOOGLE UNDERSTANDING!!! Calling those who disagree with you "kvetchers" and questioning the loyalty of Mr. Cotler to Canada is disgusting. But you have become increasing un-couthed and rabid as of late. (I guess I bit you) Tossi, come on buddy, get out of your mom's basement and experience life. I am even willing to invite you to Karkur for a visit, or I will meet you in Tiveria. Don't be scared, hey ask mom if it's alright.

...EU, US and Canada as well as Australia have decried the nonsense... So, the EU members in HR COUNCIL are the FAKE EU member. Is that what you wanted to say? All of a sudden, probably all of them become muslims, back and forth? LOL.

I wish you were right. Israel did exactly that in 2000. We all know what the palestinian response was, and the world jumped into the "blame Israel wagon" right away-- again. When it comes to rules of engagement with the youth, it would work if the older brothers don't shoot over the youngster heads.

ps. please haaretz, ban indrajaya from using all caps. one person continually shouting in a forum is disruptive to the success of the forum. well, maybe that is indrajaya's aim?

MOSHE, thanks very much for your responses, unfortunately I have to hurry, since I'm on my way to the airport..... Just quickly 2 things: In retrospective, I would say Israel made one big mistake after the war 1967. Instead of immediately settling the West Bank, they should have used the fact that they won the war, in order to make guaranteed rights for the Jewish minority already living there part of a future peace deal with the Arabs. The whole settlement adventure simply couldn't work out well, without an accord with the Palestinians. Again, I'm not at all against Jewish life on the West Bank, but Jewish only "settlements" are simply unworthy to an open democracy like Israel, espe- cially in the 21 th century. And I have never ever said that Israel is "eternal" guilty, on the contrary, I see Israels worst guilt rather over the past few years (unwillingness to enter negotiations/try to establish facts on the ground making a 2-state solution impossible).

It is a real injustice that the world has selected Israel to be its whipping boy regarding human rights abuse when we all know that the very real human rights abuses are being committed by the nations whom are doing the accussing (China, Russia, any Moslem country). This is not to absolve Israel of any wrongdoing of course. Israel has been guilty of abuse, but given the situation it finds itself under, it is not at all surprising that this occurs. The real problem though is that this situation has been created in large part by those politically correct leftists in the West who help set this agenda and in fact encourage this obfuscation of abuse. Their seems to be some kind of knee-jerk leftism which requires that Israel be set as an example while the real abusers such as Zimbabwe, Sudan, China, Russia, et al, are given a free ride.

then i might buy myself a new shiny car...lol

I lost respect when th UN appointed Kurt Waldheim SG without thoroughly investigating his back ground. Ban Ki is restoring my confidence.

Could it be true. I would hate to think it but those names that you mentioned have hung in longer then some of the more articulate anti Israel bashers and Jew haters that have posted here over the past few years. Please don't let it be true its bad enough we have to deal with the real scum bags that post here I would hate to think we now are dealing with make believe ones.

You are right. This "Jew thing" is 2000 years old and the "Palestinian thing" is only the latest incarnation. Even western style nations that may have an agenda against Jews are smart enough to be politically correct and articulate it. The members of the UN Human Rights Council obviously have not reached that level of political correctness or should they be commended for not hiding behind political correctness?

Hello Tosefta, You might be right about how loyalty to Israel and security of world Jewry overrides political party affiliation at times. There has been so many UN resolutions against Israel, one loses count and issues of concern, but there is definitely a singling-out towards Israel given the abuses and severity of abuses of many more nations around the world. I always feel uneasy about all this because as you know I've been critical of Israeli policies at times, like many other Jews, but I don't like the onslaught of criticism, eg. academic boycotts, when Israel has made significant progress in its overtures towards peace. But concerning party affiliations again, I was surprised when a friend who was a Liberal supporter, up until last summer, joined the Conservatives because of their supportive stance towards Israel as well as he agreed with their economic policies... you know more laissez-faire..Oh hum! Whatever works.

-The PLO was founded in 1964... -PLO stands for Palistinian Liberation -Organization.. -The LEGAL occupation (due to war brought upon Israel) began in 1967 Can anyone please answer this question....what were the PLO trying to Liberate in 1964?

It was the judaio christian goverment,the children of the fathers who built the reserves.Canada has 80 land claims against them by the aboriginal people,they have been their for a hundred years,even the bigot harper said it took 15 years to even adress one.So if you think it is grand that these hypocrites side with israel,so be it.And cotler does not speak for us never has never will.

WHERE WAS PALESTINIAN LAND IN 1948 ??? THE JEWISH STAE HAD THE ONLY LAND IN 1922 JORDAN WAS SET ASIDE FOR ARABS IN 1922

As an Indonesian, Indrajaya should certainly know something about human rights violations. After all, about 200,000 people were killed by Indonesian security forces in East Timor. Oops! They don't count do they; they were Christians. Things in Aceh and Papua provinces are hardly any better. The victims here are Muslims, but the perpetrators are also Muslims, so it still doesn't count. You still have to wonder why, given Indonesia's horrendous human rights record (murders, torture, rape, beatings, and the arbitrary detention of civilians by Indonesian security forces), the HRC has to spend all of its time worrying about Israel, which, for all of its faults, has an infinitely better human rights record than Indonesia or any other member of the Organization of the Islamic Conference. Indrajaya, do you think that the fact that Israel is not a Muslim country might play a role in this special attention? That would make this special attention racism, pure and simple, wouldn't it

What makes you think that Israel has ANYTHING to do with the Lebanese shelling (usual overuse of the word "massacre", as usual, for the sake of drama) of the Palestinian refugee camp. Can you provide proof of this allegations or does claiming that provide you with some form of comfort? Do you believe that Muslim-on-Muslim killing is Israel's fault? Wouldn;t that be great for you - then you would never have to introspect about the condition of the Muslim character, right Guy of NYC?

The thing about Jews, and Cotler in particular, is that their loyalty to Israel overrides party affiliation. Different parties here mean little. I have no objection to finding out from a reliable source what the Canadian motivation was, if it had any beyond Cotler`s personal kvetching.But I wouldn`t accept speculation from another kvetcher." If there ever was any doubt about you being an Aran pisher this tells it all. Canada under Harper had been tryin to correct the mistakes under the Liberals and to you this is Kvetching except there is no such a term in Arabic so how would an Arab like you and a Hamas sympathizer know. We are on to you. You have no knowlwdge about anything pertaining to Jews or Israel just pontificating and making noises on behalf of the Arab cause. A PISHER with an ATTITUDE and a PUNCTURED Balloon as a result of an overblown ego that is not warranted.

Indrajaya: This VERY article,as well as news wires ALL attest to the fact that the EU, US and Canada as well as Australia have decried the nonsense. That's pretty ENTIRE in what we call the western world and you continue to show only blind belligerence in your anti-Israel position. DUTCH: Frankly (at least from your reply to me) I have NEVER seen you so contrite. There are many, many of us who have watched you call Israel every kind of name in the book; watched you use the canards that pass for criticism but are more than that and watched you try to deligitimize Israel at every turn. Your now expressing some softening perhaps makes MY point even stronger. I think that all of you who have seen the Palestinians as blameless and the Israelis as the devil incarnate are lost. You're lost because your Hamas heroes are showing themselves to be vicious, masked, killers of innocents; incapable of grace and kindness and hence my description of your continued blind invective as last gasps.

I wonder when UN human rights council will start to look at allegations that Lebanse army committed massacres of civilins in Palestinian refugee camps during recent surge of violence in Lebanon." So tell me there genius. Do you think that the US would have been able to give the Lebanese army weapons if it wasn't at the request or behest of Israel? If Lebanon just allowed them to shoot at Israel from Lebanon do you think Israel would just sit by and allow it to happen. Your analysis gives even more creedence for the need of those Palestinians to be returned to their own country and not sitting in refugee camps in foreign countries.

