Jews who want to see Jews leave Israel

What I find so hard to understand is how you can be so thick as not to understand that NO ONE IS GOING TO RECOGNIZE ISRAEL AS, "ISRAEL, THE STATE FOR THE JEWISH PEOPLE" unless Israel changes its name. That is not the name of Israel. Israel declared statehood as the State of Israel. It is recognized as a member of the UN as the State of Israel. The name of your country is NOT Israel, the State for the Jewish People. If Israel does not call itself by that name, why should the Palestinians or anybody else call Israel by that name. If you are unable to understand that simple issue, do not address anymore correspondence to me. It will prove you are not mentally competent to carry on a dialogue.

The Arab League peace offers do mention UN 194, but give significant effort to ensure there are no, "demands," on Israel as you falsely claim. The API (Arab Peace Initiative) calls for a "just resolution to the refugee problem to be agreed upon in accordance with UNGA Resolution 194". UNGA 194, which has been reaffirmed by the UNGA every year since its adoption, remains the international consensus for resolving the Palestinian refugee question. The API ensures that through a process of negotiation, Israel?s concerns will be taken into account in deciding how the resolution will be implemented. The API also takes account of the fact that a comprehensive resolution to the refugee question cannot be achieved without the backing of several Arab states, most notably those hosting large numbers of Palestinian refugees including Lebanon, Syria and Jordan. The initiative provides a framework for an "agreed upon" solution to the refugee problem with all relevant parties, including Israel

The Arab League peace offers do mention UN 194, but give significant effort to ensure there are no, "demands," on Israel, as you falsely claim. The API (Arab Peace Initiative) calls for a "just resolution to the refugee problem to be agreed upon in accordance with UNGA Resolution 194?. UNGA 194, which has been reaffirmed by the UNGA every year since its adoption, remains the international consensus for resolving the Palestinian refugee question. The API ensures that through a process of negotiation, Israel?s concerns will be taken into account in deciding how the resolution will be implemented. The API also takes account of the fact that a comprehensive resolution to the refugee question cannot be achieved without the backing of several Arab states, most notably those hosting large numbers of Palestinian refugees including Lebanon, Syria and Jordan. The initiative provides a framework for an ?agreed upon? solution to the refugee problem with all relevant parties, including Israel.

"You repeatedly state the Palestinians will not recognize "Israel as the State for the Jewish People," so therefore they do not want peace"(Ron) Yep Ron, you got it, that's what I have been saying all along. And since the Pal Arabs by their own admission have been fighting this war because they wanted Israel to be another Arab state, NOT a Jewish one. They have to now renounce that policy by explicitly recognising Israel as the state for the Jewish people. Only then will Israel believe them that they really mean to end their war. Which bit of that do you find so hard to understand Ron?

"The actual wording of both peace offers refers to the refugee issue with, "a just and agreed upon solution to the Palestinian refugee question." Get it?"(Ron) They mention that they want to resolve the refugee issue based on the outdated UN resolution 194 which demands that Israel should allow the Pal Arab refugees into Israel proper. But of course, once again, the Arabs are being selective about UN resolutions. When they did NOT like a UN resolution, such as UN resolution 181 they have always ignored it. And then they complain when Israel too ignores UN resolutions. Especially since the UN only seems to want to enforce it's own resolutions selectively and in a discriminatory way.... The UN ignores Arab transgressions and only reacts to Israeli transgressions. Why do you think that is, Ron? Could it be Arab Petro Dollars and the pressure of Muslim allies of the Arabs, we could even call them the 'Arab Lobby' couldn't we, Ron?

...are you trying to convince yourself that you are right? "The question was, if Perez`s comments were the official Israeli response to Arab peace offers, what was it? And you say"(Ron) I say that a response from a country's foreign minister to an offer by another country is always an official response ... The rest has been covered by both of us repetitively above. Go read it again.

You should read the Arab League peace offers to the State of Israel, because you keep referring to them in ways that indicate you don't know what they really say. If you did you would not write that they insist on the return of possibly millions of Palestinians to Israel proper. The actual wording of both peace offers refers to the refugee issue with, "a just and agreed upon solution to the Palestinian refugee question." Get it? "just and agreed upon." Nothing ominous, nothing threatening, just a polite proposal that the issue be negotiated. In what more responsible and diplomatic manner could the issue be raised? And you Jews react as if the sky will fall and you must all trample each other in a mass, mad dash to Masada. You are a nation of paranoids and fear mongers. How can anybody possibly make peace with a nation possessing the diplomatic sophistication of a banana republic.

You Jews repeatedly state the Palestinians will not recognize "Israel as the State for the Jewish People," so therefore they do not want peace. No one will recognize Israel by that name until the State of Israel changes its name. As I wrote you before: your demand that Arabs recognize Israel as, "Israel the State for the Jewish People," is asinine. No nation has such an official name. The name of Israel is the "State of Israel." Arabs should only recognize Israel in the name it chose for itself, as every other nation in the world does. Israel has diplomatic relations with 162 nations, every one of them recognize Israel and the State of Israel. There is no member state in the UN with the name, "Israel the State for the Jewish People." So why do you demand the Palestinians call Israel some other name. If you don't like it, change the name of the country. How silly!

The question was, if Perez's comments were the official Israeli response to Arab peace offers, what was it? And you say: I conclude that he viewed the offer as a positive step and that he was happy to discuss the offer further. I conclude, that Israel did NOT like ALL aspects of the plan. Lets take your response and put it before the UN, and the US and EU who endorsed the offers. Arab League: what did he say? US rep: I conclude he viewed the offer as a positive step and was happy to discuss the the offer further. EU rep: You conclude? What does that mean? He didn't say he wanted to discuss the offer further. Where did you read that? Does he want to start negotiations or not? UN rep: I conclude Israel does not like all aspects of the plan. Arab League: You conclude, he concludes, everybody concludes. Don't any of you know? Can't someone call and ask the damned Jews whether they want to meet for negotiations or not? Tim, my man, Perez's opinion was not an official response.

... for the Jewish people. So you are the one who is trying to slip and slide to side topics Ron. "You started with the claim that the Palestinians refused to recognize Israel. I proved you wrong"(Ron) ... And on that score you certainly did NOT prove me wrong because the Arabs certainly did not and do not want to renounce that pretext of theirs. The fact that they insist on the 'Return' of possibly millions of Pal Arabs into Israel proper proves it ... As for the rest of your post: I have already answered your attempts of misinformation. Go read again what I said...

What part of the phrase by the 'moderate" Arab leaders who say they will never recognize Israel as a Jewish state do you not understand? I & others like me are still awaiting a proper response here.Egypt has made too many to count violations on its "liberated Sinai" & Jew free Gaza has launched thousands of rockets, mortors, etc into soverign Isarel with hardly any world rebuke! That is just sick & hypocritical to me.

... and interpret it for yourself: "Israel views positively every initiative aimed at arriving at peace and normalization"(Peres - Israel's foreign minister in 2002) "It is also clear that the details of every peace plan must be discussed directly between Israel and the Palestinians"(Peres - Israel's foreign minister in 2002) What can you conclude from that? I conclude that he viewed the offer as a positive step and that he was happy to discuss the offer further. I also conclude, as I told you before, that Israel did NOT like ALL aspects of the plan, for example: The demand for the so called right of return, possibly of millions of enemies into Israel proper. And if you look at what happened subsequently, you will find that the plan became dormant because the Arabs were not willing to discuss the plan further. They in effect said: Take it or leave it as is. That is NOT a peace offer, that?s an ULTIMATUM! That's why there were no further discussions, Kapish Ron?

If you contend that the Peres statement (below) was an official Israel government response to the Arab League peace offer, endorsed by the US and the EU, what was the response? What did he say. Was Israel prepared to enter negotiations in response to the peace offers, or did it reject them? "On March 28, 2002, then Foreign Minister Shimon Peres said: "Israel views positively every initiative aimed at arriving at peace and normalization. In this respect, the Saudi step is an important one, but it is liable to founder if terrorism is not stopped. We cannot, of course, ignore the problematic aspects which arose at the Beirut Summit and the harsh and rejectionist (sic) language used by some of the speakers. It is also clear that the details of every peace plan must be discussed directly between Israel and the Palestinians, and to make this possible, the Palestinian Authority must put an end to terror, the horrifying expression of which we witnessed just last night in Netanya"(Shimon P

It looks as if you are trying to slide away from the real subject at hand. Who committed which atrocities six or sevens decades ago is boring and not relevant to any existing issues today: a waste of time. The real issue is the Israeli response to Arab League peace offers. You started with the claim that the Palestinians refused to recognize Israel. I proved you wrong by reporting the 2002 and 2007, US, and EU endorsed, Arab League peace offers to the State of Israel, and the complete lack of an official Israeli government response. You maintain Israel did respond, and in #161 quoted Perez's comments on the Arab League offer. In #166, I asked you that if Perez's comments were an official Israeli response to the peace offers, what did he say? Did Perez declare the Israeli government agreement to meet and negotiate the peace offers, or did he declare the Israeli government rejection of the offers? If that was an official Israeli response, the entire international community missed it.

"The first date I listed for Jewish attacks was 12Dec47 because you started with 29Nov47. My list of over 2,000 words of Jewish atrocities against Palestinians starts with 1937"(Ron) Ok Ron, you now want to go back to 1937 when Jews too were violent. Then how about going back to Hebron on the 23rd and 24th of August 1929 when 67 Jews were massacred by your Palestinian Arabs. See, Ron, whatever date you bring up, I can bring up an earlier date in which your Palestinian Arabs committed violence and atrocities against Jews. So, please ... enough with your fairy tale denials that your Palestinian Arabs were NOT the first to start the war against the Jews. And sure, I admit that Jews too were violent in return ... what do you expect? Now back to the topic. The reason why the Pal Arabs were/are violent is because they didn't and many still don't want to see a Jewish state in the Middle East. They only want an Arab state on the whole of what they call Palestine (including Israel itself) ... Therefore, so long as they [your Pal Arabs] won't renounce that old policy of theirs and unless they are willing to recognise Israel as the state for the Jewish people, then clearly their real intention is to continue to fight their 100 year war against the Jewish nation of Israel even after Israel would cede lands to them. So, it would be foolhardy for Israel to release their control, at least until your Pal Arabs will come to their senses and renounce their 100 year old pretext for war. Don't you think so Ron? But then again, why am I asking the likes of you ... ?

