West Bank rabbi: Jews can kill Gentiles who threaten Israel

Wont it be a better world if there were no religions dividing people and their Holy Books commanding them to kill all the infidels? Instead of following ancient and outdated scriptures, it will be a lot more humane to follow, let us say, the US Constitution or some other more humane teachings.

You can't be from LA and still claim the concept of a child killing anyone is almost unheard of. It happens in the inner cities of the US every day.

This teaching comes straight out of the Talmud in case you didn't know.

"The Quran teaches Muslims to fight those who fight them; Jews believe it's ok to kill women and children ... " (Noor) ... and Christians believe it's their sacred duty to burn heretics and witches alive, and to mount bloody crusades against the infidels. And Hindus burn the widow. The Zionist state was built in the last century, not in biblical times. Noor means light, right? What a bizarre pseudo for a stupid ignorant.

What do we expect to come from this sick enterprise called settlements except sick minds. That is tha natural result. Dismantle all the setlements with no exception or declare a one state where there will be no difference between Jew and Gentile (non Jew).

...To all those who are saying these aren't "real jewish teachings" and other such nonsense- open up the Torah and you'll see the truth. The Quran teaches Muslims to fight those who fight them; Jews believe it's ok to kill women and children- at least, they believed it was ok in biblical times. The Zionist state was built on this kind of thinking.

Is this a sick joke?? This is barbaric and digusting. God gave Moses 10 Commandments of which the sixth says "Thou Shalt not kill." I guess they are not important to these 'rabbis'.

Stop twisting what the Rabbi is saying. The Torah provides very clear exceptions to murder as a sin if the murder is committed in self-defense, just as any Western law ethic does in the US or elsewhere. The point the Rabbi is making by singling out children and babies is that he is saying that children do not need malicious intent to kill you - if their Jihadist caretakers put a gun in their hands then they are dangerous. When kids are being told to kill Jews from an early age, this is not just realistic but it has already happened, when the very concept of a child killing anyone is almost unheard of in the Western world.

badly. Oh well, that's too bad you reap what you sow. Not my fault I could care less about Israel or the Palestinians or any other pissant country in the middle east I just want my Government to stop covering for Israel's bad behavior because folks like me are the ones that will die because of it.

So you select what is printed? Love those free discussions. Manageable news, that is what it is all about

The commandmend says "do not murder" not 'do not kill" as Torah mandates execution of criminals and execution is a form of killing. Moses of blessed memory was not a murderer. He did not kill the egyptian but recited the name of G-d Blessed Be He and that envoked a judgement of death for the egyptian which was not by the hand of Moses. The egyptian raped the wife of the jew that he [egyptian] was later beating. Moses observed the whole thing, from rape of the jew's wife by this egyptian to the beating of this jew by the same egyptian. It was for these crimes the egyptian was subject to death penalty by law of G-d. Also, Moses was denied entry to Land of Israel for disobeyng G-d and hitting the rock to get water instead of speaking to the rock as G-d told him.

If the gentile is a resident of the Land of Israel, he can be executed for breaking the 7 laws of Noah by the court of law. Jews supposed to enforce all the laws of the Torah in the Land of Israel and 7 laws of Noah are part of the Torah. Outside of the Land of Israel you are on your own.

Wasnt Moses punished by God for killing a non-Jew (an Egyptian)? If I remember it correctly he was not allowed to enter the promised land for this.

Now, really, who can "warp god?" The same people who created "him" in the first place. People create god to protect them, to justify the people's actions if in "the name of god," and think that "their god" is the "only god." Israelis who think like this Rabbi are no different from Muslims who think that their "god" gives them the same "rights" that this Rabbi's god gives the Jews, or the same "rights" that the kookie Americans have (who believe that the Jews will settle all of Palestine so that jesus can come again and kill or convert all remaining Jews). Jews are no better or worse than anyone who has created gods; they have just been doing it longer! All nut cases and will probably bring the world to a horrible end.

All the "Sacred Texts" were written by by people with agendas and an ax to grind. They can be interpreted to justify any action, anywhere ,anytime. Clerics and wannabes, and their adherents and followers must be understood to be criminally insane before any progress in Human Affairs occurs.

Rabid Rabbis with rabies rabble rousing! ya'll talk about anti-semetism, what about anti-goyism? Someone call the ADL!!

I guess this Rabbi has arrived on this conclusion after searching Old Testament and Torah. Israels actions so far in past 60 years have demonstrated same teachings. Majority of Israelis believe that the ARABS understand the language of FORCE and hear the same argument here in new york from my Friends of Israel.

You wrote: "If any gentile breaks G-d`s law, it is between G-d and the gentile as long as it does not affect the jews." WELL - THAT is really not how the Rabbi was quoted in the article: "If we kill a Gentile who has sinned or has violated one of the seven commandments - because we care about the commandments - there is nothing wrong with the murder." . Thus, a "Gentile" who is breaking the Noahite Law can be killed, rather the opposite to what you wrote....