"The government MAY not have cared enough to take a stand, and Cotler voted his conscience." - Tosefta "Cotler is a Liberal belonging to a Party that has consistantly voted against Israel at the UNHRC. Since the Conservatives have been in power they have taken the moral high ground.....and that`s why Canada dissented." - Peter I TRIED to understand Canada's dissent and therefore I did some WORK, looking for a statement that would explain it. I found none. A Canadiam might have an easier time doing such a search since he may know where to look. Speculation from a Canadian is not enough. The vote against Israel here is not a matter of morality. Holland is a bigger friend of Israel, but voted against it this time. Why? Because Israel deserves it (see post #114). The thing about Jews, and Cotler in particular, is that their loyalty to Israel overrides party affiliation. Different parties here mean little. I have no objection to finding out from a reliable source what the Canadian motivation was, if it had any beyond Cotler`s personal kvetching.But I wouldn`t accept speculation from another kvetcher.

One reason I never purchase anything made in Indonesia. Not ever.

I hope you are right. Only time will tell.

deserve a comment. And if somebody does not think so, HE MUST BE THE BIGGEST IDIOT EVER CREATED.

Yes!!! Take care.

It seems all those who decided to attack the truth I shed on the situation seem to dehumanize the Palestinian people. Some resorted to calling them savages while other more enlightened Israel apologists decided to call them less civilized. I am sure that you people are as arrogant and ignorant as your posts suggest. Israel is brutally occupying the Palestinian territories and its policies are directed to inflict harm on the civilian population and that is fact. No one on earth deserves to be occupied and dehumanized and your posts seem to attempt to justify the policies of the state. Policies that deny the Palestinian people the status of human. No worries though! Many were the losers who defended the Nazi Germany yet we all know that they were defending a murderous state! Free Palestine NOW! And allow the Palestinian people to live in dignity and free of occupation. That is the minimum right of any human being regardless of how special they claim to be.

Sure it can be revived as any way we slice it there needs to be a mechanism for order and as much as the pendulum has swung the wrong way for umpteen years it must swing back. The countries that have hijacked the UN have less and less clout, remember The US gets more oil from Canada than any other country. Iran cannot function without selling oil. The Gulf States are more frightened of Iran than of anybody else and they are pressuring to have a deal with Israel. The tide has changed.

ROland the other ARab countries need the fighting between Isreal and the Pal. This takes attention away from the corrupt Muslim nations. Blame every thing on Israel. So you see Roland it is the Arab nations that has stopped peace in that area. THe motto of the ARab nations we will fight till every Pal is dead

hello brant, I know you often like to blame Israeli bashers for spreading propaganda but has it ever occurred to you the problem maybe on the other side? You know, governments have been notorious throughout history of coloring the situation and pitting one group against another. The American historian Howard Zinn addresses this in his column and I will enclose the URL for you ( http://www.progressive.org/mag_zinn0406) I am not against Israel but Israel's polocies in the Palestinian territories. Hence my outrage lies mostly there not necessarily Israel proper. I want Israel to be lawful and just and I believe that's in its own interest too. Thanks anyway, Dutch

The toilet runneth over and I suggest you take your foot out of your mouth to prevent the sewers from running over and this may release pressure on your brain and maybe you can become normal again.

I have to give him that and he has so far shown to be a man of courage but he has a big job ahead of him and I wish he succeeds. It is too early to tell but if Europe and the USA and Britian supports him he will be successful and of course if he does not buckle under to the current forces of evil and the power of OIL.

WE know the real reason you are happy about this. It takes away from the fact that children are being abused in your country. How much profit are you making in your factory using child labor?????

The un has become a clown show to anyone who is not a hypocrite.

I am waithing for Peters answer but in my opinion unless the rules are changed The UN is destined for the dustbin of history as it is too fractured to be of any use in any real crisis situation. Ban is a new kid on the block and may have the purest of intentions but he will get worn down. You had a number of leaders over the years and yet this did not prevent major human rights abuses or massacres in many parts of the world. The UN is not even capable in handling Natural disasters and less so in handling Man Made Disasters. I do wish him luck on the way to prove me wrong, but I do have my doubts.

plays no favorites. He is willing to speak out against any and all issues pertaining to the UN and his position is quite clear. His reference to cluster bombs was justified. His reference to the issues of Hamas are quite justified. His comments on the HRC are equally justified. If any institution needs a man like Moon, the UN does.

I just knew he was going to be the right guy for the job. Foreign diplomat service. I love his Democratic approach as SG of the UN. He has also chosen some good people around him. YES!!!!!!

46 posts not posted from you!!! Well, you must have new censors who are looking to have your blog resemble the Jerusalem Post's with only 5 comments here and there. I guess they decided what you are posting is repetitive or not worth a click of the button!!! I guess you miss posts from me (smile) as it is time to be out and about. Besides, same ole posters posting the same ole nonsense in support of bad behavior. Tell Jasmine Murphy that her boasts about how much money Israel received from the # of posts won't be the same this time around. I read many of the posters say their stuff is not posted evenly divided between rah rah bad behavior supporters and those who disagree with the Zionist gov't policies. Don't worry, things are moving quickly and the world will soon see who is right and who is wrong in the matter. Keep drinking that coffee and wrestling with your censors. Regards. Ballistic.

I believe that the UN can be revived, if it has the right leadership and support. To be sure, the organization is fossilized with competing departments and agencies who would rather play political games with each other than get something done, and it's corrupt as only diplomats can make it. But Ban Ki-moon, I think, is trying to provide the right leadership, and I do think the UN is vital to the development and integration of the world community--if only it can get its act together.

Tosefta is still off to his windmills with this old new persona of his. It's bad enough that you pretend to speak with regard to Israel, and the analysis regarding Canada is just as flawed. Without getting into too many details and sticking to the connect-a-dot that has been outlined. Prof Irwin Cotler belongs to which Party? The Prime Minister is from which Party? Oh that's right they aren't the same, Cotler is a Liberal belonging to a Party that has consistantly voted against Israel at the UNHRC. Since the Conservatives have been in power they have taken the moral high ground.....and that's why Canada dissented. It was the correct thing to do.

Since anti Chinese pogroms in Indonesia. Indonesia joined the club of scum nations. Indria make yourself small when talking about racism

For a morally bankrupt organization to have a leader with some morals is already a step that I didn't think I would see. We're already ahead of the game.

I fail to see what all the ruckus is about, as Israel is certainly one of the biggest violators of human rights and international norms there is today, just as HRW and Btselem, and thus deserves its lofty position. You don't see the US or EU tyring to imply that Israel is NOT a violator of human rights, just that its violations should be overlooked in lieu of the violations committed by others, which is pure hogwash. If the US and EU beleive that other regimes should join Israel on the permanent agenda, then they should use their power to have them added to the list, but Israel itself earned its rightful place on the agenda fair and square.

Paul Harris, 60 years of Zionists ripping off Palestinian land is equally disgusting. We gave rise to people with the appitite of vultures in the Middle East and I know it doesn't reflect good honest Jews but the Zionist Enterprise system which will never succeed as a legitimate enterprize. Dutch Dutch

Aren?t there any UN resolutions condemning the attacks on Israel and the murder of Israelis by the pal jihadists? If that is so, first honor this. If there is none, the UN is against human rights, herein its resolutions are null and void. In any case, Israel has the right to defend itself and to prevent the jihadists from murdering its citizens, even if this annoys the UN.

I wonder when UN human rights council will start to look at allegations that Lebanse army committed massacres of civilins in Palestinian refugee camps during recent surge of violence in Lebanon.

After Kofi Anan and all those bigots in the Human Rights Commission, he is a breath of fresh air.

Sorry for the delay. You are correct - there are many other countries who violate human rights. Which is why the UN tries to mediate or send in stabilisation forces. But in Israel's case it refuses point blank to have UN forces as a buffer between it and the Wsst Bank terrorists. Why? As for Coalition Forces and Iraq, Iraqi Opposition to Hussein begged the West to topple him. So the basis of the SFOR is by invitation - we are NOT occupiers. However, the Palestininians did not invite the Israeli Army in - and that is the fundamental difference and why it is disingenuous and illogical to compare the occupation of Palestine by the IDF to the SFOR presence in Iraq, Ilya

I can not understand how Indrajaya from indonesia is always here criticizesing Israel. I quess human right violations in Indonesia far exceeds the level of Israel. Indrajaya should concentrate problems over there. Fundamental fact is that we people are not intrested of the victimis. If perpetrator is jew then the victim receives compassion.