The first date I listed for Jewish attacks was 12Dec47 because you started with 29Nov47. My list of over 2,000 words of Jewish atrocities against Palestinians starts with 1937. Your initial statement #154, was that Palestinians started the 1948 war. That was a false statement. Arab armies started the war, not Palestinians. Rather than address that misstatement, you now say Palestinians started the "atrocities." I told you in my #159 that you are confusing Palestinian terrorist attacks with the instigation of war. So now you have the terminology right. But you have got it wrong who started the terrorist attacks. If youd like, I can send you in 7 parts a list of Jewish attacks on Palestinians starting 7 August 1937. But who cares? This was all to prove your statement that Palestinians started the 1948 to be false.

If you contend that the Peres statement (below) was an official Israel government response to the Arab League peace offer, endorsed by the US and the EU, what was the response? What did he say? Was Israel prepared to enter negotiations in response to the peace offers, or did it reject them? "On March 28, 2002, then Foreign Minister Shimon Peres said: "Israel views positively every initiative aimed at arriving at peace and normalization. In this respect, the Saudi step is an important one, but it is liable to founder if terrorism is not stopped. We cannot, of course, ignore the problematic aspects which arose at the Beirut Summit and the harsh and rejectionist (sic) language used by some of the speakers. It is also clear that the details of every peace plan must be discussed directly between Israel and the Palestinians, and to make this possible, the Palestinian Authority must put an end to terror, the horrifying expression of which we witnessed just last night in Netanya"

"You aren`t paying attention. I asked that you not repeat comments by individual Israel officials, because they did not represent an official Israeli government response"(Ron) A response by a country's foreign minister is not an official response? Then what is your idea of an official response?

"in 2002 and 2007 when the Arab League (which included Palestine) offered a comprehensive peace plan"(Roger) I have already answered this one in my previous post #156. So I won't repeat myself ... "Stop rubbing everyones nose in the fact that Jews now have a state"(Roger) I am sorry that reality hurts your nose so much Roger but your Palestinian Arabs must acknowledge that reality if they want Israel to cede land which is now under Israel's control. It's called quid pro quo ... "and stop trying to steal other peoples land"(Roger) Emotive statements like that don't represent reality. Like I said, two Israeli prime ministers offered a land for peace deal just in the last decade. But your Palestinian Arabs seem to want something for nothing. That's why there is no peace yet Roger.

...is that a hard concept for you to understand Ron? Here, you yourself completed the picture that I gave you earlier: On 29 November 1947 the UN voted for the partition plan. On the day after the vote, a spate of Arab attacks occurred, that's November the 30th isn't it Ron? And the first date that you listed for Jewish attacks was Yehida 12th Dec47. Get the picture Ron? Your Palestinian Arabs started the hostilities as a protest against the partitioning of Palestine by the UN. And after they killed and maimed hundreds of Jews, the Jews went on a counter offensive.

You aren't paying attention. I asked that you not repeat comments by individual Israel officials, because they did not represent an official Israeli government response. But that's exactly what you did. I know what Peres said. But there was no Israeli government response to the Arab League peace offers. I asked, if they did, what did the response say? The Peres comments were just an expression of his opinion; not an official Israeli government response. Are you going to leave the subject of recognizing Israel as "what it stands for." Would it be something like "The State of Jewish Occupation of Palestinian Territory"? or, "The Jewish State of Violation of Human Rights"?

"tell me what the official response said"(Ron) "On March 28, 2002, then Foreign Minister Shimon Peres said: "Israel views positively every initiative aimed at arriving at peace and normalization. In this respect, the Saudi step is an important one, but it is liable to founder if terrorism is not stopped. We cannot, of course, ignore the problematic aspects which arose at the Beirut Summit and the harsh and rejectionist (sic) language used by some of the speakers. It is also clear that the details of every peace plan must be discussed directly between Israel and the Palestinians, and to make this possible, the Palestinian Authority must put an end to terror, the horrifying expression of which we witnessed just last night in Netanya"(Shimon Peres) "Is the Israeli denied "right of return" more important to you?"(Ron) You bet the Arab insistence on the possible right of return of millions of hostile Palestinian Arabs, into Israel proper, is important to me because that's a formula for Israel's destruction. And it was one of the demands made in your 2002 Arab peace initiative. That's one of the reasons Israel could not accept the proposal outright.

The whole truth you write about is that you are wrong again. This is becoming tiresome. In response to the Arab League peace offers: although a number of Israeli officials responded to the Initiative with both support and criticism, the Israeli state has yet to formulate an official response. In 2007, Benjamin Netanyahu, as opposition leader, as well as a number of Likud members, rejected the initiative outright. If that is wrong, tell me what the official response said. Don't repeat independent Israeli officials comments. They dont represent an Israeli official response. I did not mention the right of return issue and a lot of others. The offer is over 30 pages long, and we are restricted to less than 1,000 characters. Are you going to leave the subject of recognition of Israel as "what it stands for"? Do you agree Arab armies (and not the Palestinians) attacked in 1948 because Israel was a Jewish state? Is the Israeli denied "right of return" more important to you?

The Palestinians did not start the 1948 Israeli Arab war. You are confusing Palestinian terrorist attacks with the instigation of the war by the attacks by the armed forces of Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon and Syria. If your criteria for who started the war are terrorist attacks, I have a document of over 2,000 words listing Jewish terrorist attacks on Palestinians during that time period. It that is the criteria, Israel started the war. Here are just a very, very few. Yehida- 12-13 Dec47. 19 dead. Khisas- 18Dec47. 10 dead. Qazaza-19Dec47. 5 children Al-Sheikh-1Jan48. 40 dead Naser Al-Din- 13-14 Apr48. 123 dead Beit Daras- 21May48 All women and children Dahmash Mosque-11Jul48 80-100 dead Lydda & Ramle- ? Jul48 350 dead Dawayma- 29Oct48 80-100 dead..a rape Do you still wish to revise history?

You should know by now that Arabs don't consider Israel and the Jews enemies only because they are Jews: it is because they have always fought for the same land, and especially, have occupied Palestinian territory for almost 43 years. If Apaches occupied Palestinian territory, the sentiments would be identical. Before 1967, Israel fought Egypt, Syria, Jordan and Iraq, not Palestinian armed forces. So, the Palestinians have nothing to renounce. But, so what? Israel hasn't had a war with an Arab states armed forces for 35 years. Your claim of 65 years of war, is, of course, utter nonsense. Arabs proved they recognize the State of Israel (the name Israel calls itself) in 2002 and 2007 when the Arab League (which included Palestine) offered a comprehensive peace plan, which the US and the EU endorsed. Israel didnt reply to it. Stop rubbing everyones nose in the fact that Jews now have a state, We all know. Now learn to live within it borders, and stop trying to steal other peoples land.

"Palestinians didn't start the war"(Ron) Really Ron? Either you are lying or you don't know history. Here, read this: http://www.search.com/reference/1947_UN_Partition_Plan "On 29 November 1947 the United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine[1] or United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181, a plan to resolve the Arab-Israeli conflict in the British Mandate of Palestine, was approved by the United Nations General Assembly..... On the day after the vote, a spate of Arab attacks left seven Jews dead and scores more wounded. Shooting, stoning, and rioting continued apace in the following days. The consulates of Poland and Sweden, both of whose governments had voted for partition, were attacked. Bombs were thrown into cafes, Molotov cocktails were hurled at shops, a synagogue was set on fire. On December 3, at the instigation of the Palestinian leadership, a large mob ransacked the new Jewish commercial center in Jerusalem, looting and burning shops and stabbing and stoning whomever they happened upon. The next day, some 120?150 armed Arabs attacked Kibbutz Efal, on the outskirts of Tel Aviv? I can give you more links that say the same thing, do you still want to persist in wanting to revise history, Ron?

... in the 2002 offer. "In 2002 and 2007, the Arab League, 22 nations including Palestine, proffered a comprehensive peace plan to the State of Israel in which the League offered full diplomatic recognition by all members, in return for Israeli withdrawal from the occupied territories"(Ron) And the Right of Return of millions of enemies into Israel proper is just another formula for Israel's destruction. Nevertheless, you are wrong. Israel DID respond to that offer. It said, that it considered the offer to be a positive development but it wanted to negotiate elements of the offer, like the Right of Return. And how did the Arabs respond to that? They said no negotiations ... take it or leave it .... It would be good if you would consider telling the whole truth in the future Ron, not just half truths ...

I wrote, "every nation in the world, including Arabs, knows Israel is a Jewish state." You ask, "then why did Palestinian Arabs start a war against Israel in 1948?" First, Palestinians didnt start the war. It was Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Iraq. They did so because they "recognized that Israel was a Jewish state." No, No. The UN, all members of the international community, will recognize Israel only by its official name: the State of Israel. No nation can, nor will, recognize Israel for what it stands for: whatever that means. Palestinians and Arab nations long ago gave up the idea of destroying Israel. You suffer the Israeli curse: national paranoia. In 2002 and 2007, the Arab League, 22 nations including Palestine, proffered a comprehensive peace plan to the State of Israel in which the League offered full diplomatic recognition by all members, in return for Israeli withdrawal from the occupied territories. The US and the EU endorsed the offer. Israel didn't respond. Get it now?

"Obviously every nation in the world, including Arab states, knows that Israel is a state for Jews"(Ron) Then why did the Palestinian Arabs start the war against Israel in 1947/48 which they continued to this date? Remember: there was no "occupation" back in 1947/48. I'll tell you why because they did NOT want a state for the Jewish people in the Middle East. They wanted it to be ANOTHER state for the ARAB people. "Arabs should only recognize Israel in the name it chose for itself"(Ron) We are NOT talking about what name Israel calls itself. We are talking about who Israel is for. And all Israel is asking your Palestinian Arabs is to give up their long stated goal of destroying Israel as a Jewish state and stop trying to convert it into an Arab state. In return for which Israel would be willing to recognise their state which would live peacefully side by side with Israel, the state for the Jewish people. By the way, both states could and Israel does have minority populations with full rights. Get it now, Ron?

"Obviously every nation in the world, including Arab states, knows that Israel is a state for Jews"(Ron) Then why did the Palestinian Arabs start the war against Israel in 1947/48 which they continued to this date? Remember: there was no "occupation" back in 1947/48. I'll tell you why because they did NOT want a state for the Jewish people in the Middle East. They wanted it to be ANOTHER state for the ARAB people. "Arabs should only recognize Israel in the name it chose for itself"(Ron) We are NOT talking about what name Israel calls itself. We are talking about who Israel is for. And all Israel is asking your Palestinian Arabs is to give up their long stated goal of destroying Israel as a Jewish state and stop trying to convert it into an Arab state. In return for which Israel would be willing to recognise their state which would live peacefully side by side with Israel, the state for the Jewish people. By the way, both states could and Israel does have minority populations with full rights. Get it now, Ron?