Rabbi Yitzhak is fanatic and must be punished for his stupid declaration

I was replying to some guy, "B", who claimed that Achmedinejad wants to kill all Jews. My rebuttal is that he has more than 20,000 Iranian Jews in his power, so why hasn't he killed any of them? Neturei Karta seem happy with him and he with them. Of course, I know that Achmedinejad wants to see the end of Israel as a Zionist state (I agree), and that some of his opinions and attitudes are unacceptable to me, but that is irrelevant to my reply to "B". Incidentally, although the Iranian Jewish population has declined, it now seems stable despite last year's attempt by Israel to pay them to leave.

Does anyone know where I can purchase this book in Brooklyn? I need it for my PHD thesis on the truth behind the so called "blood libel" LOL

Your references for Rodef are correct. The problem is that babies and young children are not likely to pose a threat to the state. Rodef applies to a person attempting to murder another person. It's difficult to see a person attempting to kill the state. With one person pursuing another you can assess the Rodef, warn him etc. How do you assess that he wants to 'kill the state' and can't be stopped short of killing him to rescue 'the state'? It seems these 'rabbis' are abusing the concept of Rodef.

When Meir Kahana first began his Jewish Defense League encouraging NY Jews to fight with Blacks and Hispanics who bothered Jews, no one less than the Posek HaDor the Gaon Reb Moshe Feinstein zt'l denounced Kahana's entire philosophy, saying we must always act within the Law. Kahana moved to Israel and his party was outlawed as racist. The genuine Voice of Daas Torah must clearly condemn these vigilantes and fanatics.

You and many others seem to be completely confused by the fact that some people are capable of sympathizing with civilians while at the same time being very much against terrorists, even if they are of the same ethnicity!!! Of course I realize that it is much more convenient to think of everyone of a certain nationality as terrorists. If nothing else it makes it much easier to justify the atrocities committed against that people in retaliation for those committed by individuals of that people. Even so, I think that it could be very educational for you if you tried to differentiate between civilians and terrorists. At the very least you should be able to see that most of the posters here that you claim support terrorism aren't in fact doing that, they are merely against killing civilians. Which is quite a different thing.

A new breed of distorted and twisted thought is seeping into the Jewish Faith. At the root is a judgemental perspective which separates and disconnects people from others, allowing the gradual demonisation of all those who are seen as "heretics". Where did people forget the principle of Hillel's Golden Rule ?

In the United States they have the right to pre-emptively kill anyone that threatens them. That "anyone" includes the Jews of Israel. So Israel is screwed, just thinking about killing United States gentiles would bring retaliation that would destroy Israel, and it's people. The rabbi must be suicidal to even publicly speak of things that could destroy the israeli nation. Just some advice from a Canadian.

Jews have been killing Gentiles and having that act sanctioned by Rabbis for thousands of years.

The Rabbi proves that his Religion is nullifying the the Old Testament. And how weak a person he must be to fear Babies!!! Fear not! said Jesus!!! But Rabbi doesn't believe in him, alas.

This West Bank Rabbi's comments are execrable and should be condemned. I'm so relieved that this was said by a West Bank Rabbi and not a Jewish Rabbi.

"Several prominent rabbis, including Rabbi Yitzhak Ginzburg [...] have recommended the book to their students and followers." (Haaretz Service) Not surprising. What else could have been expected from this lunatic rabbi-settler who, "in 1994, wrote an article in which he praised Baruch Goldstein who had massacred 29 Arab worshippers at the Cave of the Patriarchs in Hebron. Rabbi Ginsburgh wrote that it is possible to view Baruch Goldstein's act as following five Halachic principles. [...] On this, Motti Inbari commented, 'In his writings, Ginzburg [...] claims that while the Jews are the Chosen People and were created in God's image - the Gentiles do not have this status, and are effectively considered subhuman." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yitzchak_Ginsburgh#Works_in_English

Oh my oh my, and in his next book he plans to question why antisemites hate the Jews........ Israel and the 12m Jewish people would do well to "dissapear" nutjobs like this pig before the 6.7 billion "gentiles" take offence and rectify the situation permanently.

Too much of anything is poison. In truth what he says is exactly what is in scripture. 'god' commanded Joshua to kill the Canaanites in Jericho. Every man woman and *child*.

"Now the Iranian President, Hamas, Hezbollah, etc wants to kill every last Jew." There are 25,000 Jewish folk in Iran, who wouldn't leave even if they were paid to. Hamas forbids harming those who have not dispossessed them or taken up arms against them (it's in their Charter) Hezbollah are allies of the Palestinians, whose territory bordering Lebanon, was illegally acquired by war by 1949 by Israel and never annexed to Israel.

"Isn`t this the same daily rhetoric used by the Islamic world on a daily basis towards all non moslem people and nations? Whom jew haters and talkbackers here praise and defend so fervently." Just one.....thx

Perhaps it'd be better to stop illegally acquiring Palestinian territory. Take away the reason some folk turn to terrorism. After all, 61 years of having your 'friendly, peace loving' neighbour take your territory against International Law and 61 years of US veto in the UNSC protecting the 'peace loving' neighbour as it goes about it's illegal acquisition, probably wears a little thin after a while.

"I don't understand all this 'shock' or false labeling of his views as 'extreme' when this is clearly kosher according to the Torah." (Joe) You are telling only half the truth, which is akin to not telling it at all. This is NOT "clearly kosher according to the Torah". This is clearly kosher according to Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro's reading of the Torah. Yitzhak Shapiro (of the Yitzhar settlement in the West Bank) is no Jewish pope.