When it comes to criticising other than Israel."Orders are orders" my commandant? No room for improvement in the UN?

Why do austrailian aboriginals like your self not see the need to support palestinian refugeese.Your people have been decimated by the white man/european.You luive on the fringe of society well the white europeans are all running the goverment.Alot of aboriginal people in canada side with the palestinian issue.Jews are not prosicuted here,in fact they are not the ones liveing on reserves.Are jewish people liveing at a rate of poverty as the aboriginal people in austrailia,look forward to your reply.

I wrote “for beginning" and I realize that I am too long, in the way of a chapter of book. Pleasant, but impossible here. So, I would like just add one brief punctual critic as exemplary. When you evoked in one of your posts the past and actual Argentine, you said, “I really think we should judge countries on what they represent today, and not 25 years ago”. If you want to say that we cannot condemn a country for the eternity, I agree. But the problem here is double (at my point of view). First, you give the impression that this is not true for Israel who has to be an eternal guilty. Second, in History you cannot place borders in time like that. Especially with the subject we are talking about, the establishment of borders in the time are not innocent. I think I have to stop here even it is somehow very frustrating. With some hope to be understood…

After the refusal of an exchange land/peace Israel could not stand doing nothing and wait for a change in mind of this Arab League. This change came lately, that’s the actual Saoudi Arabia plan. Alas it’s impossible to stop the time. In 1967 Israel had to manage with concrete problems and took some decisions (good ones and bad ones). And we have discovered that there is no peaceful or neutral occupation. The positive thing is the slow but irrevocable appearance of a Palestinian consciousness and the need for Palestinian to take the hand on their destiny. Some Palestinian friends (yes, I have Palestinian friends) made this last assertion to me.

Swiss Dino, the demand of CK Tan was a real challenge. I have found your answer more than “fair enough”, really fair! To show you that I have appreciated your response, I am going to evacuate my usual ironic style with you and adopt a normal language. Dino, I would like to make some comments concerning your lasts posts, for trying to establish a dialogue. The objective of my comments is to talk to you frankly, and to tell you what is disturbing me in these posts. For beginning, when you expose the “3 steps to Israeli felicity", I can agree with you. What is disturbing me is the step 1. The settlement expansion has to be stopped, no problem with that. The fact is that, as far as I read your posts, you give to me the impression to ignore that the 5 june 1967, there were no settlements, no occupation and…no peace to. Settelments has been the consequence of three NO (Karthoum Arab League meeting, Sept 1967: No peace with Israel, No recognition of Israel, No discussions with Israel).

Sitting down? Good. The UN is not just a branch of the Organization of the Islamic Conference. They are supposed to actually do good in the world (HA!). Their job is not to implement Sharia throughout the world and impose a terrorist regime. This may be grave disappointment to many here. Tough.

I don't understand your post- what point are you trying to make?

......And the toilet gets dirtier. Take your foot out of your mouth and two things will happen you will stop upchucking and your brain will hopefully get unplugged!!!!!!!!

Do you believe that the UN can be revived or is it destined to spend its remaining days on life support. Ban ki Moon seems determined but can he withstand the pressure from all the sides?

All the jewish readers and pro-israeli zealots were saying he was a no good anti-semite because he made a comment about Israel...this week because he is towing the Israel line he's such a great guy and of course a great leader. This is the only time th UN is useful to this pack of decievers...when they can just go about their business of murdering innocent Palestinians and taking their land without notice. Other then that..if you are not a servant of Israel..you are useless. The same way they only scream about Darfur is so while you look over there they can whip out the guns shoot a few palestinians and when you come back to look again the guns are well hidden and the halos are on top of their heads.Phonies. These guys are like US creationists. They come up with all these technical explanations when in reality they just want to push the idea that the world was created by God nothing more and nothing less. They want all of Palestine nothing less.

and when sudanese arab muslims burn down the black african muslim homes, rape the women and murder children in darfur....i guess they are also doing it for the palestinians. "pathological obsession" sums you up.

"pathological obsession"....and everybody with a functioning brain realises the problem afflicting people like you.

I HAVE SENT IN 46 TODAY ABOUT 5 HAVE SHOWN UP

Michael, don't worry, I'm not a mimosa, and your posts are constructive enough...:) And who knows, if everything goes well between Olmert and Abbas, we can soon forget about an ugly word like "payback" and discuss the beauty of the Argentinian pampa, or the chances of the New Jersey Devils for the next season...

PUBLISH THE POST I WROTE TO MARIA DO ROSARIO ABOUT NOT HATING.

I hadn't seen your earlier post. I have been to Rosario, Argentina. Great city. So my apologies to the survivors of the dirty wars. Payback is a dangerous cornerstone to base foreign policy on. If the Netherlands, Finland, and Switzerland were located where Israel is then i bet you everything your perspective would be different. (Netherlands and Switzerland are great countries. I have never been to Finland. I did meet a Finnish man who wasn't jewish but spoke Yiddish when at Oxford in the mid '90s - that fact blew me away.) Keep your posts coming, i do disagree with much of your points, but your tone is constructive -more than mine is.)

Michael, "Ban Ki-moon is awesome." I suspect Mr. Moon may be more impartial than you would like. The fact that he criticizes the action of singling out Israel from a plethora of equal or more egregious human rights violators, will not stop him from criticizing Israel in the future. Will you hold the same opinion then? By the way, Argentina has long since deposed the right wing military junta that oppressed that nation for so long. They are in fact a vibrant democracy, now. The corruption of the Argentinian right wing military leaders bankrupted the economy. They fell of their own dead weight. Now they are just trying as hard as they can to avoid prosecution for their crimes. "RECONCILIATION!" They want to let bygones be bygones. All the perpetrators do. Peace. Steve

As long as Israel and Scotch-man are (positi- vely) considering my 3 suggestions, they both can arm themselves with whatever they want, no objection at all. A free ride from Switzerland. But only if.....

UN human rights commission - was chaired by Zimbabwe - says it all, doesn't it?..

I thought you were talking about the stance Israel is taking towards the Arab leagues proposal. About firing on children, rubber bullets etc... of course too many accidents have happened. Gaza is an over populated area and children should not be let into the street when fighting breaks out. Of course I a not going to do like the Israel bashers and blame the Palestinians for the death of their own children, but there is a degree of responsability there. Unfortunately, Hamas and Fatah fighters have done even worse in terms of safeguarding Palestinian children in the recent clashes. The cruelty shown by Hamas towards their own people is exponential when compared to any excesses of individual Israeli soldiers. One can only imagine the horror if one day, G-d forbid, Iranian sponsored terrorism should have any degree of success within Israeli territory. A rational guy like yourself must admit that Israel is right to arm itself up to the teeth and be very vigilant militarily.

heard such a voice was 29 Nov 1947. Thank you Ban Ki-moon.

100,000's of deaths

Indrajaya, "He should defend whetever the decisions of any UN bodies under his supervision." He was hired to lead not follow. He is giving what direction he believes is appropriate. Where as you may disagree with his idea of appropriate, ultimately it is his decision not yours. When you get to be secretary general you can take the organization in your own direction. I would probably conduct such policy "sub rosa," but that is my personality. Mr. Ban will be exhibiting his own. Peace. Steve

Don Camillo, Yes, Israel doesn't like the rules so it complains and has the audacity to blame those organizations that call them to account. Look at the way it has tried to drag the name of the UN into the gutter and accuse it of being biased. Yes, it is a big organization and it no doubt has its biases but in the end it seems to me Israel is the real biased member who wants special provisions and uses its poor victims status like a spoiled child to get its way. And as in the the nursery rhyme, The Little Boy Boy, I doubt if any one will be there again to answer its real call for help ever again. That's what happens to people and nations that fool around and avoid being accountable and Israel is riding on the edge today. Dutch

Michael, you know exactly that I listed those countries yesterday as a response to a post from Tony L, where he stated that most of the countries voting for "Yes" would have come from the "African/Muslim" corner. With regard to Argentine, I really think we should judge countries on what they represent today, and not 25 years ago. I don't wanna say that everything is perfect there, but I would call them today an open, lively democracy. But on the other hand, it should really give you some reason to think about, when you have democracy and human rights "examples" like Japan, Finland, or the Netherlands (if I wouldn't be as "modest", I could also name another one...:) voting against Israel. The reason is not Israels brutality, the reason is simply that many abroad are fed up with certain Israeli policies over the past few years. So the key word here is clearly: "payback" Israel could turn that easily around, if she only wanted to.....