"Obviously every nation in the world, including Arab states, knows that Israel is a state for Jews"(Ron) Then why did the Palestinian Arabs start the war against Israel in 1947/48 which they continued to this date? Remember: there was no "occupation" back in 1947/48. I'll tell you why because they did NOT want a state for the Jewish people in the Middle East. They wanted it to be ANOTHER state for the ARAB people. "Arabs should only recognize Israel in the name it chose for itself"(Ron) We are NOT talking about what name Israel calls itself. We are talking about who Israel is for. And all Israel is asking your Palestinian Arabs is to give up their long stated goal of destroying Israel as a Jewish state and stop trying to convert it into an Arab state. In return for which Israel would be willing to recognise their state which would live peacefully side by side with Israel, the state for the Jewish people. By the way, both states could and Israel does have minority populations with full rights. Get it now, Ron?

You are absolutely right. The world knows Israel is a Jewish state, Just as Saudi Arabia is known as a Muslim state. But no one is going to recognize Israel as the "Jewish State of Israel" until Israel changes its name to the "Jewish State of Israel." So knock off the stupid demand and criticism of Palestinians for not recognizing Israel as the "Jewish State of Israel" until the name change takes place. Let's hope the world doesn't follow with China changing its name to the "Sino State of China," and India, the "Hindu State of India," the "Hellenic State of Greece," the "Pushtu State of Afghanistan," because it will become impossible to teach children geography. Why doesn't Israel just withdraw from all occupied Palestinian territories, cease the genocidal blockade of Gaza, and become the State of Israel, a member in good standing of the international community of nations, and stop being the nasty rogue nation it has become. Remember, Mossad is a second-rate service.

Your first paragraph makes no sense, and I have no idea what you are talking about. It's not necessary to write just to fill up space if you have no substantive comment to make. You are really grasping at straws and trying to slid away from addressing my comments in #146. Obviously every nation in the world, including Arab states, knows that Israel is a state for Jews. But your demand that Arabs recognize Israel as, "Israel the state for the Jewish people (nation)" is asinine. No nation has such an official name. The name of Israel is the State of Israel. Arabs should only recognize Israel in the name it chose for itself, as every other nation in the world does. There is no member state in the UN with the name, "Israel the State for the Jewish People (nation)." That is why my comments quoted by you in the last paragraph of your post are not WRONG. If they are, please explain to us how they are wrong.

...renounce that pretext before anyone would believe that one really means what one says and not just pretends in order to get land the easy way without having to fight for it. When Nazi Germany surrendered, they were required to renounce the doctrine of Nazism in order to end the war. In the same way, since the Palestinian Arabs used the pretext that Israel is a Jewish state (rather than an Arab state) as an excuse to wage 65 years of war, they NOW have to renounce their pretext for war by acknowledging that they NOW recognise Israel as the state for the Jewish people (nation). The fact that they are NOT willing to do so, betrays their REAL intentions. That's why your statement below is WRONG, WRONG and WRONG!!! "But for Israel now to claim that Palestinians must recognize Israel as the "Jewish State of Israel" is nothing more than another arrogant attempt to forestall peace talks"(Ron)

"The blockade [Gaza's] started in Sept 2000 along with closure of Gaza airport"(Ron) In 2000 Israel responded to ANOTHER bout of violence that the Palestinian Arabs started in response to Ehud Barak's Camp David peace offer. And they responded in the same way both in Gaza and the West Bank. By 2005, Israel eased restrictions in both Gaza and the West Bank and in fact, Israel withdrew unilaterally from Gaza and dismantled all the settlements there. Yet the rocket fire from Gaza continued relentlessly. To top it all, they came across into Israeli territory and kidnapped Gilad Shalit.

The UN in its brief sanity established the state of Israel. The majority of the world knew & understood the fact THAT IS A JEWISH NATION period. End the revisionist garbage that is polluting this talkback blog.I dont see people like ron not being offended that Saudi arabia is a muslim country only for muslims & the Vatican is a christian only country. The hypocracy is obscene. The arabs went to war & LOST. LOSERS do not dictate to WINNERS about legitamacy of their nation.Writing from a state that stole telands from the native Indians & we cal.led it manifest destiny

Why in the world should any people be expected to recognize Israel as the "Jewish State of Israel." Israel doesn't call itself that. Israel can call itself anything it wants, but it declared statehood on 14 May 1948 as the "State of Israel." It was recognized as a member of the UN as the "State of Israel." Israel has diplomatic relations with 162 nations, all of whom recognize Israel as the "State of Israel," because that's what Israel said its name is. But for Israel now to claim that Palestinians must recognize Israel as the "Jewish State of Israel" is nothing more than another arrogant attempt to forestall and complicate the introduction of peace talks. In 2002 and again in 2007 the Arab League offered a comprehensive peace plan to the "State of Israel." If Israel wants to be called the "Jewish State of Israel," change the name of the country. But it's silly. More than 20% of Israel is not Jewish. It would be like the UK deciding it is now to be called Great Anglican Britain.

Why in the world should any people be expected to recognize Israel as the "Jewish" State of Israel. Israel doesn't call itself that. Israel can call itself anything it wants, but it declared statehood on 14 May 1948 as the "State of Israel." It was recognized as a member of the UN as the "State of Israel." Israel has diplomatic relations with 162 nations, all of whom recognize Israel as the "State of Israel," because thats what Israel said its name is. But for Israel now to claim that Palestinians must recognize Israel as the "Jewish State of Israel" is nothing more than another arrogant attempt to forestall peace talks. In 2002 and again in 2007 the Arab League offered a comprehensive peace plan to the "State of Israel." If Israel wants to be called the Jewish State of Israel, change the name of the country. But its silly. More than 20% of Israel is not Jewish. It would be like the UK deciding it is now to be called Great Anglican Britain.

What part of the arab, muslim phrase including their so called "moderates" that say....." Isarel cannot be a jewish state" do you not understand ???

What you say in our article makes me sad, angry and finally resigned. Sad because its so obvious that as long as Israel continues with its present policies blood will be spilled and hate will fester within souls on both sides...angry that the radicals are allowed to high jack rationality thus run the country with these hateful policies...and finally resigned because I am not sure that people on either side are ready to let go of swords and being the only 'right' one. Makes me wonder... how did we Jews lose our way to this extent? What happened to us? Thanks you for being one of the rational ones and thank you for being willing to tell your truth. I for one am grateful you live in Israel.

As a jew not living in Israel i don't have the right to vote, but i do have the right to speak. Israel is the most peace loveing country in the world, you must be crazy not to want peace, Israel needs peace, but it takes two to make peace. It is dangerous not understanding this and blameing your own peaple.

Israeli propaganda constantly tries to make the point: there were rockets before the blockade. But like most propaganda it is not true and it is dishonest to keep repeating it. The blockade started in Sept 2000 along with closure of Gaza airport. Immediate economic effect were losses in area of $5.3 billion. In Sept 2001 Israel established a buffer zone that sealed all entry and exit points. After 9 Oct 2001, movement of people and goods between Israel and Gaza was halted, and complete internal closure was effected 14 Nov 2001. The first Qassam rocket was fired into Israel on 10 February 2002. It had nothing to do with Barak peace offer. Israel is, and will, lose the PR battle over Gaza. The international community views the Gazans as victims. No on expects Israel to be able to effectively try to starve 1.5 million people into submission without retaliation. In addition, collective punishment of a civilian population is a war crime: article 33, 4th Geneva Convention.

As an Israeli who served in 3 wars and wonded badly in the defense of our beloved country, I applaud Bradley Burston - every additional word is mute. Matti Shalev

...then by all means use it. But please don't say: "Some people in Gaza hit them with little rockets that use sugar and fertilizer for fuel and explosive, they`ve killed 15 -- 18? -- Israelis so far"(J Thomas) Because the real truth is different: 1,185 Israelis have been killed by Palestinian violence and terrorism (suicide bombings + rockets + other forms of assorted murder) since September 2000. And that was in response to Ehud Barak's peace offer ... moreover, that's just the number of dead, the number of casualties and lives ruined is much greater. But in any case, even if it WOULD be only 15 to 18 deaths. Just tell me my dear fellow, which country would tolerate a neighbouring people playing Russian Roulette with the lives of their fellow countrymen ,friends loved ones? Which country would tolerate the lobbing of thousands of rockets onto their heads for 8 years, irrespective of the actual numbers of casualties? Would yours? NOT bl...dy likely ...

It is nice to hear I am not alone. I have been accused of being a self-hater, an anti-semite, anti-Israel - yet all I know is that Israel has a right to exist alongside Palestine - our fates are together and there is no severing that tie. FREE PALESTINE and FREE THE MINDS OF ISRAEL.

One thing I know for sure is I won't be moving to or even visitng Israel any time soon.

I couldn't hep but think when you were writing about Israel as a person who loves Israel and that it came to be your place in the world, after you emigrated from the United States, if you ever stopped to ponder about all those people who were expelled Bradley. It was their place, and they cannot return even though they have the inalienable right to do so. How does that make you feel Bradley to live in a place that is someone else's place. Just curious. .

Mr. Bradly Burston, I am new to Israel and startled the way this paper represents its opinions. I now realize that the "Left" is a live and well in Israel. Just like all those other dummies 77% of the USA Jews voted for Obama(It's called idolatry). My new book is coming out soon. "All American Karate Champ" Please read and appreciate what you have in Israel and all the people that are leaning towards the Right and Torah. Otherwise you maybe looking at the opposition across the border, and believe me he will show no mercy.

Thank you. Thank you so much for articulating what I feel, what I want to feel about Israelis & about Israel. I don't want to see Israel go where Netanyahu is taking it.

or one of their peripheral dogmen like the unJewish Agency. Such efforts those 'people' go to in order to make Jews feel so unwelcome in Israel.

... we must not criticise those who criticise ...

How can you in good conscience, qualify that horrible sin? That you care so much about Israel's future that you would join with supporters of Israels worst enemies in protest of what they perceive is injustice. Not a very concincving article today.