S: "I think it is in Israel`s vital interest to keep all our terrorists safe and sound." He isn't saying "death to terrorists". He is saying "death to anyone who threatens the state". S: "If they try to kill us," That is NOT the criteria that this Rabbi is using. It isn't "they are trying to kill us". It is "their being alive is a threat to us". S: "anything so long as not to hurt those who seek to maim and kill us" Again, that is not the criteria for this Rabbi. It isn't "they seek to kill us". It is "their death will remove a threat to us". S: "Maybe we should also buy them clothes..." Maybe you should try taking your blinkers off before you read Haaretz, heh?

Comments on blogs around the world are already taking the rabbi at his word. If the brilliant rabbi says it's in the talmud, it must be so. I have no doubt the permission to kill non jewish babies is in the bible because we know it is. We know what god told joshua to do. But the talmud? I would like to see some talmudic scholars refute the book's arguments and citations. The sooner the better. As I said, it's already being quoted by those who've seen the IDF kill children in gaza without as much as a moment's hesitation. They know israel is itching to bomb Iran and the heck with casualties. Everyone knows israel cheered the mayhem in Iraq. Can people in israel even begin to comprehend the danger the publication of such a book presents? Frankly, this book seems worse than anything most radical Imams preach. And it's being quoted favorably by other settler rabbis too! Mark my word. This is gonna boomerang and I hope at least Jews around the world will condemn these "teachings".

And now we have a sect plying it's ware in the open market. Yitzhak Shapiro, the king of the chai yeshiva, a den of "copy cat" from allah's prose, the taliban, hamas, and other similar gangs. They have been killing babies, children, and men, women as well for good measure. And now we have a Jew (probably a descendant of muhammad)who claim that his private god has appointed him as leader of the pack. His accomplices, Yitzhak Ginsburg and yaakov yosef are basking themselves in the glow of mankind's reject, devoid of any sense of "love, decency, compassion"

Isn't this the same daily rhetoric used by the Islamic world on a daily basis towards all non moslem people and nations? Whom jew haters and talkbackers here praise and defend so fervently. But sadly there are no condemnations posted here when moslem leaders, politicians, mullahs, imans and alike spew the same hateful speeches. Now Haaretz writes,"Shapiro based the majority of his teachings on passages quoted from the Bible, to which he adds his opinions and beliefs". Something here does't add up, a RABBI teaching the Bible [Pretty weird]. Just like the 7 commandments instead of 10 where he obviously has forgotten a few off them, namely THOU SHALT NOT KILL. Here in such a small story you can see a good example of why there isn't and won't be any peace in the ME, from the writer, printer, the subjet, subjet matter and reader replies, Which only stir feelings and fuels/promotes hatred in people. As for killing babies, thats just wrong, whom ever implies it anywhere and in any religi

Who is Yigal Amir? Who was Baruch Goldstein? Who were the Mahteret? Who is this Teitel fellow? With stunts like theirs plus the utterances of rabbis like these and their acolytes who propose giving the books in which they are found to YESHIVA STUDENTS, the case is made without newspapers you don't like.

It is apparently in the Talmud and Tora!! Check the sources!!!! Does this teach us something about the new day we live in and that we cannot go on living on the words the Almighty has spoken ages ago? We need His word to be spoken today or at least an updated interpretation of it.

If true, this is an outrage. This rabbi and his views should be denounced vigorously.

Did people discover the Old Testament today? This Rabbi is ABSOLUTELY correct in his interpretation of the "Torah". There is no shortage of genocidal slaughter of gentiles in the old testament. I don't understand all this "shock" or false labeling of his views as "extreme" when this is clearly kosher according to the "Torah". The "book of Joshua" is no walk in the park, just for starters. The problem is not so much such religious views are dangerous, nutty and hate-filled - which they are to extreme - but a bigger problem is the marriage of such views with the political ideology of Zionism - it's twin brother - and selling political Zionism as kosher but claiming to reject it's twin religious brother. Israel today is and has been born out of such beliefs as expressed by this rabbi. It is because of such beliefs co-existence will never become a reality and peace will never be achieved. Why? Because it is written in the Torah.

I think it is in Israel's vital interest to keep all our terrorists safe and sound. If they try to kill us, we should help them and kill off our brethren for them; anything so long as not to hurt those who seek to maim and kill us. Maybe we should also buy them clothes and wine and dine them and send them on vacations to Sharm el Sheikh...

With "Rabbis" like these, who needs the Europeans? Murder is absolutely forbidden, period. In the times of the Sanhedrin this "Rabbi" would be executed for public Chilul Hashem. With that said - This is another Haaretz stunt against the religous.

"a West Bank rabbi on Monday released a book giving Jews permission to kill Gentiles who threaten Israel" "Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro, who heads the Od Yosef Chai Yeshiva in the Yitzhar settlement, wrote in his book "The King's Torah" that even babies and children can be killed if they pose a threat to the nation." Now, guys'n'gals, I want to point out that a) "threatening the nation" is not at all the same thing as b) "posing a threat to the nation" After all, someone can "pose a threat" merely by being in the way of those who insist that nothing must stand in their path..... A very dangerous man, this Rabbi. Shin Bet already has him in administrative detention, I take it? And if not, then why not?