Do not you think that the club rules supposed to be applied equally to all the members? Or there is one set of rules for Israel and another for everyone else? Why is it that UK, US, and Australia are not on the agenda for their occupation of Iraq? Since they invaded Iraq 2003 650000 died there. Do not you think that there human rights were violated a bit? That is without counting refugees and injured the invasion created. If Israel had operated in territories with such fatality rate the number of dead in 40 years would have exceeded the population of the WB and Gaza. These are only democracies I have mentioned there are other members concerned with human rights like Sudan with ongoing genocide in Darfur, Indonesia which was slaughtering East Timorese in big numbers just to name a few. This list is long as opposed to the list of condemned countries containing only Israel.

Gil, I love you (Israel) too, even if I can't show it everyday...:)

"I didn`t get that either with the EU." - Swiss I didn't find any bit of news about the EU changing its mind and criticizing the resolution. I can see two possible explanations: 1. An EU commissioner criticized the resolution on his own without realizing that the important countries of the EU actually support it. 2. Jeff Northridge works for Haaretz and he made up some "news" for them.

For western nations, especially the U.S. and Israel, supporting the U.N. has long been an exercise in masochism. Western nations, especially the U.S. pay almost all of the U.N.'s bills. In return, the U.N. demonizes them nonstop. The U.N. is worse than worthless at preventing or ameliorating genocide, a major purpose for which is was founded. It is also worse than worthless at confronting tyrants. Major international accomplishments, such as forming the coalition to free Iraq and Israel's destruction of Saddam Hussein's nuclear bomb plant, are accomplished despite the U.N. Wake up western world, what are you getting for the billions of tax dollars you shell out to the U.N.? I wonder how Americans would vote in a referendum on funding the U.N.

Israel protests too mutch, to misquaote a line from English literature. Israel has signed the Geneva Convention and protocols - yet insists they don't apply to Israel. Israel is a signatory to the Charter of the United Nations - yet refuses to comply with any UN Resolutions that don't suit it. If Israel doesn't like the clubs why doesn;t it just leave them?

Ban Ki-moon is awesome. But you chose to ignore his convictions because they don't line up with yours. You choose to disrespect all posters who hold palestinians responsible for the plight of palestinians ..Stop supporting their bloodshed. Jihad has you all under the illusion that Hamas et al are fighting for liberation. They are fighting for the destruction of the state of Israel. Even the non persian/syrian Lebanese know this as well as a growing number of Pals have come to learn. When Swiss Dino posts the great democracies on the UNHRC, not only does he select to omit some of the biggest abusers of human rights in the world, but he holds up Argentina as an example of democracy. Perhaps he is unaware of the dirty wars there which took place this generation. In any case, thank you for holding Israel up to a higher standard than all other democracies. Israel can deal with all phony double standards even when she is threatened daily with islamic violence and european ignorance.

Hi Tosefta, I didn't get that either with the EU. Could it be that the EU-guys at the Human Rights Council made their decisions without having any prior consultations with their foreign ministries, or at least with the U.N. represen- tatives of their countries...??? That would be rather strange indeed. Or a Haaretz misunderstanding...???

Addendum: Please add the corrected URL for the article I referenced in my previous post (#112). Thanks, Dutch http://www.searchforjustice.org/articles/01.20.03.html

"The European Union, Canada and the United States have already attacked the deal reached in Geneva on Monday" - Haaretz Did the European Union object to the resolution? I wonder. All the important members of the EU happen to be members of the UHRC, including Germany, France, Britain, and Italy. In addition Holland and Romania are also members. All of them joined in the resolution, and all quite friendly to Israel, so who is left to criticize it? Perhaps a mistake by Haaretz. Did Canada criticize the resolution? It voted against it, but my impression is that this was a one man (Cotler) personal decision (see #115). We come to the US, which indeed must have criticized the resolution, and not surprisingly. And so far Ban has been following his "boss" (US) closely, so he also criticized. Israel should not derive too much comfort from this. Essentially the whole world supported the resolution, and for a good reason. See my post #114.

Swiss (Dino) As an Israeli It is good to know two people love us in this world!!! Well Dino we the Jews and Israelis said it all the time, that we live in a strange World no one believed us, if we could face it, believe me you can face it!!!

Are the kkk, taliban, or skinhead????

Labhras, it rather looks like a hell of a mess. The HRC votes with 48 - 1 for the resolution and the secretary general condemns it. All the EU members in the council vote for the resolution, but the EU condemns it. What a strange and inscrutable world we are living in.....

"M.P. Professor Irwin Cotler nails the UN human rights council on its blatant bias against Israel." Here is the Canadian representative to the Human Rights Commission, a well known Jewish activist and collaborator of A. Dershowitz in attempting to bring "genocide" charges against the Iranian President. I was wondering why Canada opposed the resolution, and I now understand. The government may not have cared enough to take a stand, and Cotler voted his conscience. Instead of starting the familiar paranoid yell "everybody hates the Jews", how about considering the reason for this decision, which was apparently the refusal of Israel to cooperate with 2 inquiries into Gaza multi death events, on the Gaza beach and in Beit Hannun? (See my post #237.) Non-cooperation has some price, and even Western countries decided to send this message to Israel. Better not make to much yelling noise. The Israeli government should be able to hear the message.

Here is probably the reason for the decision, Israeli non-cooperartion: unhchr.ch/huricane/huricane.nsf/0/FDB14682D29B482FC12572F9004E72F9?opendocument COUNCIL DISCUSSES MISSIONS TO OCCUPIED PALESTINIAN TERRITORIES, INCLUDING BEIT HANOUN, AND LEBANON Human Rights Council 13 June 2007 United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights Louise Arbour said that with regard to the Resolution S-1/1 on the human rights situation in the occupied Palestinian territory, the Special Rapporteur, John Dugard, was unable to conduct the fact-finding mission that the Council mandated him to undertake due to the Government of Israel`s lack of a positive response to a request of cooperation. Likewise, the urgent fact-finding mission on human rights violations emanating from Israeli military incursions in the occupied Palestinian territory, including the recent one in Northern Gaza and the assault on Beit Hanoun, could not be deployed.. Archbishop Desmond Tutu, Head of the high-level fact-finding mission to Beit Hanoun, said fairness and even handedness had been essential to the mission`s aims, and it was distressing that the mandate could not be carried out fully. The plight of Palestinians was totally unacceptable, and their suffering should end in the interests of all. Those responsible for Beit Hanoun should be held to account. Israeli and Palestinian authorities should end the culture of impunity and bring to account those responsible, including those responsible for launching rockets against Israeli towns. The victims of Beit Hanoun had a right to ongoing medical treatment and counseling.