I feel I am stating the obvious here, but the reason for 2,000 years of persecution in the galut was sinat hinam - the fighting amongst ourselves, our own failure to be mature and take responsibility - the lesson from Pesach. Let's have debate, but anyone who lives outside Israel should be very careful in the position they posit, whether from the right or left, because they do not have to live with the consequences of whatever they're proposing. Surely we all agree we do not want sinat hinam to threaten medinat yisrael

I live in Portland in the US. I wish we could just round up all the war-hawk'ing right wingers here in the US and pile them up with the hawks from the Palestinians and the Israeli hawks - stick them all in the desert somewhere and let them all fight to their last breathes. Unfortunately, I think Israel is NOT deserving of any God's favor these days. Jews - read your Torah. Whenever the Jewish people accept hate over the love of God, they wind up getting punished. Punished by other men in most cases from what I've read. The Assyrians, the Babylonians, and so on, and so on. It's happening all over again - just with modern weapons. Bulldozzing peoples homes is NOT one of the commandments of God. Good Luck. This is one Jew that never wants to visit the so-called Holy Land ever again. If it weren't for people like Burston - I'd say good riddens to you all. But I know many good-hearted Israelies as well, so to them, I'd just say.. Good Luck, and God bless.

I don't pretend that my opinion matters or that I am an expert on the matter. However, I have an honest question. If God gave the land of Israel (and much more than that, by the way), why are you so eager to give it away to people who will never be content to live next to you? You want to give your land to people who will use it to lauch rockets at you. You want to give it to people who want to see your head separated from your body. How naive you are to think that merely giving them land is going to satisfy, or otherwise quench their desire to remove you from the face of the earth. Stop dividing Israel and stand against evil. Stop with the weak, futile, leftist placation of terrorists and fight for righteousness. It pains me to no end that our worthless President is on a road to abandon Israel. What Israel NEEDS is for her beloved people to support Netanyahu, whose every decision is respectable, honorable, and in the very best interest of Israel and her people.

Petra the only way you can see him leave is to move to israel yourself FIRST. (you cant see him leave if you are in your safe cushy house in the USA ) and when you do go it's win win ( you wont be here influencing our politics) make you choice ...put up or shut up

Only reason I have hope in Israel through the incredible layers of hatred and delusions is because of people like you. The Jewish state will last for the next thousand years because of you.Keep writing and keep informing those of us who don't have the privilege of living in Israel.

The Diaspora of Jews feeling strong attachment to Israel, are mostly right-wingers.... I am one of them, so ? Have you experienced anti-semitism once in your life ? Have you received harsh words for being a Jew ?. If not,you will never understand how important is Israel to us

As a veteran of the Yom Kippur War and many years of service both in settlement and Zahal, I understand your disappointment with critics who are arm chair Zionists. Living in Western safety and luxury while attacking your opinions and views of policy currently in Israel. I always felt it was a rule of faith, while in uniform never to be politically active, my first loyalty was always to the Army and the country. As a Jew living in the west despite the years of sacrifice and service my family and I made, I have no right to attack those who are there now. Israeli's live in Israel!. The rest of us as much as we may love our country and people, we live elsewhere, as Nomi Shemer said we are absent sons. It is extremely rude to criticize your siblings care of your parents when you are far away providing little support and rarely visit. These absent sons may still have inheritance rights, but have done little to earn them. If you want a place at the family table, perhaps these cry babies should come home, spend a few weeks or months guarding the northern border in the winter mud, while their families get by with out them. I would not take these wankers to heart. Sincerely Marvin Crane Parsippany NJ, USA Army #2139081

There are over 338 million Arabs who hope that the likes of you and Ephraim in #49 succeed in driving all Jews like Levy out of Israel. That will leave a population of Jews like you, and enough to populate the country, full of hate, vitriol, no conscience, no morals, no sense of human decency, no compassion, no respect for international law, nor for the rights and sovereignty of other nations. Your population will expel all Palestinians from Judea and Samaria, and Jerusalem and you will annex their land. You will watch 10s of thousands starve in Gaza, and force the others to flee. And you will see the heretofore unimagined wrath of the world. You will see the halt of all US support, and without the US veto, Israel will be dragged before the Intl Criminal Court in the Hague. Israel will face complete isolation, no exports, no imports, no int'l aid, boycotts, sanctions and divestment. And Israel will not survive. The call of "Allahu Akbar" will deafen the Middle East. Good luck!

Israel is a JEWISH state and must remain a JEWISH state, not a country with Jews. Separation of church and state? NEVER! Judaism is the state religion and Jews are its citizens. This is not negotiable, nor is the entire Jerusalem as Israel's capital. Israel is a democracy for Jews, not for Arabs.

Bradly's roots are stuck back where he was born,and it ain't in Israel,but in the good ole US of A. I once told someone the following: In point of fact ?no one can serve two masters?. Either he will hate the one and love the other. Or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. YOU CANOT SERVE BOTH. Bradly is trying to do both but it is impossible. You must know the source, but nevertheless it is glaringly true and applicable.

Here's one more idea, create a reality TV show, with Israelis and Palestinian College age students. They would be chosen from amongst their smartest peers, to be taken to the reality show on a beautiful island for mock negotiations between Israelis and Palestinians. At the end of let's say 40 episodes, the teams should have come up with a solution that they both agree on. They can negotiate in english but the subtitles should be in Hebrew and Arabic and it should be broadcast on Palestine TV or LBC and Israel channel 2. The reality show will not just cover the actual negotiations but show the students after the negotiations when they are relaxing and what they are thinking, what they are doing, so forth... It can generate great interest. The show will bring profound insight to everyone and show the human factor in each of the people and how difficult it is to compromise, yet as the teams move along, and mingle with each other, after 40 or so episodes they do come up with a solution.

Israel's rabid supporters here in the U.S. would probably accuse Bradly Burston of "thinking too much". This is one of the criticisms they have used against Woody Allen, Naomi Klein, Noam Chomsky, Rabbi Michael Lerner etc. You see, if a person "thinks too much" they might begin to question some Israeli (or even U.S.) policies. We certainly can't have that now, can we?

It is well known that people living outside a troubled territory tend to be more extreme than the residents themselves. In the Hamas case, the leaders living in Syria are more extreme than the Gaza leaders. Only recently did Zahar of Gaza resign over the Shalit deal because the Syrian leaders wouldn't compromise. The outsiders don't feel the pain, so their ideology is stronger than realistic considerations. The Diaspora of Jews feeling strong attachment to Israel, are mostly right-wingers. In the US, their true face is AIPAC, and they follow right-wing directions even when the Israeli government disapproves.. For example, the US Congress passed a law right after the Oslo agreement was signed, in order to undermine Oslo, and against the wishes of Clinton and Rabin, but according to AIPAC's direction. My advice: Think of the Diaspora Jews as justifying the saying "Oylem Goylem" and spend efforts on convincing Israelis (who are also afflicted by blindness, but not to such an extent).

Wishing you Shabat Shalom was commendable by the poster.My question is:Where are you living at present? The USA or here in Israel?

Yes if truth be told any Jew who loves Israel shold not olny leave California,but the rest of the USA. But they doen't because they prefer to sit tight where they are with no responsibity, versus Israel and Israeli Jews. I want to tell Mr.Burston what about the 10 generations of my family in Israel? Do they count or dismissed by him?

You say you are in London. You do not feel threatened, so you think about what is right, what is acceptable. But many Israelis do feel threatened. They think their enemies are ready to die for the chance to kill them. Their enemies are utterly implacable and will never accept them. So they are scared. Yes, the Israeli military is far stronger than all arab armies put together. Yes, they are the only ones who have nukes. They are still scared. They know they are hated. And the more they do to arabs to reassure themselves, the more the arabs hate them, and the more scared they get. Some people in Gaza hit them with little rockets that use sugar and fertilizer for fuel and explosive, they've killed 15 -- 18? -- Israelis so far. Israelis hit them back with 2000 pound bombs and kill thousands. Israelis are scared. Any arabs who ever truly get the upper hand will want revenge. You want to do the right thing because you aren't scared. You can afford it. They can't.

time criticising,fault finding,seeing nothing of value,when you could be in the perfect harmony found with the neighbours in the M.E or just North London.Nothing there that bothers your life? You people amaze,spending your day Israel bashing,searching for malevolance,that can be found anywhere,but you only seem to find it in Israel then imply it reflects the attitude of the whole state. To read your postings,a tiny country with a few million people is the repository of all that's bad in this world and it has nothing to do with the behaviour of the neighbours,of which you say nothing,because that might shed light on what your side is really about and the effect it has on people living with daily threats and attempted terror attacks.Lies of ommision are still lies. Nothing better to do with your time on a weekend?Nobody to spend your time with? Or do you have a "research grant" from a European taxpayer subsidised NGO that favors this kind of incitement?

"If Emile Zola had used discretion, Dreyfuss would have rotten in jail"(A.M) Not a good analogy A.M. Captain Dreyfuss was a French Jew who was set up by anti-semites and was wrongfully accused of betraying his country. If you point at a similar circumstance in Israel whereby innocent Arabs are set up and wrongfully accused of betraying Israel then I would agree with you. But thats not what IS happening is it? Israel has been in a 62 year old war which is NOT of its making. And in the course of that war, it is fighting against millions of Palestinian Arabs AND their supporters who hope to wipe Israel off the face of the Middle East. Or are you saying that Dreyfuss was supported by millions of Jews who hoped to wipe France off the face of Europe? "If you think our leaders are bringing our country to a point of no return and endangering our future as a jewish country your duty is to shout even stronger than B.B."(A.M) Yes, I have no problems with that if you really think so. But then I would expect you to come up with specific and detailed alternatives to outline what YOU would do instead. My problem is that I am NOT hearing such alternatives coming from the HARD left. So here is YOUR chance, lets hear what YOU would do instead and take it from there ... "he is not betraying military secrets..."(A.M) No he is NOT. But even if that is NOT his real intention, he is helping those who want to make Israel a Pariah state. Do you think that is good for Israel? "and we are not at war..."(A.M) Really? That is news to me. Just ask the following suspects if they agree with you: - Hamas - Hezbollah - Iran - Syria - Islamic Jihad - Other assorted Pal Arab terrorist factions I do assume that if THEY profess to be at war with Israel, then you too would agree that Israel is automatically at war with them, whether Israel likes it or not?