"when Moslem leaders call for and Moslem terrorists murder little children for the so-called crime of "occupation". The Left justifies the actions!" An example would be nice...

LF: "So it is ok threaten Jews but Jews can`t do it back?" Notice that Lin Fei means that sentence to read "So it is ok threaten Jews but Jews can`t threaten Gentiles back?" In which case Lin Fei is feigning ignorance of this article, because the Rabbi is actually mulling over this question: "So it is ok threaten Jews but Jews can`t murder them back?" The Rabbi's answer is: Yeah, Jews can murder Gentiles who threaten Jews Indeed, he is (apparently) also saying: Yeah, Jews can murder Gentiles who POSE A THREAT to Jews Those two statements are not necessarily the same thing but, regardless, and I don't see how either IN THEMSELVES justifies an act of murder. After all, this Rabbi's attitude clearly poses a threat to Gentiles, but I wouldn't dream of claiming that this justifies his murder.....

Well, it seems Judo-fascism is institutionalised and is a state-sponsored reality now. It will be very intereseting to see Judo-fascists and Islamo-fascists meet headway. May be we can get rid of both altogether.

It is shocking to read a rabbi giving the green light for his followers to commit murder. More shocking, is the fact that this book is being recommended to be taught to students. I wonder were is Israel is going? I am certain that it will one day face a terrible fate under the leadership of this kind of criminal minds.

And Israelis wonder why they are losing support for Israel among young American Jews.

After all, many Israeli Jews fear the demographic "threat" posed by Arabs and their high birth rate. Hence, according to the Rabbi's logic, Israel would be justified in killing Arab children so as not to threaten Israel's identity as a "Jewish state".

By next week a rsolution can be expected to be passed in the US Congress endorsing the Rabbi's views.

So there was a reason - it was a self gratifying reason but it is no different than this rabbis reasoning. Also, giving Jews the right to kill gentiles who violate the commandments - commandments written and followed by Jews - its like saying that Muslims or Christians can kill others who don't follow their rules or beliefs. Given the chance Jews, like Gentiles, become fascist - the problem for the jew is that he has never held power. Even today, ironically, Israel is dependent on the Christian west for its survival, the same people this rabbi decries and would not welcome in his "deutscheland"

Good thing the Palestinians don't have predator drones to assassinate those crazy religious nuts

Extra-judicial targeted assassinations, and killing of non-combatants including children are routinely employed. I believed someone recently wrote a report about that.

""If we kill a Gentile who has sinned or has violated one of the seven commandments - because we care about the commandments - there is nothing wrong with the murder."" Christians are "idolaters", idolatry violates one of the seven commandments, so all Christians can be killed...Nice.

Its Israel Ahmadinejad wants to do away with. Lets face it this falsifier of Jewish law needs to be condemned I hope Haaretz publishes my quotation of the rseal law. Now when can we expect you to condemn the racist lies that is the regular fare in the Arab media about JEWS!? How you can ignore it or pretend not be aware of it while coming here wrapped in the cloak of peace and justice seekers is beyond my understanding. PS Just let me know if you want some choice quotes.

When will people realize that faith does not replace understanding ? It only replaces proof for the absolute No-thing we call God. It is not faith which is blind only the people who use it to serve their own evil ends. If history has taught us one thing it is that following these insane "rabbis" will lead us only to our own destruction.

Rabbi Shapiro should stick to religion and let the Govt of Israel and the IDF do what they are best at doing.

Back all the way to the spirit of the days of Joshua and Amalekites he and his kind would take us. Any chief rabbi worthy of the name would promptly excommunicate this joker.

Too much of anything is poison. In truth what he says is exactly what is in scripture. 'god' commanded Joshua to kill the Canaanites in Jericho. Every man woman and *child*.

Judaism, Christianity and Islam have all been vandalized by its crazy clerics at one time or another. I agree that these extremist clerics have more in common with fellow extremist clerics from another religion than they have with their coreligionists. Only these extreme clerics KNOW who is a true Jew, Christian, or Muslim. The sooner the world gets rid of all of these extremists, the better chance for peace. Peace to all.

cannot be stopped by lesser means. Rodef From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search A rodef (Hebrew רודף, lit. "pursuer"; pl. רודפים, rodefim), in traditional Jewish law, is one who is "pursuing" another to murder him or her. According to Jewish law, such a person must be killed by any bystander after being warned to stop and refusing. The source for this law is the Tractate Sanhedrin in the Babylonian Talmud, page 73a, which begins: And these are the ones whom one must save even with their lives [i.e., killing the wrongdoer]: one who pursues his fellow to kill him [rodef akhar khaveiro lehargo], and after a male or a bethrothed maiden [to rape them]; but one who pursues an animal, or desecrates the Sabbath, or commits idolatry are not saved with their lives. This law, the din rodef ("law of the pursuer"), is significant as one of the few provisions in Jewish law permitting extrajudicial killings. The allowance to kill the rodef does not apply, however, in a case where lesser means would prevent the innocent's murder.[1] Furthermore, according to the Rambam, killing a rodef who may have been stopped by lesser means constitutes murder, though the punishment for a murderer in this case is not dealt out by Beit din.[citation needed]

Can the Rabbi issue further clarifcation on whether Jews are allowed to eat the babies they slaughter as well? Jews may look a tiny bit cruel if they kill them just for sport.