CK Tan, honestly, looks like a hell of a task, you gave me. If you don't mind, I will take just 2 demands for each group, is that okay...?? And I will replace the OIC with Iran, because I think that's the more important topic for Israel. Fatah: To restore law and order in the West Bank and to build up democratic structures there. Hamas: To accept the Quartetts demands and show readiness for negotiations with Israel Arab regimes: To start caring about the destiny of the Palestinian refugees in their countries, and to immediately start democratic reforms. Hezbollah: To accept Israels right to exist and to become part of the regular Lebanese troops. Iran: To accept Israels right to exist, and to start immediately with democratic reforms. And the consequences for not complying...??? As with Israel, I will refuse to lay at their feet.... Fair enough...:)

The new UN chief Ban Ki-moon is simly wrong in his criticism of the UN Human Rights Council. It was absolutley right in its decision to make Israel a permanent item agenda. It isn't simply a case of singling out Israel--Israel is a country that waves the flag of democracy and yet it maintains an illegal occupation and settlements in the territories that deprive the Palestinian people of their essential freedoms and sovereign rights. I attend meeting after meeting in the US filled to the rafters with out- raged people who are fed up with the Bush administration policies towards Israel. While Bush has committed his country to a war on Iraq (under false pretense ) to combat the evil of Saddam Huissein and his violations of Iraqi right, he remains silent and indeed a complicit part- ner in Israel's Human rights violation against the Palestinians as Edmund Hanauer notes; http://www.searchforjustice.org/articles/01.20.03.html This can't go on and it is not only an affront to even handedness but to the principles of social and political justice. The Council's reputation wouldn't be worth a dime if it didn't render this decision. And as another writer wrote in a different Haaretz's forum Israel's actions always speaks louder than its words. Hence Israel cannot clain to be for freedom and peace and continue its appalling sprawl in the West Bank. It just won't work anymore. Israel must be brought into account for its Human rights violations. That's just the law of the land and our kind. Dutch

60 YEARS OF DISGUISED ANTI SEMITISM AGAINST ITS SURVIVAL

For years the UN has hurt more people than it has helped. It was a good idea with terrible results. It is used by countries to protect their own interest rather than improving the world. The Human Rights Abuse council is a prime example of it.

Hello Scotch-man, let's get straight to your points: 1. Rules of engagement: Look, I NEVER said that the IDF soldiers are intentionallly targeting youths and kids. I am just pleading for a change from lethal force to non-(or at least less)lethal force. Means in an emergency case the use of either tear-gas or water instead of those ******* rubber-bullets. Apart from the Palestinian youths it would be Israel herself who would benefit most from taking such a step. Because the death of children and youth caused by IDF troops is definitely the No.1 image- "killer" of Israel, at least in Switzerland. 2. Negotiations: Honestly, I don't know where you get your infos from, but as far as I know, the last real peace negotiations happened more than 6 years ago in Camp David between Barak and Arafat, and they lasted about 50 minu- tes. Not really an impressive record. But now we obviously have a new chance, let's wait and see....we all will watch very carefully...

there's more brutal governments running amuck in the world, and I'm glad to see that Ban Ki-moon appears to be aware of that. I hope it's a good omen for his tenure, I have a soft spot for Koreans because they work so hard and have overcome so much. Now if there was an organization just of established democracies, it would indeed be appropriate for Israel to receive special scrutiny and criticism from it's democratic peers for the rigor with which it treats the Pals. Yes, the word rigor is taken from an English translation of the Haggadah.

So, from a systematic view, multiculturality, decolonisation etc, it is a good idea to watch it closely. Solutions found here can also serve in other parts of the world. Israel is not unique.

What a joke! Indonesia should a "proud" member of the Council for violating human rights... Most people know what Indonesia stands for and are sick and tired of your lies. How many Papuans have TNI killed and displaced lately Indrajaya?

Hi Swiss. Seems to me Ban ki- moon got a phone call from dubya and did, not really think through his "Rapid Response'.If this is what the new leadership of the Un looks like then we are in for a very bumpy ride. Rgards

The opportunity to bring some life back into the UN, an organization with such lofty goals that has fallen into disrepute has a leader that appears to be charged with raising it from the ashes. The man needs full support because lord only knows he has a plethora of obstacles in his way.

The UN and the Human Rights Group are really irrevelant in the over all big picture. Time and time again they show all these 3rd world nations that are in the UN need to just pack up and go home.If you don't like the USa or Israel go home. The truth is the UN would do more good for the NYC homeless people as a shelter then as a world community. The last thing the USA needs is more unpaid parking tickets and spies. Close the UN down and let some 3rd world country build a new one in their land.

and, unlike the well-greased kofi, knows and sees the whole picture - that Israel did not deliberately target the UN post. One of the observers, Canadian Maj. Paeta Hess-von Kruedener, just before his untimely death, clearly described that hezbollah terrorists were using the UN post as shield. He also exonerated Israel?s responses were not purposely aimed at the post but due to tactical necessity. In case you didn't want to know - the terrorists also used Lebanese civilians as HUMAN SHIELD and stationing missle launch pads in civilian areas during the war. Another of their dirty tricks ? and clear violation of international laws like the above ? is to use Press- or UN-marked vehicles/ambulances to carry out their terrorist acts.

Than the UNHRC would have been picked up and booked for stalking a long time ago. Just another reason why the US remains the global cop on the beat when it comes to how the UN treats Israel.

"...they decided to compete in adopting nicknames as Clickfool, Indrajaya..." What are you talking about?. Only because I get payed by the Iranians (through Hezbollah), it doesn't mean I'm not a zionist. Watch your language.

The Jewish State had already been labeled by UN URC ! Independent of it actions, the council taking into account their own ?highest standards in the promotion and protection of human rights? declared Israel behavior as a permanent peril for Human Rights violation ! Should Israel endanger the life of it citizens in order to take the ?stamp? out ? Apparently to Haaretz Editor, yes ! We have careful read Haaretz Editioral calling for the Jewish Government to ??Let them in ? ! Once again, The Editor forgets to listen to Rav Hilel ?greatest hits?. : You shall your friend as yourself. Please bear in mind AS and not MORE ! Is the Editor forgetting about the life sake of the Jewish population and ?loving? more our dear friends ! The solution is simple ! It time for Egypt to prove it deserve its chair in the council and apply the highest standards in the promotion and protections of human rights. With all do respect to this media vehicle, let me change your call Egypt, let them

(de Gaulle would had loved such title!) I fact, after discussion with the Director of Playboy, I have the explanation. Haaretz journalists discovered that the Magazine Playboy encountered a lot of success in its long and famous fight against the mode of burqas. This success is a nightmare for the Haaretz moderators. The talkbacks of the Magazine are more successful than the Haaretz ones (especially because you can exchange photos, not only words…) Therefore, they decided to compete in adopting nicknames as Clickfool, Indrajaya, Bernie and Cie and to produce the harsh posts we have now. Is it working, I don’t know?

in planning vacations, business deals or other endeavors check out which countries, especially the EU variety, voted at the UN to single out Israel (except Canada) by checking the members of the ?Human Rights Council? below. The composition of the Council at the fifth session is the following (the term of membership of each State expires on 18 June of the year indicated in brackets): Algeria (2007); Argentina (2007); Azerbaijan (2009); Bahrain (2007); Bangladesh (2009); Brazil (2008); Cameroon (2009); Canada (2009); China (2009); Cuba (2009); Czech Republic (2007); Djibouti (2009); Ecuador (2007); Finland (2007); France (2008); Gabon (2008); Germany (2009); Ghana (2008); Guatemala (2008); India (2007); Indonesia (2007); Japan (2008); Jordan (2009); Malaysia (2009); Mali (2008); Mauritius (2009); Mexico (2009); Morocco (2007); Netherlands (2007); Nigeria (2009); Pakistan (2008); Peru (2008); Philippines (2007); Poland (2007); Republic of Korea (2008); Romania (2008); Russian Federation (2009); Saudi Arabia (2009); Senegal (2009); South Africa (2007); Sri Lanka (2008); Switzerland (2009); Tunisia (2007); Ukraine (2008); United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (2008); Uruguay (2009); Zambia (2008).

where is palestine and who are their people? Please inform me!

Are we Black Africans supposed to love these persons that blew the embassies up in kenya and tanzania killing mostly africans????are we supposed to love these Arab muslims who are killing our brothers and sisters around the clock in Darfur????or in UK do you know how these pakistan people treat blacks living there??wake up my black african brothers,did you know who started the slave trade before the european colonials???ARAB MUSLIMS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

with different ways of writing to have your voice heard. Can't let the moonbats have all the fun :-)

a question every single person on this web site has asked many times over, including myself. It is no longer amazing for me to read some of the most hideous postings from the usual band of Australian writers, and at the same time have my moderate few lines rejected. Oh, and weekend moderators are lazy and don't post anything I write!

Another interesting pastime is emailing Haaretz directly at their 'info' email address, buried somewhere in the 'contact us' part of the website. The address apparently does not exist! I tried, unsuccessfully, to formally complain recently over some outrageous remarks by Clickfool. The censorship, consistency of applying rules to Talkback, & general editorial housekeeping leave much to be desired.....