Thank you again Mr. Burston for your very thoughtful article. Again-I ask that those who don't agree with you recognize the harm they do to not only to you and Israel when they write hateful things about you,they harm the writers of such bile as well. Hate is not a logical argument;it is just hate. It is a great shame that so many of these writers are fellow Americans;some and perhaps many have never been to Israel. I have been there on 3 occasions for as long as 3-4 weeks at a time. Short personal attacks can not even hint at the great complexity of issues facing Israel

You moved me to tears. After reading one hateful talkback after another suggesting that my husband should leave us native Israelis for Gaza or New Jersey (he served in the first and loathes the latter), implying that he has questionable Jewish "roots" when the only questionable roots in this house are on my head - and Loreal takes care of that -it was a relief to know that at least one talkbacker wished my children and I a peaceful Shabbat.

You won't be able to hear yourself think. I looked up "Galut" - exile of the Jewish people. It is the nature of a humans to wander, Shmuel. Here is an interesting story about exiled Jews: BBC News 6 March 2010 "Lost Jewish Tribe 'Found in Zimbabwe'" By Steve Vickers. They do not eat pork, they practise male circumcision, they ritually slaughter their animals, some of their men wear skull caps and they put the Star of David on their gravestones. Their oral traditions claim that their ancestors were Jews who fled the Holy Land about 2,500 years ago. It may sound like another myth of a lost tribe of Israel, but British scientists have carried out DNA tests which confirm their Semitic origin. These tests back up the group's belief that a group of perhaps seven men married African women and settled on the continent. The Lemba, who number perhaps 80,000, live in central Zimbabwe and the north of South Africa. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8550614.stm Cheers.

Isi Leibler's response to Bradley Burston's article that was just published in the Jerusalem Post on line is a must reading. Will Haaretz dare publish this blog or will the moderator delete any reference to criticism of one of its own?

This is how it can work. The Israelis and Palestinians should each appoint a team to negotiate and give them authority to do that. The team should be politically neutral, because you don't want politics of Israel or PA to effect it. The teams should include figures like important religious authorities from each side, important business men, speakers. i.e: people that the people from each side respects. Examples Palestinian: Barghouti, The chief cleric from Jerusalem. and Israeli: Chief Rabbi from Israel, Bradley Burston and other important figures. The two sides meet on many occasions and then draft 1 solution. The solution is then put for a popular vote in each of the Israeli/ Palestinian sides. This way no president or PM of either side is responsible for it. If either side veto's then the process will start again. There is a smaller chance of veto, if important people have signed it like the chief rabbi and chief mufti of Jerusalem and chief business men as I said.

Thank you for your courage and intelligence. You are a credit to Zionism and to humanity.

I can't bring myself to support the occupation of another people, to find it acceptable that within one nation a significant portion of the population are treated as second class citizens and that what is written in the bible should dictate how a country acts. So I am a humane, enlightened Jew and Zionist. Why does that make me a bad person?

"Criticise but...not now please. Allow the State to do its job [house demolitions, clampdowns on peaceful anti wall protests, some tidying up, ie. ethnic cleansing in E Jerusalem..."(Roo) There is no ethnic cleansing in East Jerusalem in our days. You must be thinking about what the Jordanian forces did, with the help of Palestinian irregular bands, in 1948, to the Jews of East Jerusalem. They attacked, starved out and ethnically cleansed the Jews of East Jerusalem. And that, according to the likes of you was enough to make East Jerusalem an Arab city? And because of that, Jews NOW have no right to go back and settle in East Jerusalem? "Then to reiterate, don`t criticise while we`re in an "existential war for gods sake" and believe me Israel has been in an existential war since its inception and will plausibly be so until eternity...but patience is a virtue, so be patient you headstrong fellow!"(Roo) Thank you Roo, that is exactly what I am advocating: P-A-T-I-E-N-C-E. By all means, negotiate patiently and make peace when the Pal Arabs will agree to reasonable peace terms which would not lead to Israe's destruction. Or if they don't want to negotiate but resort to THEIR customary violent tactics, then give them as good as they give and a bit of interest. Usually that brings them to their collective senses for a little while. Keep to that formula for as long as necessary and when your friends, the Palestinian Arabs, will realise that time is NOT on THEIR side, peace will come... "Destructive versus constructive criticism. Ah yes, please please, lace your criticism[if you really must criticise] with nice anecdotes and platitudes thus engulfing the very criticisms you make so making them more palatable to those of us who prefer not to hear them at all"(Roo) You missed what I said in my post #18 entirely, haven't you Roo? Read it again: "offer CLEAR and well thought out alternatives to tell our leaders what (and how) they SHOULD do ..."(Tim R #18) So here is your chance Roo, TELL-US what SHOULD Israel do to achieve peace with secure and recognized borders which would maintain an ongoing viable sovereign state for the Jewish people?

"As a die hard lefist, I have to say that your response is quite refreshing. It also leaves me scared as I have nothing in terms of sugestions to our leaders as a way forward. My standard " Sugestion " will always be Diplomacy, but is it enough.....?"(Jacques) Is it enough? That is the 64 dollar question. Nevertheless, I do agree with you that the diplomatic option should be vigorously pursued. However, if Israel's enemies resort to violent options, as they have done so often in the past, Israel too should respond in kind. My overall opinion is that the key to peace is NOT in Israel's hands. It is in the hands of the Arab people and in the hands of the Palestinian Arab people in particular. When they will give up the notion of replacing Israel with an Arab dominated state, thats when we will have peace ...

Yes writing beautifully is one thing. Having to deal with the daily problems does not create a comfortable vision as Bradley seems to want,nor can it be achieved. This once again it is nothing but giving vent to the person who advocated Jews/Israelis to relocate or shut up. Nothing new here.We are here warts and all. They whoever said it can stay put where they reside and leave us "content" Jews to carry on with our life in the blessed country CALLED ISRAEL.

It is well known that people living outside a troubled territory tend to be more extreme than the residents themselves. In the Hamas case, the leaders living in Syria are more extreme than the Gaza leaders. Only recently did Zahar of Gaza resign over the Shalit deal because the Syrian leaders wouldn't compromise. The outsiders don't feel the pain, so their ideology is stronger than realistic considerations. The Diaspora of Jews feeling strong attachment to Israel, are mostly right-wingers. In the US, their true face is AIPAC, and they follow right-wing directions even when the Israeli government disapproves.. For example, the US Congress passed a law right after the Oslo agreement was signed, in order to undermine Oslo, and against the wishes of Clinton and Rabin, but according to AIPAC's direction. My advice: Think of the Diaspora Jews as justifying the saying "Oylem Goylem" and spend efforts on convincing Israelis (who are also afflicted by blindness, but not to such an extent).

We Jews are part of the world's diversity as are the Arabs. Our common enemy are those that believe that death by the noxious fumes from the engine of messianic extremism advocating human reading of religious text as infallible. And that the blessings of divinity will only come to those that die or suffer from human imposed violence as a prerequisite for the insults to that divinity that comes from the existence of all that lives. And for the guilt that comes from knowing that one is living and part of that which insults divinity by their continued existence in the world. Bradley and to all that may read this. Honest dissent is the voice of conscience it is the voice of diversity. One honest voice is one honest expression in the chorus within the songs angels that call for the end of violence. And rejoices in the reverence and love for all that lives. It is the fundemental requirement of democracy. It is the fundemnetal measure of human worth.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/8550614.stm Have those white Europeans who have returned to Israel got the semite gene? Because what exactly makes a person Jewish and therefore having the right under the law of return, make aliyah to Israel? Bradley, ignore them, now here is a story.

you are the wrong type of Jew, and therefore you are not welcome in Israel. Now if you professessed full support for netanyahu and Lieberman you would be the right type of Jew and you would be allowed to stay. Interesting article on the BBC about a lost Jewish tribe being found in Zimbabwe. Much more interesting me thinks, than the rantings of a few nutjobs in Israel and abroad who are getting more and more desperate as people cease to listen to them and begin to think for themselves.

Deuteronomy 7 Genesis 12 Life and all that it entails is dependent upon G-D. Hope you come to that realization, because HE loves you.

.. should leave California?

When somebody speaks ill of Israel and it appears in an Israeli publication, no matter its foundations, it is picked up and used in their own interests by the anti-semites of the world and we the Jews of the Diaspora suffer it the most. I was badly impressed with the headline in your last article

American childrne safe by monitoring nuclear acquisitions for over 60 years by terrorist and rogue nations.Petra is right.Americans sleep safer because the terrorists want to destroy the global influence of America, the freedoms and the only obstacle is Israel. thank you Petra but the anti semites don't understand that the Islamists, the revolutionary ideology that hates Israel really hates america.they are so in hatred that they can't see that Israel is an extension of the US in the ME. Israel is a democracy one of the few places where Arab women can actually vote, drive and work. Arabs are in the government. the Israeli arab better fight for Israel or they will wind up ensalved to dictators

I think the problem is Bradley, in the current anti-Israeli climate, where more and more anti-Semitic tropes are being deployed in the name of anti-Zionism, your views can sometimes be used by others to justify that bigoted narrative against the Jewish collective. The Jews in the diaspora - especially in Europe are feeling the heat more than you might think. This doesn't excuse the comments made against you, but may help to explain the anger they feel in the current climate. May I wish you good health and kind regards to your mum and dad.

This is a superb article which should be widely publicised!Kol Hakavod to Bradley Burston!

Nothing like hearing it from a 'local'. Thank you sir, I agree wholeheartedly.

does that count? As a Jew, I will always defend Israel and her right to exist in peace. As a Muslim, you can vote for whom you choose. Also as an American, I make no apologies for my opinion, even if it bugs you. Aren't we both entitled to 'free speech" ? After all our American constitution guarantees that and we paid for that privilege in blood, the blood of our fallen troops who paid the price. What can you add to the discussion? Where do you live? Does it matter? Only to you. Same w/ me. Eat your heart out.