Happily there is many Rabbis that 100% do not agree with him at all. He is wrong yet he is part of the problem and why such people as Teitel do what they do, they are inspired by such men. Our Jewish version of the Taliban. Thankfully Israel and Israelis favour democracy and not the theocracy of the Rabbis.

I am a strong supporter of Israel but I am dissapointed this time. I disagree with the Rabbi making it legal to kill babies. The Government of Israel is now telling its citizens that they can just walk up to a baby in a stroller and cut the childs throat on the chance it might grow up to be a terrorist? This move is going to do more harm than good. Rabbi Shapiro and Netanyanhu need to realize that by officially legalizing the murder of babies they're going to alienate the US and whatever other allies they have.

There are plenty of rascist US Jews living in WB settlements who hate Christians and Muslims. They're a fairly wacky irrational crowd but potentially highly dangerous.

"this rabbi must be prosecuted" Why? Just because he went to Rabbinical school? Do you really think his title "Rabbi" gives him some kind of "authority"? You would rather his book sell because he is some kind of martyr? Time to make up your own mind about what constitutes genuine authority! It doesn't come with a piece of paper posted on his office wall! And anyone can write a book sensational enough to sell - for a while, anyway.

Should have permission to "Kill" jewish rabbis who live illegaly in the West bank Settlements and who write books that entice Jews to kill pals.

This hijacking of Judaism by a violent criminal radical like Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro, is no different than the hijacking of Islam, or the hijacking of Christianity done by other violent psychopaths in the name of "god". It is the burden of the responsible followers of Judaism to tear this man down -- just as it is the burden of Muslims and Christians to deal with those who hijack their religions.

Wonder where this rabbi and Teitel & co. were when Rabin was shot.

One thing has been made clear, Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro is a racist. Only a racist could justify the deaths of others as if they were sub-human based upon nothing more than what group they belong to.

Clearly Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro IS a threat to peace. I wonder how he would feel if he were to face his own medicine. What is good for the Goose...

Now is the time for the real Rabbis to stand up and say what is right and what is wrong. .....and what do I hear loud and clear: silence! This is the problem: we have no real Rabbis anymore. No spiritual leaders but only politicians and power loving people. We must face the reality. PS: Has the State of Isrlae arrested that man?

then every decent Jew who believes in the worth of all mankind better say goodbye to their faith. These rabbis are no different than the ayatollahs of Iran. Maybe worse.

Amen! Amen! Amen!

What religious fanatics have in common is that they have not yet learned to distinguish between their faith and their national patriotism. Until a religious person can make that distinction clearly in his own mind, he is not worth his salt as a teacher of religion, or as a leader in politics. He will inevitably gravitate towards power, wherever it is to be found. Power is his instrument. dominance his goal, and understanding his nemesis.

And I thought my religious leaders were not so loonie.

From time to time in every religion extremists pop out of the woodwork. The test is whether people will follow after the extremist and take actions advocated by him. We see what happens with the likes of Bin Laden make speeches and thousands of innocent people are killed. I hope and pray that these rabbis who advocate violence will remain isolated with no followers. This wil be the test of our Jewish values.

This is one persons fear talking no action.But Islamists everyday systematically act and train people to kill all who don't submit.This is a stupid article to write about one man instead of the whole group of Islamists who actually do kill women and children.

The the Yeshiva's in the occupied territories that are teaching hate and murder to Israeli children must be disbanded and its so-called Rabbi leaders arrested for inciting hatred and terrorism. How can Israel allow what is no different than others calling for the murder of Jews to go unchallenged, and those who preach such a sick ideology to remain free to spread their wicked venom.

"What else is common between us and them except Jewishness?" - S If you ask, then they probably consider you to not be sufficiently Jewish. Religious fanatics of all religions have much more in common with each other, than with the vast majority of their religion.

"It`s not just one rabbi, it`s a movement." - sh Yes, it is a movement. Worse than that it is a movement that holds the entire nation of Israel hostage to it's lusts. The Settlers see themselves as the only Jews doing God's work. And the see God's work as what they desire to do. This is a BIG threat to Israel, for it has prevented any peace negotiations, and made the nation of Israel appear to be everything it's worst critics claim it is. The man's virulent racism and ruthless declarations will be used to justify anti-Semitism and the claim that all Jews are just like him. Which is a real shame.

"I wonder who safeguards these extremists...." The left hand of politicians while the right hand spouts rightist propaganda? Got to have a leftist to attack or the rightist will die of boredom.

it is sad to read that the rabbi allows even righteous gentiles to be killed even if he is no problem, like making him sacrifice for own goals. I was thinking to be a noahide but i will now read talmud carefully as I think as a rabbi he might have sourced from holy books as muslims terrorize from quran. rabbi, what have you done?

This kind of religious lunatic may be found in ANY religion. We regularly hear such twaddle from folks who think they speak for God in many tongues and religions. Anyone familiar with the last 3,000 years of Jewish thinking is aware this joker is living in the very distant past. He is not typical, nor are he other fanatics in the settlements. Israel might be guilty of harboring, and supporting those people but to claim that Israel IS those people is absurd. He is nothing more than a religious nut case. Twisting religion to defend his inhumanity, warping God to his service.

the Talmud?