"...along with the entire western world..." What are you talking about? What do you "ENTIRE"?

The Muslim world cries rivers over the death of Arafat, but says nothing to Arabs murdering black muslims in Sudan.

No less than the UN Secretary General himself, along with the entire western world decries this madness of singling out Israel but, you and your fellow Jew-baiting, Israel-hating bleaters just keep excreting the same propaganda. Last gasps, Durson. Last gasps.

because my friends told me some of their posts were not published even though they were just responding (in kind). It happened to me a couple of times too. Yet, as you mentioned, haaretz frequently passes some of the most virulent opinions by regular posters but disallows vigorous responses to these people. But I am not expecting haaretz to reply or explain :-(

In my precedent letter/question #83 I had this last sentence: “I don’t need the publication of this letter, I am asking for an answer” I have had no answer and my letter has been published as a post. So, I am obliged to make alone a response to my question: HAARETZ TALKBACKS MODERATORS EXPRESS SOME DIFFICULTIES TO ABANDON A 2 THOUSAND YEARS OLD MASOCHIST PLEASURE…THE AUTO-SCOURGING. Sad, disappointed, quite despaired, I am going to send my posts exclusively to Hamas Talkbacks now…if I can found them.

individually to fatah, hamas, hizbullah, the arab muslim countries still on a state-of-war (some more aggressively than others) with Israel, and the OIC? And if your suggestions are not taken up, what are consequences for them? Thanks.

Does the Hammas have YOU on the payroll?

THere is a widespread feeling that all would be well, if only Israel withdrew from occupied lands. While this is a legitimate and desirable aim, under the right conditions, the hope of easy peace is a total delusion. The current crop of enemies of Jewry are driven by a familiar combination of extreme religious and nationalist motives, and desire nothing less than the total extermination of Israel, and as many other Jews as possible. Before 1948 there was no question of Jewish occupied lands,in the Middle East, or anywhere else on Earth. Logically, those times were an Age of halcyon peace and happiness for Jews everywhere? It is beyond dispute that, even if all Israel were suddenly to become converted to a regime of monastic Buddhism in an enclave the size of a small town , their extermination by Islamist forces would still be on the agenda. Such has always been the view of the enemies of Jewry/Israel. To pretend otherwise is a delusion, which experienced Jews will not fall for.

Haaretz talkback moderators systematically eliminate posts mentioning direct personal critics of post authors. That's a political choice that I could understand...if it was balanced. Everybody can observe that talkbacks are plenty of posts expressing hate for Israel and jews through personal virulent critics. I would appreciate an explanation, just to understand... I don't need the publication of this letter, I am asking for an answer.

The Pro-Arab Anti-Israel block at the UN have not only supported real hijackers but they themselves have hijacked the UN. Ban is doing his job of trying to make the UN a universal body and not just an evil tool in the hands of the worlds anti-democratic dictatorial regimes.

Mr Ban's opinion of the corrupted mockery that is the HRC is like a ray of sunshine piercing the darkness favoured by the moonbats. Bet they miss the good old days of the previous chief, whose palms are so well-greased they gleam in the dark.

"Swiss" taxes are mainly a national issue, not handled by the EU," is, basically correct. In 2000, the US and the EU attacked and destroyed most of the "secrecy" laws in most of the world. What was left was virtually eliminated after 9/11. The most "comforting" thought is that ever transaction over $10,000, regardless of the currency, is reported to the US Governmant by one method or another. Becareful how you spend you money!! Regards.

No, Rufus, we are not a member of the EU, but we have so called "bilateral contracts" with them, in order to make many things of our daily life a bit easier (trade, customs, immigration...). Johnny, honestly I don't know exactly how the taxation is handled in every single EU country. All I know is the fact, that our governement had a hell of a fight a few months ago, in order to make it clear to the guys in Bruxelles, that we wouldn't accept any EU orders on our tax rates.

Ban did not have his UN job last year when the 4 UN personnel were killed by Israel. Israel followed up by refusing to cooperate with the UN investigation. He needs to get up to speed on the rich history between Israel and the UN.

...Cuba, Bangladesh, Egypt, Qatar, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Mali, Malesia, Indonesia, Jordan... Wow, what a selective fact! Those other members are also: Egypt, France, Germany, India, Italy, Japan, Jordan, Netherlands, Switzerland, United Kingdom of Great Britain, and Northern Ireland. You don't like what you read, do you. Because even your traditional allies are already sick and tired of your attitudes in the middle east.

the u.s has him on the payroll, full stop.

I could not help reading your suggestion for Israel to gain friends, where you put: 2. At least rethinking of some of the rules of engagements when it comes to Palestinian youths and children. What if Hamas and other groups a) Use children and women as shields (it is done) or use them as stunts for juicy images for western tv's (it is done too) or if terrorists purposely act in populated areas in order to have such casualties, which when they unfortunately happen they are accidents. I mean you are not a slogan parrot as your friend Indrajaya, do you really believe the IDF goes into Gaza expressly to kill children???? 3. An honest readiness to enter dialogue and negotiations with the moderate people on the other side. Isn't Israel doing this? negotitiations mean bartering and it is difficult for people like us to know what is said in closed rooms. I agree with you about the settlements, but look at the price they are paying for leaving settlements.

You are right Rufus, Swiss is not a member of the EU. My subject line was bad in post #68, I addressed Swiss (Dino) but I looked like I ment Swiss the country, my bad. Anyway my point was that being a memeber of EU still gives each country the freedom to decide their own taxation polices.

If you look up the list of the members of the Human Rights Council, you can understand partly its policies. They represent countries as: Cuba, Bangladesh, Egypt, Qatar, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Mali, Malesia, Indonesia, Jordan.

Is Switzerland a full EU member? I thought it was only EFTA?

is singled out as much as this one. Not genocide in Sudan, not child slavery among other atrocities in China, nor the persecution of dissidents all over the world. The UN needs to be under a watchful eye not Israel. Disgusting. Oh, and at a time when Israel is taking in refugees daily from SUDAN.

The powerfull pro-Palestinian PR machine has had it's glory days, now that's in the past. In Sharon's time it was actually quite easy for them to vilify Israel and put the Palestinians as victims. After al the fracticide carnage in Gaza and Iraq. Now that Iran, Hizbollah Hamas et cie are showing the ruthless fascism behind their "victim" disguise. Now that the Arab world has woken up to the fact that they face the same enemy as Israel: militant Islamic fundamentalism. Now that Islamic fundamentalism kidnaps and blows up inocent western people (even freindly reporters). Now that even a Palestinian leader tells the world the truth about Hamas and the Lebanese are thinking twice about their unconditional support for Hizbollah. The anti Israeli stereo types and slogans just look childish. It is high time Palestinian politics move away from living to do PR, and toook responsability for their own people.

1. Stop of settlement expansion. 2. At least rethinking of some of the rules of engagements when it comes to Palestinian youths and children. 3. An honest readiness to enter dialogue and negotiations with the moderate people on the other side. If those 3 steps are taken, the "mainstream" world will be at your feet. (Yes, indeed !!) If not, I'm afraid the (diplomatic) "payback", even by some friendly nations, will continue. P.S. To Alicia: Read my response to indrajaya and you can calm down: Definitely no Burkhas in Ticino....:)

Swiss, taxes are mainly a national issue, not handled by the EU, there are some exceptions I believe, but it is only uniteresting taxes. Income tax, VAT, company profit taxes etc are free to be set for each member country.

I think you would find that addressing yourself as the messenger would offend most Muslims. Muhammad is the messenger (of Islam). I see you understand about as much of Islam as you do this situation.

If the accounts of the recent fighting between Hamas and Fatah are accurate, Hammas' "military" strategy is based upon "War Crimes."

...when are you going to blow yourself up to spread your message?... A good sense of humor. Unfortunaltely, a black ONE.

Yeah, spread it all over the streets and buildings and nearby cars... (Great johnny!)

Belated but well done. Over focusing on Israel really is not necessary. Eyes should all turn to focusing on the real problems the Palestinian folks have brought upon themselves.