"Criticise but...not now please. Allow the State to do its job [house demolitions, clampdowns on peaceful anti wall protests, some tidying up, ie. ethnic cleansing in E Jerusalem..."(Roo) There is no ethnic cleansing in East Jerusalem in our days. You must be thinking about what the Jordanian forces did, with the help of Palestinian irregular bands, in 1948, to the Jews of East Jerusalem. They attacked, starved out and ethnically cleansed the Jews of East Jerusalem. And that, according to the likes of you was enough to make East Jerusalem an Arab city? And because of that, Jews NOW have no right to go back and settle in East Jerusalem? "Then to reiterate, don`t criticise while we`re in an "existential war for gods sake" and believe me Israel has been in an existential war since its inception and will plausibly be so until eternity...but patience is a virtue, so be patient you headstrong fellow!"(Roo) Thank you Roo, that is exactly what I am advocating: P-A-T-I-E-N-C-E. By all means, negotiate patiently and make peace when the Pal Arabs will agree to reasonable peace terms which would not lead to Israe's destruction. Or if they don't want to negotiate but resort to THEIR customary violent tactics, then give them as good as they give and a bit of interest. Usually that brings them to their collective senses for a little while. Keep to that formula for as long as necessary and when your friends, the Palestinian Arabs, will realise that time is NOT on THEIR side, peace will come... "Destructive versus constructive criticism. Ah yes, please please, lace your criticism[if you really must criticise] with nice anecdotes and platitudes thus engulfing the very criticisms you make so making them more palatable to those of us who prefer not to hear them at all"(Roo) You missed what I said in my post #18 entirely, haven't you Roo? Read it again: "offer CLEAR and well thought out alternatives to tell our leaders what (and how) they SHOULD do ..."(Tim R #18) So here is your chance Roo, TELL-US what SHOULD Israel do to achieve peace with secure and recognized borders which would maintain an ongoing viable sovereign state for the Jewish people?

"If Emile Zola had used discretion, Dreyfuss would have rotten in jail"(A.M) Not a good analogy A.M. Captain Dreyfuss was a French Jew who was set up by anti-semites and was wrongfully accused of betraying his country. If you point at a similar circumstance in Israel whereby innocent Arabs are set up and wrongfully accused of betraying Israel then I would agree with you. But thats not what IS happening is it? Israel has been in a 62 year old war which is NOT of its making. And in the course of that war, it is fighting against millions of Palestinian Arabs AND their supporters who hope to wipe Israel off the face of the Middle East. Or are you saying that Dreyfuss was supported by millions of Jews who hoped to wipe France off the face of Europe? "If you think our leaders are bringing our country to a point of no return and endangering our future as a jewish country your duty is to shout even stronger than B.B."(A.M) Yes, I have no problems with that if you really think so. But then I would expect you to come up with specific and detailed alternatives to outline what YOU would do instead. My problem is that I am NOT hearing such alternatives coming from the HARD left. So here is YOUR chance, lets hear what YOU would do instead and take it from there ... "he is not betraying military secrets..."(A.M) No he is NOT. But even if that is NOT his real intention, he is helping those who want to make Israel a Pariah state. Do you think that is good for Israel? "and we are not at war..."(A.M) Really? That is news to me. Just ask the following suspects if they agree with you: - Hamas - Hezbollah - Iran - Syria - Islamic Jihad - Other assorted Pal Arab terrorist factions I do assume that if THEY profess to be at war with Israel, then you too would agree that Israel is automatically at war with them, whether Israel likes it or not?

We don't need "friends" like Bradley .

Dear Petra, protected by the US. You have to make a choice: defend Israel and move there OR defend the United States and you are welcome. You see, Israel has become dangerous to and an enemy of the US, and all of you "duals" or expats or Israel firsters must now show your loyalties. Or, you can just keep quiet.

I appreciate you Burston. The Judaism that inspires me is the Judaism I hear in your article.

"With "lovers" like you, we don`t need enemies." So, if you didn't have lovers like him you would need enemies?

So let me tell you this: "If you find it so necessary to criticize Israel, you should just pack up and leave, and the sooner the better." There are millions of Israelis like me who would have told you the same thing, but guess what, they read Hebrew papers, not English. I guess most of those who read English papers do so because they can't read Hebrew, and they actually don't live in Israel. So let me reiterate it again: If you don't like it here, just leave. You can materialize your second citizenship at once.

The bible has no say in this debate, just as the Koran, the book of Mormon, etc., do not. Leave religion out of the discussion please, as it is inflammatory enough as it is. Giving people the delusion that they are chosen makes the situation in the Middle east much more explosive. It simply re-inforces the argument from those with opposing religious views and makes you sound silly.

Wholeheatedly agree.

Burston said it like it is and perhaps even not forcefully enough. Israel is its own worse enemy. Burston will not convince the many, including the responders whose worldview is as narrowminded, chauvenistic and xenophobic. But he had to say it for the record. When the s--t altimately hit the fan there will no one left to protest that they were not forewarned.

Since you always criticize one side in this conflict ( Israel of course) I cannot take your criticism seriously. Why don't you do something for the lack of democracy, freedom of the press, lack of leadership and the manipulation of the Palestinian population and the Muslims masses in general in their own countries? Help them to become more democratic and you will see how peace will be achieved in the Middle East. But, first you should move to one of the West Bank Town and feel what it is to live under "that tolerant" regime that only takes care of its people. I will be very grateful if you do that. Because Jews who really want to see Muslims and Arabs should first live in a Muslim country. Please do it. The sooner the better and than you can stop being just a "shock jock" and report to us about some real experiences. But first to do that, you will have to move back to Israel where you can express anything you want. Pity! This is the last time I will read such " shock jock"material. M

The memory hole: Criticise but...not now please. Allow the State to do its job [house demolitions, clampdowns on peaceful anti wall protests, some tidying up, ie. ethnic cleansing in E Jerusalem and bits and bobs in the West Bank, some more blitzkriegs in Gaza or Lebanon as deemed essential due to existential dilemnas] then criticise by all means...when it's too late to do anything about any of it! Cute huh? Then to reiterate, don't criticise while we're in an "existential war for gods sake" and believe me Israel has been in an existential war since its inception and will plausibly be so until eternity...but patience is a virtue, so be patient you headstrong fellow! The doublethink: Destructive versus constructive criticism. Ah yes, please please, lace your criticism[if you really must criticise] with nice anecdotes and platitudes thus engulfing the very criticisms you make so making them more palatable to those of us who prefer not to hear them at all. After all we don't all have either your penchant for introspection or justice. OK? Then remember our sages, as Rabbi Yaacov Perin eulogized at the funeral of Baruch Goldstein, , "One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail." So to summarise, just be more like us, gloss over the faults Bradley, sanitize them for our sensitive ears and remember the wise words of Rabbi Yaacov Perin. I simply ask you, follow these precepts and fear not the wrath of your fellow Zionists. Indeed we will all laud you with the finest epithets reserved for our greatest heroes and icons. There's a good boy ...pat pat.

The memory hole: Criticise but...not now please. Allow the State to do its job [house demolitions, clampdowns on peaceful anti wall protests, some tidying up, ie. ethnic cleansing in E Jerusalem and bits and bobs in the West Bank, some more blitzkriegs in Gaza or Lebanon as deemed essential due to existential dilemnas] then criticise by all means...when it's too late to do anything about any of it! Cute huh? Then to reiterate, don't criticise while we're in an "existential war for gods sake" and believe me Israel has been in an existential war since its inception and will plausibly be so until eternity...but patience is a virtue, so be patient you headstrong fellow! The doublethink: Destructive versus constructive criticism. Ah yes, please please, lace your criticism[if you really must criticise] with nice anecdotes and platitudes thus engulfing the very criticisms you make so making them more palatable to those of us who prefer not to hear them at all. After all we don't all have either your penchant for introspection or justice. OK? Then remember our sages, as Rabbi Yaacov Perin eulogized at the funeral of Baruch Goldstein, , "One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail." So to summarise, just be more like us, gloss over the faults Bradley, sanitize them for our sensitive ears and remember the wise words of Rabbi Yaacov Perin. I simply ask you, follow these precepts and fear not the wrath of your fellow Zionists. Indeed we will all laud you with the finest epithets reserved for our greatest heroes and icons. There's a good boy ...pat pat.

Mr. Burston, i could not be more proud, as a jew with very close israeli ties,about the sentiments you write about in your recent article. Unfortuntely, we in the U.S. also have a phenomenon whereby those who critique our own country are branded as unpatriotic. Those who feel that the US is not perfect and (god forbid) has actually had misguided or wrong policies.....are branded as un-american. similarly this philosophy dictates that only blind, unwaivering american support for israel, regardless of its policies, tactics or behavior.....is the only truly patriotic stance that an american can take. When did it become a sin to hold your goverment to the highest standards, and critique those actions that fall short or are blatantly amoral, unethical or illegal?i argue that the MOST patriotic thing a citizen can do is to hold his country accountable for its sins,not pretend they dont exist. stay in israel mr. burston, and know that some american jews continue to support your effort

If Emile Zola had used discretion, Dreyfuss would have rotten in jail. If you think our leaders are bringing our country to a point of no return and endangering our future as a jewish country your duty is to shout even stronger than B.B. he is not betraying military secrets and we are not at war. But we will be if we dont open our eyes. To use patriotism to defend a suicidary policy is an additional proof that patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel. Our situation is not adapted to polite tea room disgressions. If this country is going to survive strong words are needed, not whispers.

Thank you for your articles. Peace and hope to all.

"many US Jews are beginning to realize how important Israel is" The wish being father to the thought? Many more Jews are waking up to precisely the opposite. 'From 79% to 69%: American Jews are losing interest in Israel' http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/rosnerBlog.jhtml?itemNo=933589&contrassID=25&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=1&listSrc=Y&art=1 'Another study, more proof: Younger American Jews are alienated from Israel' http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/rosnerBlog.jhtml?itemNo=901587&contrassID=25&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=1&listSrc=Y&art=1

as an american i remember the vietnam eras right wing catch phrase;our country right or wrong-love it or leave it.and then we did the unthinkable;we made peace.our divided society became less divided.our economy eventually rebounded(not without energy turmoil)and we moved on.israel can do it too.nice piece.shalom-salaam.

You give many of us in Israel hope that common deceny will find a way out of this rabid nationalist fanaticism which is gripping the region and which denies and negates both dialogue and dissent. Thank you for being there for us and thank you for being our voice until we get our own voice back again. Wish us the strength and courage to speak up and out once more for the Jewish, democratic and moral Israel we cherish and believe in. If we do it for no one else than for ourselves that is enough to keep us from turning into our enemies. Sincerely,

Bradley, as usual, you are "right on"! We Jews need his well balanced evaluation of what is really going on in Israel. It is critical that Israel change course, to prevent its demise!