"Didn`t you people notice the punch line? It`s not just one rabbi, it`s a movement." Right, sh. Is doesn't matter which national or religious name you attach to it, it is still radical right terrorism. You can call it Iranian,Gazan, West Bank, Syrian, or Israeli. You can call it Shia, Sunni, Jewish, Christian, or Zionist. Wherever you look, in whichever faith you search you will always find these reactionaries who spend so much time studying the past that they lose contact with the present. The sad irony is, they want to change the present and mold your future and mine. They will fail; but they will not understand why

Correct! But it IS zionist! These guys have been around since the day the walls of Jericho came tumbling down. You can't get rid of them any more than you can get rid of Islam's jihadists, only stomp on them as they raise their irreverent, terrorist eyes to their imagined heaven.

Correct! But it IS zionist! These guys have been around since the day the walls of Jericho came tumbling down. You can't get rid of them any more than you can get rid of Islam's jihadists, only stomp on them as they raise their irreverent, terrorist eyes to their imagined heaven.

As a Jew, reading this makes me sick to my stomach. As a staunch Zionist and supporter of Israel, I can understand the desire to protect the Jewish nation at any cost but to publish books saying it's ok to kill babies and children is way over the top. This is not in line with Jewish teachings and values and this rabbi needs a bit of a lesson in what it means to be a Jew. I always wondered what it would be like to a be a muslim horrified by the horrible things some muslims do and say and now I'm starting to catch a glimpse of what that must be like just reading about this rabbi....

You know, by Palestinians that feel that Jews threaten the existance of Palestine? Seems only fair.

Often I disagree with swiss Dino, but today you no. 35 must have had too much vodka: can you please send me a copy of the by you quoted newspaper, because I have never heard of it. So much for the Swedish Truth. PS: This so-called Rabbi should be put behind bars and in perpetual detention.

There is never a valid reason to target youngsters. Collateral damage is another story. Let another people be extremists.

Exactly, but that is precisely the problem with this sick mentality. It thrives on anti-semitism. It must have anti-semitism and they create their own sufl fulfilling prophesy. They believe the world can only be anti-semitic. It is an imperative. It is an existential reality for them. The gentiles are created with animal soulds that make them qualitatively different from Jews. They are on a different plain. At best you live in seperation from them and let them live as long as they do not inteerfere with Jews. If they are deemd an enemy in action then you kill them and there is no distinction between those who are the actual perpetrators and innocent. They are all guilt and must be wiped out. It cannot be any different for them. They vannot exist without a world that is against them in an adverserial relationship.

This sounds pretty much like hamrada. Idf you belong to the wrong fold you get indicted for such incitement. Let us see what happens next. A psaq to kill the prosecutor maybe? We are back at square one, and must act quickly. Where are Mazuz, Lador and Neeman? Where is the police?

Another world... they for us...and us for them. What else is common between us and them except Jewishness?

If palestinians themselves are willing to endanger their own children and use them as human shields while shooting jewish soldiers and while shooting missiles at israeli daycare centers (in Sderot, etc.) intending to kill the jewish children, why should jewish soldiers let the palestinians do that? What's a jewish soldier to do? Should the jewish soldier protect the palestinian human shield-children and thus let the palestinian terrorist kill more jews? If palestinian children die in attacks it is because palestinian terrorists force them to become human shields.

The article did NOT say that the rabbi was arguing that killing is GOOD. Rather that in a threatening situation killing it is PERMISSIBLE. Also, the rabbi did NOT say, "oh how fun, lets go kill a non-jewish baby!" Rather that sometimes the elimination of a threat will result in the INCIDENTAL death of innocent lives. While I am not a personal fan of using religious texts to sort out moral questions of this sort, all of us in our respective societies struggle in deciding WHEN we are allowed to kill in perceived self-defense and HOW MANY innocent casualties are considered REASONABLE. The idea that it is possible to eliminate threats of these sorts with no collateral damage is an illusion.

"Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro...wrote...that even babies and children can be killed if they pose a threat to the nation...Several prominent rabbis...have recommended the book to their students and followers." I tried to formulate an adequate response to this, but was utterly at a loss for suitable words. Is my New Testament God so completely different from that of the Old Testament?

And that's the rabbi's point. If you as a jew know that a certain gentile is coming to attack you with an intent to kill, as a jew you are allowed to and must defend youself and kill the gentile if needed. That's not extremism but an unfortunate reality of the Middle East. Unlike islam, judaism does not seek world domination. Jews do not seek to become gentile world's judge and jury. If any gentile breaks G-d's law, it is between G-d and the gentile as long as it does not affect the jews.

To kill and murder have different meanings, if someone kills in self defence it is not murder. That Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro used the word murder makes the meaning different.

come on Peter sm---give us one of your slogans to cover this one???.

I'm a "J-Street Supporter of Israel;" but I can't comprehend where this Rabbi is coming from. If Jews are wondering why there's anti-semitic behavior in the world, start with oneself and especially this Rabbi's comments.

In Europe they send people to jail for denying the Holocaust!-and it's right,so. We should send to prison, here in Israel,all those who incite to murder, rabbi or not! It looks like we forgot the lesson from the death of Prime Minister Rabin! WORDS CAN KILL! STOP HIM NOW !