Dino I have posted an answer to you on the related article talkbacks: UN Human Rights Council makes Israel permanent agenda item

"I am only the messenger for Palestinian people causes". Who appointed you to this job? Unless you are a Palestinian living in Jakarta, why don't you clean up your own country's mess before taking care of other people's problems? Or maybe you are a bored person who likes to bla-bla as I understand from your letter to Maria

Everyone knows that United Nations Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon is actually a Jew who has been put in his current position by the Zionists who are controlling the world. Of course he's had surgery to change his features, all part of the plot. Whatever the true reasons he had for making those comments shows he is a professional with integrity.

Indrajaya, don't worry, as a true Swiss "mainstream-macho" (ha,ha,ha...) I know very well to differentiate between a diplomatic mini-skirt and a real one. The southern part of Switzerland borders on Italy. No need to say more...:)

Though a young man, you are, you obviously prefer Burkas to mini-skirts. Oh dear! I thought you were a tolerant and emancipiated Swiss! Ever thought that it is to you men to learn to control your drives?

The problem is with the "pathological obsession" with the lady herself.

Alicia, the EU has done a wonderful job by preventing armed conflicts in Europe over the past decades (Ex-Yugoslavia is the sad exception of the rule). But we Swiss would never give up our right to vote on issues that matter in Switzerland (especially when it comes to our taxes and banks....). So I'm afraid Swiss-Dino won't see the day of a Swiss-membership to the EU. But who knows, maybe his dog will...:) Wuff wuff.....

produced UN Human rights council , as well i think the likes of monkey bussiness Haaretz is involved in.

That's why Indrajaya is fighting here. Best to keep the UN busy elsewhere so they can keep murdering.They are ably assisted by the useful idiots who have to shoulder their share of the blame for having their selective agenda.

"the Israeli cruel occupation is directly responsible for the atrocities committed against the Palestinians even by fellow Palestinians." This is typical lefty racism; Palestinians are savages, incapable of rational, civilized actions.

"I`m only the messenger of palestinian people causes. Do not blame the messenger." So, Indrajaya, when are you going to blow yourself up to spread your message?

...That might attract (much) less lustful glances by the HRC members... That's an advise from a mother with a wise motherhood. Only come from a female (well, usually).

from the 3rd world circus that is the General Assembly. What other "liberation movement" besides the Pals has UN representation? Why not Tibet or Kurdistan? What other "refugees" have their own special department at the UN despite they and their brothers doing everything possible to prevent resolution annd resettlement which the rest of the civilised world has achieved elsewhere.

No problems there comrade? No need for Spezial Aktion? How conveniently spun "since 1950".This mess of course was started by Arabs specifically ignoring and thus sidelining the UN in this conflict.Remember Nasser telling the UN peace keepers to leave in 1967 so he could have his war? You amaze me with your selective facts and memory.Not all of us non intellectuals are totally ignorant. Remember that

This just proves that Kofi Annan was a horrible leader of the UN. He was a 'YES MAN' for all the dictatorial regimes of the world and sat back as the entire UN was hijacked by pro-Arab Anti-Israel racists.

...he can`t dsay what he believes, then its just a meaningless title... If everybody is the world body like UN could say anything he wanted to say, what's the point to have an organization then. He doesn't know what his job description really is. Believe me, Israel doesn't want him as a hero, he is just plain stupid, buddy.

Banking Moon is a disgrace to the UN. His leadership is hardly present. How many people in the world take notice of him. This guy is too worried about being bullied by the US so whatever comes out of his mouth needs to be considered in that light.

The problem with the EU is that it is run by the BIGgest EU-states and the small ones are trampled on and ignored. They are just the "tail". The small ones are needed only to 1) finance the EU and 2) to obey. That much of democarcy and equality: in "name" only. SO - obviously the "small" EU-countries were reproaching the "big" ones sitting in the Council: it went to deaf ears anyway! Switzerland is very smart to keep out!

Roland, you don't know what you are talking about - Occupation? What Occupation? THE WEST BANK AND GAZA ARE NOW UNDER PALESTINIAN GOVERNING BODIES. ISRAEL RETREATED FROM THESE AREAS ALMOST TWO YEARS AGO. And now those Palestinian governing bodies are fighting and killing each other instead of building their 23rd Arab State, the land for which Israel has given over to them. In which world are you living - in an 'Occupied Dream'?

Thanks for the laugh Roland. Innocent Palestinian victims..you mean the ones who had their throats slit or were decapitated in Gaza by the uncivilized, barberous, murderous, blood-thirsty, ruthless, masked Hamas "soldiers". I feel sorry for the Palestinians who dream of a brighter future but are too afraid to stand up and have their voices heard. Imagine, they run to Israel to save them from the madness that has filled the streets of Gaza. I think it says a lot about Israel's humanitarian image...don't you Roland? Nowhere to hide Roland, soon you could be terrorized by Hamas. Maybe they'll even throw a bomb or 2 into your neighborhood. OR worse, they might send a suicide bomber on a bus or in a school? Is this the kind of war you want? If you think this is a local war on terrorism - think again...no one is safe.

Yes, indeed, the Human Rights Council seems at times to be obsessed with Israel. But why on earth does Israel keep on wearing a (diplomatic) mini-skirt...??? If I could give a shy advice, I would simply try it with long pants for a change. That might attract (much) less lustful glances by the HRC members. I know it's summer now in Israel, but it defini- tely would be worth a try....

60 YEARS OF BLATANT ANTI SEMITISM !!

The new Secretary General, Ban Ki-moon, is showing strong, positive leadership. He has not hesitated to come out in opposition to powerful forces within the international community. Belatedly, and rather surprisingly, the EU has also woken up, and has condemned a vote in which member states had participated. It is to be hoped that these are the first steps on the road to a more positive relationship between Israel and the United Nations.

israel should ignore it

I noticed that Cuba was removed from the list of Human Rights violators by the United Nations. I wonder what rights Cubans have today to hold an election and to choose their leaders? I wonder if a Cuban exile leader could travel from Miami to la Habana, and make a speech critical of Fidel Castro at the Plaza de la Revolucion in la Habana?

The Secretary General of the United Nations is not a puppet leader of the various UN bodies. He is the leader. The whole point of leadership is to LEAD - not simply to rubber stamp everything. From your previous posts it is clear you have little understanding of the importance of human freedom and human life. While Israel, like any other western nation, has human rights issues - we also have a system set up to address and deal with them that can also change to meet new questions and challenges. There are nations where human life and women and children can be mistreated, imprisioned, slaughtered and violated without the benefit of a system to protect them. That is what the UN Human Rights Counsil was formed to address - not whether it's member states think there should be a Jewish State.

on such list, given the non-democratic, corrupt, theocratic, murderous and/or oppressive regimes that prevail in the countries who promoted the list. The only significance is that Israel does not belong to this club of countries/regimes.

...Ban Ki-Moon is No Waldheim!... If I were you, I rather believe in Waldheim than Moon. At least, he was more elegance to defend his stand on anything. And more importantly, he knew his job description better than Moon. This Moon is stupid, Israel doesn't deserve this kind of man. Believe me.

...it is too much to me... Please, take it easy. This is only a talk, buddy. Besides, I'm only the messenger of palestinian people causes. Do not blame the messenger.

...it is too much to me... Please, take it easy. This is only a talk, buddy. Besides, I'm only the messenger of palestinian people causes. Do not blame the messenger.

If I was a chairman of any Jewish Lobby Organizations in the US, I would give him an advice like this: "We would like to appreciate your support upon Israel, but please be more elegance in the way you support us, and in accordance with UN standing on the matters. If not, it would be embarrasing for Israel and counterproductive for Jewish people".

please excuse my dismay at your comment. but i find it almost laughable(almost...because it really isn't funny), that you have the gall to make such a comment in light of israel's history of unjust and unfair treatment of the palestinians. and those are only two of countless other adjectives to describe it. not every member of the council is biased against israel, my friend, and the vote had only ONE dissention! the eyes of the world are opening; and THAT is the problem that israel is facing. so perhaps instead of the usual "everyone is against us" stance that israel and its supporters have used for 60 years to justify its notoriety; maybe...just maybe...it needs to stop and take a long hard look at itself and its policies...and make the changes that are needed to impress upon the world that it is NOT deserving of any special concern from the u.n. human rights council. but you see...in the present day and age; veiled lies and slight of hand will no longer do. because no one anymore is really fooled. not even israel's friends.