We must earn it. It will not be given to us. The Holocaust is now part of history, to be remembered so that it never again occurs. What bothers me greatly, is that a great scientific mind, which is Israel, succumbs to the old anti-semetic theme and anyone, whether Jew or outsider is invited to take a hike(usually to an Arab country) if they disagree with our radicals. Radicals did not build this country. Hard working Jews, and some of them not so religious, did. A word to those who enjoy the benefits without the labor: "Why don't you take a hike out of Israel" Know why they don't.? Because here in Israel they have the closest to receiving benefits as welfare recipients. And this, my friends, is not the REAL Israel!!

Many years ago, a Dry Bones comic strip showed two children shouting vile epitaths at each other. Their mother walked in and chastised them for hurling such abuse at one another...after which, the children responded that they weren't being mean to each other, only just playing "Knesset". Here's the problem, the use of vile epitaths and coarsening of the debate, have been extended to the public at large. The abuse comes from both the Left and the Right. We saw this when Sharon pulled out of Gaza, and was called everything from Hitler, to Haman, to Pharoh. The same has been seen by the likes of Gideon Levy who's shrill voice over Cast Lead provided a mirror image of such abuse. And these sorts of comments come from people who are Jews and Zion (yes, on both sides of the political divide). When you throw into the pot a wide list of Israel and Jew haters the ability to hold a rational and deliberate discussion on Israel's actions and goals becomes exceedingly difficult.

Diaspora Jews who shout they do not want peace but want to wage war forever should stop getting fat in Florida and move to Israel. Once their own kids are risking their lives in the army, they might change their minds and stop supporting settlers and all those who do not want peace.

Thank you Bradley for the courage of your conviction!!People who really care for Israel and the well being of Jews in Israel and the world in general should be more forceful in expressing our disappointment that we lost what is the most precious trait we have:compassion,humility,seeing right from wrong! Good work and God Bless you!

Mr. Burston, I love very much to read your articles. Do not take everthinG to heart.(Al tikach la Lev) But KEN IRBU KAMOCHA BEISRAEL I share the same vision of Israel as you. The definition of Right and left in Israel is distorded. Those definition mostly apply to socio economical problems.

What do people really mean when they say they love their country? What exactly do they love? If a country commits such wrongs, as Israel does, and you know and agree that these are wrongs, then what is it that you love?

bradley time to think like a jew who lived in europe 1933-1945 not a spoiled american !

living and growing up in a liberal environment. many US Jews are beginning to realize how important Israel is. We thought that our home was in the countries we come from. And the US is great the best but when push comes to shove the Jews in Europe, the 900,000 Jews ethnically cleansed from Arab countries came home home to Israel.I can't wait for the US Jews and Christians who make up the liberal left to wake up. Bradley you don't get it because you never really lived under anti semitism but when you do you will be glad to have Israel. From the inside you just can't see the truth

I agree with the advice you have been getting. Leave! With friends like you, who needs enemies. If anyone put your form of extreme "peacenick" policies into play, there would be no hope left of the State of Israel remaining a home for Jews.

When Israelis were killed on a daily basis due to the "Oslo accords". Now those who were responsible for them critisize those who had to fix their mistakes.

Why would they do that? For them Israel is their God of War. It exists simply to fufill a holocaust revenge fantasy. Once you grasp the enourmity of this cowardice, than its not difficult to understand their reticence when it comes to shedding their own blood or that of their kids in pursuit of the pair of testicles that always ssem to be just out of reach in the shtetl.

DISLIKE the hate and perfidy, lies, propaganda, INJUSTICE committed AGAINST Israel by its Arab-Muslim neighbors, by the huge swaths of hypocrites, phoney leftists, anti-Semites, Jew-haters the World over. Don't confuse the cart and the horse. Dont' confuse the SKUNK and the one trying to remove the SKUNK from the Vineyard. Don't confuse Jihad, and the teaching of hate and demonization, with Resistance by the One Jewish Tiny State against the 22 Arab States and 57 Muslim States and the power of their terror and black gold. Don't Blame the victims of Hate, Jealousy with the Land that belongs to the Jewish People. Negotiating with the NO,No, and No. Placating the enemies that want destruction and supremecy. Palestine was already divided unfairly. There is darkness and oppression in all those states that seek the Destruction of ISRAEL. Don't be fooled or be a pawn of Darkness like the "Arab refugees". ZIONIST Burston?

israelis have always by and large supported a pal state that would live in peace, next door. The sticking point is that the pals dont want that..they don't want a jewish state next door. They dont want to respect the UN decision from 1948. They are not after just gaza and west bank...but you never hear brad talk about that, do you? nooo, wouldn't want to get into 1947, or 1948, or 1964... tell me brad..why was the PLO established in 1964? you do know what PLO stands for eh brad? you do know that in 1964 there was no occupation, right brad? so my dear friendly traitor bradley, why dont you come back when you have something more honest to say.

The far left is trying to make "Zionist" an insult in the same way that Republicans made "liberal" a dirty word. As you can see from Bradley's article, Zionism can be a beautiful thing, as well. Thanks, Bradley, and to all liberal Israelis, for living in Israel, for your sacrifices for Jewish self-determination, and for working to make Israel a tolerant, Democratic state for all.

no unending need to take to the streets in protest... Dude... There are always going to be those Idiots going to the streets protesting because the sky is blue and they want it Green those are the freedoms shared by the west and Israel... And there is a difference between criticism and Jewish criticism.... Bradley what you dont seem to want to accept is that when a jew says something bad about Israel... Those who hate Israel use those words as evidence to de-legitimise the very Existence of the Country... Does Goldstone ring a bell? How about we make CONSTRUCTIVE criticism in the future? Because reading what you have to say is like watching a slug slither on the edge or a knife trying not to cut its self... Though please dont Leave Israel... Every Country needs their Village Idiots...

The troubling thing is how Israel's enemies seize hold of the dissent shown by the disillusioned and build a mountain of lies upon that dissent. They know full well that to disheaten and demoralise Israel's population is a more powerful tool than shooting rockets at innocent civillians. You just have to look at the talkbacks. Israel faces a battle for the heart and minds of its own citizens unless it can persaude those who wish to leave that their future will be no better, perhaps even worse in a morally and economically bankrupt Europe and USA which is in the process of changing their demographic balance, with consequences of an increasing hostility towards Jews.

wonderful statement that reflects the spirit of renewal and self improvement that historic zionism has always been about. we cannot leave the Jewish future to our zealots of hate and ignorance. kol hakavod!

Voice of reason. I'm quite impressed. Voices like this endear Haaretz to some of us who still hope that one day the denizens of this patch of land would see the futility in stoking the embers of this unending conflict.

Bradley,not every Jew who lives outside Israel wants you to leave. People like you and Gideon Levi expose the injustices and discriminations of Israeli society. In the future, thanks to your courage and resolve people could not claim that they did not know what was going on.

YOu say people who live abroad have no right to tell you to leave. I do live, my kids do the army, and I wish you would leave. Apartments are very cheap in Gaza. And you can be with the people you so much want to care about.

along with all the other 'Israel's really great but I think I'll stay in the USA, UK, Australia, Sweden, crowd' even though 'they' are really anti-semitic countries full of Muslim hordes.

When someone says that 700k israelis have left israel, it is important to understand the statistics. 1. It is natural, that in a country with high immigration, a certain % will not adapt and leave after a short time. But since those leaving do get automatic citizenship, they will by default be counted as expat Israelis. For example: if a Bosnian came to Switzerland and lived there 10 years, but did not get citizenship, after returning to Bosnia he will NOT be counted as an expat Swiss. The russian jew WILL be counted as an expat Israeli. 2. 700K also includs arab israelis, not only jews! 3. 700k also includes unaccounted people who have died since, thus the figure is lower, around 600k (IL Central Bureau of Statistics). 4. 600K is the amount of expat Swiss, a rich country with the same pop. size as IL. 5. Migration in search for opportunity (work, health, marriage, etc) is normal and does NOT imply ideological emigration.

All you Pro-Israel no-matter-what people read (or not read) the articles and it's like the points made go WAAAAAY over your head. You might be reading but you're not getting the message. All you who say "if you dont like it then leave" dont realize that you're only participating in a system where you need everyone to shut up and passively go along with your plans without any speculation, no articulation, no thinking outside the box... just blind following. If you actually believe in democracy and freedom you should learn to embrace diffferent opinions and respect it. Not try to eliminate every free-thinker until all thats left is a docile, mis-guided, fanatic army.

As a die hard lefist, I have to say that your response is quite refreshing. It also leaves me scared as I have nothing in terms of sugestions to our leaders as a way forward. My standard " Sugestion " will always be Diplomacy, but is it enough.....?

I despaired of ever hearing this kind of sense from an Israeli's publically; it takes courage, real courage, I admire you.Criticism of Israel is not being anti-Israeli or anti-semetic. Charges I have been accused of ad nausem in Haaretz. The level of vilification of criticism borders on hysteria at times. It's understandable in the context of a war footing, but extremely damaging and unhelpful. Israeli's should care about the perilous state of their nation. Not from external threats but from within.Those who love it, or like me genuinely wish it well and also want peace in the ME, should try to save it from itself.

I hope we have more people like this man ( Bradley Burston)and i hope all these people who are putting him down and calling him all kind of name, come down to earth because they living in space and like he wrote they all living outside Israel and they have nothing to loose and they don't know how to live in danger and or to join the arm services so there for i hope for you Mr. burston to continue you writing and you opinions i thing thats you are the only logical person that on this earth good luck and continue the good work

Thankyou both for providing fine examples of the kind of blind right-wing negativism and stupidity that will bring down Israel if it wasn't for the bravery of pople like Bradley. This article was meant for you.

Judging by the racist comments you made about Obama before he got elected, I expect Gideon [if you got your wish] would be able to meet up with you at the next KKK meet'.

So you can watch your grandchildren do teshuva and learn in yeshiva- in Hebron or Shilo or Beit-El. Where they will be welcomed with open arms. This is the nation of Israel's "manifest destiny".

Beautifully said, Bradley. If we Jews are critical of Israel, we are of course, self-hating. If we are not Jews, we are of course, anti-semitic. The hypocrites who sit in their living rooms in America, yelling and screaming for other people's children to kill and be killed, are nothing short of cowards.

I so agree with waht you said - I have been there and done just what you said. I lived in Israel 20 yrs & vists often with family still living there, so I know boththe beaty & the uglness. You are not saying you cannot critises with out living there BUT people out there use your brains & manners. Think may be those living there see things visistors don't & at least disagree with politness. It was an inability to respect the other side tha eventually lead to Rabin's assisination.

(for England) ,just as you care for Israel. There's no difference between pal pre-1967 demands and their demands today. There's no room for you should those you fight egainst lose ,there'd be no place on the map called "Israel".