You shall not murder.

There is no difference. Looks like both Islam and Judaism has it's share of nutjobs who proclaim that killing for religion is a good thing.

The Bible says do not murder, so this is a contradiction of the Bible. "If we kill a Gentile who has sinned or has violated one of the seven commandments - because we care about the commandments - there is nothing wrong with the murder." I guess he also thinks that he is sinless. Whoever has not committed sin, throw the first stone. Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro you were born in sin just like rest of humanity. You are talking like the Extremist Muslims that say it is alright to murder the enemies in the name of Allah, and that would make you no better than them. Your chosen leaders will give the country notice when it is necessary to defend the country.

this rabbi is ignorant. children are gods creatures and as such we must protect them. i dont care about the religion that someone has . i care about his feeling as a human being. our enemies are the ones who put our existence to danger by their dids or their preaching , jews or gentiles.

rabbis turning to talibans do not have the right to teach in a yeshiva. they are our worst enemies.

Would you be as complaisant if it were an imam advocating the same rules for muslims toward Jews? If not, what's the difference? For you are there two sets of rules, depending on what religion one espouses?

I agreee with you a 100 percent. We find evil people hiding in all religions. They take sacred texts and twist them until they are a total perversion to the true meaning. G-D knows these evil people who manipulate others to commit crimes that go against everything sacredt to true believers. This rabbi is not a man of G-D.

Your point being...?

This man is not a "rabbi". A nut by any other name is still a nut. It just goes to show that there are Jewish lunatics in the world as well. Barry Zornberg

"Now the Iranian President, Hamas, Hezbollah, etc wants to kill every last Jew." Utter bilge! Think about this - if Achminejad wanted to kill Jews, why are there so many in Iran and why don't they leave, even when offered a bribe by the Zionists to do so? If you come here to defend these murderous rabbis, what does that make you?

Shame on those "rabbis" ( ? ) who dare to say such immoral and stupid things. They certainly want to show off, looking for new "markets" in some paranoid microsociety. But in facts they only give room to prejudice for antisemites and sadness to sane fellow Jews.

This kind of man who would ask you to kill your own family What a shame , he really must be prosecuted and arrested

I wonder if there is a bug going around which affects the mind. Talibanpsychosis? It needs to be looked into.

A week ago a story came out how the troops opened fire at suspects ,hitting a father and his daughters . Point me out to talbacks at the Danish press ,commenting upon it so extensively as this piece at "Haaretz" does. You won't be able to.Period.

You must be kiddin' - I can't read the sarcasm out of your post but I surely missing out on something. Thanks for an entertaining post - for a second I thought you were for real! Phew.

Terrorists in disguise using religion again.

and therefore Gnom Dingo expresses outrage somebody threatening other country's existence could actually be killed. No ,those threatening Switzerland are bored slowly to death by Gnom Dino readng them the "Züricher Allgemeine Zeitung" .

Some psychotic rabbi from the West Bank states what has been the Israeli policy through decades. Where's the novelty in that?

The same old story, i have the right to kill because he the moslem os christian threaten to kill me, NO,no onehas this right ,no matter what religion or where you live, its called murder, plain and simple as that.

This is really a libel. What is in question is whether in situations where it is permissable to kill a Jew from a philosophical point of view whether it justifiable to kill a gentile(s) perhaps even those who are blameless due to their age. Think of bombing Dresden or Hiroshima or better yet Munich's perpetrator's daughter in order to kill her father (remember that scene??). Jewish morality since it derives from Torah is much more liberal than the morality of the world at large. Rabbi uses scripture to substantiate the claim that indeed in certain situations of extreme calamity to the Jewish race such action is justifiable and perhaps required.

... when Moslem leaders call for and Moslem terrorists murder little children for the so-called crime of "occupation". The Left justifies the actions!

is deaming it Kosher to kill Palestinin babies? Let's hope that not to many Israelis sign on to that one. Should the "right of return" for the Jews of West Bank apply to this guy and his followers?

nor history for that matter. I was talking about the Palestinians stabbing the Solders! However, I think you understood I am not talking about babies. Think what you like but Jews there are being killed and threatened all the damn time. I am sick of it! All of Europe fears the Arabs but yet Israel can not only challenge them but can defeat them as well. Go to Israel and call yourself a Jew or better yet go to Gaza and do that and see what threats come to you. So I ask would you give them coffee or cry to Israel for help? Wake up damn it!

one has rights to defence himself; which is not clear "the babies issue"

here we have a radical idea how to solve it. These settlement 'Rabbis" are a threat to Israel.

This is sickening and just as insane as the preaching of extreme orthodox muslim and christian leaders. This man is nothing but a result of centuries of inbreeding in the orthodox communithy. Something very wrong in his head.

This means that the alleged war crimes were perfectly legal after all? [shakes head]

The question is not to compare what Rabbi SHAPIRO proposes as a response to what arabs would do: there are standards of ethic to respect no matter what.Babies are not soldiers.

There are plenty of them all over the world, it is not especially surprising that there are Jewish ones as well. Lin Fei, you may want to note that the word threaten does not seem to be playing such an important part as the title implies: "It is permissable to kill the Righteous among Nations even if they are not responsible for the threatening situation," "If we kill a Gentile who has sinned or has violated one of the seven commandments - because we care about the commandments - there is nothing wrong with the murder."