""Thanks for promoting fundamentalist Jihad in our part of the world - why don`t you promote it in yours too?"" In Indonesia they're arresting Jihadists in droves so they're looking for a refuge in Hamastan/Palestine

since it's clearly in violation of every thing the UN stands for. Gety rid of it alrady!

People like Ban Ki-moon are the ones who can make a difference. He is genuinely interested in the well-being of humans. Thank you Ban Ki-moon, good job!

casting the same old murky shadows over the UN's human rights image! While-ever the spotlight is on Israel, America is also in focus. Of course Alejandro Wolff (who seems to fit quite well into John Boltons shoes) would protest any criticism of the poor human rights record/apartheid practiced by Israel, the only 'democracy' in the M.E.!

"Why does the EU vote one way, then comment on the vote differently?" Here is how it works. If France for instance wants to keep quiet their actrivities in Ruanda for example, jsut before the slaughter they have to do some horse trading with the major blocs. In this case the largest bloc that votes blindly together is the OIL Arab Bloc. The Arab Bloc will sit quietly while the French do their dirty work in the Ivory Coast for example. Back in 2003 the French army played an active role against demonstrators in Bouake. French troops were active participants in the war there, which has left thousands upon thousands dead. Why no condemantion from the UN? Why no condemnation of the French for their activities in Ruanda prior to the slaughter? Just watch how the French vote on Middle Eastern issues, it is mesmorizing, and then look at how the Arab Bloc do not propose any condemantion of France regarding their militarism in central Africa. Comprend?

"He should defend whetever the decisions of any UN bodies under his supervision" Indrajaya .....Your comment sounds a little dangerous dont you think? Whats the point of having a head of he can't dsay what he believes, then its just a meaningless title.

Maybe Yosemite will forgive me?

This says it all.

Roland even if what you say may be true, can;t beat television for knowing the facts eh? It still does not mean that the UN has to fixate on Israel, thus letting much more aggrevious abusers off the hook. I realize that you find the Pals cool, somewhat like your t-shirt of Cze Guevera, but their plight actually pales when put beside the plight of Darfur, the Congo, North Korea and yes Cuba. Once again I point out that your views are jaundiced by the attention the situation here recieves, and I am certain that you are not freely writing to any english talkback emanating from North Korea or China, but open your eyes. Fifty Arab states, and those that lick their oil have made it their life-long or generation long ambition to destroy Israel. Palestine is just their weapon. It must be remembered that when Jordan and Egypt took control of the territories after the 48 war, they did not make any attempts to bring the Pals independence nor democracy. Think clearly my friend

""Free Palestine NOW!"" from the rule of Hamas!!

How very true! Does this statement not also apply to the following: Clickfool, Indrajaya, Dutch, Maureen, Leon, Tosefta, Joe, (to a certain extent) Swiss (Dino) aka cheese/Martin/chocolate, and many, many more, who should be working rather than covertly & probably deceitfully wasting their employers' bandwidth/time/money on something that they have zero influence over - a bit like this UN 'Council' then.....

With 57 Muslim countries, and many other countries depending on Arab / Islamic oil, is it any surprise the UN can single out Israel for its attack? How strong are the human rights situations in the member states?

""What is this man doing? He should defend whetever the decisions of any UN bodies under his supervision. He should be a SPOKEPERSON of the UN. If not, he would be irrelevance as a leader of the UN and a laughable object of any member of the UN. UNBELIEVABLE."" Indeed Indrajaya.He should equally condemn human rights abuses in countries such as Russia, a permanent member of the Security Council which commits terrible atrocities in Chechnya,not to mention Indonesia for its blatant human rights violations in Western Papua.How many Papuans have the TNA killed lately Indrajaya?

It is refreshing to finally have someone in the top spot who has relexed his brain muscle. After Waldheim, a former Nazi officer, watched serenely as the body voted "Zionism is Racism", it is good that someone is calling the pot black. I have gotten used to the Kafkaesque "Castle" reasoning used by the Pal and Islamic facisism apologist. They know they have a good thing going in the UN. Whereas not one of their Moslem buddies allow democracy in their own lands, they are free to form their blocs and grease votes with an abundance of oil and grease. A look at some of the countries on this Council points out the reasons why they use Israel to deflect attention from their own pathetic records. For instance we hear regularly from Indrajaya, who writes from INDONESIA! This is a country that killed over thirty thousand fellow Moslems in Achea, and then let them wrought after the Tsunami. They hate the Yanks, but happily accepted the US fleet with it's food and medicines.

So the UN should encourage nations to go to war to solve problems and those nations should keep the land they occupy as a result. It is a total lie to say that the Arab attacked Israel, everyone knows that. Israel the only country in the world without borders, Israel the only country in the world that claims that God has given them the land from Egypt to Iraq and Israel the only country in the world that practices ethnic cleansing and expects the world to support it.

Singling out Israel is like singling out the Jews and singling out the Jews is called antisemitism no matter how many committees and agendas permenanent or otherwise they choose to set up in the name of the so called "human rights".

You 2 will have a lovely future ahead of you. Come to Gaza, the sea's lovely this time of year. Thanks for promoting fundamentalist Jihad in our part of the world - why don't you promote it in yours too?

Indrajaya, you again!!! Get a life... just remember what your country did to poor fellows timorenses... Really, I can't stand this people that criticises Israel with bad human rights records like Indonesia.. .it is too much to me..

That was so ridiculous in the first place. Ban did the right thing putting his organization in its proper place.

All of the EU states on the Human Rights Council voted in favour of the resolution, but the EU is condemning the decision. Men, will you guys ever get your act together...???

Ban is not yet corrupted like kofi, and whatever Israël does, taking care o the sick palestinians or provoding food and taking them in their hospitals for free, Israël never get any thanks, totally injust

A good leader, or good manager, is measured as someone who strives to enhance the function and credibility of the stated goals of his organization or company. Apparently in your eyes he should be a puppet looking out for the sole interests of those that would exploit power to meet their own agendas - as is common to undemocratic countries. LEarn, Indrajaya, how democracy works.

Those were not compulsory resolutions. They were fits of spleen led by the Army of Islamic BTUers (as in oil people). I shudder to think how they would be treated were it not for the oil. If the U.N. were to enforce international law, the occupied territories would be forfeited in a war of aggression. There is potential loss of territory for unprovoked attacks by states. Don't get into the U.N., it a losing battle, though there are pockets, small pockets of sanity and Ban Ki-moon seems like he may be one of those tiny pockets. Got to love that pathological obcession thing but its actually pure hate.

The incompetent head of the UN seeks to appease Israel and the United States despite the crimes committed against the Palestinian people. If he were from the moon he should be able to see that the occupation is sinister and needs to to be condemned as an act of terror against an innocent Palestinian population. The moonster failed to see that the Israeli cruel occupation is directly responsible for the atrocities committed against the Palestinians even by fellow Palestinians. Free Palestine NOW!

What is this man doing? He should defend whetever the decisions of any UN bodies under his supervision. He should be a SPOKEPERSON of the UN. If not, he would be irrelevance as a leader of the UN and a laughable object of any member of the UN. UNBELIEVABLE.

THERE IS NO BETTER RESPONSE, AND THE UN IS DIGGING ITS OWN GRAVE. AS AN UNBIASED, WELL INTENDED, AND PEACE PURSUING BODY, THE UN HAS LOST ALL CREDIBILITY. THIS BEGAN THE DAY THAT THEY ALLOWED ARAFAT TO ADDRESS THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY WITH A PISTOL IN HIS BELT.

Ban-moon as boss of the anti-israel United Nations has the authority to dismantle the UN HUMAN RIGHTS COUNCIL But he only talks.!!So he agrees with the council.

Indeed, it seems the UN Human Rights Council is at last being taken to task at its unfair and unjust criticisms of Israel. Perhaps that 'Oil Money' does not always work.......

Israel has been blatantly ignoring UN Resolutions since the 1950s so this move will budge the Israeli political conscience not one inch.