So many have attention deficit disorder (ADD) and cannot or will not learn the full adage. They can only get or remember the first line. My country, right or wrong. When it is right, to keep it right, When it is wrong, to make it right. Brad, not everybody outside of Israel has kids who don't serve. But, apparently caring about human life, your kids' lives or the lives of the people they may face, makes you hopelessly liberal. And to the Braggart in Boise (Hung Well), size does not matter.

He'd make a perfect gentile, an anti semetic KKK one at that! Emira Haas can join him.

Your dishonesty is demonstrated by a simple fact: you only resent right-wing diaspora Jews who criticize your stomach-turning,trecherous articles. But in the case of posters who agree with your left-wing Israel-hating prejudice, well they can live where they want, right? No need for anyone in J-street to make aliyah, eh? You are soooo in bad faith, Burston, that Haaretz is your natural home!

By failing to conclude peace (and I reckon Israel does not bear sole responsibility for this failure), Israel's democracy has settled into a continuous state of war that is undermining its democratic institutions, as well as the democratic resistances of its societies. The articles of Bradley Burston correctly point out these phenomena: more and more intolerance inside Israel, less and less secularism, and more and more militarism. It's easy for those of us who don't live in Israel to blame that country and those who live there and keep the ability to criticise, with the hope of changing what is wrong. What is certain, however, is that no one can (nor should) be satisfied with Israel and Israelis living in a constant state of war. This is why peace, and the creation of a Palestinian State alongside with Israel, are a necessity - and I would even say: it has long been the most urgent matter to be solved in the Middle East.

The only reason I still have hope in Israel-Palestinian conflict is because of people like Gideon Levy and Amira Hass. I love to see Israeli conscience. Right wingers are burning that conscience.

That is more or less 20 % of its Jewish population (and so as per figures published a few weeks ago on a French zionist website, based on Israeli data I believe). Which country would lose 20 % of its population without engaging in a real debate about the reasons for leaving etc.?! Mr. Bradley has then maybe started to launch such debate!

And the Israeli left threw them to the dogs.

Old countries like the UK or France or Germany have learnt over rhe centuries the damage nationalism can do. It makes you feel great, proud of who you are, makes you feel special and strong, but ultimately it can also lead to hatred, violence, self-destruction. Jews haven't had a chance to experience this over the centuries of the disapora, and in the early years of Israel, they were probably too worried about Israel's mere survivial to waste too much time on it. Now,though, that Israel is the regional superpower they can let it all hang out and really binge on nationalism. Feels good. And better still, they have another race and neighbours they can look down on, and there's a vague threat from Iran which can give nationalism that extra little spice of danger! It's all higely exciting and intoxicating and under its influence, normally mild-mannered people do all sorts of stupd things like insulting your parents and wishing you death from cancer.

Bradley: you have some nerve, writing articles like Bashing Israel for Helping Haiti. KNow why people do that? BECAUSE OF YOU! AND GIDEON LEVY! And the other Haaretz writers who bash Israel in every column you write, except for your columns asking why other people bash Israel so much! Because of YOU!

I am probably as far from Bradley politically as the North Pole is from the South, if I can judge by his columns. However, at the end of the day, both he and I lay down to sleep HERE, IN ISRAEL. Both he and I, as immigrants to this Jewish state of ours, have "put our money where our mouths are". I so truly wish my right-wing fellow travelers from overseas would do the same (not least of all because then we can - lovingly! - outnumber our Bradley-style brethren....). And Bradley, I hope you also are sharp enough to chastise your Jewish political fellow travelers who condemn Israel's policies from overseas.

Thank you for putting into words what so many people in Israel feel. Shabbat shalom to you and your family

It's going to take SOME Doctor to fix the kopts of all the mishugennes we got! Uhhh... some headache I got right now! Oy vey!

Bradlry burston says that all of the critical lettersare from out of the country? who is he kidding/ The reason that there arenot much MORE letters from isreal. is that people just arent interested in wha he has to say. i ,as a matter, of fact, get most of my info on bradley second hand, since I donr have time for his jewsih self hate. so as a jewand and an oleh, living in isreal, i too say, why dont you just get the hell out. btw, check and see who are thos ewho are leaving Isreal . you will find it is the leftists

Mr Burston, you have writtern once more an excellent article,and i agree with you,now sit back and read your talkbacks, more then likly you will end up becoming even more sadden.

There is a time, place and method of criticising. What do I mean? Time: One does not have to jump down our own proverbial throat right in the middle of every war that our enemies provoke. Sure, we are NOT perfect either and we too get things wrong at times. But let a bit of time pass and allow for a bit of perspective to seep in before jumping in and going for our own jugular. After all, maybe .... just maybe in the goodness of time we might find that NOT everything that we do is wrong ... Place: One does not have to stand on a soap box and make every bit of criticism Soooooo public. Some discretion should apply, lets NOT hang out every bit of dirty laundry in public, use more discrete channels to criticise, we are still in the middle of an existential war for G-D's sake ... Method: There is criticism and there is constructive criticism. I find that all too often, some of us Jews want to be harder on ourselves than even our enemies and we (or should I say you) criticise destructively. Destructively, because we (you) concentrate on what Israel supposedly should NOT do. But you do NOT offer CLEAR and well thought out alternatives to tell our leaders what (and how) they SHOULD do ... So in summary, like I told Zeev (one of our regular posters), you too should heed our ancient sage Hillel, who said: "If I am not for myself, who will be for me?"(Rabbi Hillel) To me that means that if we end up so hard on ourselves then how can we expect others to side with us? And it would be a pity if we drive our friends away because on a fundamental level, we are NOT the ones who are wrong in this conflict ... Having said that, one has to be mindful of what else our sage said: "If I am not for others, what am I?"(Rabbi Hillel) And that means in this context that it is OK to criticise because we do have to try to think of others. But keep in mind what was said above ... After all, other countries too use and used heavy censorship in the middle of their wars. And I am NOT even advocating HEAVY censorship, just SOME discretion.

Zionism is not about left or right. It is about Jews living in their national homeland express the very best in us; in word and deed; of a fundamental reverence for all creation. (Zeev will like this) "...Let us examine our attitude toward peace itself. Too many of us think it is impossible. Too many think it unreal. But that is a dangerous, defeatist belief. It leads to the conclusion that war is inevitable -- that mankind is doomed -- that we are gripped by forces we cannot control... ...So, let us not be blind to our differences -- but let us also direct attention to our common interests and to the means by which those differences can be resolved. And if we cannot end now our differences, at least we can help make the world safe for diversity. For, in the final analysis, our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this small planet. We all breathe the same air. We all cherish our children's future. And we are all mortal...." JFK Not Zionist, But Close Enough. :)

Burston says: "There is little room for democracy, after all, between my way and the highway." His (Russian?) version of the old Americanism "In the Soviet Union you can have ANY COLOR CAR YOU WANT... so long as you want a black car."

YOUR CRITICS UNDERSTAND THAT YOU JUST DON'T GET IT. YOU PROBABLY NEVER WILL. GROW UP. GET OVER YOURSELF. IF YOU'RE NOT WILLING TO FIGHT TO KEEP YOURSELF ALIVE, THEN OF WHAT WORTH ARE YOU TO THE JEWISH PEOPLE. GO BACK TO EGYPT.

I have been to Israel quite a few times and find the country and people exciting. Like every country Israel is not perfect.I am with you Bradley. Sometimes those that are too close to whatever is happening around them leaves additudes that effect them. For those that say-- "If you find it so necessary to criticize Israel, you should just pack up and leave, and the sooner the better." and you wrote-- Nearly all of those who wrote in this vein, it turns out, live not in Israel but overseas. -- I feel sorry for them. They are blind to the fact of living and fighting for what you believe. Bradley As a newspaper person you see a lot of things as you stated that never reaches the outside. Those criticizing you are looking and hearing half truths (lies.) Bradley continue the good work.

Beautifully said?.many Israeli agree with you. Enough is enough. Never again.

Zionists like us are exactly what's needed. You F-ing rule. Seriously. Keep writing, friend.

right on; enlightenment is the duty of those who SEE, and always fought by those who don't.

...your family and the whole of Israel. Please find it in your heart to forgive our mis-guided forefathers who caused so much agony. Continue to continue my friend, there are many here abroad who pray for and support Israel and her children. Now to those who send hate, you will reap what you sow. Be careful when you address any of HIS chosen ones in such a manner. Especially if you part of the Zionist/Hebrew/Jewish Family.

Haaretz coresspondents cross the line from legitimate criticism to advocacy journalism distorting the facts to smear their own country and pretend to be the "enlightened and righteous" ones. A perfect example was the false portrayal of IDF war crimes in Gaza by so-called "eye-witnesses" whose testimony was hearsay and later proven false, but only after their stories appeared in the NY Times quoting Haaretz sources. Haaretz journalists are unwilling to accept the results of a democratic election and so attempt to undermine an elected government with falsehood. You and your colleagues at Haaretz have crossed the line from legitimate criticism of Israel to one of persistent unwarrented abuse. Respond to this post, Bradley!

Just a short and simple comment: Israel has enough enemies doesn't need one more idiot like B.B.

Good for you. You are brave to take an unpopular stand and defend it because it is right, and the world needs more people like you. I wanted to be one of the voices offering you support, against those offering you their hatred. Be well.

I wish more people were like you as I grow sick of how often ANY bad word about Israel is immediately called anti-Israel and anti-semantic. Although if the same words were spoken about any other state, especially a Muslim nation in these troubling times, it would not be seen as anti-state or anti-nation. This double-standard and how it's accepted by a majority of first world citizens is very troublesome. Critiques of nations is what helps it prosper, as if everyone keeps believing that everything is fine...there is no incentive to change for the better. I also disagree with the treatment of the occupied territories and the discriminative-nationalist laws; but I digress, as that is another discussion for another time.

Thank you for this article! I relate to every word you wrote.

or clear the hell out! LOL

We need more people like you in Israel - and around the world for that matter. Good luck.

good piece. The true patriot is the one who will carefully examine every request of the state, in the harsh light of wise thought, and only act to suport if the request is in the long-term good for everybody. Knee-jerk suport is simply being a pliant robot, which is not being patriotic, it is being idiotic. Well done.

just as I could easily cite a person who espouses your particular philosophy, but simultaneouly discredits that philosophy. Please stay on target with representatives of a philosphy that are not off-the-wall.