"What if you get stabbed in the neck? Would you give them coffee. If it is up to God then let it be." Do you believe you could get stabbed in the neck by babies? BTW. Babies aren't to be given coffee, under no circumstances. It may prove harmful to them.

Well,it is well admitted that judaism brought progress in ethics and humanism, in antique times. And even though It was THEN a progress, there were still traces of barbarism, very much common on that times.But many of cruel laws of the Bible have not been eagerly enforced by antique Rabbis and Sanhedrin for ethical considerations (ex: lapidation). An most jews now understand that many laws of the Bible cannot be applied anymore. Now Rabbi SHAPIRO talking of murdering babies is the very example of negation of how judaism evolved- as much compassion as possible. Rabbi Shapiro would have been a good ante-babylonian legislator.

"Several prominent rabbis, including Rabbi Yithak Ginzburg and Rabbi Yaakov Yosef, have recommended the book to their students and followers." It's not just one rabbi, it's a movement.

You know what, there is a line and its called our owm limits, we have the right to free speech as long as it does not advocate murder etc etc, this rabbi has now passed the limits and should be held acounable for what he said, nobody but nobody has the right to kill, or even say you have the right, because then you are just as guilty as the murderer.

I do not think that he is really talking about babies from his heart but if so then maybe the Palestinians should care more about them instead of using them for weapontry! but that is ok when Arabs do it and to their own kids at that!

People there are people who want to kill jews but no word from these same haters.So it is ok threaten Jews but Jews can't do it back? What if you get stabbed in the neck? Would you give them coffee. If it is up to God then let it be.

Arrest him.

...that supports violent actions against unarmed civilians,Rabbi, Mullah or Priest - no difference - should be persecuted and put to jail. As well as it is TOTALLY unacceptable with suicide-bombers acting against Jewish civilians, also this kind of conduct from the extremists in the Jewish side is TOTALLY unacceptable. G-D aka Allah aka Hashem - save the world from extremism !!!

Now the Iranian President, Hamas, Hezbollah, etc wants to kill every last Jew.

This West Bank rabbi is giving false teachings of the Tenach, based on his own interpretation! It is very dangerous because this promotes fighting and brutal killings of children in the name of G-d. This extremism breeds terrorism. Sad to hear that a rabbi could do such a thing.

A very sick, and dangerous, society has been created in the West Bank. True, there are few murderers among the inhabitants and certainly not all are of the lunatic fringe. But there is enough sickness among the population to be very disturbing. And the sickness is spreading. The sane among them must come home. And, the rest need to be cut off. The State of Israel cannot allow itself to become captive to a fanatical and violent fringe.

Here the lines have disappeared between Muslim, Jewish, Christian, Hindu and others chilling and killing extremism. Here is the trigger that bridges long build up prejudices and hatred to bloody and pre-meditated violence. The persecuted became the persecutor, the 'victim' perpetrator.

Rabbi "Elior Chen and several of his followers allegedly used knives, hammers and other tools to abuse children as young as 3 and 4 years old in the West Bank settlement of Beitar Illit" A settlement Rabbi, what did you expect?

a settlemet Rabbi, what did you expect?

How can a Rabbi say this? It clearly is in violation of Torah. I also feel its for G-d to judge and not us.

My duly considered point is, that while Rabbi Shapiro's quote seems pretty much on the "cold" side, so to speak, inasmuch as "murder" is by definition an illegal taking of life--which he indicates there's nothing wrong with (as long as one of the "seven" commandments have been violated)--does he propose the same apparent inconsistency (unless it's a translation problem) for violations of the other three commandments (whichever is which)? In any event, I would hazard a guess that his teaching will not "play well in Peoria"--not that he's announced so far that he's taking his show on the road--or even which road. Stay tuned, as they say.

The best place for Rabbi Shapiro is a mental hospital. He is an example of extreme terrorism. Very bad for Judaism.

I am horrified. I agree with talkback#1: these rabbis are issuing inciting rhetoric under the guise of religion. And in this case, it is my religion and my spiritual heritage which is being abused. And I agree: these Rabbis should be arrested and prosecuted for inciting speech.

This Rabbi's comments reflect the very same premise of extremism that the enemies of Israel promote and carry out. His blatant departure from intelligent and thoughtful probing into the Torah is inexcusable and he has proclaimed himself an enemy of Hashem, the Torah, Humanity and the State of Israel. As such, he should be brought to justice by a 'sane' world and his position dismissed immediately. He has flagrantly branded himself a terrorist. I say this without the least bit of left-wing, tree-hugging ignorance but from a deep understanding of the disposition as it has been bestowed upon all human beings. How a "Rabbi" could arrive at such absurd departures from reality is a sad thing and his statements are tantamount to murder as it defames Jews the world over, shedding blood through embarassment and making us a target for physical, verbal and emotional abuse from our gentile bretheren. As if we don't have enough problems on our hands, we need this? Pathetic and sad.

...cand be killed if they threatens Israel? So absurb... The paranoia in its "best"

This so called 'Rabbi" should be charged with incitment to murder and put behind bars where he belongs !